Hypocrisy Check

[ConHog]

You show a stupid videotape of a group of Palestinians and purport that to represent the view of the "vast majority" of Muslims....some 1657 million?

Don't be an embecile.

By the way, not that I agree with the stupid Catholic generalization any more than I do with the stupid Muslim generalization - but - anytime you have an organization shuffling known pedophile priests around within the organization and keeping them in contact with children - then, my friend, while you may not have a wholesale celebration but you most certainly have a tacit acceptance and, lets say - a lack of real condemnation for the act.

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

No, you posted it as an example of how the majority of muslims supported 9/11. It's as if someone said "The majority of Catholic priests support pedophilia. Here's an example" and then posted the following photo:

If your picture was a video of Catholics running around celebrating a child being molested, you would have a valid argument, but of course your argument is no more valid than you are.

 

[Coyote]

YouTube - Palestinian response on 11/9[/url]


Show me a video of ANY catholics celebrating that way when a child get's abused and you have an argument.

I'll wait.

You show a stupid videotape of a group of Palestinians and purport that to represent the view of the "vast majority" of Muslims....some 1657 million?

Don't be an embecile.

By the way, not that I agree with the stupid Catholic generalization any more than I do with the stupid Muslim generalization - but - anytime you have an organization shuffling known pedophile priests around within the organization and keeping them in contact with children - then, my friend, while you may not have a wholesale celebration but you most certainly have a tacit acceptance and, lets say - a lack of real condemnation for the act.

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

You made a claim:

"No, but the vast majority of Muslims are just fine with it happening ."

Then you stated:
For example.
(and posted the video).

The logical intention is that this video is representative of what the "vast majority" of Muslims think.

Do I have a video of them expressing outrage? No. I don't tend to bother with videos because they are easily distorted by cutting out important bits (context) and it's harder to verify their authenticity than it is with the written word.

However here is one link with examples of Muslim anger against the acts of 9/11: September 11 Terrorist Attack - Muslim Scholars Condemn September 11 Terrorist Attack

 

[ConHog]

You show a stupid videotape of a group of Palestinians and purport that to represent the view of the "vast majority" of Muslims....some 1657 million?

Don't be an embecile.

By the way, not that I agree with the stupid Catholic generalization any more than I do with the stupid Muslim generalization - but - anytime you have an organization shuffling known pedophile priests around within the organization and keeping them in contact with children - then, my friend, while you may not have a wholesale celebration but you most certainly have a tacit acceptance and, lets say - a lack of real condemnation for the act.

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

You made a claim:

"No, but the vast majority of Muslims are just fine with it happening ."

Then you stated:
For example.
(and posted the video).

The logical intention is that this video is representative of what the "vast majority" of Muslims think.

Do I have a video of them expressing outrage? No. I don't tend to bother with videos because they are easily distorted by cutting out important bits (context) and it's harder to verify their authenticity than it is with the written word.

However here is one link with examples of Muslim anger against the acts of 9/11: September 11 Terrorist Attack - Muslim Scholars Condemn September 11 Terrorist Attack

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

 

[Immanuel]

Just because a person may have "the right" to do something, there are times when consideration for others is the right thing to do. Many people who live in the area lost loved ones on 9/11. They feel like it's another slap in the face to build a mosque on that site. People may criticize them and call them bigots or whatever, but if you've lost someone in a terrorist attack it's kinda difficult to go along with the same religion the attackers murdered in the name of.

If my child was malled and killed by a bear in my front yard, I don't think my family would let me build a bear statue in the front yard.

I agree with you in point, but have to ask, how far away are we supposed to push them?

Two blocks still too close for you? How about two miles? Twenty? Two Hundred? Two Thousand?

When I first heard about the issue I was told ON ground zero. I was appalled that they would be so arrogant. Then I realized it was two blocks away. Okay, that is a little better but not much in my book. Still too close if you ask me, but then this IS a country founded on the idea of religious freedom.

If we are going to say we grant those kinds of freedoms we have to grant them even for people we are not all that fond of, including Muslims.

Like I said, two blocks is too close in my book, every time a person who lost a loved one at the WTC approaches the area from the street this Islamic Center is built on, it will be a reminder of who caused this, but then do we really support "religious" freedoms or is it that we support the freedoms of OUR religion and screw everyone else?

Immie

 

[sangha]

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

No, you posted it as an example of how the majority of muslims supported 9/11. It's as if someone said "The majority of Catholic priests support pedophilia. Here's an example" and then posted the following photo:

If your picture was a video of Catholics running around celebrating a child being molested, you would have a valid argument, but of course your argument is no more valid than you are.

The Catholics in that picture are doing something worse than celebrating. They are worshipping a supporter of pedophilia.

 

[Big Fitz]

Wow, talk about a concerted effort by some to derail the basic topic of discussion and try to make it all about how Christians are bad and not the hypocrisy of putting a mosque... oops "community center for muslims" practically on top of the WTC site, while if it was done to a muslim nation they'd have problems with a church over there. After all... thre's 1.2 billion muslims in the world, so they can be rightfully outraged, and well, we Christians and Americans have to just suck it.

 

[Immanuel]

Let me know when the plumbers union starts covering up for pedophiles. Then you'd have a valid point.



The vast majority of muslims did not fly a plane into the WTC towers. The OP is applying the rule of the exception. Talk to him

It doesn't matter, you are still blaming all Catholics for what a few of them and a few of their leaders have done.

This is where you are mistaken. I dont blame Catholics for the pedophilia. I blame "The Church". The Vatican has been an active supporter of pedophilia.

As I read further into the thread, I began to realize the point you were actually trying to make.

It appears that it was not so much that you blamed Catholics but rather that you were pointing out that the ideas were similar.

I don't quite agree with you, but I do think I see the point you were trying to make.

Immie

 

[sangha]

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

You made a claim:

"No, but the vast majority of Muslims are just fine with it happening ."

Then you stated:
For example.
(and posted the video).

The logical intention is that this video is representative of what the "vast majority" of Muslims think.

Do I have a video of them expressing outrage? No. I don't tend to bother with videos because they are easily distorted by cutting out important bits (context) and it's harder to verify their authenticity than it is with the written word.

However here is one link with examples of Muslim anger against the acts of 9/11: September 11 Terrorist Attack - Muslim Scholars Condemn September 11 Terrorist Attack

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

This is what I mean when I said you're talking to wall. Now, he's insisting on video without giving a reason why. It's as if he thinks going on 60 minutes and condemning 9/11 is somehow less of an action than dancing in the streets.

There isn't any videos of Americans running into the streets and staging protests on 9/11 either.

Remember, this is a guy who just said there is not contradiction in saying that bush both did, and did not, support spending bills.

 

[Shadow]

IMO, if we allow Catholics to build churches near schools, we should allow Muslims to build mosques near the WTC site

BTW - they're not building on the site of the WTC and they're not building a mosque.

Not equivalent. This is talking about building a church on/near the site of a terrorist attack caused by radical adherents to that religion, not next to a school.

Catholic clergymen raped children. They shouldn't be allowed near children

Muslim extremists killed people at WTC. They shouldn't be allowed near the WTC

Religious criminals should not be allowed near their victims

School teachers and coaches have raped children too,guess they shouldn't go to school or play sports. You sound like a broken record. Good to know you have your left wingnut flash cards handy at all times.

 

[sangha]

Wow, talk about a concerted effort by some to derail the basic topic of discussion and try to make it all about how Christians are bad and not the hypocrisy of putting a mosque... oops "community center for muslims" practically on top of the WTC site,

I guess you're OK with a titty bar being "practically on top".

At least, you're not complaining.

while if it was done to a muslim nation they'd have problems with a church over there.

So you think we should sink to their level? Just toss religious freedom?

 

[Coyote]

No, I presented the video as an example of Muslims celebrating, I did NOT present the video as proof that ALL Muslims were celebrating. if you have video evidence of Muslims acting in outrage immediately preceding 9/11 I would love to see it though.

You made a claim:

"No, but the vast majority of Muslims are just fine with it happening ."

Then you stated:
For example.
(and posted the video).

The logical intention is that this video is representative of what the "vast majority" of Muslims think.

Do I have a video of them expressing outrage? No. I don't tend to bother with videos because they are easily distorted by cutting out important bits (context) and it's harder to verify their authenticity than it is with the written word.

However here is one link with examples of Muslim anger against the acts of 9/11: September 11 Terrorist Attack - Muslim Scholars Condemn September 11 Terrorist Attack

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

So, basically - you're saying you are going to ignore a whole bunch of written quotes and statements from Muslims deploring it because it isn't a video?

Is literacy an issue here?

 

[ConHog]

You made a claim:

"No, but the vast majority of Muslims are just fine with it happening ."

Then you stated:
For example.
(and posted the video).

The logical intention is that this video is representative of what the "vast majority" of Muslims think.

Do I have a video of them expressing outrage? No. I don't tend to bother with videos because they are easily distorted by cutting out important bits (context) and it's harder to verify their authenticity than it is with the written word.

However here is one link with examples of Muslim anger against the acts of 9/11: September 11 Terrorist Attack - Muslim Scholars Condemn September 11 Terrorist Attack

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

So, basically - you're saying you are going to ignore a whole bunch of written quotes and statements from Muslims deploring it because it isn't a video?

Is literacy an issue here?

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

 

[NYcarbineer]

For Americans to rise above it ALL and embrace the idea of mosque near the site of 9/11 would be one of the most stunningly noble gestures in the history of religious freedom and tolerance...

...or, put another way, Americans aren't capable of acting out the ideals their country is founded upon.

He says of a country that just elected a black man with the middle name "Hussein".

Actually most of us didn't consider THAT a big deal. THAT was you people.

 

[sangha]

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

So, basically - you're saying you are going to ignore a whole bunch of written quotes and statements from Muslims deploring it because it isn't a video?

Is literacy an issue here?

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

What evidence? All you have so far is one video that you admit is not "a majority of muslims"

BTW, the links also have polls showing a majority of muslims, both in the US and worldwide, reject terrorism

 

[Immanuel]

Yep, you're right. IF the vast majority of Muslims around the world didn't feel that way you could EASILY find a video of some deploring it. And don't give me that crap about " I don't bother with videos."

So, basically - you're saying you are going to ignore a whole bunch of written quotes and statements from Muslims deploring it because it isn't a video?

Is literacy an issue here?

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

I think you would have to admit that the Media is guilty of making it appear to be the case. The News Media sells news... typically bad news sells. No one in America gets riled up (and thus watching the news for the next "affront") at seeing Muslims decry terror, but Americans sure get pissed at seeing them celebrate the attacks on 9/11. If seeing Muslims decry 9/11 got people watching the news, you would see it. Since it doesn't sell news, you ain't gonna see it.

Edit: That is also why you don't see Tea Party protests that don't involve racist signs or hear of such protests/rallies until and unless some jerk in the crowd yells out the N-Word or a congressman says he was spit upon.

Immie

 

[NYcarbineer]

For Americans to rise above it ALL and embrace the idea of mosque near the site of 9/11 would be one of the most stunningly noble gestures in the history of religious freedom and tolerance...

...or, put another way, Americans aren't capable of acting out the ideals their country is founded upon.

He says of a country that just elected a black man with the middle name "Hussein".

Excellent point.

An ironic attempt at a point since the right did everything in their power to try to make something of 'Hussein' and Obama's real and imagined kinship to Arabs and Muslims.

Less like an excellent point, more like stepped in it, every one of you.

Although perhaps in the with revisionism all the rage nowadays, we'll have to hear that 'hey what do you mean, we conservatives NEVER tried to make anything of Barack Obama's name or heritage!! Whachoo talkin' about!!'

lol

 

[theDoctorisIn]

So, basically - you're saying you are going to ignore a whole bunch of written quotes and statements from Muslims deploring it because it isn't a video?

Is literacy an issue here?

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

I think you would have to admit that the Media is guilty of making it appear to be the case. The News Media sells news... typically bad news sells. No one in America gets riled up (and thus watching the news for the next "affront") at seeing Muslims decry terror, but Americans sure get pissed at seeing them celebrate the attacks on 9/11. If seeing Muslims decry 9/11 got people watching the news, you would see it. Since it doesn't sell news, you ain't gonna see it.

Immie

Thousands of Muslims protested in the streets of Tehran AGAINST the attacks, back in 2001.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Iran's gulf of misunderstanding with US

 

[Immanuel]

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

I think you would have to admit that the Media is guilty of making it appear to be the case. The News Media sells news... typically bad news sells. No one in America gets riled up (and thus watching the news for the next "affront") at seeing Muslims decry terror, but Americans sure get pissed at seeing them celebrate the attacks on 9/11. If seeing Muslims decry 9/11 got people watching the news, you would see it. Since it doesn't sell news, you ain't gonna see it.

Immie

Thousands of Muslims protested in the streets of Tehran AGAINST the attacks, back in 2001.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Iran's gulf of misunderstanding with US

And like I said, did we in America hear about it from the American Media? I don't recall having heard about these protests.

It doesn't sell news in America so it doesn't get played on the Nightly News, but a hundred or so Palestinians in (I don't remember where that video was taken) who did celebrate the attacks and burned American flags (if I am not mistaken) were on the news for weeks.

Immie

 

[ConHog]

No, quite honestly I have an 18 month old in my lap and just overlooked your links. I just now noticed them. I have never denied that SOME Muslims decried the attack, but the evidence seems to back up my claim that MOST were thrilled .

I think you would have to admit that the Media is guilty of making it appear to be the case. The News Media sells news... typically bad news sells. No one in America gets riled up (and thus watching the news for the next "affront") at seeing Muslims decry terror, but Americans sure get pissed at seeing them celebrate the attacks on 9/11. If seeing Muslims decry 9/11 got people watching the news, you would see it. Since it doesn't sell news, you ain't gonna see it.

Immie

Thousands of Muslims protested in the streets of Tehran AGAINST the attacks, back in 2001.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Iran's gulf of misunderstanding with US

Yeah, I'm sure that wasn't politically motivated.

 

[sangha]

I think you would have to admit that the Media is guilty of making it appear to be the case. The News Media sells news... typically bad news sells. No one in America gets riled up (and thus watching the news for the next "affront") at seeing Muslims decry terror, but Americans sure get pissed at seeing them celebrate the attacks on 9/11. If seeing Muslims decry 9/11 got people watching the news, you would see it. Since it doesn't sell news, you ain't gonna see it.

Immie

Thousands of Muslims protested in the streets of Tehran AGAINST the attacks, back in 2001.

BBC NEWS | Middle East | Iran's gulf of misunderstanding with US

Yeah, I'm sure that wasn't politically motivated.

He asks for outraged protestors. He gets what he asks for, so he moves the goalposts

Like I've said before. Nothing will ever get conjob to admit he will say anything to avoid saying he was wrong