"He's not MY president"

[Brian Blackwell]

Thank you for your explanation. I'm not sure if I understand, though. In any society, there has to be a heirarchy of persons who make the rules and ensure al the people in that society have their own rights not infringed upon,

If every person "was an island" without any laws to keep order in the land chaos would ensue.

If you feel no one can rule you, you may feel that no person can walk on the street where your home is built.
BUt someone will walk down that street and an argument will begin. The arguing continues and you shoot the man that walked down that street, What a dismal story. The man was okay to walk down that street and it was fine for you to shoot him for there weren no laws at all,

The man who was waking in that steet was a waste employee picking up trash. His family's home will be gone for the family could not afford a home without that income. So, a father is gone, a family on the street without food but there will be no recourse against you because no one rules over you.

So much for each person's moral judgement being society's only limitation of behaviors.

I understand the concern, but you must admit that this outlandish scenario is not thoroughly thought-out. First of all, it implies that governmental law stops things like that from happening, which it absolutely doesn't (Exhibit A: the nightly news every single night). Also, it implies that the only thing stopping people from shooting their garbage man (or other innocent citizens) is the law. Is that the only thing stopping you? Do you suppose that's the only thing stopping all those people shopping with you at the mall? It also implies that there are no consequences without law; that no one would defend themselves, or their neighbors. And lastly, it implies that there could never be a full-time organized protection and investigation agency without government.

The only thing that government is removing from the equation (beside parasitical corruption, war, and other crimes against humanity on a massive scale) is the notion of authority, i.e. the right to rule. If I pay a bodyguard to protect me, or an armed security guard to protect my business, he does not suppose that he has any rights I don't have. He is merely executing my rights in my stead. He cannot stop people on the street and ask to look in their backpack, then throw them in a cage for having a plant. He doesn't everyone at every turn via fines. He doesn't feel justified bossing everyone around, especially since I am his direct employer and I am free to refuse his service and hire someone else if I'm not satisfied or if customers are complaining. We have bodyguards and security guards now, do they behave like police? He is also not going to fly halfway around the world and kill people he never met because he believes in a flag and the lies that go with it.

The fallacious belief in authority is what's wrong with government. We can still have organization, voluntary hierarchy, crowd-funding, etc. (just like any business, habitat for humanity, or any other voluntary cooperation between people etc.)

 

[Brian Blackwell]

If he's not your president then you can't impeach him

I'm not advocating impeaching him, I'm advocating ignoring him and the entire system that supports the existence of a president.

Go back to Mexico or China or wherever the hell you came from then.

I was born here

So was Benedict Arnold we know how to deal with your kind.

Benedict Arnold is not an apt comparison. Maybe more like Thomas Paine...

While you're waving your flag on the Fourth of July, remember that the spirit of the men who freed us from the tyranny of an over-bearing government can be found in the words I'm speaking here (and what they revolted against looks like anarchy compared to what we have now). "Love it or leave it" would have made you a redcoat sympathizer in 1776.

 

[Tilly]

Wingers scream "he's not MY President" now whenever the other party is in the White House.

Silly wingers. If you're a United States citizen, if you live here, he's your President.

Says you, and says him, but I never consented to his rule, or anyone else's. And no, being born and remaining in the place of my birth does not qualify as consent.

But you consent to your democratic processes, ie voting?

 

[Brian Blackwell]

Trump has made Palin irrelevant by being the must ignorant and dysfunctional human being in American politics. I never would have thought that was possible. I now know for sure that nobody could possibly set the standard lower than Trump has, and i find a small comfort in knowing that it is impossible to get a worse chief executive in the future.

My hope is that the lunacy of having this man be the *cough* "Leader of the free world" (a joke on so many levels) will help to wake people up to realizing that this whole dog-and-pony show isn't real. It literally is not real. There were many better actors before him, but with Trump it's downright obvious that this man is not capable of running a nation at all, and yet the nation persists, so the nature of president-as-puppet is more apparent.

It's hard to conduct business when every move is blocked and hindered by the Goddamn Progressive Liberal Commie bastards in Congress and SCOTUS. A curse upon all of them.

Well that's always the pretext for the false promises, isn't it? Obama couldn't close Guantanamo or get us out of the Middle East. Aw, shucks, he really wanted to but, ya know, checks and balances *shrug*

It's a con. It's a game. They rape and pillage and murder and the circus you see on TV is a cover, nothing more. You're dealing with gangsters. Until this is understood, your worldview is too (purposefully) poisoned to see what's going on. Not everyone in government, obviously, but at the highest levels and beyond, that's the score; and it's dreadfully apparent to anyone who's relinquished the Civics Class dream.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

Wingers scream "he's not MY President" now whenever the other party is in the White House.

Silly wingers. If you're a United States citizen, if you live here, he's your President.

Says you, and says him, but I never consented to his rule, or anyone else's. And no, being born and remaining in the place of my birth does not qualify as consent.

But you consent to your democratic processes, ie voting?

No, not at all. I do not recognize the claimed authority of the president to rule anyone but himself. To me, lawmakers are bandits that jump out from behind a tree while you're passing on the road. I don't know them, I don't want to talk to them, they have nothing to do with me, and I'll do anything within reason to keep them away from me.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Wingers scream "he's not MY President" now whenever the other party is in the White House.

Silly wingers. If you're a United States citizen, if you live here, he's your President.

Says you, and says him, but I never consented to his rule, or anyone else's. And no, being born and remaining in the place of my birth does not qualify as consent.

He's your President, so get over it.

 

[initforme]

The OP has just figured out that the uber wealthy call all the shots and let the rest have a few crumbs. It took you long enough. This has been going on for a long long time. No use in comp!aining just go to work and fend for your family. Some will say ohhh you can become rich too but they know that's a bunch of bunk. Just suck it up and deal with it. Can't change it. It matters not who is president its all the same. The working poor and middle class will for some reason buy into one side or the other because of reasons unknown.

 

[Syriusly]

It goes hand in hand with "If you don't vote, you have no right to complain"...

If we all agree to draw straws to see who get tossed into the volcano, and you draw short, how do you have a right to complain? You agreed to draw straws in the first place.

Of course he's YOUR president, you voted to have a president in the first place, and knew the nature of the game going in - corrupt elections and all. The only people who DO have a right to complain are those who reject the system outright and don't vote at all.

We squabble over the sword of power, clamoring around it like naked animals around a trough. But where is the voice of that noble minority who says "bury the sword"? Nowhere to be found in the mass media - that's for sure - and where they are heard, they are chastised without fail for daring to question the cultural indoctrination.

Are we so narrow in our vision that we cannot see the divide-and-conquer nature of democracy? Over every issue imaginable we are made to choose a side and hurl stones across the fence. All the while the richest and most powerful people in the world laugh hysterically on route to the bank. We picket outside the Capital, while the criminals inside peek through the curtains and grin... "Look at them begging... they still believe in our power".

They love to see you picketing. They love to see you on line at the polls. Voting is a census to find out how many people are still buying into the con of politicians' right to rule. You think those with the wealth and power to guide events are going to allow nature to take its course? You think they're just going to sit back and let the people choose their leaders? They are like the parent who offers the stubborn child a false choice: "You're a big boy now, Timmy, you get to choose for yourself - would you like broccoli or peas with dinner?" The child thinks he's made a choice, but the parent wins either way. Timmy is getting stinky vegetables, whichever way he goes.

With big money marketing and control of the media, they present you only with choices that serve their ends. So choose away and feel like you've actually done something. When one party has taken theft and injustice as far as the people can stand, the swing voters usher in the opposing party, which continues the relay race as far as they can until they've worn out their welcome, and it switches again. The left/right march into outright tyranny, with the spirit of revolution being vented by the false "change" of a switch in parties.

You are a joke to them, and this post SHOULD make you mad - but not at the messenger. You've been conned, and no amount of working within the con will free you from getting shackled and fleeced. He IS your president - they all are - because you've bought into the sham hook, line, and sinker. And we'll never get anywhere until we snap out of our stupor and realize that it's not the person sitting on the throne that's the problem, it's the throne itself.

I didn't bother to read most of your overly long post.

Donald Trump is our President- I am not happy about it- but he is our President.

Just as President Obama was our President and the contards were busy declaring he was not their President.

Whoever is sworn into office is our President- love him or hate him.

 

[Harry Dresden]

My President is Trump. Who is your president? Mine won.

My president is my own moral judgment. All you've "won" is a new master.

if you live here he is your master too.....

 

[initforme]

My master is my lord and savior Jesus Christ. The true master. Presidents are average ordinary men who were born into money and power. Big difference.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

Wingers scream "he's not MY President" now whenever the other party is in the White House.

Silly wingers. If you're a United States citizen, if you live here, he's your President.

Says you, and says him, but I never consented to his rule, or anyone else's. And no, being born and remaining in the place of my birth does not qualify as consent.

He's your President, so get over it.

By what authority? A piece of parchment written hundreds of years before I was born? A bunch of people doing some lever-pulling ritual? He’s a man, I’m a man, he has no claim on me other than the dream you and he share.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

The OP has just figured out that the uber wealthy call all the shots and let the rest have a few crumbs. It took you long enough. This has been going on for a long long time. No use in comp!aining just go to work and fend for your family. Some will say ohhh you can become rich too but they know that's a bunch of bunk. Just suck it up and deal with it. Can't change it. It matters not who is president its all the same. The working poor and middle class will for some reason buy into one side or the other because of reasons unknown.

You seem to get it, but if we turn a blind eye, that family you’re fending for now may someday “...wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered” (Jefferson).

Remember, “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”

 

[Brian Blackwell]

It goes hand in hand with "If you don't vote, you have no right to complain"...

If we all agree to draw straws to see who get tossed into the volcano, and you draw short, how do you have a right to complain? You agreed to draw straws in the first place.

Of course he's YOUR president, you voted to have a president in the first place, and knew the nature of the game going in - corrupt elections and all. The only people who DO have a right to complain are those who reject the system outright and don't vote at all.

We squabble over the sword of power, clamoring around it like naked animals around a trough. But where is the voice of that noble minority who says "bury the sword"? Nowhere to be found in the mass media - that's for sure - and where they are heard, they are chastised without fail for daring to question the cultural indoctrination.

Are we so narrow in our vision that we cannot see the divide-and-conquer nature of democracy? Over every issue imaginable we are made to choose a side and hurl stones across the fence. All the while the richest and most powerful people in the world laugh hysterically on route to the bank. We picket outside the Capital, while the criminals inside peek through the curtains and grin... "Look at them begging... they still believe in our power".

They love to see you picketing. They love to see you on line at the polls. Voting is a census to find out how many people are still buying into the con of politicians' right to rule. You think those with the wealth and power to guide events are going to allow nature to take its course? You think they're just going to sit back and let the people choose their leaders? They are like the parent who offers the stubborn child a false choice: "You're a big boy now, Timmy, you get to choose for yourself - would you like broccoli or peas with dinner?" The child thinks he's made a choice, but the parent wins either way. Timmy is getting stinky vegetables, whichever way he goes.

With big money marketing and control of the media, they present you only with choices that serve their ends. So choose away and feel like you've actually done something. When one party has taken theft and injustice as far as the people can stand, the swing voters usher in the opposing party, which continues the relay race as far as they can until they've worn out their welcome, and it switches again. The left/right march into outright tyranny, with the spirit of revolution being vented by the false "change" of a switch in parties.

You are a joke to them, and this post SHOULD make you mad - but not at the messenger. You've been conned, and no amount of working within the con will free you from getting shackled and fleeced. He IS your president - they all are - because you've bought into the sham hook, line, and sinker. And we'll never get anywhere until we snap out of our stupor and realize that it's not the person sitting on the throne that's the problem, it's the throne itself.

I didn't bother to read most of your overly long post.

Donald Trump is our President- I am not happy about it- but he is our President.

Just as President Obama was our President and the contards were busy declaring he was not their President.

Whoever is sworn into office is our President- love him or hate him.

Consider it a short essay. Having not read the length of it, I think you misunderstand my position. I have nothing against Trump that couldn’t be said of Washington, Lincoln, et al.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

if you live here he is your master too.....

That’s slave talk, quite obviously. It’s a battle of the mind. Would you tell Patrick Henry that the King was his master?

 

[Harry Dresden]

if you live here he is your master too.....

That’s slave talk, quite obviously. It’s a battle of the mind. Would you tell Patrick Henry that the King was his master?

you are under the same shit as the rest of us....you can play your big bullshit game here about how you dont follow this or that,but at the end of the day you are no different than the rest of us...

 

[Brian Blackwell]

if you live here he is your master too.....

That’s slave talk, quite obviously. It’s a battle of the mind. Would you tell Patrick Henry that the King was his master?

you are under the same shit as the rest of us....you can play your big bullshit game here about how you dont follow this or that,but at the end of the day you are no different than the rest of us...

More slave talk... "Who are you to think you're free?!"

I would argue that there is a huge difference between believing and actively supporting the notion of valid governmental authority, and not doing so. Yes, I am subject to the physical threat of government just like everyone else, but should a significant minority recognize the illegitimacy of government, it can be abolished by simply ignoring its dictates (see the Indian liberation movement inspired by Gandhi).

 

[TemplarKormac]

It goes hand in hand with "If you don't vote, you have no right to complain"...

If we all agree to draw straws to see who get tossed into the volcano, and you draw short, how do you have a right to complain? You agreed to draw straws in the first place.

Of course he's YOUR president, you voted to have a president in the first place, and knew the nature of the game going in - corrupt elections and all. The only people who DO have a right to complain are those who reject the system outright and don't vote at all.

We squabble over the sword of power, clamoring around it like naked animals around a trough. But where is the voice of that noble minority who says "bury the sword"? Nowhere to be found in the mass media - that's for sure - and where they are heard, they are chastised without fail for daring to question the cultural indoctrination.

Are we so narrow in our vision that we cannot see the divide-and-conquer nature of democracy? Over every issue imaginable we are made to choose a side and hurl stones across the fence. All the while the richest and most powerful people in the world laugh hysterically on route to the bank. We picket outside the Capital, while the criminals inside peek through the curtains and grin... "Look at them begging... they still believe in our power".

They love to see you picketing. They love to see you on line at the polls. Voting is a census to find out how many people are still buying into the con of politicians' right to rule. You think those with the wealth and power to guide events are going to allow nature to take its course? You think they're just going to sit back and let the people choose their leaders? They are like the parent who offers the stubborn child a false choice: "You're a big boy now, Timmy, you get to choose for yourself - would you like broccoli or peas with dinner?" The child thinks he's made a choice, but the parent wins either way. Timmy is getting stinky vegetables, whichever way he goes.

With big money marketing and control of the media, they present you only with choices that serve their ends. So choose away and feel like you've actually done something. When one party has taken theft and injustice as far as the people can stand, the swing voters usher in the opposing party, which continues the relay race as far as they can until they've worn out their welcome, and it switches again. The left/right march into outright tyranny, with the spirit of revolution being vented by the false "change" of a switch in parties.

You are a joke to them, and this post SHOULD make you mad - but not at the messenger. You've been conned, and no amount of working within the con will free you from getting shackled and fleeced. He IS your president - they all are - because you've bought into the sham hook, line, and sinker. And we'll never get anywhere until we snap out of our stupor and realize that it's not the person sitting on the throne that's the problem, it's the throne itself.

In sum, refusing to acknowledge the will of the majority is the first step to tyranny. He's your president. Stop whining.

 

[TemplarKormac]

if you live here he is your master too.....

That’s slave talk, quite obviously. It’s a battle of the mind. Would you tell Patrick Henry that the King was his master?

you are under the same shit as the rest of us....you can play your big bullshit game here about how you dont follow this or that,but at the end of the day you are no different than the rest of us...

More slave talk... "Who are you to think you're free?!"

I would argue that there is a huge difference between believing and actively supporting the notion of valid governmental authority, and not doing so. Yes, I am subject to the physical threat of government just like everyone else, but should a significant minority recognize the illegitimacy of government, it can be abolished by simply ignoring its dictates (see the Indian liberation movement inspired by Gandhi).

You are advocating for anarchy. That is unacceptable. Government needs to be minimized, not abolished.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

It goes hand in hand with "If you don't vote, you have no right to complain"...

If we all agree to draw straws to see who get tossed into the volcano, and you draw short, how do you have a right to complain? You agreed to draw straws in the first place.

Of course he's YOUR president, you voted to have a president in the first place, and knew the nature of the game going in - corrupt elections and all. The only people who DO have a right to complain are those who reject the system outright and don't vote at all.

We squabble over the sword of power, clamoring around it like naked animals around a trough. But where is the voice of that noble minority who says "bury the sword"? Nowhere to be found in the mass media - that's for sure - and where they are heard, they are chastised without fail for daring to question the cultural indoctrination.

Are we so narrow in our vision that we cannot see the divide-and-conquer nature of democracy? Over every issue imaginable we are made to choose a side and hurl stones across the fence. All the while the richest and most powerful people in the world laugh hysterically on route to the bank. We picket outside the Capital, while the criminals inside peek through the curtains and grin... "Look at them begging... they still believe in our power".

They love to see you picketing. They love to see you on line at the polls. Voting is a census to find out how many people are still buying into the con of politicians' right to rule. You think those with the wealth and power to guide events are going to allow nature to take its course? You think they're just going to sit back and let the people choose their leaders? They are like the parent who offers the stubborn child a false choice: "You're a big boy now, Timmy, you get to choose for yourself - would you like broccoli or peas with dinner?" The child thinks he's made a choice, but the parent wins either way. Timmy is getting stinky vegetables, whichever way he goes.

With big money marketing and control of the media, they present you only with choices that serve their ends. So choose away and feel like you've actually done something. When one party has taken theft and injustice as far as the people can stand, the swing voters usher in the opposing party, which continues the relay race as far as they can until they've worn out their welcome, and it switches again. The left/right march into outright tyranny, with the spirit of revolution being vented by the false "change" of a switch in parties.

You are a joke to them, and this post SHOULD make you mad - but not at the messenger. You've been conned, and no amount of working within the con will free you from getting shackled and fleeced. He IS your president - they all are - because you've bought into the sham hook, line, and sinker. And we'll never get anywhere until we snap out of our stupor and realize that it's not the person sitting on the throne that's the problem, it's the throne itself.

In sum, refusing to acknowledge the will of the majority is the first step to tyranny. He's your president. Stop whining.

Ah, so the abolitionists were the real tyrants in 19th century America? Obviously not, though they refused to acknowledge the will of the majority and helped slaves escape to the north.

So that model's not going to work. Not to mention, this doesn't address the larger point of the post, which is not to say that Trump is bad, but that the office he holds is inherently invalid and morally anti-human.

 

[Brian Blackwell]

if you live here he is your master too.....

That’s slave talk, quite obviously. It’s a battle of the mind. Would you tell Patrick Henry that the King was his master?

you are under the same shit as the rest of us....you can play your big bullshit game here about how you dont follow this or that,but at the end of the day you are no different than the rest of us...

More slave talk... "Who are you to think you're free?!"

I would argue that there is a huge difference between believing and actively supporting the notion of valid governmental authority, and not doing so. Yes, I am subject to the physical threat of government just like everyone else, but should a significant minority recognize the illegitimacy of government, it can be abolished by simply ignoring its dictates (see the Indian liberation movement inspired by Gandhi).

You are advocating for anarchy. That is unacceptable. Government needs to be minimized, not abolished.

Maybe it's unacceptable, maybe it's not. We wouldn't know until we investigate it in earnest. If you simply block the idea at the gate, without actually considering the full arguments for and against, then you are merely expressing culturally-programmed bias, not critical reasoning. In order to defend the support of government without descending into cognitive dissonance, you must address the major objections. One such objection has been discussed here:

CDZ - The Government of No Authority, Part 1: Law and Morality