Education vs Indoctrination: FDR's Depression

[G.T.]

What year did this imaginary "recovery" occur, can you point it out?

Also, in the 1930's the US economy was just beginning to see the effects of transformative technologies of electricity, wireless communication and mass production. There's no excuse for FDR's failure

The economy grew like wildfire from the 1933 to 1937. Industrial and agricultural output had rebounded to close to pre-crash levels.

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

Unemployment was 20% for 7.5 years.


You said that.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Wow. So much lol-worthiness in this thread.

1. Hearty-LOLs to defending Joseph McCarthy
2. Hearty-LOLs to believing in the Red Scare
3. Gut-busting LOLs to thinking the moon was "put" there by anything other than natural universal physics
4. LOL to a Conservative trying to teach indoctrination vs. education
5. Massive LOLs to Conservatives claiming FDR wasn't a brilliant President, and the standard by which all modern Presidents have been judged and fail MISERABLY in comparison to.

Maybe FDR did borrow from Hoover to write the New Deal. So what? The fact is that after FDR's policies were put in place, our country boomed like no other country had before. What's the Conservative rationale for that, exactly? Taxes were way higher than they were right now, and regulations on business were the highest they've ever been. And we still prospered at a rate we've never seen since.

It's one thing to re-write history, but to re-write it into such craziness is well...Conservative.

Again, another teaching moment.

American were indoctrinated into "McCarthy's Red Scare" (odd that McCarthy would pick a time a few months after the Russians tried to start WWIII with the Berlin Blockade and a few months before the ChiComs started a real War in Korea killing Americans to pick on Communists and launch his "Red Scare", but when you accept indoctrination and never ask question, those are the lies you can accept as fact). McCarthy was correct that the US government, WH and State were infiltrated by Communist spies. Indoctrination tells us he a drunk, crazy man; education tells us he was accurate and actually understated

How is 20% unemployment for 7 1/2 years "booming"? Can you explain that to me?

I think you keep misspelling education. The word you're looking for "history revision." Shit, that's two words. I guess you're just dumb.

See, that's your indoctrinated hive mind talking. You didn't think about that at all and rather than think about the timing of McCarthy's "Red Scare" you reflexively attacked

It's scary at first to think, it's an unused muscle, in your case dormant since first grade, but it gets easier with practice

 

[Polk]

What year did this imaginary "recovery" occur, can you point it out?

Also, in the 1930's the US economy was just beginning to see the effects of transformative technologies of electricity, wireless communication and mass production. There's no excuse for FDR's failure

The economy grew like wildfire from the 1933 to 1937. Industrial and agricultural output had rebounded to close to pre-crash levels.

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

You're comparing completely different things. Not all recessions are created equal. Truman followed the same policies you're denouncing during the post-war recession during his term. Even though it was a much larger demobilization, the slump was shorter and less severe than the post-WW1 recession.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The economy grew like wildfire from the 1933 to 1937. Industrial and agricultural output had rebounded to close to pre-crash levels.

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

Unemployment was 20% for 7.5 years.


You said that.

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%
1938: 19.0%
1939: 17.2%
1940: 14.6%

Average 18.5% over 8 years, 19.2% before Hitler conquered France

 

[Darkwind]

Nope. I see a partisan hack who has consumed so much kool-aid his blood sugar has caused mental impairment.

1. In your educated opinion, what year did FDR's New Deal rescue the US economy? Did you research it at all?

2. McCarthy found genuine Verona certified Communist spies throughout the US government and the WH.

Before a I answer let me be clear. You're a partisan hack, not very bright and parrot the talking points of the right wing (Fascists in many respects). You lack any of the qualities of "Americana", are a callous conservatives who doesn't give a moments concern for anyone but himself. It's why I belittle you constantly, why I call Warrior an asshole at every opportunity, why I laugh at the stupidity or Willow Tree and Stephanie and become nauseas whenever I read PC's defense of conservatism.

1. FDR put people to work. The world economy was in chaos, Fascism was the growing ideology in parts of Europe and Asia as well as Communism. The threat of revolution here was real as the discrepancy between the 1% and the rest of of our people had never been greater (until possible now). Hoover sent troops to disperse the veterans of the first World War, read about the bonus army.

See: List of strikes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

FDR was calm, focused and assured the American People that fear was the only thing to fear. You and your kind use fear as a tool to gain power (Hello Reichstag fire) and hate (Hello Kristalinacht).

Open you eyes, try (in your case it will be hard work) to think about the consequence of what you believe you want.

2. McCarthy was a drunk demagogue who ruined peoples lives. An asshole, much like today's callous conservatives.

Obama's plan is to put people to work. You're to damn dumb to understand that is the ultimate solution to our economic mess. Putting more money into the hands of the few only increases the likelihood we will become a pure plutocracy, the fascism of the 21st Century.

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around to help put America back to work.

 

[Polk]

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

Unemployment was 20% for 7.5 years.


You said that.

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%
1938: 19.0%
1939: 17.2%
1940: 14.6%

Average 18.5% over 8 years, 19.2% before Hitler conquered France

See where it spikes back up in 1938? That's when your preferred policy of austerity was attempted.

 

[Polk]

1. In your educated opinion, what year did FDR's New Deal rescue the US economy? Did you research it at all?

2. McCarthy found genuine Verona certified Communist spies throughout the US government and the WH.

Before a I answer let me be clear. You're a partisan hack, not very bright and parrot the talking points of the right wing (Fascists in many respects). You lack any of the qualities of "Americana", are a callous conservatives who doesn't give a moments concern for anyone but himself. It's why I belittle you constantly, why I call Warrior an asshole at every opportunity, why I laugh at the stupidity or Willow Tree and Stephanie and become nauseas whenever I read PC's defense of conservatism.

1. FDR put people to work. The world economy was in chaos, Fascism was the growing ideology in parts of Europe and Asia as well as Communism. The threat of revolution here was real as the discrepancy between the 1% and the rest of of our people had never been greater (until possible now). Hoover sent troops to disperse the veterans of the first World War, read about the bonus army.

See: List of strikes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

FDR was calm, focused and assured the American People that fear was the only thing to fear. You and your kind use fear as a tool to gain power (Hello Reichstag fire) and hate (Hello Kristalinacht).

Open you eyes, try (in your case it will be hard work) to think about the consequence of what you believe you want.

2. McCarthy was a drunk demagogue who ruined peoples lives. An asshole, much like today's callous conservatives.

Obama's plan is to put people to work. You're to damn dumb to understand that is the ultimate solution to our economic mess. Putting more money into the hands of the few only increases the likelihood we will become a pure plutocracy, the fascism of the 21st Century.

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around, to put America back to work.

It's pretty laughable to say he was "proven right" because he had a few hits. If you fire a Gatling gun into a crowd of people, you're going to hit a few people who deserve to be shot, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The economy grew like wildfire from the 1933 to 1937. Industrial and agricultural output had rebounded to close to pre-crash levels.

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

You're comparing completely different things. Not all recessions are created equal. Truman followed the same policies you're denouncing during the post-war recession during his term. Even though it was a much larger demobilization, the slump was shorter and less severe than the post-WW1 recession.

Actually famed Keynesian economist Paul Samuelson predicted another Great Depression would follow the WWII demobilization and like every other Keynesian economist he was wrong in the trillions column and never paid an academic price for it. He's still followed as closely as Krugman.

My point was to contrast a policy that worked, Hadring Coolidge and Mellon's "let the market reprice" against a policy that failed FDR and Obama's "Government Stimulus"

 

[Darkwind]

Before a I answer let me be clear. You're a partisan hack, not very bright and parrot the talking points of the right wing (Fascists in many respects). You lack any of the qualities of "Americana", are a callous conservatives who doesn't give a moments concern for anyone but himself. It's why I belittle you constantly, why I call Warrior an asshole at every opportunity, why I laugh at the stupidity or Willow Tree and Stephanie and become nauseas whenever I read PC's defense of conservatism.

1. FDR put people to work. The world economy was in chaos, Fascism was the growing ideology in parts of Europe and Asia as well as Communism. The threat of revolution here was real as the discrepancy between the 1% and the rest of of our people had never been greater (until possible now). Hoover sent troops to disperse the veterans of the first World War, read about the bonus army.

See: List of strikes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

FDR was calm, focused and assured the American People that fear was the only thing to fear. You and your kind use fear as a tool to gain power (Hello Reichstag fire) and hate (Hello Kristalinacht).

Open you eyes, try (in your case it will be hard work) to think about the consequence of what you believe you want.

2. McCarthy was a drunk demagogue who ruined peoples lives. An asshole, much like today's callous conservatives.

Obama's plan is to put people to work. You're to damn dumb to understand that is the ultimate solution to our economic mess. Putting more money into the hands of the few only increases the likelihood we will become a pure plutocracy, the fascism of the 21st Century.

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around, to put America back to work.

It's pretty laughable to say he was "proven right" because he had a few hits. If you fire a Gatling gun into a crowd of people, you're going to hit a few people who deserve to be shot, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea.

And I implied as much. However, it gets ignored or lost in the rush to hate him that he was right in regards to many (it was more than just a few) people were communists and managed to get into positions of influence

Regardless, the point of the thread is that FDR gets a lot of credit for something he did not do.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I think the problem that the Old Fogeys Association is having is that since many of us in the generation didn't live through the Bullshit,er I mean "Red" Scare, we have only the historical record to refer to. And since the historical record shows that the Red Scare was essentially bullshit, as was the Cold War, and so those of us who have had the advantage of not swallowing the anti-Communist-Just-Because-They're-Communists Kool-Aid we can see how BOTH the USSR and the USA conducted themselves like total assfucks for a long, long time.

We can do the same analysis work on McCarthy. He was a massive fuck-up and mostly just ran the good names of good people through the mud. But at least we can thank him for creating a 60-year hate-boner Conservatives have had for Hollywood...I guess.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Unemployment was 20% for 7.5 years.


You said that.

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%
1938: 19.0%
1939: 17.2%
1940: 14.6%

Average 18.5% over 8 years, 19.2% before Hitler conquered France

See where it spikes back up in 1938? That's when your preferred policy of austerity was attempted.

What gave you the idea that I support "Austerity" especially as currently employed? The modern idea of austerity is the stupidest idea ever, it only serves to keep the banks whole and damages everybody else

It's a financial neutron bomb that destroys a nation but gives the banks the illusion of solvency

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I also like how people freak out about Communists getting into seats of power. I thought we had Freedom of Ideas here, no? So unless those reported Communists were actually doing treasonous things and participating in sedition, it's all a lot of hot air and dumb-dumb-ocity.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I think the problem that the Old Fogeys Association is having is that since many of us in the generation didn't live through the Bullshit,er I mean "Red" Scare, we have only the historical record to refer to. And since the historical record shows that the Red Scare was essentially bullshit, as was the Cold War, and so those of us who have had the advantage of not swallowing the anti-Communist-Just-Because-They're-Communists Kool-Aid we can see how BOTH the USSR and the USA conducted themselves like total assfucks for a long, long time.

We can do the same analysis work on McCarthy. He was a massive fuck-up and mostly just ran the good names of good people through the mud. But at least we can thank him for creating a 60-year hate-boner Conservatives have had for Hollywood...I guess.

What did McCarthy have to do with Hollywood?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I also like how people freak out about Communists getting into seats of power. I thought we had Freedom of Ideas here, no? So unless those reported Communists were actually doing treasonous things and participating in sedition, it's all a lot of hot air and dumb-dumb-ocity.

You know people in the White House and State take an oath to protect and defend the US Constitution, right?

 

[Polk]

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around, to put America back to work.

It's pretty laughable to say he was "proven right" because he had a few hits. If you fire a Gatling gun into a crowd of people, you're going to hit a few people who deserve to be shot, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea.

And I implied as much. However, it gets ignored or lost in the rush to hate him that he was right in regards to many (it was more than just a few) people were communists and managed to get into positions of influence

Regardless, the point of the thread is that FDR gets a lot of credit for something he did not do.

He was right about a few people, but what does that really prove? How many innocent people have to suffer to capture a handful?

 

[Polk]

The economy grew when the Fed started to put back the money the siphoned out of the economy, no doubt.

Here are the US unemployment stats now think before you answer, but in light of Harding and Coolidge dropping US from 12% to 2% in 1 1/2 years, how is FDR's record anything but a failure?

1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1%
1936: 16.9%
1937: 14.3%

You're comparing completely different things. Not all recessions are created equal. Truman followed the same policies you're denouncing during the post-war recession during his term. Even though it was a much larger demobilization, the slump was shorter and less severe than the post-WW1 recession.

Actually famed Keynesian economist Paul Samuelson predicted another Great Depression would follow the WWII demobilization and like every other Keynesian economist he was wrong in the trillions column and never paid an academic price for it. He's still followed as closely as Krugman.

My point was to contrast a policy that worked, Hadring Coolidge and Mellon's "let the market reprice" against a policy that failed FDR and Obama's "Government Stimulus"

You still don't get that there are different kinds of recessions.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I think the problem that the Old Fogeys Association is having is that since many of us in the generation didn't live through the Bullshit,er I mean "Red" Scare, we have only the historical record to refer to. And since the historical record shows that the Red Scare was essentially bullshit, as was the Cold War, and so those of us who have had the advantage of not swallowing the anti-Communist-Just-Because-They're-Communists Kool-Aid we can see how BOTH the USSR and the USA conducted themselves like total assfucks for a long, long time.

We can do the same analysis work on McCarthy. He was a massive fuck-up and mostly just ran the good names of good people through the mud. But at least we can thank him for creating a 60-year hate-boner Conservatives have had for Hollywood...I guess.

What did McCarthy have to do with Hollywood?

Really?

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[CrusaderFrank]

1. In your educated opinion, what year did FDR's New Deal rescue the US economy? Did you research it at all?

2. McCarthy found genuine Verona certified Communist spies throughout the US government and the WH.

Before a I answer let me be clear. You're a partisan hack, not very bright and parrot the talking points of the right wing (Fascists in many respects). You lack any of the qualities of "Americana", are a callous conservatives who doesn't give a moments concern for anyone but himself. It's why I belittle you constantly, why I call Warrior an asshole at every opportunity, why I laugh at the stupidity or Willow Tree and Stephanie and become nauseas whenever I read PC's defense of conservatism.

1. FDR put people to work. The world economy was in chaos, Fascism was the growing ideology in parts of Europe and Asia as well as Communism. The threat of revolution here was real as the discrepancy between the 1% and the rest of of our people had never been greater (until possible now). Hoover sent troops to disperse the veterans of the first World War, read about the bonus army.

See: List of strikes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

FDR was calm, focused and assured the American People that fear was the only thing to fear. You and your kind use fear as a tool to gain power (Hello Reichstag fire) and hate (Hello Kristalinacht).

Open you eyes, try (in your case it will be hard work) to think about the consequence of what you believe you want.

2. McCarthy was a drunk demagogue who ruined peoples lives. An asshole, much like today's callous conservatives.

Obama's plan is to put people to work. You're to damn dumb to understand that is the ultimate solution to our economic mess. Putting more money into the hands of the few only increases the likelihood we will become a pure plutocracy, the fascism of the 21st Century.

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around to help put America back to work.

Name one "innocent person" harmed by McCarthy

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Before a I answer let me be clear. You're a partisan hack, not very bright and parrot the talking points of the right wing (Fascists in many respects). You lack any of the qualities of "Americana", are a callous conservatives who doesn't give a moments concern for anyone but himself. It's why I belittle you constantly, why I call Warrior an asshole at every opportunity, why I laugh at the stupidity or Willow Tree and Stephanie and become nauseas whenever I read PC's defense of conservatism.

1. FDR put people to work. The world economy was in chaos, Fascism was the growing ideology in parts of Europe and Asia as well as Communism. The threat of revolution here was real as the discrepancy between the 1% and the rest of of our people had never been greater (until possible now). Hoover sent troops to disperse the veterans of the first World War, read about the bonus army.

See: List of strikes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

FDR was calm, focused and assured the American People that fear was the only thing to fear. You and your kind use fear as a tool to gain power (Hello Reichstag fire) and hate (Hello Kristalinacht).

Open you eyes, try (in your case it will be hard work) to think about the consequence of what you believe you want.

2. McCarthy was a drunk demagogue who ruined peoples lives. An asshole, much like today's callous conservatives.

Obama's plan is to put people to work. You're to damn dumb to understand that is the ultimate solution to our economic mess. Putting more money into the hands of the few only increases the likelihood we will become a pure plutocracy, the fascism of the 21st Century.

I used to think that you may have some basis for your belief in your own intelligence. I've revised that opinion downward.

Mccarthy was a self-centered fool who was correct in exposing the communist problem of that time, but a moron in how he went about exposing it. Needless to say, he harmed many innocent people. He deserves the poor reputation he enjoys to this day.

That does not negate that he has been proven right. As for FDR and putting people to work...

You may as well give credit to putting people to work in America to Adolph Hitler. It would be much more accurate. Nothing FDR did would have solved the economic problem this country faced in those days.

Unfortunately, for you and others (but fortunately for the world), Obama does not have a Hitler this time around to help put America back to work.

Name one "innocent person" harmed by McCarthy

The Hollywood Ten. There are ten men who were unjustly blacklisted from working in Hollywood, forced to live in Mexico while they write, and all thanks to McCarthyism. There are ten people you can start with.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I think the problem that the Old Fogeys Association is having is that since many of us in the generation didn't live through the Bullshit,er I mean "Red" Scare, we have only the historical record to refer to. And since the historical record shows that the Red Scare was essentially bullshit, as was the Cold War, and so those of us who have had the advantage of not swallowing the anti-Communist-Just-Because-They're-Communists Kool-Aid we can see how BOTH the USSR and the USA conducted themselves like total assfucks for a long, long time.

We can do the same analysis work on McCarthy. He was a massive fuck-up and mostly just ran the good names of good people through the mud. But at least we can thank him for creating a 60-year hate-boner Conservatives have had for Hollywood...I guess.

What did McCarthy have to do with Hollywood?

Really?

McCarthyism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

What did Joe McCarthy have to do with Hollywood?

Joe McCarthy was a person.

Can you please tell me what Joe McCarthy ever did to anyone in Hollywood?