Good going Jan Brewer: 2 down 97 to go.

[bigrebnc1775]

Why would I trade my insurance for the crap government offers?

You don't have any fucking insurance. Stop lying.

I don't have healthcare coverage anymore thanks to obamacare. I just lost it this past Monday. My company droped the carrieer that covered our plan. I will flat out refuse obamacare

 

[daveman]

It hasn't happened on a national level with government.

Why are you pretending it won't?

You act like this is something new Dave. Insurance companies make these life and death decisions by the day.
Someone died today because insurance did not provide enough or no cash for tests, treatment or surgery.
Real world. The current system is fucked. We pay 300K for an 88 year old to live and let these other folks die.
We have become a nation of village idiots.

So: Insurance companies making decisions to withhold treatment for financial reasons is bad.

But government making decisions to withhold treatment for financial reasons is good.

Have I got that right?

If that is what you believe then have at it.
I run 3 businesses and pay 1K a month for health insurance for a healthy family of 5.
1 month ago my son goes in for ACL surgery from a football injury. It is paid for but get this dave: we had quotes for the MRI from $400-$4000.
Guess why that is dave? The current system needs to be done away with. We need to end health care as abenefit and go back to where the FREE MARKET determines health care, not insurance companies and government.
I agree with you. Government and insurance are terrible ways to deliver health care efficiently and cost effective.
Unless someone else is paying the freight. Those folks are the problem and that over demand on the system because those that get their health insurance provided for free have no conception of free market pressures and that is what has run up the price of health care.
We need to end group health care now and go back to YOU pay for YOUR health care and I pay for mine. Individual policies that YOU pay for with YOUR $$ and I pay forwith MY $$$.
End all government paid health care for everyone including employees immediately.
Do you favor that? That would cut costs immediately as YOU and I would immediately be the CUSTOMER again.
It needs to happen now. The free ride is over. Everyone pays their own way. NO BENEFIT HEALTH CARE PERIOD.

I'm okay with that.

 

[daveman]

and water is wet, that doesnt refute my post at all. Thank you for admitting you are stupid.

How does your "seriously stupid" comment refute her post?

Oh, yeah...it doesn't.

jesus i actually have to explain this to you?
i wasnt refuting her post, i was calling her stupid for the post. Her post does not refute me calling her stupid. in fact she didnt even bother to defend herself.

what you are saying never happened. Stop eating paste and maybe you will get it.

So I see you're going with the "It's Not Hypocrisy When I Do It" gambit. Let me know how that works out for you.

 

[daveman]

lol......nobody is buying this act.

Certainly not those who refuse to see it.

are the ones that do have special powers?
in my world we call those people retards.

I thought about visiting your world once, but I couldn't manage to smack my head with a hammer quite hard enough.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)



“…[T]he government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the state governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government.”
-James Madison

“If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one subject to particular exceptions.” James Madison, “Letter to Edmund Pendleton,”
-James Madison, January 21, 1792, in The Papers of James Madison, vol. 14, Robert A Rutland et. al., ed (Charlottesvile: University Press of Virginia,1984).

 

[NYcarbineer]

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)



“…[T]he government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the state governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government.”
-James Madison

“If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one subject to particular exceptions.” James Madison, “Letter to Edmund Pendleton,”
-James Madison, January 21, 1792, in The Papers of James Madison, vol. 14, Robert A Rutland et. al., ed (Charlottesvile: University Press of Virginia,1984).

Arizona is a state government.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)



“…[T]he government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the state governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government.”
-James Madison

“If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one subject to particular exceptions.” James Madison, “Letter to Edmund Pendleton,”
-James Madison, January 21, 1792, in The Papers of James Madison, vol. 14, Robert A Rutland et. al., ed (Charlottesvile: University Press of Virginia,1984).

Arizona is a state government.

Well good I am glad to see you finally realize that. Let Arizona govern Arizona, and let New York govern New York

 

[Greenbeard]

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)

The bit you've left out there is that he meant spending money on non-citizens. You see, moments after he said that, someone called him on it:

Mr. Clark wished that the gentleman who spoke last [Madison] would be careful about preserving consistency. It was only a few days ago that he had laid before the House a resolution, by which Congress were to indemnify all such citizens of the United States as had suffered losses by the British pirates. He supposed that for this, there would be found as little authority in the articles of the Constitution, as for relieving the fugitives from Cape Francois.

Mr. Madison, in explanation, replied that the two cases were widely different. The vessels of America sailed under our flag, and were under our protection, by the law of Nations, which the French sufferers unquestionably were not.​

 

[bigrebnc1775]

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying, “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
-James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)

The bit you've left out there is that he meant spending money on non-citizens. You see, moments after he said that, someone called him on it:

Mr. Clark wished that the gentleman who spoke last [Madison] would be careful about preserving consistency. It was only a few days ago that he had laid before the House a resolution, by which Congress were to indemnify all such citizens of the United States as had suffered losses by the British pirates. He supposed that for this, there would be found as little authority in the articles of the Constitution, as for relieving the fugitives from Cape Francois.

Mr. Madison, in explanation, replied that the two cases were widely different. The vessels of America sailed under our flag, and were under our protection, by the law of Nations, which the French sufferers unquestionably were not.​

Argue with madison

“…[T]he government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the state governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of the government.”
-James Madison

 

[rdean]

Republican Health Care Plan for Americans:

230 billion added to deficit

32 million Americans lose HC

Children thrown off parents HC

HC Companies once again able to "cut" sick people

------------------------------------

Republicans screaming, "Somebody, please poke me in the eye"!

you have posted some shit that has been way over the top, but this time even this shit tops the rest. BULL SHIT.

Hello! What do you think repealing the HC bill would actually do?

230 billion added to deficit

32 million Americans lose HC

Children thrown off parents HC

HC Companies once again able to "cut" sick people

Note to Congress: Keep your hands off our health care law - USATODAY.com

From Rhonda Abrams, "President of The Planning Shop" and publisher of books for entrepreneurs. Her newest is the 5th edition of The Successful Business Plan: Secrets and Strategies.

• The best chance for small businesses and the self-employed to get affordable health insurance – through health insurance exchanges.

• The best chance for entrepreneurs to be able to start new businesses and create jobs – by eliminating exclusions due to pre-existing conditions, and the exchanges.

Take my business. This year, my health insurance cost increased a whopping 29%. Last year, I had a 20% increase. Yes – more than 50% in two years compounded! Oh – you may say – my insurance is expensive because we have a so-called "Cadillac" plan. Nope – my own health care plan provides little more than catastrophic coverage; I can't afford anything better. And it's not because my employees cost insurance companies a lot — we're an unusually healthy group.

Politicians or insurance companies may claim price increases like mine are the result of "Obamacare." Bullhockey! It happens every year.

Why do I – and you – face such huge premium increases? Because health insurance companies don't want small businesses. We're too risky – there aren't enough people in a small group to even out the risk. If only one person in a small business gets sick, insurance companies lose all the profit they've made on our few healthy employees. The way they get rid of us? Continually raising our prices.

------------------

You see, for Republicans, "small business" is at least a billion in yearly revenue.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Republican Health Care Plan for Americans:

230 billion added to deficit

32 million Americans lose HC

Children thrown off parents HC

HC Companies once again able to "cut" sick people

------------------------------------

Republicans screaming, "Somebody, please poke me in the eye"!

you have posted some shit that has been way over the top, but this time even this shit tops the rest. BULL SHIT.

Hello! What do you think repealing the HC bill would actually do?

230 billion added to deficit

32 million Americans lose HC

Children thrown off parents HC

HC Companies once again able to "cut" sick people

Note to Congress: Keep your hands off our health care law - USATODAY.com

From Rhonda Abrams, "President of The Planning Shop" and publisher of books for entrepreneurs. Her newest is the 5th edition of The Successful Business Plan: Secrets and Strategies.

• The best chance for small businesses and the self-employed to get affordable health insurance – through health insurance exchanges.

• The best chance for entrepreneurs to be able to start new businesses and create jobs – by eliminating exclusions due to pre-existing conditions, and the exchanges.

Take my business. This year, my health insurance cost increased a whopping 29%. Last year, I had a 20% increase. Yes – more than 50% in two years compounded! Oh – you may say – my insurance is expensive because we have a so-called "Cadillac" plan. Nope – my own health care plan provides little more than catastrophic coverage; I can't afford anything better. And it's not because my employees cost insurance companies a lot — we're an unusually healthy group.

Politicians or insurance companies may claim price increases like mine are the result of "Obamacare." Bullhockey! It happens every year.

Why do I – and you – face such huge premium increases? Because health insurance companies don't want small businesses. We're too risky – there aren't enough people in a small group to even out the risk. If only one person in a small business gets sick, insurance companies lose all the profit they've made on our few healthy employees. The way they get rid of us? Continually raising our prices.

------------------

You see, for Republicans, "small business" is at least a billion in yearly revenue.

Children thrown off parents HC

Anyone who is over the age of 18 is not a child

32 million Americans lose HC

Bullshit

The best chance for small businesses and the self-employed to get affordable health insurance – through health insurance exchanges.

When you are forced to cover people who already have a p[re exsisting condition you must raise your rates. If you have to raise your rates how is it allowing anyone to save money?

230 billion added to deficit

When you are not having to pay for somethig that does not exsist how does it cost anything?

Dean this is total bullshit because the democrats gave the CBO bogus figures to make the numbers fit their argument.

 

[Stephanie]

You got to hand to Rdean. he has all the DNC talking points down pat.

and that lovely picture he posted, WHO are the ONES FEARMONGERING. good grief.

 

[NYcarbineer]

This is what healthcare rationing looks like. This is rationing by definition, contrary to what conservatives would like you to believe.

 

[daveman]

are the ones that do have special powers?
in my world we call those people retards.

I thought about visiting your world once, but I couldn't manage to smack my head with a hammer quite hard enough.

you're to stupid for my world

And yet, oddly, I know to capitalize the first word of a sentence, I know the difference between "to" and "too", and I know how punctuation works.

 

[daveman]

jesus i actually have to explain this to you?
i wasnt refuting her post, i was calling her stupid for the post. Her post does not refute me calling her stupid. in fact she didnt even bother to defend herself.

what you are saying never happened. Stop eating paste and maybe you will get it.

So I see you're going with the "It's Not Hypocrisy When I Do It" gambit. Let me know how that works out for you.

alright you dont get it. you are a fucking retard.

Oh, I get it, all right. You refuse to hold yourself to the standards you hold others to.

 

[rdean]

you have posted some shit that has been way over the top, but this time even this shit tops the rest. BULL SHIT.

Hello! What do you think repealing the HC bill would actually do?

230 billion added to deficit

32 million Americans lose HC

Children thrown off parents HC

HC Companies once again able to "cut" sick people

Note to Congress: Keep your hands off our health care law - USATODAY.com

From Rhonda Abrams, "President of The Planning Shop" and publisher of books for entrepreneurs. Her newest is the 5th edition of The Successful Business Plan: Secrets and Strategies.

• The best chance for small businesses and the self-employed to get affordable health insurance – through health insurance exchanges.

• The best chance for entrepreneurs to be able to start new businesses and create jobs – by eliminating exclusions due to pre-existing conditions, and the exchanges.

Take my business. This year, my health insurance cost increased a whopping 29%. Last year, I had a 20% increase. Yes – more than 50% in two years compounded! Oh – you may say – my insurance is expensive because we have a so-called "Cadillac" plan. Nope – my own health care plan provides little more than catastrophic coverage; I can't afford anything better. And it's not because my employees cost insurance companies a lot — we're an unusually healthy group.

Politicians or insurance companies may claim price increases like mine are the result of "Obamacare." Bullhockey! It happens every year.

Why do I – and you – face such huge premium increases? Because health insurance companies don't want small businesses. We're too risky – there aren't enough people in a small group to even out the risk. If only one person in a small business gets sick, insurance companies lose all the profit they've made on our few healthy employees. The way they get rid of us? Continually raising our prices.

------------------

You see, for Republicans, "small business" is at least a billion in yearly revenue.

Anyone who is over the age of 18 is not a child



Bullshit

The best chance for small businesses and the self-employed to get affordable health insurance – through health insurance exchanges.

When you are forced to cover people who already have a p[re exsisting condition you must raise your rates. If you have to raise your rates how is it allowing anyone to save money?

230 billion added to deficit

When you are not having to pay for somethig that does not exsist how does it cost anything?

Dean this is total bullshit because the democrats gave the CBO bogus figures to make the numbers fit their argument.

Yes, but if you allow people who have children going to college to stay on their health care, it certainly helps.

Arguing with you guys is difficult because you refuse to learn anything. Stick with Republican talking points and you just look kinda stupid, seriously.

If someone doesn't have insurance and they get hit by a bus, we, the taxpayers have to pay for that person being in the hospital. Plus, they go bankrupt, we have to pay for that too.

The "pre-existing" condition is finally "spelled out" until it makes sense. Insurance companies categorized "pre-existing" condition as anyone with an allergy, a woman who has had a mammogram within the last six months, anyone who had a health checkup within the last six months, an appendectomy, their tonsils out and so on. Any of these "conditions" and you could lose your insurance if you became really sick.

If your son has an allergy and dad gets cancer, the entire family could be dropped for "pre-existing condition".

Now, none of those work. However, if you have cancer and no health care, you couldn't go and suddenly get health care. That would be like driving, getting into an accident and then going and getting car insurance to pay for your accident. That would be ridiculous. All that is spelled out in this bill.

In fact, that is the reason it makes health care insurance mandatory. So if someone gets ill later on, they couldn't be dropped and they wouldn't try to get health care after they got sick.

Not a single person has been prosecuted for refusing to get health care.

And you guys tell ME that I'm following the talking points? You guys don't even know Insurance Companies definition of "pre-existing" condition.

It's like the difference between "theory" and "scientific theory".

You guys are going to have to do better. You are NOT "master debaters" and you will never be a "cunning linguist".

 

[NYcarbineer]

I thought about visiting your world once, but I couldn't manage to smack my head with a hammer quite hard enough.

you're to stupid for my world

And yet, oddly, I know to capitalize the first word of a sentence, I know the difference between "to" and "too", and I know how punctuation works.

If you knew how punctuation worked you'd know where in that sentence you should have put semi-colons instead of commas.

 

[daveman]

you're to stupid for my world

And yet, oddly, I know to capitalize the first word of a sentence, I know the difference between "to" and "too", and I know how punctuation works.

If you knew how punctuation worked you'd know where in that sentence you should have put semi-colons instead of commas.

Wrong.

 

[manu1959]

What we want, and will get eventually, is a single payer plan that covers all citizens. And blackhearted bastards like you can go to hell.

as long as everyone pays the same amount for coverage i am good with that.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Now we see what a person's life is worth to some people. I hope none of those who put money over life claim to be Christians.

"Christians" used to feed people to lions....