If A Terrorist Group of Mexicans

[jillian]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

Jillian, I've been trying to tell you for years that you belong to the wrong party. In case you haven't noticed most democrats hate the Country of Israel and all the Jewish people who reside theirin. They favor the side of the terror groups like Hamas and the PLO. So lobbing rockets into Israel is the right thing to do. On the other hand democrats love the Mexicans and wish to erase all borders between the USA and Mexico and they demonize anyone who thinks we should protect our country from millions of illegal invaders. I hope this brings you up to speed. And, secondly, with the drug cartels now in power in Mexico don't think for a moment they wouldn't stoop to firing rockets into Arizona, California, or Texas. It's not a question of it it's a question of when.

Democrats love America.

don't pollute my party with your anti-semitism and terrorist support.

thanks.

 

[jillian]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

That is the hypocrisy on everything.
First, no nation in WORLD wouldn't response with force to a nation shooting missiles at it! NONE.
Second, none would hold restraints if another nation was SPECIFICALLY targetting it's civilians!
Third, the hypocrisy of the liberal Muslim Sympathizing (or fearing) media doesn't report on any of the Gaza missile flying at Israel, only the Israeli response!

well there are problems. but i'm not sure it's a muslim sympathetic media.... sometimes, in trying NOT to take a position, newspapers actually take a position. but even in israel the reportage is different depending on the paper. you won't find the same things highlighted in, say, the j'lem post as you'll find in ha'aretz. right? and i don't have to tell you that if you put three jews into a room, you get ten opinions.

i'm not sure it's hypocrisy... but there is a double standard.

 

[4Horsemen]

The most peaceful time was under Ottoman control then the discovered oil, next was WW1, so we(western powers) have been destabilizing the ME since...

No. actually the most peaceful time was the time the land was inhabited by the Israelites, during the rule of King David and King Solomon. which was eons prior to the Ottoman control.

and the land is not being constantly de-stablized for oil. it's being de-stabilized because Jerusalem is a Holy city and they have been fighting over it eversince.

What evidence do you have to believe that? most Historians agree that was a time of many wars and even the Bible says the Jews slaughtered the Canaanites and fought with the Philistines(Palestinians) until Rome took control.

Most Historians are liars and hide the truth. get a clue.

 

[Valerie]

Aaron David Miller, a vice president at the Wilson Center, a Washington policy group, said: “There’s absolutely no way this president is not going to demonstrate full and complete support for Israel on this issue, particularly as this involves jihadi groups which are operating with a fair degree of impunity.”

Gaza Conflict Highlights Tensions Obama Faces in Mideast - Bloomberg

 

[editec]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

I doubt anyone, regardless of their POV about Isreal, is really CONFUSED about why Israel responds to attacks in kind, Jill.

You and I both know that the day-to-day fighting and attacks aren't really the issue that the pro-Zionists and anti-Zionists are debating.



WE can try to paint on side as pure evil the other as saintly, we can search back in history to try to decide who has more right to control, we can piss and moan about this opportunity for peace or that, we can debate how many terrorists can dance on the head of a pin, but NONE OD THAT is really the issue, is it?

The issue remains exactly what it was in 1948.

Who controls the land, the Moslems or the Jews?

 

[emilynghiem]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

Dear Jillian: If you add up the home invasions, drug and human trafficking, killing of law enforcement officers by illegal immigrants, and gang related violence that has crossed the border into our states, you would see there is this war going on and the federal govt is not defending the states but pushing for amnesty and other lax policies which are not strong enough to deter the criminal abuses going on.

People are basically mixing up church and state. Because the church and religious leaders and members fail to make peace and use all resources to serve their respective communities, people are turning to political gangs to abuse GOVT authority.

I agree with you that the GOVT should be in charge of national security and international agreements. The churches need to do their job, so the govt can do its job and not mix up the two.

 

[Truthseeker420]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

That is the hypocrisy on everything.
First, no nation in WORLD wouldn't response with force to a nation shooting missiles at it! NONE.
Second, none would hold restraints if another nation was SPECIFICALLY targetting it's civilians!
Third, the hypocrisy of the liberal Muslim Sympathizing (or fearing) media doesn't report on any of the Gaza missile flying at Israel, only the Israeli response!

Palestine has no power to stop Israel from specifically targeting it's civilians.

 

[jillian]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

Dear Jillian: If you add up the home invasions, drug and human trafficking, killing of law enforcement officers by illegal immigrants, and gang related violence that has crossed the border into our states, you would see there is this war going on and the federal govt is not defending the states but pushing for amnesty and other lax policies which are not strong enough to deter the criminal abuses going on.

People are basically mixing up church and state. Because the church and religious leaders and members fail to make peace and use all resources to serve their respective communities, people are turning to political gangs to abuse GOVT authority.

I agree with you that the GOVT should be in charge of national security and international agreements. The churches need to do their job, so the govt can do its job and not mix up the two.

i don't want your church having ANYTHING to do with my life.

thanks.

and our constitution specifically prohibits it from having anything to do with my life.

Thank G-d.

 

[JWBooth]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

With what, their leaf blowers?

 

[jillian]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

I doubt anyone, regardless of their POV about Isreal, is really CONFUSED about why Israel responds to attacks in kind, Jill.

You and I both know that the day-to-day fighting and attacks aren't really the issue that the pro-Zionists and anti-Zionists are debating.



WE can try to paint on side as pure evil the other as saintly, we can search back in history to try to decide who has more right to control, we can piss and moan about this opportunity for peace or that, we can debate how many terrorists can dance on the head of a pin, but NONE OD THAT is really the issue, is it?

The issue remains exactly what it was in 1948.

Who controls the land, the Moslems or the Jews?

who lost the wars?

what other group lost and had hysteria from other parts of the world demanding a do-over, or more absurdly, demanding a return of the land that was lost.

i always say, half tongue in cheek, that i want my great grandfather's land in belarus back.

but are the pals any different than my family who had to leave where they were from?

stuff happens.

i don't see anyone demanding that my family property be returned to me, or more absurdly, a 'right of return'.

do you think irish who left because of the troubles are entitled to the return of what they left?

it's the double standard accorded these people that i'm asking about.

and with any other country "THERE IS NO QUESTION" about who controls the land...

same as we control Texas and California

 

[emilynghiem]

i don't want your church having ANYTHING to do with my life.

thanks.

So if spiritual healing can cure mental and physical illness to reduce the burden on society, taxpayers and govt, you would not want people to have access to free therapy? If Christian ministries have counseled people to get help or get cured for their dangerous alcoholic addictions or other criminal, drug and/or gang related behavior putting the population and public health and safety at risk, you would not want any of that going on?

Why not let help churches take on more responsibility so the govt doesn't keep charging taxpayers millions of dollars for drunk drivers, rapists and child molesters they can't control?

I am a Constitutionalist, by the way. So I hope you believe in that.

So I don't believe in imposing church policy on govt, and by the same laws I don't believe in govt policy denying the free and equal exercise of religion, especially when the solutions offered can solve problems that the govt can't because it is not in charge of people's personal and spiritual process of healing from abuse and addiction. That belongs in private.
If people don't get enough help to resolve their criminal abuse and addiction issues, then they become a burden and threat to society, costing taxpayers and govt millions of dollars.

So even for the sake of govt ethics, where the Code of Ethics calls for govt employees in public service to "seek more efficient and economical means of getting tasks accomplished" then using spiritual healing methods to cure mental and criminal illness would cut costs.
This can't be imposed by law, but freely chosen if nothing else works to cure people.

The same First Amendment that protects people from religious imposition by govt also protects the free exercise of religion. So if you believe in the Constitution as I do, you would not deny either one.

 

[jillian]

i don't want your church having ANYTHING to do with my life.

thanks.

So if spiritual healing can cure mental and physical illness to reduce the burden on society, taxpayers and govt, you would not want people to have access to free therapy? If Christian ministries have counseled people to get help or get cured for their dangerous alcoholic addictions or other criminal, drug and/or gang related behavior putting the population and public health and safety at risk, you would not want any of that going on?

Why not let help churches take on more responsibility so the govt doesn't keep charging taxpayers millions of dollars for drunk drivers, rapists and child molesters they can't control?

I am a Constitutionalist, by the way. So I hope you believe in that.

So I don't believe in imposing church policy on govt, and by the same laws I don't believe in govt policy denying the free and equal exercise of religion, especially when the solutions offered can solve problems that the govt can't because it is not in charge of people's personal and spiritual process of healing from abuse and addiction. That belongs in private.
If people don't get enough help to resolve their criminal abuse and addiction issues, then they become a burden and threat to society, costing taxpayers and govt millions of dollars.

So even for the sake of govt ethics, where the Code of Ethics calls for govt employees in public service to "seek more efficient and economical means of getting tasks accomplished" then using spiritual healing methods to cure mental and criminal illness would cut costs.
This can't be imposed by law, but freely chosen if nothing else works to cure people.

The same First Amendment that protects people from religious imposition by govt also protects the free exercise of religion. So if you believe in the Constitution as I do, you would not deny either one.

who is keeping you from practicing your religion?

it just shouldn't have anything to do with my life.

but are you aware that has nothing to do with this thread? perhaps you're looking for something else?

 

[emilynghiem]

...
same as we control Texas and California

Similar battles of ideology are going on here, too. Where people who believe they are connected by ancestry to Native Americans have the right to populate the land freely, and do not respect the borders separating Texas or California, which some people ACTUALLY believe are still part of Mexico!
====================================================
BTW you may have no faith in Christian or church laws doing any good.
But this helps with my Christian friends who were quoting the Bible about
(a) not turning away or mistreating the foreigner/stranger
(b) not neglecting to do for the least as this would be neglecting duty to Jesus
(c) or the people paid the same even though some worked fewer hours than others

I DID successfully use the same Bible to point out that believers are STILL required
to follow and respect CIVIL AUTHORITY and INSTITUTIONS. So if the immigration laws say to go through a process, and wait in line like others who are following the laws, and to pay any fine or restitution for cheating and breaking laws when others did not; then you still owe if you commit violations against civil laws. You can be forgiven spiritually without condition, but that does not necessarily void physical debts unless the people offended agree to it.

So when dealing with people who ARE under church/Biblical authority,
it DOES help to use this same frame of reference when issuing corrections.
Avoiding this altogether is NOT going to solve the problem with people taking
their religious beliefs "out of context" and imposing them where they don't belong.

 

[WillowTree]

Democrats love America.

Are you an isolationist?

As far as military intervention,yes.

So there's no one in the world you'd raise a weapon to help? No one?

 

[emilynghiem]

i don't want your church having ANYTHING to do with my life.

thanks.

and our constitution specifically prohibits it from having anything to do with my life.

Thank G-d.

I agree.
I also see the same Constitution protects equal and free exercise of religion.

So to be fair, if you don't want people imposing their views on yours,
then please have equal respect for people who do "believe" in the Palestinians having
equal spiritual identity and sovereignty as their Jewish neighbors. if people have different beliefs, just take responsibility for that without imposing on someone else who disagrees!

If only the people who agree to share the land peacefully are allowed citizenship and residency rights to live there, then anyone who believes in imposing one view over another would be deported and have to leave. Only if you are a guest of someone else who agrees to take legal responsibility for you, could you also be there under that status. If the guest violates laws to disrupt the peace, then both the guest and the sponsor would be held responsible. So the same policy of taking responsibility could work with border/sovereignty issues in the Middle East as with immigration and border issues in America. As long as the people who believe in helping immigrants take responsibility instead of dumping this on others, we wouldn't have this problem we have now.

 

[WillowTree]

fired over 100 missiles into Texas and California, would there be any doubt that we'd retaliate and hard...and that no one would ever question our right to retaliate?

so...what is it that makes anyone question the obligation of the Israeli government to respond to hundreds of Hamas missiles?

Personally, I think when your people are forced to live in bomb shelters by terrorists, you have an obligation to do what you have to in order to protect your population.

Reminder that this is the Clean Debate Zone and was intentionally placed here so as not to be another ranting and insane israel/pal section thread.

Jillian, I've been trying to tell you for years that you belong to the wrong party. In case you haven't noticed most democrats hate the Country of Israel and all the Jewish people who reside theirin. They favor the side of the terror groups like Hamas and the PLO. So lobbing rockets into Israel is the right thing to do. On the other hand democrats love the Mexicans and wish to erase all borders between the USA and Mexico and they demonize anyone who thinks we should protect our country from millions of illegal invaders. I hope this brings you up to speed. And, secondly, with the drug cartels now in power in Mexico don't think for a moment they wouldn't stoop to firing rockets into Arizona, California, or Texas. It's not a question of it it's a question of when.

you know willow, the way i see it, the extremes on the right and left hate jews. that's why i believe in moderate societies. we thrive in moderation. we get off'd when things go too far off the rail right or left. the right has it's kkk'ers... the left has its terrorist apologists. just the way it is. and while i appreciate being brought into the fold, i don't see things like making israel not return SCUD attacks in order to preserve bush I's "coalition" and making israel not finish the job against hezbollah...and getting rid of the one person (saddam) who kept iran at bay as being helpful to israel. in fact, i think all of those things hurt israel, destabilized the region and are at least one of the reasons that hamas is emboldened. have i mentioned that it was bushII who pushed for elections in the gaza that resulted in hamas' ascendency.

so you see, hon... and i appreciate the support for israel from people of good will on both sides of the aisle, but i'd never trade everything else i believe in ... from our courts on down... just because of one issue... particularly when i think as positive as the rhetoric from the right, it's effect has not been all sunshine lollypops and rainbows.

Jillian I've never met a Republican who openly states they hate Jews. Can you tell me about one?


Oh and the KKK was invented and founded by Democrats.

 

[WillowTree]

Remember this folks. The Israeli people left Gaza. and what to they get in return? Rockets now sent to Tel A Viv and now to Jerusalem.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Jillian, I've been trying to tell you for years that you belong to the wrong party. In case you haven't noticed most democrats hate the Country of Israel and all the Jewish people who reside theirin. They favor the side of the terror groups like Hamas and the PLO. So lobbing rockets into Israel is the right thing to do. On the other hand democrats love the Mexicans and wish to erase all borders between the USA and Mexico and they demonize anyone who thinks we should protect our country from millions of illegal invaders. I hope this brings you up to speed. And, secondly, with the drug cartels now in power in Mexico don't think for a moment they wouldn't stoop to firing rockets into Arizona, California, or Texas. It's not a question of it it's a question of when.

you know willow, the way i see it, the extremes on the right and left hate jews. that's why i believe in moderate societies. we thrive in moderation. we get off'd when things go too far off the rail right or left. the right has it's kkk'ers... the left has its terrorist apologists. just the way it is. and while i appreciate being brought into the fold, i don't see things like making israel not return SCUD attacks in order to preserve bush I's "coalition" and making israel not finish the job against hezbollah...and getting rid of the one person (saddam) who kept iran at bay as being helpful to israel. in fact, i think all of those things hurt israel, destabilized the region and are at least one of the reasons that hamas is emboldened. have i mentioned that it was bushII who pushed for elections in the gaza that resulted in hamas' ascendency.

so you see, hon... and i appreciate the support for israel from people of good will on both sides of the aisle, but i'd never trade everything else i believe in ... from our courts on down... just because of one issue... particularly when i think as positive as the rhetoric from the right, it's effect has not been all sunshine lollypops and rainbows.

Jillian I've never met a Republican who openly states they hate Jews. Can you tell me about one?


Oh and the KKK was invented and founded by Democrats.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/257983-romney-adviser-said-fuck-the-jews.html

 

[jillian]

Remember this folks. The Israeli people left Gaza. and what to they get in return? Rockets now sent to Tel A Viv and now to Jerusalem.

you noticed, huh?

 

[JWBooth]

Remember this folks. The Israeli people left Gaza. and what to they get in return? Rockets now sent to Tel A Viv and now to Jerusalem.

No argument. So what?
They either take care of the problem or not.
Either way, the US should stay the hell out.