Gun culture or parenting culture?

[Redfish]

The only thing that can stop bad kids with guns, are good kids woth guns

But are good kids going to walk around in gangs with guns pretending to be the world's police and not become that bad kids?

in your world only the police (government) and criminals would have guns. Would you feel safe? Part of the reason for the 2nd amendment is so that citizens can protect themselves from the government. They saw the results of over-powerful governments in Europe, that's why they put the 2nd in the constitution.

A little American history might do wonders for your understanding of this country.

 

[Redfish]

Kids should have guns. If they don't have guns, they can't accidentally shoot others and really, that's what it's all about, right?


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

no one has said anything close to that, but your stupid attempt at humor is noted.

 

[Divine Wind]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

 

[JoeB131]

in your world only the police (government) and criminals would have guns. Would you feel safe? Part of the reason for the 2nd amendment is so that citizens can protect themselves from the government. They saw the results of over-powerful governments in Europe, that's why they put the 2nd in the constitution.

That's actually retarded.

The thing is, the government will always have more guns, bigger guns and the ability to use them, and we almost never hold the government accountable for shooting people when they do.

Hey, how many people went to jail for Waco? Oh, that's right, the only people who went to jail were the Branch Davidians who survived!

 

[Redfish]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

21.

 

[ricechickie]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

Two-year olds have proven themselves capable of defending themselves.

Report: Toddlers shooting people at faster rate in 2016

 

[Pogo]

I found a local gun story that I wanted to share because the accused is a minor. Kids with guns are not all that unusual (especially here in Cleveland) but what I found most telling is the response of the mother.

In short, this kid was arrested for having BB gun in a public park (very similar to the Tamir Rice situation) a year earlier. The judge went easy on the kid, but now the 16 year old was busted having a real loaded gun. Here are some quotes from the mother:

"He has to learn the right way. I can't stop him." When the I TEAM asked where he got the gun this time, his mother said, "I don't know. Don't know. He was using it for protection. He was walking down the street and people would shoot at him. Nowadays, that's what you need for protection. I don't consider it a good thing."

That mom says she did talk to her son before the Parma BB gun incident and after it. Didn’t matter. She said, “Kids these days need to learn their own lessons. He's learning his lessons."

Teen caught with BB gun at Parma park now busted with gun; mom says she can’t stop him

With the path this kid is on, it's more than likely he'll be dead or in prison for murder the next decade. Then the left will blame the guns.

Another thing that struck me: she said "I don't know, and I can't stop him." Not "We can't stop him" as if there was a father figure around. This woman practically justified her son illegally carrying a likely stolen gun underage. When he gets older and arrested for shooting somebody, I'm sure the mother will once again respond to a news interview by saying "My baby didn't do nutting wrong, he's a good boy." If he gets gunned down in the street, well........then I guess he "learned his own lessons."

Okay, what's your point here? This is a 16-year-old kid in the US, as such he's been told guns are gods and he "needs" one and he bought it. Nothing unusual, sadly -- it goes on here at USMB every day.

Where we going with this?

 

[Divine Wind]

.....Another thing that struck me: she said "I don't know, and I can't stop him." Not "We can't stop him" as if there was a father figure around. This woman practically justified her son illegally carrying a likely stolen gun underage. When he gets older and arrested for shooting somebody, I'm sure the mother will once again respond to a news interview by saying "My baby didn't do nutting wrong, he's a good boy." If he gets gunned down in the street, well........then I guess he "learned his own lessons."

While I agree that all of this is cultural, disagreed that the mother justified anything. It appears that, culturally, she is dependent upon society to raise her child and that she is blameless for not being able to stop her 16 year old son from possessing and carrying a gun. When or if he is shot dead in the streets over a gang dispute, no doubt she'll also blame society for his death and, therefore, continue to shed all personal responsibility for his death.

 

[Divine Wind]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

Two-year olds have proven themselves capable of defending themselves.

Report: Toddlers shooting people at faster rate in 2016

Are you too supporting children with guns?

While children are protected by the Constitution, SCOTUS has clearly ruled that children don't have the same rights as adults such as voting, choosing where to live, parental rights, etc.

Where do you want to draw the line on children and parents? Parental responsibility? If that 2 year old or 16 year old shot and killed someone, should the parents be held responsible? The mother in the OP?

 

[TheOldSchool]

The only thing that can stop bad kids with guns, are good kids woth guns

But are good kids going to walk around in gangs with guns pretending to be the world's police and not become that bad kids?

Only one way to find out

 

[Divine Wind]

The only thing that can stop bad kids with guns, are good kids woth guns

But are good kids going to walk around in gangs with guns pretending to be the world's police and not become that bad kids?

in your world only the police (government) and criminals would have guns. Would you feel safe? Part of the reason for the 2nd amendment is so that citizens can protect themselves from the government. They saw the results of over-powerful governments in Europe, that's why they put the 2nd in the constitution.

A little American history might do wonders for your understanding of this country.

Agreed 100%. Clearly the reason the Founders made the Second Amendment was so "We, the People" could protect and defend our rights in the First Amendment, and all the others.

The right of Self-Defense is well known and legally established in history.

 

[Divine Wind]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

21.

Agreed, although science shows us that most young people don't fully mature until age 25. Actuaries also know this which is why auto insurance rates drop dramatically once a person reaches their 25th birthday.

 

[TheOldSchool]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

Two-year olds have proven themselves capable of defending themselves.

Report: Toddlers shooting people at faster rate in 2016

That's right! #MAGA

 

[OldLady]

.....Another thing that struck me: she said "I don't know, and I can't stop him." Not "We can't stop him" as if there was a father figure around. This woman practically justified her son illegally carrying a likely stolen gun underage. When he gets older and arrested for shooting somebody, I'm sure the mother will once again respond to a news interview by saying "My baby didn't do nutting wrong, he's a good boy." If he gets gunned down in the street, well........then I guess he "learned his own lessons."

While I agree that all of this is cultural, disagreed that the mother justified anything. It appears that, culturally, she is dependent upon society to raise her child and that she is blameless for not being able to stop her 16 year old son from possessing and carrying a gun. When or if he is shot dead in the streets over a gang dispute, no doubt she'll also blame society for his death and, therefore, continue to shed all personal responsibility for his death.

Culturally, we're all somewhat dependent on culture for what our 16 year olds do. Unless you live on an isolated commune, if you have children they have been affected to some degree by the culture around them and their peers.
Now, if I were that Mom, I would have kept going through that kid's sock drawer every night and if I found a gun I would have taken it straight to the police station and told them someone threw it on my lawn. You can't actually ground a 16 year old, especially if you work and aren't there half the time. You wouldn't want to wrestle a loaded gun out of his hands as he walked out the door, either. So sneakily remove the weapon from the house and see how many times he can replace it. Just keep taking them to the police station. But if in the meantime, my kid was shot dead on his way home from school, I'd always wonder if I somehow played a hand in it. The kids I've known who grew up in those kind of neighborhoods carry for self-protection. It's not very effective, but it's the truth.

 

[ricechickie]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

Two-year olds have proven themselves capable of defending themselves.

Report: Toddlers shooting people at faster rate in 2016

Are you too supporting children with guns?

While children are protected by the Constitution, SCOTUS has clearly ruled that children don't have the same rights as adults such as voting, choosing where to live, parental rights, etc.

Where do you want to draw the line on children and parents? Parental responsibility? If that 2 year old or 16 year old shot and killed someone, should the parents be held responsible? The mother in the OP?

How else will a two-year-old defend themselves from their mean mommy? They don't want to nap!

Of course, is Mom is also armed, then it's fair. What's that saying? "An armed family is a polite family."

 

[Divine Wind]

That's actually retarded.

The thing is, the government will always have more guns, bigger guns and the ability to use them, and we almost never hold the government accountable for shooting people when they do.

Hey, how many people went to jail for Waco? Oh, that's right, the only people who went to jail were the Branch Davidians who survived!

Your usual sophomoric insults aside, disagreed about "the government" since those holding the guns are good, honest red-blooded American volunteers....and usually politically conservative. They are unlikely to strafe a town, send an artillery barrage on a group of protesters or nuke a city, even if it's full of liberals.

As for Waco, why did Bill and Hillary Clinton murder all of those people?

 

[Divine Wind]

.....Another thing that struck me: she said "I don't know, and I can't stop him." Not "We can't stop him" as if there was a father figure around. This woman practically justified her son illegally carrying a likely stolen gun underage. When he gets older and arrested for shooting somebody, I'm sure the mother will once again respond to a news interview by saying "My baby didn't do nutting wrong, he's a good boy." If he gets gunned down in the street, well........then I guess he "learned his own lessons."

While I agree that all of this is cultural, disagreed that the mother justified anything. It appears that, culturally, she is dependent upon society to raise her child and that she is blameless for not being able to stop her 16 year old son from possessing and carrying a gun. When or if he is shot dead in the streets over a gang dispute, no doubt she'll also blame society for his death and, therefore, continue to shed all personal responsibility for his death.

Culturally, we're all somewhat dependent on culture for what our 16 year olds do. Unless you live on an isolated commune, if you have children they have been affected to some degree by the culture around them and their peers.
Now, if I were that Mom, I would have kept going through that kid's sock drawer every night and if I found a gun I would have taken it straight to the police station and told them someone threw it on my lawn. You can't actually ground a 16 year old, especially if you work and aren't there half the time. You wouldn't want to wrestle a loaded gun out of his hands as he walked out the door, either. So sneakily remove the weapon from the house and see how many times he can replace it. Just keep taking them to the police station. But if in the meantime, my kid was shot dead on his way home from school, I'd always wonder if I somehow played a hand in it. The kids I've known who grew up in those kind of neighborhoods carry for self-protection. It's not very effective, but it's the truth.

Agreed about how society is part of a child's upbringing. Still, the parents are the primary caregivers. This has been supported by law numerous times. A parent can't say they have parental rights then drop those rights when it becomes inconvenient or because they were negligent in the upbringing of their children.

Agreed too about it being difficult to ground a 16 year old, which is why child-rearing begins at birth, not when they are 16.

Agreed too about monitoring the child, including their "sock drawer" and calling the police if necessary. Better to have a child with a juvie record than dead by 18.

 

[Divine Wind]

She said he was carrying it for protection. Why do you hate the 2nd Amendment?

Good to see you be honest and support everyone carrying guns. So, since you support 16 year olds carrying guns, how about 15 year olds? 12 year olds? How low will you go?

Two-year olds have proven themselves capable of defending themselves.

Report: Toddlers shooting people at faster rate in 2016

Are you too supporting children with guns?

While children are protected by the Constitution, SCOTUS has clearly ruled that children don't have the same rights as adults such as voting, choosing where to live, parental rights, etc.

Where do you want to draw the line on children and parents? Parental responsibility? If that 2 year old or 16 year old shot and killed someone, should the parents be held responsible? The mother in the OP?

How else will a two-year-old defend themselves from their mean mommy? They don't want to nap!

Of course, is Mom is also armed, then it's fair. What's that saying? "An armed family is a polite family."

In that case, wouldn't it be good for society at large that these such mothers shoot their children?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

While I agree that all of this is cultural, disagreed that the mother justified anything

I disagree with your disagreement. She said this:

He was using it for protection. He was walking down the street and people would shoot at him. Nowadays, that's what you need for protection.

That's what you need for protection? That sure sounds like justification to me. If I were caught with a gun as a kid, my mother sure as hell would never say that, and my dad would have kicked my as from one end of the house to the other.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I found a local gun story that I wanted to share because the accused is a minor. Kids with guns are not all that unusual (especially here in Cleveland) but what I found most telling is the response of the mother.

In short, this kid was arrested for having BB gun in a public park (very similar to the Tamir Rice situation) a year earlier. The judge went easy on the kid, but now the 16 year old was busted having a real loaded gun. Here are some quotes from the mother:

"He has to learn the right way. I can't stop him." When the I TEAM asked where he got the gun this time, his mother said, "I don't know. Don't know. He was using it for protection. He was walking down the street and people would shoot at him. Nowadays, that's what you need for protection. I don't consider it a good thing."

That mom says she did talk to her son before the Parma BB gun incident and after it. Didn’t matter. She said, “Kids these days need to learn their own lessons. He's learning his lessons."

Teen caught with BB gun at Parma park now busted with gun; mom says she can’t stop him

With the path this kid is on, it's more than likely he'll be dead or in prison for murder the next decade. Then the left will blame the guns.

Another thing that struck me: she said "I don't know, and I can't stop him." Not "We can't stop him" as if there was a father figure around. This woman practically justified her son illegally carrying a likely stolen gun underage. When he gets older and arrested for shooting somebody, I'm sure the mother will once again respond to a news interview by saying "My baby didn't do nutting wrong, he's a good boy." If he gets gunned down in the street, well........then I guess he "learned his own lessons."

Okay, what's your point here? This is a 16-year-old kid in the US, as such he's been told guns are gods and he "needs" one and he bought it. Nothing unusual, sadly -- it goes on here at USMB every day.

Where we going with this?

Where it was going with this is that guns are not the problem--parents who have this attitude towards raising a child is more the problem than the guns. These women have fatherless kids, and when they get in their teen years, a woman is too weak to control them and the male is not afraid of a woman--even if it's his own mother.