I don’t get the narrative the Democrats are trying with old America

[Soggy in NOLA]

They didn't have to pass laws. All they had to do was enforce the laws protecting people. Eventually society would have grown up past the point. In fact the majority of the country had already changed at the time the government had got involved. I guarantee you if most of the country was against it then the laws would not have been passed. They want you to think people need the government to do these things. And as you can tell by your response they got you believing it as well.

Really, so the gay have the right to marriage already?

my GF and I are co-habitating.
We were able to get a mortgage and HE loan together. We have not sufferd b/c we are not married, quite the opposite. There are zero fights over money b/c her paycheck belongs to her and my paycheck belongs to me.

We split the bills amicably.

perhaps gays are better off in the long run not being married. Marriage is over-rated.

BTW, the state we live in has a law that prohibits co-habitation for unmarried heterosexual couples. It's OK for gays to live together however.

So don't tell me about how the poor gays are all that bad off.

Wait, unmarried heterosexuals cannot live together yet gays can? Where the hell do you live?

 

[G.T.]

I responded.

You responded with common-sense statements and implied that I wouldn't have known otherwise, which is a great subversion of rational discussion.

the fact is, the Government is taken over by big money, and big money comes from big corporate interests.

This is not even hidden anymore, it's out in the wide open - so to not acknowledge it and be a bit peeved about it, is to have fallen for the "look over there, at the left! look over there, at the right!" subversion tactic they play you overtly political types with, like a fiddle.

You honestly think Boehner sits and has a beer with Obama taking pictures and giggling - really thinks Obama is evil and destroying the country at the same time? Grow up, if so.

Democrats have been supposedly fighting big bad corporations for how long? Yet corporations are still doing fine. It is the small business that has paid the price for this battle. Second the big things that have hit corporations negatively would not have happened if what you say is true. In fact if what you say is true then it could never happen because they already run everything. The fact is that it is a lie. It is an excuse to give more power to the government to protect us from the big evil corporations. Fear is the way government uses to get us to give away our freedoms. To “Protect Us” But at the end of the day it is the government people should fear. People will always have a way to attack a corporation and prevent it from truly taking over; however, you have no recourse against the government. Once it has total control it is all over.

do you see me saying Democrats are not involved anywhere?

congrats on a post not even involved in the discussion because you went all childish "hes a progressive, obviously" route.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Yes, grown up, they all met in their secret room and conspired together to make the Superpac ad. all tens of millions of them.

I doubt that, but most of you guys sure embrace the message...

Who? the 15 or so probable D's on here, or the 10-20 D commentators you read or hear about daily........................................out of TENS OF MILLIONS? so like, 0.0000583%?

you sure you don't fall for propoganda? Absolutely POSITIVE you don't?

Propaganda, what propaganda? This board is replete with threads about Mitt Romney's money, Ann Romney's horse, etc. And I have yet to hear one of you libs denounce that vile ad which we now know was BS. That's reality, not propaganda.

 

[miami_thomas]

Oh and America is number one...Number 1 in the number of fat asses and Number 1 in the number of citizens in Prison

Woot!

Yes and Democrats trying to get rid of morals and destroy family values really has been a great help. Thanks for playing.

oh gosh.


Nevermind on any of the discussion we were having.

You deny there is an attack on the teaching of morals and the family? Maybe it is intentional maybe it was unintentional but at the end of the day it is happening. Democrats have been long trying to get church out of people’s lives. This is ok but you have to replace the moral education you lose when you do that with something else. If you are going to remove church, then you need to teach something like philosophy in its place. Then the introduction of welfare has helped to destroy families whether intentional or not. It has had that effect.

 

[Moonglow]

Have Democrats truly been able to convince people that America of old was truly an awful place? We are talking about the top country in the world. We are talking about a country where everyone wished they could be. We are talking about one of the most successful nations of all times. How can anyone be dumb enough to believe it was a failure?

So the Democrats are selling that America of old was a failure and they want to offer what every other country has as a fix? This makes no sense either seeing that people in those other countries wanted to come here. True with Obama that has decreased because we are getting closer to what they already have. The Democrats are successfully destroying this country and making it like every other country. I mean no country has had as much success as America in its prime nor have they even come close.

I can’t see how so many people are buying this narrative? We are talking almost half the country. Are there that many people with blinders on? I just don’t get it. Do they not know what the reality is of these other countries people like Michael Moore try to put out as successful. I mean come on they have to know people risk their lives in dinky little boats just to get out of Cuba. Come on what gives?

Are you talking about slavery times or when the elderly were homeless and lived off cat food? Or some time in between? And can you name that time?

When it comes to Cuba, it's a matter of perspective. Better here doesn't mean "great" here. You can always make things better, but Conservative and Republican policies have ruined the economy and killed and maimed tens of thousands of young Americans for no reason even they can name. And their solution is to crush the middle class.

Are you sure you've thought this through?

Again read other comments in regard to the dumb slavery comment. As far as homeless living off cat food that is just plain dumb. That has not been the case since prior to the 1920s. Charities and churches provide for the poor. There is no perspective when it comes to Cuba. It is a God awful place and the people there that are not in the government live in hell. When you always try to make things better you can make things worse. Sometimes you have to do less to make things better especially when it comes to Government. Government is the ones not to be trusted not some evil corporation. Government has always been the enemy of freedom not the deliverer of freedom.

During the periods of inflation and recession during the Carter and Reagan years there were many stories about old people, stealing food and eating animal food.

 

[squeeze berry]

Really, so the gay have the right to marriage already?

my GF and I are co-habitating.
We were able to get a mortgage and HE loan together. We have not sufferd b/c we are not married, quite the opposite. There are zero fights over money b/c her paycheck belongs to her and my paycheck belongs to me.

We split the bills amicably.

perhaps gays are better off in the long run not being married. Marriage is over-rated.

BTW, the state we live in has a law that prohibits co-habitation for unmarried heterosexual couples. It's OK for gays to live together however.

So don't tell me about how the poor gays are all that bad off.

Wait, unmarried heterosexuals cannot live together yet gays can? Where the hell do you live?

there are 7 states that have anti-cohabitation laws. Google it

you will never see libs bitching about it however.

 

[G.T.]

I doubt that, but most of you guys sure embrace the message...

Who? the 15 or so probable D's on here, or the 10-20 D commentators you read or hear about daily........................................out of TENS OF MILLIONS? so like, 0.0000583%?

you sure you don't fall for propoganda? Absolutely POSITIVE you don't?

Propaganda, what propaganda? This board is replete with threads about Mitt Romney's money, Ann Romney's horse, etc. And I have yet to hear one of you libs denounce that vile ad. That's reality, not propaganda.

this board........

 

[G.T.]

Yes and Democrats trying to get rid of morals and destroy family values really has been a great help. Thanks for playing.

oh gosh.


Nevermind on any of the discussion we were having.

You deny there is an attack on the teaching of morals and the family? Maybe it is intentional maybe it was unintentional but at the end of the day it is happening. Democrats have been long trying to get church out of people’s lives. This is ok but you have to replace the moral education you lose when you do that with something else. If you are going to remove church, then you need to teach something like philosophy in its place. Then the introduction of welfare has helped to destroy families whether intentional or not. It has had that effect.

No, I'd assume that self-responsible parents don't need the church to teach their kids morals to begin with, and so the "point," to me, is purely bogus and the blame still lays squarely on the individuals - not the part(ies).

 

[miami_thomas]

America of old was not an awful place for most. But we are a better society today by far

Liberals have made this a better country

Yeah, that 1/6 of Americans on public assistance, credit downgrades, $5,000,000,000,000 new debt in 3 years, 40+ months of 8%+ unemployment, no growth, worthless U.S. $ is an awesome thing.

Thanks, thanks a lot.

Unemployment is supposed to be controlled by self-sufficient entrepreneurs. Where's all the hard working risk-takers? Certainly not *not* taking risks because of Government & taxes, whereas they actually had testicles when tax rates were 90%? Amiright?

But the current uncertain times have businesses and entrepreneurs sitting on their hands. Many like to look and plan to the future but with all the uncertainty how can you? The truth is you can’t until the government gets its act in order.

 

[miami_thomas]

Really, so the gay have the right to marriage already?

First society is still growing up. Second, Gays can get married they just want it recognized by the government. Why does the government have to recognize any marriage? Marriage is a religious thing that the government should get out of the middle of. As far as tax breaks for married couples, that did not work. It did not prevent a single family from breaking up. So get rid of it.

Why? Taxes(married gays want the status as hereto's). the right to marry is not a religious issue, you can be married without any religional influence, I have, twice.

That is bacause you had to because of the government. The fact is Marriage is a religious thing. Where else did marriage come from if not from religion?

 

[G.T.]

Yeah, that 1/6 of Americans on public assistance, credit downgrades, $5,000,000,000,000 new debt in 3 years, 40+ months of 8%+ unemployment, no growth, worthless U.S. $ is an awesome thing.

Thanks, thanks a lot.

Unemployment is supposed to be controlled by self-sufficient entrepreneurs. Where's all the hard working risk-takers? Certainly not *not* taking risks because of Government & taxes, whereas they actually had testicles when tax rates were 90%? Amiright?

But the current uncertain times have businesses and entrepreneurs sitting on their hands. Many like to look and plan to the future but with all the uncertainty how can you? The truth is you can’t until the government gets its act in order.

The uncertainty is a heckuva whole lot of right-wing propoganda because they want a D out of office - meanwhile back in reality - life ain't all that different at ALL.

 

[rdean]

Have Democrats truly been able to convince people that America of old was truly an awful place? We are talking about the top country in the world. We are talking about a country where everyone wished they could be. We are talking about one of the most successful nations of all times. How can anyone be dumb enough to believe it was a failure?

So the Democrats are selling that America of old was a failure and they want to offer what every other country has as a fix? This makes no sense either seeing that people in those other countries wanted to come here. True with Obama that has decreased because we are getting closer to what they already have. The Democrats are successfully destroying this country and making it like every other country. I mean no country has had as much success as America in its prime nor have they even come close.

I can’t see how so many people are buying this narrative? We are talking almost half the country. Are there that many people with blinders on? I just don’t get it. Do they not know what the reality is of these other countries people like Michael Moore try to put out as successful. I mean come on they have to know people risk their lives in dinky little boats just to get out of Cuba. Come on what gives?

Are you talking about slavery times or when the elderly were homeless and lived off cat food? Or some time in between? And can you name that time?

When it comes to Cuba, it's a matter of perspective. Better here doesn't mean "great" here. You can always make things better, but Conservative and Republican policies have ruined the economy and killed and maimed tens of thousands of young Americans for no reason even they can name. And their solution is to crush the middle class.

Are you sure you've thought this through?

Again read other comments in regard to the dumb slavery comment. As far as homeless living off cat food that is just plain dumb. That has not been the case since prior to the 1920s. Charities and churches provide for the poor. There is no perspective when it comes to Cuba. It is a God awful place and the people there that are not in the government live in hell. When you always try to make things better you can make things worse. Sometimes you have to do less to make things better especially when it comes to Government. Government is the ones not to be trusted not some evil corporation. Government has always been the enemy of freedom not the deliverer of freedom.

Charities provide for the poor? Oh you people. What is wrong with you? One of the largest charity organizations in the world, the Catholic Charities gets 70% of their revenue from the government. Don't you guys ever read the links? And that info came off the Catholic Charities website.

Actually it doesn't surprise me. How many times have right wingers said, "I don't need to read anything, I already know the truth"?

Well, at least you admit that poor people were eating cat food. But the question is, "How many companies sold canned cat food before the 20's?" Not many if any at all. Therefore, it must have been much later than the 20's. Oops.

 

[rightwinger]

First society is still growing up. Second, Gays can get married they just want it recognized by the government. Why does the government have to recognize any marriage? Marriage is a religious thing that the government should get out of the middle of. As far as tax breaks for married couples, that did not work. It did not prevent a single family from breaking up. So get rid of it.

Why? Taxes(married gays want the status as hereto's). the right to marry is not a religious issue, you can be married without any religional influence, I have, twice.

That is bacause you had to because of the government. The fact is Marriage is a religious thing. Where else did marriage come from if not from religion?

Marriage is a religious thing until it comes to:
Taxes
Survivorship
Medical Decisions
Divorce

Then we want the Government involved

 

[miami_thomas]

We would not have gotten civil rights without the government. The "people" had a hundred years to resolve the role of blacks in this country. They couldn't do it. It took the courts (non elected) and the Federal Government to force the issue. People fought it, many still do. Most eventually realized it was not that big a deal after all

They were doing it. Sure it was a battle but growing up is always a battle. But it was happening without government. You do realize the first black congressman was in 1868 and the first black senator was in 1870. The first black federal judge was in 1901. Those were long before the government got involved. Society grew up and that is why those things happened. It had nothing to do with the government and everything to do with the people in the government.

Learn your history. The black congressmen, senators and politicians were a result of reconstruction. They were forced on the people of the south and helped lead to the emergence of the clan. It had nothing to do with newfound liberalism in the south and everything to do with punitive reconstruction. Led to Jim Crow laws

After the Civil War we had 100 years to resolve the issue of blacks in America. Society on its own could not do it. It took a small group of protestors and the strength of the Federal Government to force the issue

Again if the majority had not wanted it then they could have removed the people from office and put people in that were pro-segregation.

 

[squeeze berry]

Why? Taxes(married gays want the status as hereto's). the right to marry is not a religious issue, you can be married without any religional influence, I have, twice.

That is bacause you had to because of the government. The fact is Marriage is a religious thing. Where else did marriage come from if not from religion?

Marriage is a religious thing until it comes to:
Taxes
Survivorship
Medical Decisions
Divorce

Then we want the Government involved

taxes: how much of a break if any?
survivorship: designation of beneficiary will take care of that
medical decisions: living will. POA
divorce: with gay marriage comes gay divorce. Are you certain that is a good thing?

 

[miami_thomas]

You responded with common-sense statements and implied that I wouldn't have known otherwise, which is a great subversion of rational discussion.

the fact is, the Government is taken over by big money, and big money comes from big corporate interests.

This is not even hidden anymore, it's out in the wide open - so to not acknowledge it and be a bit peeved about it, is to have fallen for the "look over there, at the left! look over there, at the right!" subversion tactic they play you overtly political types with, like a fiddle.

You honestly think Boehner sits and has a beer with Obama taking pictures and giggling - really thinks Obama is evil and destroying the country at the same time? Grow up, if so.

Democrats have been supposedly fighting big bad corporations for how long? Yet corporations are still doing fine. It is the small business that has paid the price for this battle. Second the big things that have hit corporations negatively would not have happened if what you say is true. In fact if what you say is true then it could never happen because they already run everything. The fact is that it is a lie. It is an excuse to give more power to the government to protect us from the big evil corporations. Fear is the way government uses to get us to give away our freedoms. To “Protect Us” But at the end of the day it is the government people should fear. People will always have a way to attack a corporation and prevent it from truly taking over; however, you have no recourse against the government. Once it has total control it is all over.

do you see me saying Democrats are not involved anywhere?

congrats on a post not even involved in the discussion because you went all childish "hes a progressive, obviously" route.

I never assume anyone is progressive or conservative. Heck many don’t even know the true meaning of the terms. But the discussion was regarding corporations and I responded regarding corporations. What I said should have no bearing on your affiliation.

 

[Katzndogz]

There is no marriage break with taxes. There is a marriage penalty instead.

TPC Tax Topics | Marriage Penalty

 

[G.T.]

Democrats have been supposedly fighting big bad corporations for how long? Yet corporations are still doing fine. It is the small business that has paid the price for this battle. Second the big things that have hit corporations negatively would not have happened if what you say is true. In fact if what you say is true then it could never happen because they already run everything. The fact is that it is a lie. It is an excuse to give more power to the government to protect us from the big evil corporations. Fear is the way government uses to get us to give away our freedoms. To “Protect Us” But at the end of the day it is the government people should fear. People will always have a way to attack a corporation and prevent it from truly taking over; however, you have no recourse against the government. Once it has total control it is all over.

do you see me saying Democrats are not involved anywhere?

congrats on a post not even involved in the discussion because you went all childish "hes a progressive, obviously" route.

I never assume anyone is progressive or conservative. Heck many don’t even know the true meaning of the terms. But the discussion was regarding corporations and I responded regarding corporations. What I said should have no bearing on your affiliation.

my point was - theyre perceived to have been "supposedly fighting," but in reality - no. Theyre all in pockets. It's out in the open.

 

[miami_thomas]

Are you talking about slavery times or when the elderly were homeless and lived off cat food? Or some time in between? And can you name that time?

When it comes to Cuba, it's a matter of perspective. Better here doesn't mean "great" here. You can always make things better, but Conservative and Republican policies have ruined the economy and killed and maimed tens of thousands of young Americans for no reason even they can name. And their solution is to crush the middle class.

Are you sure you've thought this through?

Again read other comments in regard to the dumb slavery comment. As far as homeless living off cat food that is just plain dumb. That has not been the case since prior to the 1920s. Charities and churches provide for the poor. There is no perspective when it comes to Cuba. It is a God awful place and the people there that are not in the government live in hell. When you always try to make things better you can make things worse. Sometimes you have to do less to make things better especially when it comes to Government. Government is the ones not to be trusted not some evil corporation. Government has always been the enemy of freedom not the deliverer of freedom.

During the periods of inflation and recession during the Carter and Reagan years there were many stories about old people, stealing food and eating animal food.

There are people stealing now and starving has nothing to do with it. As far as Carter and Reagan go, I’m not true fans of either. I think Carter was a disaster and I think Reagan allowed the deficit to balloon too much. Sure he made the cuts to taxes to help the economy grow but did nothing to cut spending.

 

[bripat9643]

America of old was not an awful place for most. But we are a better society today by far

Liberals have made this a better country

Wrong. We aren't a better society. We have almost as many people collecting checks from the government as we have people paying taxes. We are $15 trillion in debt and quickly going bankrupt. How is that better?