If God made the universe, who made God?

[Bruce_T_Laney]

When You build that time machine ask Jacob Wives and tell me if it was Ishmael or Issac at the top of that damn mountain so I will know if God favor the Jews or Muslims!

Come on Rabbi do better!

Of course it was Yitzchak and of course you know nothing about the context.
We COULD discuss it right here and NOW if you'd like.
Or do you prefer coming up with yet another "witticism"?

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

 

[Indeependent]

Nothing speaks louder than failure and these "religions" failed.
You'll have to try harder to convince me of their veracity.

The smallest Abrahamic Religion is the Children Israel, right Rabbi?

So with the Christian religion ( which is influenced by the roman empire ) and the Muslim ( which is influenced by, well do you know? ) being bigger which one will survive, and before you get cocky I was raised by Polish Jewish women, and damn it man they argued better than you!

Your women obviously, and sadly, left you bereft of Biblical details.
I always enjoy it when self-hating, atheistic Jews tout their heritage.
I'm sure your great grandparents and other ancestors are kvelling over your abandonment of a belief they held and practiced for over 2,000 years, so that statement of yours falls flat on it's face.
You don't read your Torah so you don't even KNOW that God purposely made us very small in number because the majority of humanity could never live up to God's Gold Standard.

Do better mate!

Meek shall inherit the Earth, and I had a choice to get cut at thirteen or stay Christian, well I did not get cut...

God is Chaos which is Anu, and to argue I am wrong is like arguing with a bull while you hold a red cape in front of me, and you know you have the sword but sometimes the bull wins...

Again the stories are meant to teach us right from wrong, but the rest is mythology.

You believe in a Divine so be it, and I respect that but this does not mean I agree with you.

Humans have to believe in something and we need a God so we can believe there is a purpose in life but in the end I can ask you to produce the word of God written by it and you can not, so what does that tell us?

You will argue there is a God, and I will argue there is not, and you will grab your Tanakh, and I will grab my Tanakh, and then our Jewish Prayer Books, and so on, and where will that leave us?

I already explained the dispersion of Noah's children and you ignored the post.
The same thing has happened throughout the millennia so the reasoning is beyond refutation.

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

When You build that time machine ask Jacob Wives and tell me if it was Ishmael or Issac at the top of that damn mountain so I will know if God favor the Jews or Muslims!

Come on Rabbi do better!

Of course it was Yitzchak and of course you know nothing about the context.
We COULD discuss it right here and NOW if you'd like.
Or do you prefer coming up with yet another "witticism"?

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

I just realized the wording of the question doesn't make sense.
Ishmael and Eliezer were left waiting with the donkey at a distance from the mountain.

Alright, the reality is you and I were taught it was Isaac but Muslims or children of Ishmael were taught it was him, so how do we know?

 

[Indeependent]

Of course it was Yitzchak and of course you know nothing about the context.
We COULD discuss it right here and NOW if you'd like.
Or do you prefer coming up with yet another "witticism"?

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

 

[aris2chat]

It's a question, people say the universe is so complex it couldn't just have made itself, it must have been made by someone or something.

But then if God is complex enough to make the universe, then he himself must be extremely complex and therefore, under the same logic, he must have been made by someone or something that was also extremely complex (probably more complex than the god that was made, you'd think).

So who made God?

$64billion question

 

[Indeependent]

Of course it was Yitzchak and of course you know nothing about the context.
We COULD discuss it right here and NOW if you'd like.
Or do you prefer coming up with yet another "witticism"?

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

I just realized the wording of the question doesn't make sense.
Ishmael and Eliezer were left waiting with the donkey at a distance from the mountain.

Alright, the reality is you and I were taught it was Isaac but Muslims or children of Ishmael were taught it was him, so how do we know?

680AD...it's called plagiarism.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

The smallest Abrahamic Religion is the Children Israel, right Rabbi?

So with the Christian religion ( which is influenced by the roman empire ) and the Muslim ( which is influenced by, well do you know? ) being bigger which one will survive, and before you get cocky I was raised by Polish Jewish women, and damn it man they argued better than you!

Your women obviously, and sadly, left you bereft of Biblical details.
I always enjoy it when self-hating, atheistic Jews tout their heritage.
I'm sure your great grandparents and other ancestors are kvelling over your abandonment of a belief they held and practiced for over 2,000 years, so that statement of yours falls flat on it's face.
You don't read your Torah so you don't even KNOW that God purposely made us very small in number because the majority of humanity could never live up to God's Gold Standard.

Do better mate!

Meek shall inherit the Earth, and I had a choice to get cut at thirteen or stay Christian, well I did not get cut...

God is Chaos which is Anu, and to argue I am wrong is like arguing with a bull while you hold a red cape in front of me, and you know you have the sword but sometimes the bull wins...

Again the stories are meant to teach us right from wrong, but the rest is mythology.

You believe in a Divine so be it, and I respect that but this does not mean I agree with you.

Humans have to believe in something and we need a God so we can believe there is a purpose in life but in the end I can ask you to produce the word of God written by it and you can not, so what does that tell us?

You will argue there is a God, and I will argue there is not, and you will grab your Tanakh, and I will grab my Tanakh, and then our Jewish Prayer Books, and so on, and where will that leave us?

I already explained the dispersion of Noah's children and you ignored the post.
The same thing has happened throughout the millennia so the reasoning is beyond refutation.

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

 

[Indeependent]

Your women obviously, and sadly, left you bereft of Biblical details.
I always enjoy it when self-hating, atheistic Jews tout their heritage.
I'm sure your great grandparents and other ancestors are kvelling over your abandonment of a belief they held and practiced for over 2,000 years, so that statement of yours falls flat on it's face.
You don't read your Torah so you don't even KNOW that God purposely made us very small in number because the majority of humanity could never live up to God's Gold Standard.

Do better mate!

Meek shall inherit the Earth, and I had a choice to get cut at thirteen or stay Christian, well I did not get cut...

God is Chaos which is Anu, and to argue I am wrong is like arguing with a bull while you hold a red cape in front of me, and you know you have the sword but sometimes the bull wins...

Again the stories are meant to teach us right from wrong, but the rest is mythology.

You believe in a Divine so be it, and I respect that but this does not mean I agree with you.

Humans have to believe in something and we need a God so we can believe there is a purpose in life but in the end I can ask you to produce the word of God written by it and you can not, so what does that tell us?

You will argue there is a God, and I will argue there is not, and you will grab your Tanakh, and I will grab my Tanakh, and then our Jewish Prayer Books, and so on, and where will that leave us?

I already explained the dispersion of Noah's children and you ignored the post.
The same thing has happened throughout the millennia so the reasoning is beyond refutation.

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

You think I am witty, no...

I am being factual...

The Jewish religion is based on many religions and is not the oldest on the Earth...

You can write all you want about how you have the Tanakh to prove me wrong, but as I pointed out it has too much of mythology in it...

It does not take away the teachings of right from wrong, but do not be foolish to believe it is the word of God because it was written by man just like every holy book!

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

I just realized the wording of the question doesn't make sense.
Ishmael and Eliezer were left waiting with the donkey at a distance from the mountain.

Alright, the reality is you and I were taught it was Isaac but Muslims or children of Ishmael were taught it was him, so how do we know?

680AD...it's called plagiarism.

How do you know?

Were we there?

Sure it could be argue the time difference but how do we actually know?

One time the human race thought we were the center of the Universe, and now?

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Do better mate!

Meek shall inherit the Earth, and I had a choice to get cut at thirteen or stay Christian, well I did not get cut...

God is Chaos which is Anu, and to argue I am wrong is like arguing with a bull while you hold a red cape in front of me, and you know you have the sword but sometimes the bull wins...

Again the stories are meant to teach us right from wrong, but the rest is mythology.

You believe in a Divine so be it, and I respect that but this does not mean I agree with you.

Humans have to believe in something and we need a God so we can believe there is a purpose in life but in the end I can ask you to produce the word of God written by it and you can not, so what does that tell us?

You will argue there is a God, and I will argue there is not, and you will grab your Tanakh, and I will grab my Tanakh, and then our Jewish Prayer Books, and so on, and where will that leave us?

I already explained the dispersion of Noah's children and you ignored the post.
The same thing has happened throughout the millennia so the reasoning is beyond refutation.

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

Alright, so tell me then how do we know these stories were not stolen from another mythology?

 

[Indeependent]

You are correct as man was worshipping God in many variant forms from the beginning.
Unfortunately, those religions required actualized child sacrifice and global torture and murder of anyone who refused to join their religion.
And those religions are gone.
We also see thousands of forms of Christianity; and I'm talking incompatible.
I won't even bother discussing the barbaric, "religion of peace", Islam.

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

At least 2,000 years before the Koran.
I will take the Holy book that doesn't call for global mass murder.
In fact, I have read the first 6 Suras and can't make heads or tails of it.

 

[Indeependent]

I already explained the dispersion of Noah's children and you ignored the post.
The same thing has happened throughout the millennia so the reasoning is beyond refutation.

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

Alright, so tell me then how do we know these stories were not stolen from another mythology?

It takes study to come to this realization.
For instance, the insight I gain on an annual basis leaves me feeling as though I knew nothing the year before.
You can't pass Medical School in one night on a Message Board.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

At least 2,000 years before the Koran.
I will take the Holy book that doesn't call for global mass murder.
In fact, I have read the first 6 Suras and can't make heads or tails of it.

I have never read the Qur'an and that is my next book to read, and my brother think I am nuts, but it is better to know thy enemy than be oblivious to them...

We are from the House of Isaac and the House of Ishmael is suppose to be the Muslim religion, but I am not foolish enough to say I know the answer when I have no clue.

I respect your right to believe in the Tanakh, Torah, and anything else but in the end this discussion is about if God exist and I believe we ( humans not you ) created him...

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

You brought up child sacrifice and I ask which one was on the alter?

Was it Isaac or Ishmael?

Why?

Simple, the fact is God told Abraham to stop so which kid was there?

Jewish children will say Isaac and children of Islam will say Ishmael...

Now what does this have to do with the discussion?

Come on Rabbi and know I like you!

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

Alright, so tell me then how do we know these stories were not stolen from another mythology?

It takes study to come to this realization.
For instance, the insight I gain on an annual basis leaves me feeling as though I knew nothing the year before.
You can't pass Medical School in one night on a Message Board.

As i wrote I like you...

The reality is we will agree to disagree while you want to call me a putz, schmuck or whatever!

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Tell me something and was it Isaac or Ishmael that God told Abraham to stop!?!

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

At least 2,000 years before the Koran.
I will take the Holy book that doesn't call for global mass murder.
In fact, I have read the first 6 Suras and can't make heads or tails of it.

Here is something funny and two children of Isaac arguing so civil and if we were of the House of Ishmael, well head would roll!

 

[Indeependent]

It was a Malach (Heavenly Messenger) as Avraham was in too stressed of a state to receive a statement directly from God.
Different levels of preparation lead to different levels of revelation.
Of course, Yitzchaz was 67 and Avraham was way over 100 and Yitzchak didn't kick his father's ass.

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

At least 2,000 years before the Koran.
I will take the Holy book that doesn't call for global mass murder.
In fact, I have read the first 6 Suras and can't make heads or tails of it.

I have never read the Qur'an and that is my next book to read, and my brother think I am nuts, but it is better to know thy enemy than be oblivious to them...

We are from the House of Isaac and the House of Ishmael is suppose to be the Muslim religion, but I am not foolish enough to say I know the answer when I have no clue.

I respect your right to believe in the Tanakh, Torah, and anything else but in the end this discussion is about if God exist and I believe we ( humans not you ) created him...

Perhaps one day you should pick up the ArtScroll ArtScroll.com - Bereishis / Genesis 2 Volume Set
and spend a wee bit of time following Sages as they treverse from the Creation through the lives of the Avos.
It's a decent primer.

Anyway, I'm heading for the mattress.
Have a good night.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Yes, but Isaac is our story and the children of Ishmael have a different one...

So which one is true?

Not the one written after 680AD dictated by the illiterate Mohammad to a Jewish scribe at knife point.

And the story of Abraham was not written until years later...

We do not know!

At least 2,000 years before the Koran.
I will take the Holy book that doesn't call for global mass murder.
In fact, I have read the first 6 Suras and can't make heads or tails of it.

I have never read the Qur'an and that is my next book to read, and my brother think I am nuts, but it is better to know thy enemy than be oblivious to them...

We are from the House of Isaac and the House of Ishmael is suppose to be the Muslim religion, but I am not foolish enough to say I know the answer when I have no clue.

I respect your right to believe in the Tanakh, Torah, and anything else but in the end this discussion is about if God exist and I believe we ( humans not you ) created him...

Perhaps one day you should pick up the ArtScroll ArtScroll.com - Bereishis / Genesis 2 Volume Set
and spend a wee bit of time following Sages as they treverse from the Creation through the lives of the Avos.
It's a decent primer.

Anyway, I'm heading for the mattress.
Have a good night.

Shalom mate...

 

[Indeependent]

Avraham was told to bring Yitzchak as a sacrifice.
This is a simple Google.
Ishmael was long expelled from Avraham's house with his mother Hagar.
Ishmael loved Avraham and often visited him in his old age.

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

Alright, so tell me then how do we know these stories were not stolen from another mythology?

It takes study to come to this realization.
For instance, the insight I gain on an annual basis leaves me feeling as though I knew nothing the year before.
You can't pass Medical School in one night on a Message Board.

As i wrote I like you...

The reality is we will agree to disagree while you want to call me a putz, schmuck or whatever!

You're not a putz if you're willing to look into your heritage.
You may also be frustrated by those you've encountered.
I never omit the possibility you met a jerk who was a turnoff.
Torah is too fascinating to miss.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

We were taught that but how do we know that is the truth?

It was written by man many years after the fact...

There are Torah scrolls going back hundreds of years and Muslims don't deny the Koran stated being written down circa 680AD.
In fact, according to the Koran, Sura 2 or 3, every Torah scroll extant on earth from 680AD and on is a perversion of the original Torah and can't be trusted.
Not a bad start for a new religion made popular be beheading Heretics.

Alright, so tell me then how do we know these stories were not stolen from another mythology?

It takes study to come to this realization.
For instance, the insight I gain on an annual basis leaves me feeling as though I knew nothing the year before.
You can't pass Medical School in one night on a Message Board.

As i wrote I like you...

The reality is we will agree to disagree while you want to call me a putz, schmuck or whatever!

You're not a putz if you're willing to look into your heritage.
You may also be frustrated by those you've encountered.
I never omit the possibility you met a jerk who was a turnoff.
Torah is too fascinating to miss.

Go to bed and have peaceful dreams, and if you hear a roar, well never mind and shalom...