Do only Christians go to heaven?

[baileyn45]

My Golden Retrievers will be there also, oh and my drinking buddies regardless of their beliefs.

 

[Skull Pilot]

No one goes to heaven because it doesn't exist

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

 

[Mudda]

My Golden Retrievers will be there also, oh and my drinking buddies regardless of their beliefs.

Bring extra water bowls!

 

[hadit]

No one goes to heaven because it doesn't exist

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

You cannot prove a negative. The best you can say is, "We can't replicate God in a lab, so we don't think He exists". God is not an ATM, where you push the right buttons and the goodies come out. He is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

 

[Skull Pilot]

No one goes to heaven because it doesn't exist

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

You cannot prove a negative. The best you can say is, "We can't replicate God in a lab, so we don't think He exists". God is not an ATM, where you push the right buttons and the goodies come out. He is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

I'm not trying to prove a negative

When you prove there is a supreme being with scientific and verifiable evidence I will then say you were right.

But I won't hold my breath

 

[AVG-JOE]

Every religion needs to believe that theirs is the only way.

It's the only way to justify the cost of being faithful to any particular dogma or ideology.

That's actually not true.

There are in fact numerous faiths that do not believe that only their followers will meet a different end than the rest of the non-believers.

For example, some believe in reincarnation, where you come back to right the wrongs of the past. Many believe that everyone will come back, whether you are part of their faith or not.

Another well known faith, believes that everyone will be judged by g-d at their death, and some will go to Heaven and others Hell, but this isn't determined by faith. So some who don't know anything about this particular faith, will go to Heaven, and those that are of the faith, and practice it religiously will go to Hell.

No one knows, whether they are orthodox believers or complete atheist, where they are going. There's no way to know, until you get there.

Yet there are other cults, that believe that everyone is going to Heaven, it only depends on how long it takes you to get there. They believe that there are different levels of Heaven, or that there is a time-out-box place that people have to go, to in a simplistic version, work their way up to the highest level. How bad you are, determines how long it takes, but everyone is going.

So Hitler and Mother Teresa, are both going to Heaven, only it's going to take Hitler another 3000 years, and Teresa likely just stopped by for 15 seconds, and got back on the elevator up.

Then you have yet another major religion which doesn't have any orthodox belief system, and you are part of the faith, whether you believe or not. If you are born there, or if you die there, you are magically part of the faith no matter what you believe.

Biblical Christianity, and Judaism, is one of only a few belief systems in the world, where they start from the premise that all human kind is flawed, and we are all internally evil, and have done wrong things that separate us from G-d. But G-d gave us a way to escape this separation, by having the debt of the crimes paid for, by someone else who is Jesus the Christ.

But of course, being told that all humanity is inherently evil and flawed, is horribly offensive. This is why you can see university professors openly tell people to be hostile and mocking towards Christians under the guise of "all religions are phony", yet turn right around and openly invite Hindus and Islamic people on the staff of their universities.

Jesus is more offensive than any cult around the world, because all the rest say:
"yes you screwed up but do these three things, and you are fine"
"Yes that was a mistake, but it was an evil spirit that caused you to do it"
"Yes that was a bad move, but you'll fix it when you come back"
"Yes maybe that was a mistake, but as long as you help a little old lady, and give a homeless person a dollar, it cancels each other out"

Christianity is the faith that says "Yes you did evil. It was evil, and you are the cause of that evil, and you have no excuse. You can't earn your way out, you can't balance the scales, you can't fix it, but if you repent, and turn back to the Lord, he will forgive you."

People hate that. Why do you think after the "god is dead" 1970s, that all of a sudden everyone became a victim, and everyone had someone to blame? Nothing was anyone's fault anymore. It's not their fault they got shot, just because they had a gun, and refused to drop it when police showed up... no no it's societies fault. It's racism fault. It's the fault of H-B1 visas that I lost my job. It's discrimination that my pay is lower.

As soon as the people of America turned away from the faith that said "Evil is your fault, and you have no excuse"... now everyone has an excuse for everything.

And yet human nature says that I'm right.

Everyone needs to justify their decisions and the more time and treasure one has invested in a decision, the more likely they are to rationalize away the facts they are slowly but surely facing.

Anything is possible... but, if God is, and given human history, do you really think that any of the popular ancient Arab tales on the subject is the last word on such a being?

 

[AVG-JOE]

Every religion needs to believe that theirs is the only way.

It's the only way to justify the cost of being faithful to any particular dogma or ideology.

That's actually not true.

There are in fact numerous faiths that do not believe that only their followers will meet a different end than the rest of the non-believers.

For example, some believe in reincarnation, where you come back to right the wrongs of the past. Many believe that everyone will come back, whether you are part of their faith or not.

Another well known faith, believes that everyone will be judged by g-d at their death, and some will go to Heaven and others Hell, but this isn't determined by faith. So some who don't know anything about this particular faith, will go to Heaven, and those that are of the faith, and practice it religiously will go to Hell.

No one knows, whether they are orthodox believers or complete atheist, where they are going. There's no way to know, until you get there.

Yet there are other cults, that believe that everyone is going to Heaven, it only depends on how long it takes you to get there. They believe that there are different levels of Heaven, or that there is a time-out-box place that people have to go, to in a simplistic version, work their way up to the highest level. How bad you are, determines how long it takes, but everyone is going.

So Hitler and Mother Teresa, are both going to Heaven, only it's going to take Hitler another 3000 years, and Teresa likely just stopped by for 15 seconds, and got back on the elevator up.

Then you have yet another major religion which doesn't have any orthodox belief system, and you are part of the faith, whether you believe or not. If you are born there, or if you die there, you are magically part of the faith no matter what you believe.

Biblical Christianity, and Judaism, is one of only a few belief systems in the world, where they start from the premise that all human kind is flawed, and we are all internally evil, and have done wrong things that separate us from G-d. But G-d gave us a way to escape this separation, by having the debt of the crimes paid for, by someone else who is Jesus the Christ.

But of course, being told that all humanity is inherently evil and flawed, is horribly offensive. This is why you can see university professors openly tell people to be hostile and mocking towards Christians under the guise of "all religions are phony", yet turn right around and openly invite Hindus and Islamic people on the staff of their universities.

Jesus is more offensive than any cult around the world, because all the rest say:
"yes you screwed up but do these three things, and you are fine"
"Yes that was a mistake, but it was an evil spirit that caused you to do it"
"Yes that was a bad move, but you'll fix it when you come back"
"Yes maybe that was a mistake, but as long as you help a little old lady, and give a homeless person a dollar, it cancels each other out"

Christianity is the faith that says "Yes you did evil. It was evil, and you are the cause of that evil, and you have no excuse. You can't earn your way out, you can't balance the scales, you can't fix it, but if you repent, and turn back to the Lord, he will forgive you."

People hate that. Why do you think after the "god is dead" 1970s, that all of a sudden everyone became a victim, and everyone had someone to blame? Nothing was anyone's fault anymore. It's not their fault they got shot, just because they had a gun, and refused to drop it when police showed up... no no it's societies fault. It's racism fault. It's the fault of H-B1 visas that I lost my job. It's discrimination that my pay is lower.

As soon as the people of America turned away from the faith that said "Evil is your fault, and you have no excuse"... now everyone has an excuse for everything.

agreed good post

Why? Because it helps you to justify your own position. That's why.

 

[Mudda]

He (god) is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

And you know that how?

 

[hadit]

Prove it?

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

You cannot prove a negative. The best you can say is, "We can't replicate God in a lab, so we don't think He exists". God is not an ATM, where you push the right buttons and the goodies come out. He is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

I'm not trying to prove a negative

When you prove there is a supreme being with scientific and verifiable evidence I will then say you were right.

But I won't hold my breath

And therein lies the problem. "Scientific and verifiable" means repeatable and controllable. God moves when and where He wants to, not when and where we think He should.

 

[hadit]

He (god) is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

And you know that how?

If He were accountable to mans' demands, He would be controllable, and thus replicated in the lab. Thus, He is free to act in one circumstance and not in another, though we think they are the same.

 

[AVG-JOE]

hadit , Which God do you believe in, and why?

 

[Skull Pilot]

You haven't proven there is a heaven so you first

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

You cannot prove a negative. The best you can say is, "We can't replicate God in a lab, so we don't think He exists". God is not an ATM, where you push the right buttons and the goodies come out. He is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

I'm not trying to prove a negative

When you prove there is a supreme being with scientific and verifiable evidence I will then say you were right.

But I won't hold my breath

And therein lies the problem. "Scientific and verifiable" means repeatable and controllable. God moves when and where He wants to, not when and where we think He should.

God either exists or he doesn't
Until there is proof I will assume he doesn't
If there is proof I will gladly say I was wrong

 

[esthermoon]

No
Only Buddhists go to Nirvana lol

 

[hadit]

Between the two of us, which openly has a belief system of faith?

I'm not standing around trying to claim that I can empirically prove the existence of Heaven, because my belief system is based on faith.

You on the other hand are saying that there is no Heaven, as if it is a provable fact. If it is, then do so.

If you can't, and you are taking it on faith alone that there is no Heaven, which means your view is no more or less valid, than my own view.

There is no empirical proof of heaven.
When there is I'll admit I was wrong

There is no evidence that a supreme being exists
When there is I will admit I was wrong

But you will never say you are wrong because no matter what evidence is given you you will refuse to believe it

You cannot prove a negative. The best you can say is, "We can't replicate God in a lab, so we don't think He exists". God is not an ATM, where you push the right buttons and the goodies come out. He is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

I'm not trying to prove a negative

When you prove there is a supreme being with scientific and verifiable evidence I will then say you were right.

But I won't hold my breath

And therein lies the problem. "Scientific and verifiable" means repeatable and controllable. God moves when and where He wants to, not when and where we think He should.

God either exists or he doesn't
Until there is proof I will assume he doesn't
If there is proof I will gladly say I was wrong

By that time, it could well be too late, but that's your choice. Would you believe if He proved Himself to you in a very personal way that no one else would accept, or are you holding out for Him to reveal Himself to all mankind when He brings down the curtain?

 

[hadit]

hadit , Which God do you believe in, and why?

"Which God"? That's very interesting. I assume you mean to ask if I can put a name to God? Please elaborate.

I believe in God because I have seen Him move and work in my own life and in the lives of the people closest to me. I have seen lives changed.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Yes please. Name Him.

I don't like to assume that by 'God' you mean The God of Abraham, as described in The Torah, The New Testament and/or The Qur'an unless specified, even though that's exactly Who most Americans are referring to when they use the term 'God'.

I'm also curious as to why you believe in the God that holds your faith.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Are Christians the only ones accepted into heaven? - Interesting read (includes Bible verses)
"Classical evangelical doctrine holds that salvation comes only through faith in Jesus Christ, and that those without such faith will be condemned to hell. A number of texts are typically cited in support of this position."

So a good person who is an atheist goes to hell, but a Christian who commits crimes and murders people can go to heaven?
Please discuss. Is accepting Jesus Christ the only way to go to Heaven?

That is NOT what the bible teaches. Everyone will be judged at the end but those that never had the opportunity to make an informed choice about following God through Jesus will be given a second chance to do so. They will be taught the way and then given the choice.

 

[Mudda]

He (god) is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

And you know that how?

If He were accountable to mans' demands, He would be controllable, and thus replicated in the lab. Thus, He is free to act in one circumstance and not in another, though we think they are the same.

So that fact that your invisible being can't be replicated in a lab is proof that it exists? Your logic is so weak that I'm afraid for your sanity.

 

[baileyn45]

My Golden Retrievers will be there also, oh and my drinking buddies regardless of their beliefs.

Bring extra water bowls!

A couple of my drinking buddies will bring their own bowls.

 

[hadit]

He (god) is a sovereign being, unaccountable to mans' demands.

And you know that how?

If He were accountable to mans' demands, He would be controllable, and thus replicated in the lab. Thus, He is free to act in one circumstance and not in another, though we think they are the same.

So that fact that your invisible being can't be replicated in a lab is proof that it exists? Your logic is so weak that I'm afraid for your sanity.

I'm not offering you proof in that statement. Perhaps that's why you're confused. Here's a question for you. Exactly what proof of God's existence would you accept? Be as specific as possible.