CDZ I Told You...Democrats Want To Outlaw AC and Refrigeration In The United States

[oldsoul]

This is one of the things I've been telling everyone for years. Democrats were using the EPA to jack up the price of refrigerants on purpose and now John Kerry is in Austria talking about eliminating air-conditioning and refrigeration to save the planet, comparing them to ISIS.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS
By John Siciliano • 7/22/16 2:49 PM

​

Air conditioners and refrigerators pose as big a threat to "life on the planet" as the threat of terrorism, Secretary of State John Kerry said Friday.

Kerry was in Vienna negotiating a global climate deal to phase out chemicals used as refrigerants in basic household and commercial appliances such as air conditioning and refrigerators, called hydrofluorocarbons, or HFCs. The chemicals are a potent source of greenhouse gas emissions that many scientists blame for contributing to global warming.

Kerry made the remarks as part of a pep talk for negotiators working through the weekend to amend a 1987 treaty called the Montreal Protocol to deal with the chemicals.

"Yesterday, I met in Washington with 45 nations — defense ministers and foreign ministers — as we were working together on the challenge of [the Islamic State], and terrorism," he said. "It's hard for some people to grasp it, but what we — you — are doing here right now is of equal importance because it has the ability to literally save life on the planet itself."

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy is one of the U.S.'s lead negotiators in the discussions in Vienna. She said Thursday that one of her goals is to move the HFC agreement into force by the end of the year.

The global deal would match new EPA regulations to ban HFCs in the United States and promote alternative chemicals for use in appliances.

The EPA's rules, together with the negotiations in Vienna, are part of the president's climate agenda for his final year in office.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS​

I wonder if he checked the A/C in the building to see if there was HFC'c there. If there where, a somewhat likely case, did he chastise the buildings owner(s)? Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them? I find it quite ironic that so many of these warmers do not practice what they preach. You know, Internal combustion engines are killing the environment, as the jet around the world, and arrive in HUGE motorcades of SUVs and Limos. A/C is bad m"kay, while they stand in an air conditioned venue. Etc., etc.

 

[Arianrhod]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

This is one of the things I've been telling everyone for years. Democrats were using the EPA to jack up the price of refrigerants on purpose and now John Kerry is in Austria talking about eliminating air-conditioning and refrigeration to save the planet, comparing them to ISIS.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS
By John Siciliano • 7/22/16 2:49 PM

​

Air conditioners and refrigerators pose as big a threat to "life on the planet" as the threat of terrorism, Secretary of State John Kerry said Friday.

Kerry was in Vienna negotiating a global climate deal to phase out chemicals used as refrigerants in basic household and commercial appliances such as air conditioning and refrigerators, called hydrofluorocarbons, or HFCs. The chemicals are a potent source of greenhouse gas emissions that many scientists blame for contributing to global warming.

Kerry made the remarks as part of a pep talk for negotiators working through the weekend to amend a 1987 treaty called the Montreal Protocol to deal with the chemicals.

"Yesterday, I met in Washington with 45 nations — defense ministers and foreign ministers — as we were working together on the challenge of [the Islamic State], and terrorism," he said. "It's hard for some people to grasp it, but what we — you — are doing here right now is of equal importance because it has the ability to literally save life on the planet itself."

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy is one of the U.S.'s lead negotiators in the discussions in Vienna. She said Thursday that one of her goals is to move the HFC agreement into force by the end of the year.

The global deal would match new EPA regulations to ban HFCs in the United States and promote alternative chemicals for use in appliances.

The EPA's rules, together with the negotiations in Vienna, are part of the president's climate agenda for his final year in office.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS​

Please get these ass clowns out of office ASAP

 

[oldsoul]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

You may be right. I will not comment on that, as I do not have the back-ground to formulate an educated opinion.

Couldn't help but notice you have not commented on the other aspects of my post. I would be curious to find out why...

 

[oldsoul]

This is one of the things I've been telling everyone for years. Democrats were using the EPA to jack up the price of refrigerants on purpose and now John Kerry is in Austria talking about eliminating air-conditioning and refrigeration to save the planet, comparing them to ISIS.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS
By John Siciliano • 7/22/16 2:49 PM

​

Air conditioners and refrigerators pose as big a threat to "life on the planet" as the threat of terrorism, Secretary of State John Kerry said Friday.

Kerry was in Vienna negotiating a global climate deal to phase out chemicals used as refrigerants in basic household and commercial appliances such as air conditioning and refrigerators, called hydrofluorocarbons, or HFCs. The chemicals are a potent source of greenhouse gas emissions that many scientists blame for contributing to global warming.

Kerry made the remarks as part of a pep talk for negotiators working through the weekend to amend a 1987 treaty called the Montreal Protocol to deal with the chemicals.

"Yesterday, I met in Washington with 45 nations — defense ministers and foreign ministers — as we were working together on the challenge of [the Islamic State], and terrorism," he said. "It's hard for some people to grasp it, but what we — you — are doing here right now is of equal importance because it has the ability to literally save life on the planet itself."

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy is one of the U.S.'s lead negotiators in the discussions in Vienna. She said Thursday that one of her goals is to move the HFC agreement into force by the end of the year.

The global deal would match new EPA regulations to ban HFCs in the United States and promote alternative chemicals for use in appliances.

The EPA's rules, together with the negotiations in Vienna, are part of the president's climate agenda for his final year in office.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS​

Please get these ass clowns out of office ASAP

Not sure how your comment adds anything of value to the discussion.
Aside from that, I am not inclined to disagree with you on the sentiment.

 

[Manonthestreet]

We've alrdy done this once. Yes the new chems were more expensive and are the reason you now have to buy a new refig and a/c on 10 yr plan......let's do it again and make it worse........it's not science.....it's mad science

 

[Holos]

Honestly, I don't take your source as credible, although the topic seems an interesting point for debate.

Your stated opinion before the article excerpt seems valid to me to be of discussion, but the article itself is excessively swerving the direction I have perceived in your comment, and would as well swerve mine.

 

[Arianrhod]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

You may be right. I will not comment on that, as I do not have the back-ground to formulate an educated opinion.

Couldn't help but notice you have not commented on the other aspects of my post. I would be curious to find out why...

I thought it might be the most easy to prove. Besides, the goal is to gradually replace HFCs with three equally efficient substitutes: propane, isobutane, and a chemical known as R-441A:

http://www.environmentalleader.com/...ree-alternative-refrigerants-to-replace-hfcs/

As the article indicates, these substances were approved as coolants five years ago. Again, gradual replacement.

The OP makes it seem as if SWAT teams will be breaking down people's doors and confiscating their refrigerators.

 

[Syriusly]

This is one of the things I've been telling everyone for years. Democrats were using the EPA to jack up the price of refrigerants on purpose and now John Kerry is in Austria talking about eliminating air-conditioning and refrigeration to save the planet, comparing them to ISIS.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS
By John Siciliano • 7/22/16 2:49 PM

​

Air conditioners and refrigerators pose as big a threat to "life on the planet" as the threat of terrorism, Secretary of State John Kerry said Friday.

Kerry was in Vienna negotiating a global climate deal to phase out chemicals used as refrigerants in basic household and commercial appliances such as air conditioning and refrigerators, called hydrofluorocarbons, or HFCs. The chemicals are a potent source of greenhouse gas emissions that many scientists blame for contributing to global warming.

Kerry made the remarks as part of a pep talk for negotiators working through the weekend to amend a 1987 treaty called the Montreal Protocol to deal with the chemicals.

"Yesterday, I met in Washington with 45 nations — defense ministers and foreign ministers — as we were working together on the challenge of [the Islamic State], and terrorism," he said. "It's hard for some people to grasp it, but what we — you — are doing here right now is of equal importance because it has the ability to literally save life on the planet itself."

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy is one of the U.S.'s lead negotiators in the discussions in Vienna. She said Thursday that one of her goals is to move the HFC agreement into force by the end of the year.

The global deal would match new EPA regulations to ban HFCs in the United States and promote alternative chemicals for use in appliances.

The EPA's rules, together with the negotiations in Vienna, are part of the president's climate agenda for his final year in office.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS​

Hmmm so Kerry didn't say that refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS- and there is no move to 'outlaw air conditioning or refrigerators'.

But they are talking of banning one chemical in favor of less damaging chemicals

Climate-friendly alternatives to HFCs and HCFCs - European Commission

 

[mudwhistle]

This is one of the things I've been telling everyone for years. Democrats were using the EPA to jack up the price of refrigerants on purpose and now John Kerry is in Austria talking about eliminating air-conditioning and refrigeration to save the planet, comparing them to ISIS.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS
By John Siciliano • 7/22/16 2:49 PM

​

Air conditioners and refrigerators pose as big a threat to "life on the planet" as the threat of terrorism, Secretary of State John Kerry said Friday.

Kerry was in Vienna negotiating a global climate deal to phase out chemicals used as refrigerants in basic household and commercial appliances such as air conditioning and refrigerators, called hydrofluorocarbons, or HFCs. The chemicals are a potent source of greenhouse gas emissions that many scientists blame for contributing to global warming.

Kerry made the remarks as part of a pep talk for negotiators working through the weekend to amend a 1987 treaty called the Montreal Protocol to deal with the chemicals.

"Yesterday, I met in Washington with 45 nations — defense ministers and foreign ministers — as we were working together on the challenge of [the Islamic State], and terrorism," he said. "It's hard for some people to grasp it, but what we — you — are doing here right now is of equal importance because it has the ability to literally save life on the planet itself."

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Gina McCarthy is one of the U.S.'s lead negotiators in the discussions in Vienna. She said Thursday that one of her goals is to move the HFC agreement into force by the end of the year.

The global deal would match new EPA regulations to ban HFCs in the United States and promote alternative chemicals for use in appliances.

The EPA's rules, together with the negotiations in Vienna, are part of the president's climate agenda for his final year in office.

Kerry: Refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS​

Hmmm so Kerry didn't say that refrigerator chemicals are just as bad as ISIS- and there is no move to 'outlaw air conditioning or refrigerators'.

But they are talking of banning one chemical in favor of less damaging chemicals

Climate-friendly alternatives to HFCs and HCFCs - European Commission

There's no need to. The Montreal Protocol already addressed it years ago.

What Kerry is trying to do is jack up the price of refrigerants across the board. Democrats have been trying to eliminate any chemicals or fuel sources that make life better.....offering little or nothing as a alternative.

These lying dicks are using Climate Change as an excuse to fleece what they call "Income Concentrations".

 

[Arianrhod]

What Kerry is trying to do is jack up the price of refrigerants across the board.

That's a lot different from your original premise that A/C and refrigerators would be - what? Banned, confiscated, their owners subject to a fine and/or imprisonment?

Now that you've tempered your "argument," perhaps you can tell the class how Mr. Kerry would "jack up the prices." All by himself, with an invasion force, other?

 

[oldsoul]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

You may be right. I will not comment on that, as I do not have the back-ground to formulate an educated opinion.

Couldn't help but notice you have not commented on the other aspects of my post. I would be curious to find out why...

I thought it might be the most easy to prove. Besides, the goal is to gradually replace HFCs with three equally efficient substitutes: propane, isobutane, and a chemical known as R-441A:

http://www.environmentalleader.com/...ree-alternative-refrigerants-to-replace-hfcs/

As the article indicates, these substances were approved as coolants five years ago. Again, gradual replacement.

The OP makes it seem as if SWAT teams will be breaking down people's doors and confiscating their refrigerators.

Maybe I am mistaken, but aren't Propane, Butane (in all it's forms), and R-441A hydrocarbons? Aren't hydrocarbons bad, according to people like Mr. Kerry? So we trade one bad substance for another? Maybe they are less bad, maybe they are not, I don't really know the science, but bad is bad right? Pollutants are pollutants, right?
And the last I knew hydrocarbons are dangerous, and flammable. So, is Mr. Kerry suggesting we put more flammable substances in and around our homes and businesses? At least on the surface it doesn't seem like a very good "fix" to the "problem".

 

[Arianrhod]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

You may be right. I will not comment on that, as I do not have the back-ground to formulate an educated opinion.

Couldn't help but notice you have not commented on the other aspects of my post. I would be curious to find out why...

I thought it might be the most easy to prove. Besides, the goal is to gradually replace HFCs with three equally efficient substitutes: propane, isobutane, and a chemical known as R-441A:

http://www.environmentalleader.com/...ree-alternative-refrigerants-to-replace-hfcs/

As the article indicates, these substances were approved as coolants five years ago. Again, gradual replacement.

The OP makes it seem as if SWAT teams will be breaking down people's doors and confiscating their refrigerators.

Maybe I am mistaken, but aren't Propane, Butane (in all it's forms), and R-441A hydrocarbons? Aren't hydrocarbons bad, according to people like Mr. Kerry? So we trade one bad substance for another? Maybe they are less bad, maybe they are not, I don't really know the science, but bad is bad right? Pollutants are pollutants, right?
And the last I knew hydrocarbons are dangerous, and flammable. So, is Mr. Kerry suggesting we put more flammable substances in and around our homes and businesses? At least on the surface it doesn't seem like a very good "fix" to the "problem".

I'd recommend you read the article at the link in Post #48, and especially the article at the link in Post #49.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Anyone that wants to outlaw those things would face my opposition and I'd vote against them.

 

[Arianrhod]

Anyone that wants to outlaw those things would face my opposition and I'd vote against them.

Read the articles linked to in Posts #48 and #49.

The claims in the OP are the predictable inaccurate sensationalism.

Given your avatar, one would think you'd be interested in the facts.

 

[oldsoul]

Does Mr. Kerry make sure that none of the appliances he uses have HFC's in them?

It would be interesting if you could find out.

Again, "replacing HFCs" =/= "banning air conditioning."

Except possibly to the gullible and uninformed.

You may be right. I will not comment on that, as I do not have the back-ground to formulate an educated opinion.

Couldn't help but notice you have not commented on the other aspects of my post. I would be curious to find out why...

I thought it might be the most easy to prove. Besides, the goal is to gradually replace HFCs with three equally efficient substitutes: propane, isobutane, and a chemical known as R-441A:

http://www.environmentalleader.com/...ree-alternative-refrigerants-to-replace-hfcs/

As the article indicates, these substances were approved as coolants five years ago. Again, gradual replacement.

The OP makes it seem as if SWAT teams will be breaking down people's doors and confiscating their refrigerators.

Maybe I am mistaken, but aren't Propane, Butane (in all it's forms), and R-441A hydrocarbons? Aren't hydrocarbons bad, according to people like Mr. Kerry? So we trade one bad substance for another? Maybe they are less bad, maybe they are not, I don't really know the science, but bad is bad right? Pollutants are pollutants, right?
And the last I knew hydrocarbons are dangerous, and flammable. So, is Mr. Kerry suggesting we put more flammable substances in and around our homes and businesses? At least on the surface it doesn't seem like a very good "fix" to the "problem".

I'd recommend you read the article at the link in Post #48, and especially the article at the link in Post #49.

Ok, read them, what's your point? Both articles focused on developing areas (AKA not the U.S. or Europe).

 

[oldsoul]

Anyone that wants to outlaw those things would face my opposition and I'd vote against them.

Read the articles linked to in Posts #48 and #49.

The claims in the OP are the predictable inaccurate sensationalism.

Given your avatar, one would think you'd be interested in the facts.

Sensationalism? You want to talk about sensationalism. How's this for sensationalism:
From Embarrassing Predictions Haunt the Global-Warming Industry

• The 2005 UNEP predictions claimed that, by 2010, some 50 million “climate refugees” would be frantically fleeing from those regions of the globe. However, not only did the areas in question fail to produce a single “climate refugee,” by 2010, population levels for those regions were actually still soaring.
• For well over a decade now, climate alarmists have been claiming that snow would soon become a thing of the past. In March 2000, for example, “senior research scientist” David Viner, working at the time for the Climatic Research Unit (CRU) at the University of East Anglia, told the U.K. Independent that within “a few years,” snowfall would become “a very rare and exciting event” in Britain. “Children just aren’t going to know what snow is,” he was quoted as claiming in the article, headlined “Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past.”
  
  The very next year, snowfall across the United Kingdom increased by more than 50 percent.
• Speaking to an audience in Germany five years ago, Gore — sometimes ridiculed as “The Goracle” — alleged that “the entire North Polarized [sic] cap will disappear in five years.” “Five years,” Gore said again, in case anybody missed it the first time, is “the period of time during which it is now expected to disappear.”
  
  The following year, Gore made similar claims at a UN “climate” summit in Copenhagen. “Some of the models … suggest that there is a 75 percent chance that the entire north polar ice cap, during some of the summer months, could be completely ice-free within the next five to seven years,” Gore claimed in 2009. “We will find out.”
  
  Yes, we have found out. Contrary to the predictions by Gore and fellow alarmists, satellite data showed that Arctic ice volume as of summer of 2013 had actually expanded more than 50 percent over 2012 levels.

And from 18 spectacularly wrong apocalyptic predictions made around the time of the first Earth Day in 1970, expect more this year - AEI:

• Harvard biologist George Wald estimated that “civilization will end within 15 or 30 years unless immediate action is taken against problems facing mankind.”
• “Population will inevitably and completely outstrip whatever small increases in food supplies we make,” Paul Ehrlich confidently declared in the April 1970 Mademoiselle. “The death rate will increase until at least 100-200 million people per year will be starving to death during the next ten years.”
• Ehrlich sketched out his most alarmist scenario for the 1970 Earth Day issue of The Progressive, assuring readers that between 1980 and 1989, some 4 billion people, including 65 million Americans, would perish in the “Great Die-Off.”
• Peter Gunter, a North Texas State University professor, wrote in 1970, “Demographers agree almost unanimously on the following grim timetable: by 1975 widespread famines will begin in India; these will spread by 1990 to include all of India, Pakistan, China and the Near East, Africa. By the year 2000, or conceivably sooner, South and Central America will exist under famine conditions….By the year 2000, thirty years from now, the entire world, with the exception of Western Europe, North America, and Australia, will be in famine.”

How's THAT for sensationalism.

 

[Unkotare]

Makes perfect sense to me. What's your problem with replacing the HFC's if they are screwing with the atmosphere?

Environmental impacts are beyond the intellectual capacity of conservatives

European heatwave caused 35,000 deaths


Why the French prefer sweat to Yankee air conditioning

 

[Arianrhod]

Ok, read them, what's your point? Both articles focused on developing areas (AKA not the U.S. or Europe).

Is it your perception that chemicals behave differently depending on what country they're employed in?

Curious, though, that despite all the caterwauling upthread about how "Kerry's jacking up prices" (still waiting for someone to tell me how he's accomplishing that), poorer countries are able to utilize these other chemicals instead of HFCs.

And since you haven't mentioned it again, I'm assuming those two articles have at least set your mind at rest about the perceived "dangers."

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Makes perfect sense to me. What's your problem with replacing the HFC's if they are screwing with the atmosphere?

The problem is we've already replaced most of them. Why is he bringing it up now?
Because Obama plans on totally ending the use of refrigerants in America within a set number of years.
HFCs were already scheduled to be phased out back in 2010. R-22 was replaced by other refrigerants and all commercial air-conditioning systems now use 410a which operates at much higher pressures, thus causes more leaks than R-22. A 30lb can of R-22 went from $30 to $600 since Obama took office rendering it unaffordable.....and added cost to homeowners who still have systems that operate off of R-22. Eventually they'll tell you that your system can't be serviced and has to be replaced.

Our cars run off of R-134a which will soon be phased out as well. Cars run at much higher temperatures and using 410a would be highly problematic. So, forget about having AC in your car.


Links
1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Montreal Protocol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
R-410A - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Did you read the OP?

Kerry is arguing for the rest of the world to adopt the standards the US has, not trying to "outlaw air conditioning".

You guys get more ridiculous by the day.