How can a Christian God exist given this?

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by mattskramer, Oct 20, 2008.

  1. mattskramer
    Offline

    mattskramer Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Messages:
    5,852
    Thanks Received:
    359
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Texas
    Ratings:
    +359
    Please help me by giving me your perspective on a topic/issue that has been on my mind for a long time. You might call it a more “down-to-earth and human issue”. Why do bad things happen to good people – and don’t give me that “free will and choice” excuse. Some people are so young that they don’t have free will and sometimes the suffering that people endure is not even the fault of the parents.

    I have a series of “yes-no” questions for you and a follow up question demanding an explanation. This has puzzled me for a long time and no one has given me a satisfactory explanation – at least an explanation that satisfied me. It is a key thing that drove me away from God – at least the benevolent, fair, all knowing, and all powerful god that most Christians consider. Please don’t give me a complicated convoluted complex high-brow explanation filled with apologist jargon.

    1. Is god all-knowing? Yes?
    2. Is god all-powerful? Yes?
    3. Is god all-good? Yes?
    4. Does god hold each one responsible for choices that he makes? Yes?

    Then how the h@II do you explain this?!?!!?

    http://www.flatrock.org.nz/topics/odds_and_oddities/ultimate_in_unfair.htm

    Look at the child practically preparing to be food for the vulture. Did the child, with free will and such, make a decision that resulted in this?

    In my opinion, if there is a god, he she it or they either don’t know everything that is going on, can’t do anything about what goes on everywhere, does not care what is going on, or is random in the way that he imposes punishment. Explain.
     
  2. RetiredGySgt
    Offline

    RetiredGySgt Platinum Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2007
    Messages:
    39,508
    Thanks Received:
    5,897
    Trophy Points:
    1,140
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Ratings:
    +8,920
    You may want to learn about the Christian God and why he does what he does. Satan made a claim about man and so God gave earth to him to prove his point. God does not interfere with man because he agreed to not do so until the end of times. After Satan fails we will be all judged and those not found evil will be give a perfect earth to live on with no disease or sickness or death. An earth ruled by Jesus as our King.

    You will have to ask a Muslim to explain why God allows bad things to happen from their prospective and a Jew for theirs.
     
  3. Gentlewarrior
    Offline

    Gentlewarrior Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2008
    Messages:
    4
    Thanks Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  4. sparky
    Offline

    sparky VIP Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    3,326
    Thanks Received:
    324
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    paradise
    Ratings:
    +341
  5. LionSiege
    Offline

    LionSiege Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2008
    Messages:
    3
    Thanks Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Location:
    Louisiana
    Ratings:
    +1
    Your question is centered around the classic case of which all religions grapple with; suffering and the exitsence of God.

    All I can say is that though I see the same image as you it doesn't shake my faith in God. I believe we must, one, look beyond the temporal and trust that God shall right what is wrong in the eternal. Secondly, as a believer, it sturs a feeling of compassion for the plight of people so unfortunate. These people have a value in their life being created in the likness of God so we ought help them as we are fit to do so through finacial giving and humanitarian support. I'll be in Africa next summer. Your faith in the goodness of God must be greater than the suffering of a fallen world, or you'll just end up like that photographer and give up.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  6. ABikerSailor
    Offline

    ABikerSailor Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2008
    Messages:
    31,360
    Thanks Received:
    4,794
    Trophy Points:
    1,140
    Location:
    Amarillo TX
    Ratings:
    +8,408
    It's not so much that God allows bad things to happen, it is that people decide to do bad things to each other. It's the conflict between the yetzer harrah, and the yetzer hartov (animal nature vs. God nature).

    Now....the thing that happens is that there are lots of people, who, in their desire to pursue their own version of pleasure, end up going down the wrong road and running away from God. But.....they can't really "run away from God" because there is a piece of God in each and every one of us in the form of our soul. You may know it better as your conscience, you know, that little voice in your head that tells you something isn't a good idea.

    Now.....some people decide that they don't want to listen to that little voice, and they spend a great deal of time stifling it. After a while, they find a way to ignore it. When they've finally figured out how to ignore it once, every time it pops up afterwards, they've already got a way to ignore it yet again. Ignore your conscience long enough, and you eventually can't hear it. Think of it as adding layers of paint over a light. Eventually, whether or not the light is turned on, it won't glow. Same with ignoring your soul......eventually, you "shellac" it to the point where God has lost all contact with you, because you've spent so much time running away from Him, and you're no longer able to hear what He's trying to tell you.

    When that happens, you start to believe that there is no God, and therefore, you are able to do as you please, regardless of the damage or pain it may cause yourself or others. Now, when you're at this point, you are no longer in contact with God, and He is no longer in contact with you. So, instead of being able to stop you with just a gentle word in your mind, and showing you a better way, you are only able to be noticed when it impacts upon others, as in a murder, robbery, or anything else that goes against the 10 Commandments. When it is found out that you have done something to harm another person, others take notice and then law enforcement, nations, etc, get involved and try to bring the perpetrator to justice.

    It's not so much that God allows it to happen, it is that some people have spent so much time running from Him, that they are able to hide for a short, at least, until their behavior becomes so aberrant and they end up doing mass murder (like Cho), or become serial killers (like Dahmer), or any other really bad thing that happens in the world.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  7. Gurdari
    Offline

    Gurdari Egaliterra

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2007
    Messages:
    1,019
    Thanks Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    the West
    Ratings:
    +40
    Bad things happening to good people? Where?

    If you can define 'bad things' and then define 'good people' it would be easier.
    There is no right or wrong, only desirable and undesirable.

    What is a god?

    1. Is god all-knowing? no evidence suggests that
    2. Is god all-powerful? no evidence suggests that
    3. Is god all-good? HWat the hell does that eve mean? either way: no evidence suggests that
    4. Does god hold each one responsible for choices that he makes? What does that mean? again: no evidence suggests that is true either



    Though for some sweet sounding guess-work, contact any true believer.
     
  8. mattskramer
    Offline

    mattskramer Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Messages:
    5,852
    Thanks Received:
    359
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Texas
    Ratings:
    +359
    What did that little child do that was so bad?
     
  9. Truthmatters
    Offline

    Truthmatters BANNED

    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Messages:
    80,182
    Thanks Received:
    2,223
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings:
    +2,233
    The answer is there is no God.

    See how simple that one was?
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  10. 9 Volt
    Offline

    9 Volt Shaking You Violently

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2008
    Messages:
    321
    Thanks Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Ratings:
    +23
    Satan doesn't exist. He's an amendment to the original writings.
     

Share This Page