How many deaths are necessary before something should be banned?

[marvin martian]

No one wants to ban guns. We want background checks and common sense regulations. Same as we do for cars.

Guns are a civil right, cars are not.

When will you fascists ever understand that simple concept?

 

[LibertyKid]

They should ban cigarettes. The only diff is smokers kill themselves, not their neighbors.

What is 2nd hand smoke then? That's the stat I posted.

What does the number of deaths have to be before we want more regulations or banning of cigarettes and other items that produce smoke from tobacco? What's the number?

 

[sealybobo]

Guns are a civil right, cars are not.

When will you fascists ever understand that simple concept?

Not any gun you want though. I know what you are going to say and a part of me agrees. If the military has it, so should we. In case we need to fight our own government.

So while I want to say we should ban assault rifles, I know that's not the answer. Just better background checks to do all you can to make sure nuts don't get guns.

And if you get arrested for domestic violence, I think they should maybe POSSIBLY take your guns away from you.

 

[2aguy]

They should ban cigarettes. The only diff is smokers kill themselves, not their neighbors.

Guns are not regulated enough. We should take them much more seriously. I sell an aftermarket product where I can give the company I buy from the serial number and they can tell me when it was purchased, who purchased it.

Background checks, no straw purchases.

IDK. I just know we could do more.

Republicans want to make it easier for nuts to get guns and then execute them after they kill your mother or child. Too late c*&t.

Moron....you don't even know what a fucking straw purchase is.........

A straw purchase is me buying a gun for someone who can't buy a gun. I can buy that gun because I can pass any background check....so your background check laws do nothing to stop it.

We already have all the gun laws we need....

The problem, again, you dumb ass.....is the democrat party prosecutors and judges who keep releasing actual criminal gun offenders over and over again. If they stopped releasing them, our gun crime would drop 99%.

 

[hadit]

They should ban cigarettes. The only diff is smokers kill themselves, not their neighbors.

Guns are not regulated enough. We should take them much more seriously. I sell an aftermarket product where I can give the company I buy from the serial number and they can tell me when it was purchased, who purchased it.

Background checks, no straw purchases.

IDK. I just know we could do more.

Republicans want to make it easier for nuts to get guns and then execute them after they kill your mother or child. Too late c*&t.

That's not what I'm seeing. I'm seeing demands that we don't have any more mass shootings carried out by someone that has had dozens of visits by the police, are on an FBI watch list, and who have been hospitalized for violent rhetoric and outbursts. IOW, stop ignoring likely mass shooters when there are clear red flags warning us about them beforehand.

 

[LibertyKid]

I pretty much do recognize the right to drive a car as something you do gain at age 16, until you screw yours up by failing to go along with proper regulation, to make it safe for you to be on the road with others that do. Then you should lose it and if necessary, be jailed to keep you from doing it.

Cigarettes? There has been a public outcry to ban them going forward since the late 60s. People like me, have been forced from common inside areas and taxed beyond belief, supporting all sorts of unrelated revenue shortfalls, deemed worthy of government funding by somebody or some group. I don't smoke, even in my wife's car or our home, much less anybody else's or even in bars, though I rare visit a bar anymore. Being healthier and in better shape than anybody I know, I'd just as soon be left the fk alone. I should actually be thanked for all good works I support with my sin taxes, the "good" Americans don't wish to fund generally.

It is unlikely, they will ever have another ban on drinking, or an outright ban on cigarettes. The last prohibition did little or nothing except to spark highly lucrative major crime and black market fortunes, along with violence and deaths reported in the newspapers, never ending the problem they meant to attack.

But, where is the political and MSM media outcry to abolish tobacco.

The actual number of deaths related to both Alcohol and Tobacco vs Guns, is a staggering difference. The problem is for the person addicted to alcohol or tobacco, the vast majority only affect themselves. However there are deaths related to alcohol and tobacco that do affect others, but these deaths are ignored. I want to know what the number is before those deaths are just as important as gun deaths.

 

[sealybobo]

What is 2nd hand smoke then? That's the stat I posted.

What does the number of deaths have to be before we want more regulations or banning of cigarettes and other items that produce smoke from tobacco? What's the number?

Notice you can't smoke in bars anymore? We realized that smokers were killing non smokers in bars.

Hell, there are even condo complex' that ban smoking. Even outside!!!

And a company can fire you for smoking even if it's off property.

 

[Blues Man]

No one wants to ban guns. We want background checks and common sense regulations. Same as we do for cars.

Tell which guns we have that are not common sense.

Common sense would mean we actually enforce the gun laws we have on the books

 

[LibertyKid]

Notice you can't smoke in bars anymore? We realized that smokers were killing non smokers in bars.

Hell, there are even condo complex' that ban smoking. Even outside!!!

And a company can fire you for smoking even if it's off property.

But what's the number? Yes, states, cities, etc have abolished smoking in public in businesses, but not everywhere.

When are the deaths too many? If 30,000 gun deaths are too many for some people and guns should be abolished, than why not tobacco and alcohol? Yes, I'm trying to prove a point here.

 

[marvin martian]

Not any gun you want though. I know what you are going to say and a part of me agrees. If the military has it, so should we. In case we need to fight our own government.

So while I want to say we should ban assault rifles, I know that's not the answer. Just better background checks to do all you can to make sure nuts don't get guns.

And if you get arrested for domestic violence, I think they should maybe POSSIBLY take your guns away from you.

You can't even define an "assault rifle". You people don't even understand the basics about the civil rights you want to deprive us of. We've seen in recent years the extent of the hate and violence you people perpetrate against those you disagree with. If we weren't armed, you would have shoveled us all into ovens years ago, and we KNOW that if we're ever disarmed, that will be the very next step.

We WILL NOT let you chip away at our civil rights until there's nothing left. It's not going to happen.

 

[sealybobo]

common sense regulations?

like banning the firearm least responsible for deaths?

Solutions​

Everytown recommends these evidence-based solutions. Our research shows that common-sense public safety policies can reduce gun violence and save lives.

KEEP GUNS OUT OF THE WRONG HANDS​

• Alert Local Law Enforcement of Failed Background Checks
• Background Checks on All Gun Sales
• Close the Charleston Loophole
• Disarm Hate
• Extreme Risk Laws
• Prevent Gun Trafficking
• Prohibit People With Dangerous Histories From Having Guns
• Report Lost and Stolen Guns
• Require Prohibited People to Turn in Their Guns
• Waiting Periods

 

[sealybobo]

But what's the number? Yes, states, cities, etc have abolished smoking in public in businesses, but not everywhere.

When are the deaths too many? If 30,000 gun deaths are too many for some people and guns should be abolished, than why not tobacco and alcohol? Yes, I'm trying to prove a point here.

But no one is asking for guns to be abolished.

Let me ask you a question. How many family members of yours need to be gunned down before you will wake up and start being more open minded to common sense gun legislation such as

KEEP GUNS OUT OF THE WRONG HANDS​

• Alert Local Law Enforcement of Failed Background Checks
• Background Checks on All Gun Sales
• Close the Charleston Loophole
• Disarm Hate
• Extreme Risk Laws
• Prevent Gun Trafficking
• Prohibit People With Dangerous Histories From Having Guns
• Report Lost and Stolen Guns
• Require Prohibited People to Turn in Their Guns
• Waiting Periods

 

[sealybobo]

But what's the number? Yes, states, cities, etc have abolished smoking in public in businesses, but not everywhere.

When are the deaths too many? If 30,000 gun deaths are too many for some people and guns should be abolished, than why not tobacco and alcohol? Yes, I'm trying to prove a point here.

Every day, 120 Americans are killed with guns.

Lung cancer kills 382 people each day in the U.S.

 

[marvin martian]

But no one is asking for guns to be abolished.

Let me ask you a question. How many family members of yours need to be gunned down before you will wake up and start being more open minded to common sense gun legislation such as

KEEP GUNS OUT OF THE WRONG HANDS​

• Alert Local Law Enforcement of Failed Background Checks
• Background Checks on All Gun Sales
• Close the Charleston Loophole
• Disarm Hate
• Extreme Risk Laws
• Prevent Gun Trafficking
• Prohibit People With Dangerous Histories From Having Guns
• Report Lost and Stolen Guns
• Require Prohibited People to Turn in Their Guns
• Waiting Periods

Did you think we forgot your reaction to Hunter Biden getting busted for breaking federal gun laws?

CDZ - Two options...the European model of self defense, and the American model of Self defensse.

We kill lots of people. They don't kill nearly a many. We should do what they are doing. London does not have a drug-gang industry fueled by Fatherless poor Black communities like the US does. Replicate our inner cities in London and their statistics would be in line with ours. So you think...

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[sealybobo]

You can't even define an "assault rifle". You people don't even understand the basics about the civil rights you want to deprive us of. We've seen in recent years the extent of the hate and violence you people perpetrate against those you disagree with. If we weren't armed, you would have shoveled us all into ovens years ago, and we KNOW that if we're ever disarmed, that will be the very next step.

We WILL NOT let you chip away at our civil rights until there's nothing left. It's not going to happen.

I'm going to agree with you guys on this list. None of these things or most of these things won't stop gun violence. In fact, maybe more good people with concealed guns would make us safer. If a nut with a gun comes to school, I'd like to know some good people are packing

What are the solutions for gun violence?


Keep Communities Safe

• Block Concealed Carry Reciprocity.
• Keep Guns Off Campus.
• Prohibit Guns in Sensitive Areas.
• Prohibit Open Carry.
• Require Permits to Carry Concealed Guns in Public.
• Strong Standards for Carrying Concealed Guns in Public.
• Victims of Crime Act (VOCA) Assistance Funding.
• Violence Intervention Programs.

 

[2aguy]

But no one is asking for guns to be abolished.

Let me ask you a question. How many family members of yours need to be gunned down before you will wake up and start being more open minded to common sense gun legislation such as

KEEP GUNS OUT OF THE WRONG HANDS​

• Alert Local Law Enforcement of Failed Background Checks
• Background Checks on All Gun Sales
• Close the Charleston Loophole
• Disarm Hate
• Extreme Risk Laws
• Prevent Gun Trafficking
• Prohibit People With Dangerous Histories From Having Guns
• Report Lost and Stolen Guns
• Require Prohibited People to Turn in Their Guns
• Waiting Periods

Again, background checks are bypassed when criminals steal guns or use straw buyers.....the only reason you want them is to come back and demand gun registration....the true goal.


there is no gun show loophole.

It is already against the law to gun traffic to criminals.

We already have laws to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and the dangerously mentally ill.

Reporting lost or stolen guns? How about you simply lock up criminals caught with illegal guns, and add on time if they stole the gun?

Prohibited people can already be arrested if they are found with guns.

Waiting periods do nothing.....

So what else do you have since nothing you just posted would do anything to stop gun crime or gun murder.....

 

[2aguy]

I'm going to agree with you guys on this list. None of these things or most of these things won't stop gun violence. In fact, maybe more good people with concealed guns would make us safer. If a nut with a gun comes to school, I'd like to know some good people are packing

What are the solutions for gun violence?


Keep Communities Safe

• Block Concealed Carry Reciprocity.
• Keep Guns Off Campus.
• Prohibit Guns in Sensitive Areas.
• Prohibit Open Carry.
• Require Permits to Carry Concealed Guns in Public.
• Strong Standards for Carrying Concealed Guns in Public.
• Victims of Crime Act (VOCA) Assistance Funding.
• Violence Intervention Programs.

Solutions to gun violence?

Lock up violent criminals....

Notice that the following actual solutions do not target normal gun owners, but instead target actual criminals.....

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a gun in a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... with only 74 people murdered in mass public shootings in 2022 they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....

Mass shooters


1) end gun free zones

2) get the media to stop covering mass shootings like it is the Oscars.....

3) We are already seeing this...get people who know these nuts to report these nuts....

4) Make sure the police who know these nuts arrest these nuts when they have the chance so they will pop on background checks....

What does each do to stop mass shooters....

1) keeps shooters from targeting people, since they target gun free zones.

2) The media not covering it like they are the criminal oscars deters copycats...just like they stopped covering teen suicides to stop the copycat effect

3) The only way to stop mass shooters, since they commit no other crime, is for family, coworkers and neighbors to report their violent behavior....the Odessa shooter should have felonies for the crimes he was committing but they didn't report his shooting his weapon from his front porch....

4) The Parkland shooter had 33 contacts with police and numerous contacts with police at his school.....due to Obama's "Promise Program" the police never arrested him for the felonies he committed....so he didn't pop on the background check..

5). Harden public schools........ one entrance with buzz only access....police blue call boxes, like fire alarm pull stations, that send a call directly to the police station and all officers in the area, which will cut down response time by bypassing 911, saving minutes to save lives

6) allow schools to choose to arm and train some staff.....I like arming support staff over teachers because they have more freedom around the building and teachers main duty is to protect the children under their direct care.....and support staff could be anywhere in the building at any time, making it more difficult for mass shooters to plan because they may face armed resistance at any time......

 

[sealybobo]

Again, background checks are bypassed when criminals steal guns or use straw buyers.....the only reason you want them is to come back and demand gun registration....the true goal.


there is no gun show loophole.

It is already against the law to gun traffic to criminals.

We already have laws to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and the dangerously mentally ill.

Reporting lost or stolen guns? How about you simply lock up criminals caught with illegal guns, and add on time if they stole the gun?

Prohibited people can already be arrested if they are found with guns.

Waiting periods do nothing.....

So what else do you have since nothing you just posted would do anything to stop gun crime or gun murder.....

What? Don't bring up stolen guns when we're talking about background checks. That's just a distraction from the topic. Background checks.

What do you mean when you said
the only reason you want them is to come back and demand gun registration....the true goal.
Huh? The only reason I want background checks is to demand gun registration? Fuck yes. Everyone should register their guns. Are you afraid the government will use that list to round up your guns?

2. Yes you can buy a gun at a gun show, skip the background check and get a gun. Stop allowing this. You want a gun from a show? Then go tell the cops. Give them the serial number and they'll make sure that gun hasn't been used in a crime.

And pass a law straw purchases will not be tolerated. If you sell a gun to someone and you don't go through the process and they commit a crime, you go to jail too.

This legislation will help lower the number of school shooters

Parents of Michigan high school shooter Ethan Crumbley will go to trial, judges rule​

Ethan Crumbley, then 15, killed four students in the Oxford High School attack.

a three-judge panel with the Michigan Court of Appeals has ruled.

Jennifer and James Crumbley have pleaded not guilty to four counts of involuntary manslaughter in connection with the Nov. 30, 2021 mass shooting at Oxford High School.

I bet you and the NRA wouldn't have charged the parents.

 

[sealybobo]

Solutions to gun violence?

Lock up violent criminals....

Notice that the following actual solutions do not target normal gun owners, but instead target actual criminals.....

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a gun in a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... with only 74 people murdered in mass public shootings in 2022 they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....

Mass shooters


1) end gun free zones

2) get the media to stop covering mass shootings like it is the Oscars.....

3) We are already seeing this...get people who know these nuts to report these nuts....

4) Make sure the police who know these nuts arrest these nuts when they have the chance so they will pop on background checks....

What does each do to stop mass shooters....

1) keeps shooters from targeting people, since they target gun free zones.

2) The media not covering it like they are the criminal oscars deters copycats...just like they stopped covering teen suicides to stop the copycat effect

3) The only way to stop mass shooters, since they commit no other crime, is for family, coworkers and neighbors to report their violent behavior....the Odessa shooter should have felonies for the crimes he was committing but they didn't report his shooting his weapon from his front porch....

4) The Parkland shooter had 33 contacts with police and numerous contacts with police at his school.....due to Obama's "Promise Program" the police never arrested him for the felonies he committed....so he didn't pop on the background check..

5). Harden public schools........ one entrance with buzz only access....police blue call boxes, like fire alarm pull stations, that send a call directly to the police station and all officers in the area, which will cut down response time by bypassing 911, saving minutes to save lives

6) allow schools to choose to arm and train some staff.....I like arming support staff over teachers because they have more freedom around the building and teachers main duty is to protect the children under their direct care.....and support staff could be anywhere in the building at any time, making it more difficult for mass shooters to plan because they may face armed resistance at any time......

I like a lot of your ideas too.

 

[White 6]

But, where is the political and MSM media outcry to abolish tobacco.

The actual number of deaths related to both Alcohol and Tobacco vs Guns, is a staggering difference. The problem is for the person addicted to alcohol or tobacco, the vast majority only affect themselves. However there are deaths related to alcohol and tobacco that do affect others, but these deaths are ignored. I want to know what the number is before those deaths are just as important as gun deaths.

Oh, I don't think it necessary anymore. It is cut in stone, smokers are an easy mark for singling out for tax hikes, as their likes and lifestyles, though often unrelated to their personal realties have been weighed and measured for the good of all, pronounced deficient to the point of no personal defence acceptable or listened to in polite society and are just a guaranteed income stream, worthy of any sin tax a state legislature wishes to impose. They have smokers where they want them. Now they are turning their attention to gun owners, not criminals or mentally defective, but all gun owners to put them in the same place, whether they are a threat or not, and not a matter of simple regulation, but one of relegation, to the ranks of the negative, with the only thing standing in the way being our constitution, a constitution that is under general attack from multiple sides, including Republicans and especially Trumpers.