Do You Force Religion on Your Kids?

[Abbey Normal]

I think this text, tho', Abbey, speaks VERY strongly to the responsibility we have to our children.
...

Yes, I think so too.

 

[Gunny]

I am not basing it on the belief that there is no God. But how do you know that your God exists? What if it's really Allah up there? I am not denying the existence of your God or any other God-- my presumption, which is a fact, is that there are many different Gods that believe in. What if, for instance, your kids want to be Hindu? Or Jewish? Or Muslim? Or nothing at all? Shouldn't they be able to decide this without the impartial influence of Christianity?

And please don't take this as me telling you what to do; that's not my intention-- I'm just raising this point because people tend to overlook it. Your business is your business and quite frankly I really don't care how you raise your kids. So don't think I'm personally attacking you.

The one point that you make that I will concede to is: "Christianity compels us to raise our children in the eyes of the Lord. THAT is a part of the religion. By telling me to not teach my children about God, you are telling me to turn my back on my religion."

That's an excellent point that you make. So based on that, you are fulfilling your role as a Christian by raising your kids that way. It's a tough statement to work around because if I say that you still shouldn't do it, then I'm saying YOU, yourself (not your kids), should not be Christian. If I say to do it, then I contradict myself.

Personally, I would retort to that by saying that all Christians have sinned along the way (hell, when you're born you've already sinned). To do this may be a sin, but what's the difference between that and all the other sins that you've repented? I don't know if you do confession, I'm just basing it on catholocism because thats how I was brought up.

I take this as telling me what to do when that is exactly what it is. You can't get anywhere attacking Christianity itself, so you think you have found a chink in the armor to exploit through the back door.

When a child is intellectualy and emotionally mature enough to decide what and who if any to worship, then they should be allowed to. Until that time, parents are morally responsible to raise their children to be productive members of society, and the Christian religion places the responsibility of teaching Christianity to their children.

In response to your last statement .... to purposefully deny a child God's Grace is a sin directly against God -- blaspheming the Holy Spirit -- and is not forgiveable.

You state you were raised Catholic, or words to that effect. Yet, based on your reasoning, you chose to turn your back on your faith.

Why does the premise of your argument presume that every other child raised in Christianity does not do the same? The problem with the intellectually elite is that you all think you are are privy to some enlightenment denied us dumb, redneck Christians.

There is no back door here for you to attack Christianity with the "nip it in the bud" theory.

Here is a little something for you to ponder:

If I am wrong, as a conscience entity I cease to exist. I'll never know it.

If you are wrong, you're damned-sure going to know all about it .... for eternity.

 

[Joz]

"Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it." Proverbs 22:6
For us Christians, it is a source of great comfort.

I'm sorry to harp on this text. I mentioned earlier that if my child chooses differently, from the principles I taught him, then I as a parent have failed.
But there has to be something more to it, right? Or am I trying to find a loop hole out of the fact?

 

[manu1959]

i do not force religion on my children......i go to church and i bring them with me.....they go to sunday school....they enjoy the stories.....and believing in god is something they seem to like.....my son sings in the childrens choir because he asked to....at some point he may choose not to go....at the moment he knows right from wrong and is well behaved....

 

[liberalogic]

I take this as telling me what to do when that is exactly what it is. You can't get anywhere attacking Christianity itself, so you think you have found a chink in the armor to exploit through the back door.

When a child is intellectualy and emotionally mature enough to decide what and who if any to worship, then they should be allowed to. Until that time, parents are morally responsible to raise their children to be productive members of society, and the Christian religion places the responsibility of teaching Christianity to their children.

In response to your last statement .... to purposefully deny a child God's Grace is a sin directly against God -- blaspheming the Holy Spirit -- and is not forgiveable.

You state you were raised Catholic, or words to that effect. Yet, based on your reasoning, you chose to turn your back on your faith.

Why does the premise of your argument presume that every other child raised in Christianity does not do the same? The problem with the intellectually elite is that you all think you are are privy to some enlightenment denied us dumb, redneck Christians.

There is no back door here for you to attack Christianity with the "nip it in the bud" theory.

Here is a little something for you to ponder:

If I am wrong, as a conscience entity I cease to exist. I'll never know it.

If you are wrong, you're damned-sure going to know all about it .... for eternity.

I'm no intellectual elite, but I'm certainly not a redneck. Whatever the case, you have, as usual, attacked me for bringing up a point and have gone on to avoid the issue at hand. In this forum I have not argued anything about Christianity itself-- as a matter of fact, I'm talking about all religion-- not just you and jesus.

As you know, I completely disagree with many Christian values. But I'm not talking about them here. We're talking about children and religion-- not just christianity. So don't single yourself out.

 

[manu1959]

I completely disagree with many Christian

sorry i must have missed a meeting.....with which christian values do you disagree?

 

[Joz]

.....As you know, I completely disagree with many Christian values.

......For instance, I think people should be able to have premarital sex or masturbate for that matter. I think gays should be accepted. I don't think slavery should be condoned on any level. I think women are 100% equal to men. I value this and it all contradicts the bible. So I could argue that it shouldn't be used to show morality, but that's a totally different issue and does not pertain to the subject.

I asked you to start another thread as you didn't want to discuss this in this thread but it looks like that's the way it's heading. And also, to back up the Bible contradictions you spoke of. Nor have you stated exactly why you don't care for so-called christian principles. I'm still curious.

 

[liberalogic]

I asked you to start another thread as you didn't want to discuss this in this thread but it looks like that's the way it's heading. And also, to back up the Bible contradictions you spoke of. Nor have you stated exactly why you don't care for so-called christian principles. I'm still curious.

I did back up the principles a few posts ago...check again.

And how fair would it be if I started that thread? Every word that I say will be dissected; I will be accused of blasphemy; I will be called a "Christian hater" and I will be attacked from every conceivable angle. It's just not fair because I am only human and I can only respond to so much. My words will be twisted and then I'll have to respond to that as well. I'd love to discuss it with you individually if you'd like, but allowing everyone else to pounce on every word I write and twist them to fit their own arguments and thenresort to personally criticizing me just isn't fair.

 

[liberalogic]

sorry i must have missed a meeting.....with which christian values do you disagree?

Check almost any post I've written.

 

[Joz]

I did back up the principles a few posts ago...check again.

I'm sorry, I've read it and apparently I'm missing something.

.... I'd love to discuss it with you individually if you'd like, but allowing everyone else to pounce on every word I write and twist them to fit their own arguments and thenresort to personally criticizing me just isn't fair.

I do believe you're fair in your assessment. I just tho't it could be a good discussion. Sometimes christians, have to give more than lip-service when proving their beliefs :blah2: ; actually do some soul-searching.

 

[manu1959]

Check almost any post I've written.

sorry not doing the research....name 5.

 

[musicman]

liberalogic:

When I held my newborn son in my arms, I whispered a promise to him: "I will never lie to you". And I never have. I know the Gospel of Jesus Christ to be the truth - as well as I know that flowers bloom in the spring, running out into a busy street will get you killed, and stealing is wrong. I'm not cramming anything down my child's throat. I'm keeping my promise to him.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I did back up the principles a few posts ago...check again.

And how fair would it be if I started that thread? Every word that I say will be dissected; I will be accused of blasphemy; I will be called a "Christian hater" and I will be attacked from every conceivable angle. It's just not fair because I am only human and I can only respond to so much. My words will be twisted and then I'll have to respond to that as well. I'd love to discuss it with you individually if you'd like, but allowing everyone else to pounce on every word I write and twist them to fit their own arguments and thenresort to personally criticizing me just isn't fair.

coward.

 

[dmp]

coward.

Bingo.

I wonder if people should stop teaching their kids Science. After all, there are SOO many scientific theories out there; our kids should decide for themselves!


And MATH!! ooh! No math for my kids. Let them figure it out on their own!

Same with potty training! Who am I to try to force 'taking a poo in the toilet' upon my kids!

 

[Gunny]

I'm no intellectual elite, but I'm certainly not a redneck. Whatever the case, you have, as usual, attacked me for bringing up a point and have gone on to avoid the issue at hand. In this forum I have not argued anything about Christianity itself-- as a matter of fact, I'm talking about all religion-- not just you and jesus.

As you know, I completely disagree with many Christian values. But I'm not talking about them here. We're talking about children and religion-- not just christianity. So don't single yourself out.

You DO comprende Ingles, right? You completely disagree with many Christian values. You aren't talking about them here; yet, you are questioning a Chrisitian value, Einstein.

I have addressed your question directly and avoided nothing. Apparently, if you don't like the answer, then it doesn't count as one.

Since you want to accuse me of attacking YOU personally, here ya' go .....I don't know if I need to draw you a picture or what ..... Parents are responsible for teaching their children what THEY believe is right until such time as those children are emotionally and intellectually mature enough to make those decisions on their own, or they reach the age of majority, whichever comes first.

That INCLUDES the parent's religion. Obviously if the parents didn't believe their religion to be correct, they wouldn't practice it, now would they?

I speak from a Christian point of view because I AM one. Talk about your bullshit deflection. What .... you expect me to defend Judaism or Wiccans? GMAFB.

I answered your question. You don't like the answer, too bad. But don't give me the tears routine in your bullshit attempt to villify me.

Here, talk to this: :moon4:

 

[Gunny]

I did back up the principles a few posts ago...check again.

And how fair would it be if I started that thread? Every word that I say will be dissected; I will be accused of blasphemy; I will be called a "Christian hater" and I will be attacked from every conceivable angle. It's just not fair because I am only human and I can only respond to so much. My words will be twisted and then I'll have to respond to that as well. I'd love to discuss it with you individually if you'd like, but allowing everyone else to pounce on every word I write and twist them to fit their own arguments and thenresort to personally criticizing me just isn't fair.

 

[Bonnie]

Gunny Here, talk to this: :moon4:

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[liberalogic]

liberalogic:

When I held my newborn son in my arms, I whispered a promise to him: "I will never lie to you". And I never have. I know the Gospel of Jesus Christ to be the truth - as well as I know that flowers bloom in the spring, running out into a busy street will get you killed, and stealing is wrong. I'm not cramming anything down my child's throat. I'm keeping my promise to him.

I wasn't really sending this in the direction of lying. My point was more about determining something that is so ambiguous (any religion) at an age where children can't comprehend the larger implications.

Take this for example: Do you talk to your kids about sex when they are really young? I'd doubt it. You probably don't do that because they can't understand it, they can only accept it. With religion, you can be told to accept the existence of Christ, Allah, or anyone else, but the Child doesn't realize that there might be more to it, less to it, or exactly what's there. They can only base that on their own experiences, research, or soul-searching. I'm not saying Christianity is a lie-- please don't get me wrong. I'm just saying that, in my opinion, it should be left up the child (when they mature) without any bias training from the parents.

What no one has brought up, which I'd be interested to hear about, are the mentally handicapped. I bring this up specifically because my brother is autistic. So if he can never worship or can never understand God or really believe in him, is he condemned to hell? I'm genuinely interested in this answer, if anyone can throw something out there.

 

[Joz]

Talk about self control! I want to jump in here soooooo bad, but since it's addressed to Mm, I'll wait.

 

[5stringJeff]

I wasn't really sending this in the direction of lying. My point was more about determining something that is so ambiguous (any religion) at an age where children can't comprehend the larger implications.

Take this for example: Do you talk to your kids about sex when they are really young? I'd doubt it. You probably don't do that because they can't understand it, they can only accept it. With religion, you can be told to accept the existence of Christ, Allah, or anyone else, but the Child doesn't realize that there might be more to it, less to it, or exactly what's there. They can only base that on their own experiences, research, or soul-searching. I'm not saying Christianity is a lie-- please don't get me wrong. I'm just saying that, in my opinion, it should be left up the child (when they mature) without any bias training from the parents.

Your whole argument is that religion is too complex for a child to understand, therefore we shouldn't tell them anything about it. That's horrible advice. How about these questions:

Why is the sky blue?
Why is the grass green?
Why did my puppy die?

All three questions, very likely to come out of a child's mouth, yet all three are quite complex. Should we tell our children, "Well, that's really complex, so you'll just have to wait and learn about it in school, or figure it out as a grown-up?" Of course not. We give them an answer that they can comprehend. We treat religion the same way - we give them information about God as they are able to comprehend it. For example, I'm reading a systematic theology book right now. It's hard reading - and I consider myself to be somewhat intellegent. I wouldn't explain it to my 12 year old, even though she understands and believes the basic truths about Christianity, because she'd glaze over. But we have a duty to raise our children in respect to the truth about God.

What no one has brought up, which I'd be interested to hear about, are the mentally handicapped. I bring this up specifically because my brother is autistic. So if he can never worship or can never understand God or really believe in him, is he condemned to hell? I'm genuinely interested in this answer, if anyone can throw something out there.

I don't know the "right" answer, but I would say that God understands how a person's mind works, and understands how much a particular autistic person can comprehend, and would judge him accordingly. However, I will say that God doesn't accept us based on our knowledge; he accepts us based on our belief.