Has Obama just snatched defeat from victory?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Oldguy, Dec 21, 2012.

  1. Oldguy
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    Oldguy Senior Member

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    The President and his advisors may have just made a major mistake in the fiscal cliff and debt ceiling negotiations. In fact, they may have just saved the Republican's bacon.

    Obama's "Plan B," the stripped down version he's pushing now, has nothing in it the GOP can't vote against. Oh, some wheeling and dealing might be done which allows them to kick the ball on into next year, but adding in his insistence upon passing some kind of gun legislation immediately has given the GOP leverage they didn't have earlier this week.

    By making gun legislation a signature item, attaching his name to it and demanding it be done forthwith, he's handed the GOP a weapon they can beat him to death with. Resisting gun legislation is a no-brainer for the GOP and they lose nothing by refusing to even consider it. Not only that, but they can harvest enormous amounts of political hay because it seems to prove what the Nutter's have been saying all along: "Obama's coming to get your guns!"

    Whether or not that's true, it DOES put the House into the position of basically saying, "You want a gun bill? Fine, we'll pass something...BUT you'd better back off on taxing the rich and you'd better offer up some serious budget cuts or your gun bill dies right here." They have nothing to lose and much to gain by holding that position.

    Obama never has been a really strong leader and he's not always gotten good political advice from his inner circle. That seems to be the case now and he might have just punked his own hand.
     
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  2. OKTexas
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    OKTexas New Life Member of the NRA 12/15 Supporting Member

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    What do we have here, a zombie coming out of his comma? You just now figuring out Maobama is not a strong leader who has surrounded himself by a bunch of incompetents and academics. Could you really have expected less from an incompetent academic, the old saying that "people that can do and people that can't teach", became an old saying by being true. I just hope the country survives the idiot.
     
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  3. EriktheRed
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    EriktheRed Eh...

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    And yet somehow you nutbags couldn't stop him from getting 4 more years...
     
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  4. Oldguy
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    Oldguy Senior Member

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    No. I've said all along that Obama has some serious limitations at leadership. I've said that since he failed to offer up his version of a healthcare reform bill and basically wasn't involved in crafting it. At one point, I even went so far as to tell my friends I wouldn't vote for him again because of his weak leadership. Of course, that was before the GOP offered up their Clown Car Cavalcade of Candidates and I had to reconsider.

    What you have here, and probably have difficulty understanding, is a voter who keeps up, who studies, who understands the political system and how it works. What you DON'T have is a closed-minded ideologue who sees and hears only what he wants to hear.

    The only ideologies I subscribe to are the Constitution and good government.
     
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  5. OKTexas
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    OKTexas New Life Member of the NRA 12/15 Supporting Member

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    That just says we need to lower the standard of our messages to grade school levels, speaking to adult levels are no longer sufficient.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2012
  6. Ernie S.
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    Ernie S. Platinum Member

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    Yet you voted for obama twice? I'm calling bullshit on that.

    I'm not a closed minded ideologue myself, but there are principles I absolutely refuse to compromise on.
     
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  7. OKTexas
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    OKTexas New Life Member of the NRA 12/15 Supporting Member

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    Yet you admittedly voted twice for an individual who plainly stated his contempt for the Constitution. I find that perplexing.
     
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  8. Staidhup
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    Staidhup Gold Member Supporting Member

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    No, the media will inform Americans that it is Bush's fault, furthermore point out that the GOP is at fault for not capitulating to his demands. When tax rates increase and mandatory spending cuts come into effect they will direct blame away from his incompetence, remember he is after all the Messiah. The sad part is that there are people will believe it.
     
  9. Politico
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    Politico Gold Member

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    Relax people. We are only on plan B. There are 24 letters left in the alphabet.
     
  10. Oldguy
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    Oldguy Senior Member

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    Sorry. I just can't stand Mitt Romney and never could. He has ambitions he won't explain and I don't trust him. Never did. I've never trusted Santorum or Brownback either because of their gratuitous sucking up to the Evangelical's (who I also can't stand) or Newt Gingrich. Oddly, there was one GOP candidate I MIGHT have voted for before she proved herself to be really batshit crazy: Bachmann. At first glance, she seemed alright enough to vote for, but that false impression didn't last long.

    And, by the way, I also have principles I won't compromise and one of them is that I will never again be fooled into voting for the Neo-Conservative American Fascist's. They conned me out of my vote in 1980,84,88,92,96 and 2000, but MY blinders come off in 2004.

    A couple of more principles I won't compromise is my absolute dedication to truth and justice. All I've seen from the right since 2008 is a relentless campaign of lies and character assassination directed at the person of Barack Obama and that turns my stomach. If a party wants to win on it's merits, I'll consider it. If it wants to win by creating an aura of fear and distrust about the other side, they've lost my vote.

    All things considered, Obama was the best choice for the country this year and still is, weaknesses not withstanding.
     
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