Gun free Britain? Murders going to hit 10 year high...

[2aguy]

"even when they had access to guns", like they don't have access to guns.

We've done this before so many fucking times. THEY HAVE GUNS.

What's DIFFERENT is that access is LIMITED and RESTRICTED whereas in the US it isn't.

The issue here is that there are more guns than before, the Yardies brought in guns for the first real time. Gun murders WENT UP.

Homicide - Office for National Statistics

You can look on this interactive map and see. April 2002 to March 2003 was the highest murder rate. It got up to 1.7 murders per 100,000 people. Massively lower than the US's rate. This is for England and Wales rather than the UK.

By April 2014-March 2015 this has dropped to 0.9, nearly half.

That's with guns being in the country. So why did the murder rate go down?

Better policing, the left wing Labour Party increased spending on the police force.

You know what's changed since then? The right wing Tory Party reducing spending on policing.

The murder rate is going up. But by 2017 it was 10.7.

Homicide in England and Wales - Office for National Statistics

So, the murder rate fluctuates, and it often fluctuates based on police spending and the like. But the UK is more likely to deal with the problems from every aspect, social, economic etc, whereas in the US politicians ignore all the problems, and people like you do too.

The regular point that 2aguy makes is that gun laws don't prevent gun crimes 100% so should be scrapped.
The answer just writes itself.
Why have drug laws, abortion laws, immigration laws...?

The point that 2Aguy makes is that he's an absolute fraud and "fake news" reporter.

No, gun laws don't stop things 100%, who said they do?

The UK's murder rate is 4 time or more lower than the US's. A rise in crime is inevitable as is a drop in crime at other times. That's what happens in life.

The fraud is trying to claim that a rise is worse than a drop in crime and murders, REGARDLESS of what the rate is in the first place. This is just ridiculous.

And again, you go to a statistic that is not relevant to the gun control laws in Britain working, since gun crime is going up..which means there are more guns in the hands of criminals in Britain...... that means that if they wanted to murder people with those guns, they could.

You keep being told over and over again that Britain did not have a high gun murder rate for it's entire history.....that means before they banned guns. Then, they banned guns and there was a spike in gun murder, and now it has gone down...what didn't go down? Gun crime...that is up...not down. You need to distract attention away from that fact.

You're telling me about stuff that's not relevant? Wow, the king of posting totally irrelevant crap.

No, more gun crime does not equate to more guns in the hands of criminals. That's a ridiculous assertion.

Yes, if they wanted to murder people, they could. I mean if you had a knife or poison or a car or hands you could also murder people.

Unfortunately for you and your lunacy, there are no international statistics on the numbers of people who WANT TO MURDER PEOPLE BUT DON'T.

But thank you for that irrelevant crap anyway.

So, you're trying to make the argument that gun violence was low before gun control laws were enacted therefore.... therefore... who the fuck knows that comes after therefore. The UK had low numbers of guns before gun control. In 1997 gun control was enacted to stop random mass gun murders, of which there haven't been many while the US has one every month right now.

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

As for your claim, backed up by not one single statistic, that gun crime didn't go down. Bullshit.

See here, 2002 gun murders went up, as did murder in general, and then it wen down again. Dropping by more than 50%.

And here's firearms offenses which reached a high in 2006 and then went down too.

Right, so you've just made up "facts" again, for the umpteenth time. Why do you pull this shit exactly?

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

This is pretty much the cornerstone of his bullshit. Refuting claims that have never been made. A rational person reading it would conclude that we need less guns in the UK not more.

With low gun ownership we have a murder rate that is a fraction of the US with its gun culture. It is impossible to make a coherent argument against that.

Gun ownership doesn't drive the murder rate...criminals deciding to murder their victims drives the murder rate and as we keep showing you, criminals in Britain have guns......lots of guns....they don't use them to murder their victims as often as American criminals do. You can't make a coherent argument because you can't explain how you have more gun crime in Britain after you banned and confiscated guns...while in America we have less gun crime as more Americans own and actually carry guns. You go to the British gun murder rate in a desperate attempt to hide your inability to explain more gun crime, but as we show you that Britain had a low gun murder rate before they banned guns, you can't explain the increase in gun crime...so you keep hyping the already low gun murder rate as an indication that gun control is working....

Since British criminals are using guns more often, not less....gun control is not working...since the point is to keep guns out of the hands of criminals....

 

[harmonica]

FOUR times lower than the US

 

[2aguy]

You just admitted in your post that gun crime is not dependent on gun control......it is about time you admitted it. Criminals use guns...they don't always use them for murder.....and Britain has a growing gun crime problem......

Yes, I admit that the number of guns does not lead to X amount of gun crime or gun murders.

This topic is not just "this leads to that every single time". There are lots and lots of factors in what leads to higher murder rates. But then dealing with lots and lots of factors with a guy who repeatedly misuses single facts and statistics is going to be futile, isn't it?

The only time when complexity is convenient for you is when your simplistic argument has been destroyed and you're clinging on to whatever you can find.

You can't even be honest enough to answer questions properly, but you continue to misrepresent every single time. Oh, and insult. Remember the "Moron" and then your reason why I was a "Moron" was you not responding to what I wrote and saying something completely disconnected with what I said?

Yes...you are another one who hides the failure of gun control laws in Britain by focusing on gun murder which has never been a major problem in Britain, since their criminals didn't do it...even before they banned guns. You have to hide the fact that gun crime, the illegal use of guns in the commission of violent crimes against unarmed citizens, is increasing...

And if the criminals have the guns in increasing numbers, what gun control law is stopping them from walking into a church, a school or a mall? And which gun control law keeps them from pulling the trigger and aiming at the head or chest instead of the leg?

Please explain how that works.

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

 

[2aguy]

FOUR times lower than the US

And again, that has nothing to do with their gun control laws....

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Yes, I admit that the number of guns does not lead to X amount of gun crime or gun murders.

This topic is not just "this leads to that every single time". There are lots and lots of factors in what leads to higher murder rates. But then dealing with lots and lots of factors with a guy who repeatedly misuses single facts and statistics is going to be futile, isn't it?

The only time when complexity is convenient for you is when your simplistic argument has been destroyed and you're clinging on to whatever you can find.

You can't even be honest enough to answer questions properly, but you continue to misrepresent every single time. Oh, and insult. Remember the "Moron" and then your reason why I was a "Moron" was you not responding to what I wrote and saying something completely disconnected with what I said?

Yes...you are another one who hides the failure of gun control laws in Britain by focusing on gun murder which has never been a major problem in Britain, since their criminals didn't do it...even before they banned guns. You have to hide the fact that gun crime, the illegal use of guns in the commission of violent crimes against unarmed citizens, is increasing...

And if the criminals have the guns in increasing numbers, what gun control law is stopping them from walking into a church, a school or a mall? And which gun control law keeps them from pulling the trigger and aiming at the head or chest instead of the leg?

Please explain how that works.

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

 

[2aguy]

Yes...you are another one who hides the failure of gun control laws in Britain by focusing on gun murder which has never been a major problem in Britain, since their criminals didn't do it...even before they banned guns. You have to hide the fact that gun crime, the illegal use of guns in the commission of violent crimes against unarmed citizens, is increasing...

And if the criminals have the guns in increasing numbers, what gun control law is stopping them from walking into a church, a school or a mall? And which gun control law keeps them from pulling the trigger and aiming at the head or chest instead of the leg?

Please explain how that works.

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

No....you are wrong....gun ownership is limited for law abiding citizens...the ones who weren't using them for crime in the first place...but among criminals, gun crime is up 42% in London and up 23% across England and Wales...they obviously didn't get the message that guns are limited.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

No....you are wrong....gun ownership is limited for law abiding citizens...the ones who weren't using them for crime in the first place...but among criminals, gun crime is up 42% in London and up 23% across England and Wales...they obviously didn't get the message that guns are limited.

Guns are limited, "law abiding people" can have guns too.

Crime is up. You've been told why crime is up, because of the right wing government in power.

But crime is up, and still MASSIVELY LOWER THAN IN THE USA.

 

[frigidweirdo]

FOUR times lower than the US

And again, that has nothing to do with their gun control laws....

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Yes, it has A LOT to do with gun control laws.

 

[harmonica]

FOUR times lower than the US

And again, that has nothing to do with their gun control laws....

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

then tell me what makes the difference

 

[harmonica]

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

No....you are wrong....gun ownership is limited for law abiding citizens...the ones who weren't using them for crime in the first place...but among criminals, gun crime is up 42% in London and up 23% across England and Wales...they obviously didn't get the message that guns are limited.

their murder rate is FOUR times lower
but who cares about that/murder/etc?

 

[frigidweirdo]

The regular point that 2aguy makes is that gun laws don't prevent gun crimes 100% so should be scrapped.
The answer just writes itself.
Why have drug laws, abortion laws, immigration laws...?

The point that 2Aguy makes is that he's an absolute fraud and "fake news" reporter.

No, gun laws don't stop things 100%, who said they do?

The UK's murder rate is 4 time or more lower than the US's. A rise in crime is inevitable as is a drop in crime at other times. That's what happens in life.

The fraud is trying to claim that a rise is worse than a drop in crime and murders, REGARDLESS of what the rate is in the first place. This is just ridiculous.

And again, you go to a statistic that is not relevant to the gun control laws in Britain working, since gun crime is going up..which means there are more guns in the hands of criminals in Britain...... that means that if they wanted to murder people with those guns, they could.

You keep being told over and over again that Britain did not have a high gun murder rate for it's entire history.....that means before they banned guns. Then, they banned guns and there was a spike in gun murder, and now it has gone down...what didn't go down? Gun crime...that is up...not down. You need to distract attention away from that fact.

You're telling me about stuff that's not relevant? Wow, the king of posting totally irrelevant crap.

No, more gun crime does not equate to more guns in the hands of criminals. That's a ridiculous assertion.

Yes, if they wanted to murder people, they could. I mean if you had a knife or poison or a car or hands you could also murder people.

Unfortunately for you and your lunacy, there are no international statistics on the numbers of people who WANT TO MURDER PEOPLE BUT DON'T.

But thank you for that irrelevant crap anyway.

So, you're trying to make the argument that gun violence was low before gun control laws were enacted therefore.... therefore... who the fuck knows that comes after therefore. The UK had low numbers of guns before gun control. In 1997 gun control was enacted to stop random mass gun murders, of which there haven't been many while the US has one every month right now.

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

As for your claim, backed up by not one single statistic, that gun crime didn't go down. Bullshit.

See here, 2002 gun murders went up, as did murder in general, and then it wen down again. Dropping by more than 50%.

And here's firearms offenses which reached a high in 2006 and then went down too.

Right, so you've just made up "facts" again, for the umpteenth time. Why do you pull this shit exactly?

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

This is pretty much the cornerstone of his bullshit. Refuting claims that have never been made. A rational person reading it would conclude that we need less guns in the UK not more.

With low gun ownership we have a murder rate that is a fraction of the US with its gun culture. It is impossible to make a coherent argument against that.

Gun ownership doesn't drive the murder rate...criminals deciding to murder their victims drives the murder rate and as we keep showing you, criminals in Britain have guns......lots of guns....they don't use them to murder their victims as often as American criminals do. You can't make a coherent argument because you can't explain how you have more gun crime in Britain after you banned and confiscated guns...while in America we have less gun crime as more Americans own and actually carry guns. You go to the British gun murder rate in a desperate attempt to hide your inability to explain more gun crime, but as we show you that Britain had a low gun murder rate before they banned guns, you can't explain the increase in gun crime...so you keep hyping the already low gun murder rate as an indication that gun control is working....

Since British criminals are using guns more often, not less....gun control is not working...since the point is to keep guns out of the hands of criminals....

Gun ownership itself doesn't drive murder. There's far more to it than that.

Easy availability of guns is one massive factor here. It's the difference between having a gun and using it freely, and having a gun and protecting it.

The inability of US politicians to actually give a fuck about sorting out social problems is another reason why guns exacerbate already bad problems.

The problem here is you don't understand Britain's gun bans and how they worked. So you're pretending there were lots of guns and then all of a sudden there weren't lots of guns. It never worked like that.

Guns have never been totally banned. Over a period of time guns have been more limited. In 1997 handguns were banned. It wasn't like many people actually had handguns in the first place. The ban didn't impact many people. So it wasn't actually much of a watershed moment for guns at all. Had handguns not been banned, not much would have changed.

I can explain the increase in gun crime. Guns can get into the UK because the UK has a massive coastline. However guns are not easily available.

With the prevalence of US TV shows, some kids think it's cool to get guns. There was a short period of time where gun crime increased for a period of about two months. It was caused by young kids using guns as if they were in the US. For the police it was a problem, but they were able to deal with this situation because they could mop up the guns, and then they can't easily get more.

But you keep going out of your way to attack me and leave yourself open to ridicule when you say stuff that is based on ignorance.

 

[frigidweirdo]

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

No....you are wrong....gun ownership is limited for law abiding citizens...the ones who weren't using them for crime in the first place...but among criminals, gun crime is up 42% in London and up 23% across England and Wales...they obviously didn't get the message that guns are limited.

their murder rate is FOUR times lower
but who cares about that/murder/etc?

He's very selective in what he says because he know he doesn't have anything. So he ignores most things and sticks to what he thinks he does have.

His aim isn't to show the truth. His aim is only to show that guns aren't bad. Even if they are.

So he'll say "an increase in gun crime" because he's hoping people are so fucking stupid that they'll see that and think the UK has a massive problem and the US doesn't.

It's all he's got.

 

[harmonica]

The point that 2Aguy makes is that he's an absolute fraud and "fake news" reporter.

No, gun laws don't stop things 100%, who said they do?

The UK's murder rate is 4 time or more lower than the US's. A rise in crime is inevitable as is a drop in crime at other times. That's what happens in life.

The fraud is trying to claim that a rise is worse than a drop in crime and murders, REGARDLESS of what the rate is in the first place. This is just ridiculous.

And again, you go to a statistic that is not relevant to the gun control laws in Britain working, since gun crime is going up..which means there are more guns in the hands of criminals in Britain...... that means that if they wanted to murder people with those guns, they could.

You keep being told over and over again that Britain did not have a high gun murder rate for it's entire history.....that means before they banned guns. Then, they banned guns and there was a spike in gun murder, and now it has gone down...what didn't go down? Gun crime...that is up...not down. You need to distract attention away from that fact.

You're telling me about stuff that's not relevant? Wow, the king of posting totally irrelevant crap.

No, more gun crime does not equate to more guns in the hands of criminals. That's a ridiculous assertion.

Yes, if they wanted to murder people, they could. I mean if you had a knife or poison or a car or hands you could also murder people.

Unfortunately for you and your lunacy, there are no international statistics on the numbers of people who WANT TO MURDER PEOPLE BUT DON'T.

But thank you for that irrelevant crap anyway.

So, you're trying to make the argument that gun violence was low before gun control laws were enacted therefore.... therefore... who the fuck knows that comes after therefore. The UK had low numbers of guns before gun control. In 1997 gun control was enacted to stop random mass gun murders, of which there haven't been many while the US has one every month right now.

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

As for your claim, backed up by not one single statistic, that gun crime didn't go down. Bullshit.

See here, 2002 gun murders went up, as did murder in general, and then it wen down again. Dropping by more than 50%.

And here's firearms offenses which reached a high in 2006 and then went down too.

Right, so you've just made up "facts" again, for the umpteenth time. Why do you pull this shit exactly?

So the gun control law works. However you have decided that somehow you either have gun control and it works 100% or you don't have it. You can't have an in between because... because... who the fuck knows what comes after because.

This is pretty much the cornerstone of his bullshit. Refuting claims that have never been made. A rational person reading it would conclude that we need less guns in the UK not more.

With low gun ownership we have a murder rate that is a fraction of the US with its gun culture. It is impossible to make a coherent argument against that.

Gun ownership doesn't drive the murder rate...criminals deciding to murder their victims drives the murder rate and as we keep showing you, criminals in Britain have guns......lots of guns....they don't use them to murder their victims as often as American criminals do. You can't make a coherent argument because you can't explain how you have more gun crime in Britain after you banned and confiscated guns...while in America we have less gun crime as more Americans own and actually carry guns. You go to the British gun murder rate in a desperate attempt to hide your inability to explain more gun crime, but as we show you that Britain had a low gun murder rate before they banned guns, you can't explain the increase in gun crime...so you keep hyping the already low gun murder rate as an indication that gun control is working....

Since British criminals are using guns more often, not less....gun control is not working...since the point is to keep guns out of the hands of criminals....

Gun ownership itself doesn't drive murder. There's far more to it than that.

Easy availability of guns is one massive factor here. It's the difference between having a gun and using it freely, and having a gun and protecting it.

The inability of US politicians to actually give a fuck about sorting out social problems is another reason why guns exacerbate already bad problems.

The problem here is you don't understand Britain's gun bans and how they worked. So you're pretending there were lots of guns and then all of a sudden there weren't lots of guns. It never worked like that.

Guns have never been totally banned. Over a period of time guns have been more limited. In 1997 handguns were banned. It wasn't like many people actually had handguns in the first place. The ban didn't impact many people. So it wasn't actually much of a watershed moment for guns at all. Had handguns not been banned, not much would have changed.

I can explain the increase in gun crime. Guns can get into the UK because the UK has a massive coastline. However guns are not easily available.

With the prevalence of US TV shows, some kids think it's cool to get guns. There was a short period of time where gun crime increased for a period of about two months. It was caused by young kids using guns as if they were in the US. For the police it was a problem, but they were able to deal with this situation because they could mop up the guns, and then they can't easily get more.

But you keep going out of your way to attack me and leave yourself open to ridicule when you say stuff that is based on ignorance.

guns are the most efficient, designed to kill hand held '''tool''
much harder to kill/commit a crime with a knife/bat/pool/etc

 

[frigidweirdo]

Yes, I admit that the number of guns does not lead to X amount of gun crime or gun murders.

This topic is not just "this leads to that every single time". There are lots and lots of factors in what leads to higher murder rates. But then dealing with lots and lots of factors with a guy who repeatedly misuses single facts and statistics is going to be futile, isn't it?

The only time when complexity is convenient for you is when your simplistic argument has been destroyed and you're clinging on to whatever you can find.

You can't even be honest enough to answer questions properly, but you continue to misrepresent every single time. Oh, and insult. Remember the "Moron" and then your reason why I was a "Moron" was you not responding to what I wrote and saying something completely disconnected with what I said?

Yes...you are another one who hides the failure of gun control laws in Britain by focusing on gun murder which has never been a major problem in Britain, since their criminals didn't do it...even before they banned guns. You have to hide the fact that gun crime, the illegal use of guns in the commission of violent crimes against unarmed citizens, is increasing...

And if the criminals have the guns in increasing numbers, what gun control law is stopping them from walking into a church, a school or a mall? And which gun control law keeps them from pulling the trigger and aiming at the head or chest instead of the leg?

Please explain how that works.

Easy availability of guns means that criminals value their weapons less, which means they're more likely to use them.

Whereas in the UK a criminal might be able to get a gun, or might not, it might cost them more and it might be more of a struggle to get another one.

Also that gun warfare isn't prevalent means guns are often used as a means of scaring people, rather than actually having to use them.

But then again, I showed you the murder rate in the US and the UK compared in a chart, and somehow you believe this is me "focusing on gun murder".

Another one of your inabilities to know what people are talking about in your desire to "win" of get what you want regardless of the truth.

UK gun control laws are not a failure. They're also not 100% effective, but what laws are?

But the UK gun murder rate is massively low, it's murder rate isn't high. It's a success.

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Right, so you need someone to explain it for you? You can't do it yourself?

The Daily Mail is a right wing newspaper that aims to sell with sensationalism.

Also I showed you statistics which tell us that gun violence hit a high in 2006 and then dropped.

Also the Daily Mail is being deliberately dishonest, what a surprise. Had they gone from 1993 to 2009 they'd have seen gun crime rose only slightly in that time, from about 7.75 to 8.2 according to this chart.

But they wanted to bash the Labour Party. The problem is, it was the Tories' lack of investment in the police, in social problems etc that caused this. It just took a bit of time for it to come about.

The same thing is happening now. They've been in power 8 years, crime is rising again, police funding is dropping, social problems funding is dropping too.

Labour took over and had everything going down by the time they left office.

But you carry on being dishonest and ignorant of the UK.

 

[Baron]

Yep....young males, raised without fathers to teach them to be adult men, mixed with 3rd world males running the drug gangs, and the British police hamstrung due to lack of manpower, money, and politically correct rules of engagment.....

London on course for highest number of killings in a decade after 2018 passes 2017 total

All criminals in Europe have guns, only law-abiding citizens prohibit to posses them. Commies were always allies of thugs.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

This is a quite scary report.
From a Czech warehouse to a street near you: the journey of a gun

But on the other hand it shows how proper gun control works. The guns are confined to criminals and the police are able to track down individual guns. But scary stuff.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Yep....young males, raised without fathers to teach them to be adult men, mixed with 3rd world males running the drug gangs, and the British police hamstrung due to lack of manpower, money, and politically correct rules of engagment.....

London on course for highest number of killings in a decade after 2018 passes 2017 total

All criminals in Europe have guns, only law-abiding citizens prohibit to posses them. Commies were always allies of thugs.

Any evidence of this made up "fact"?

 

[Baron]

Yep....young males, raised without fathers to teach them to be adult men, mixed with 3rd world males running the drug gangs, and the British police hamstrung due to lack of manpower, money, and politically correct rules of engagment.....

London on course for highest number of killings in a decade after 2018 passes 2017 total

All criminals in Europe have guns, only law-abiding citizens prohibit to posses them. Commies were always allies of thugs.

Any evidence of this made up "fact"?

Look all laws and bills passed by lefts ( dems, commies & Co )

 

[2aguy]

You think that criminals are not getting more guns now? Your post has no bearing on the fact that Britain's criminals are getting more guns... you only focus on gun murder since that hasn't changed in Britain, except for the massive spike immediately after they banned guns.

You want to show that criminals are getting more guns now. Then prove it. Until then I call bullshit on your fake crap.

Here......a history of increasing gun crime in Britain after they banned guns...

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade | Daily Mail Online

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.

The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .


========



Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

=========



Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.

Top trauma surgeon reveals shocking extent of London’s gun crime

A leading trauma surgeon has told how the number of patients treated for gunshot injuries at a major London hospital has doubled in the last five years.

----

He said the hospital’s major trauma centre had seen a bigger rise in gunshot injuries compared to knife wounds and that the average age of victims was getting younger.

-----

Last year, gun crime offences in London increased for a third year running and by 42 per cent, from 1,793 offences in 2015/16 to 2,544 offences in 2016/17. Police have seized 635 guns off the streets so far this year.

Dr Griffiths, who also teaches medical students, said: “Our numbers of victims of gun injury have doubled [since 2012]. Gunshot injuries represent about 2.5 per cent of our penetrating trauma.

-----

Dr Griffiths said the average age of gun crime victims needing treatment at the hospital had decreased from 25 to the mid to late teens since 2012.

He added that medics at the Barts Health hospital’s major trauma centre in Whitechapel had seen a bigger rise in patients with gun injuries rather than knife wounds and that most were caused by pistols or shotguns.

Met Police commander Jim Stokley, who was also invited to speak at the meeting, said that handguns and shotguns were the weapons of choice and that 46 per cent of London’s gun crime discharges were gang-related.

He said: “We believe that a lot of it is associated with the drugs trade, and by that I mean people dealing drugs at street level and disagreements between different gangs.”

Guns arent banned in the UK. But gun ownership is limited. Thats why our death rates are a fraction of yours. You have lost this argument so many times its laughable.

No....you are wrong....gun ownership is limited for law abiding citizens...the ones who weren't using them for crime in the first place...but among criminals, gun crime is up 42% in London and up 23% across England and Wales...they obviously didn't get the message that guns are limited.

Guns are limited, "law abiding people" can have guns too.

Crime is up. You've been told why crime is up, because of the right wing government in power.

But crime is up, and still MASSIVELY LOWER THAN IN THE USA.

Yes......criminals are getting guns because they need them to support their drug business.....and as the left wing socialists use all the money for social welfare programs, the first groups that get hit are law enforcement....which the socially active left wingers attack as racist and out of control....allowing their manpower to be cut, their resources to be cut and their effectiveness to be cut because of politically correct policies.....

Gun ownership in Britain is reserved for the rich..... those who can own the tiny number of hunting shotguns for shooting game on their estates...meanwhile....the nurse coming home on the tube gets dragged into a park and gang raped because she can't have a gun to defend herself....the senior citizen living in public housing gets beaten and tortured by the feral youths, raised on welfare, without fathers.......

Crime is going up in Britain.....a lot...their social welfare system has finally reached the point of no return....

 

[miketx]

Clearly the only sensible answer is to have more guns freely available...that'll fix it.

It's hard to kill someone or rob or rape them when they are shooting you. Now spin twist lie and smoke that one.