Zone1 Do I Understand These Biblical Stories Correctly?

[Donald H]

Read my response again. I was obviously speaking of biological children.

You're very ignorant if you think that children conceived by AI aren't biological.
I think we'll end it there before you start going off.

 

[Road Runner]

You're very ignorant if you think that children conceived by AI aren't biological.

No they aren't if they have somebody else's sperm.

 

[buttercup]

With IVF, one can have biological children without having sex.... but of course that's in this day and age. Pretty sure that didn't exist in Jesus' day.

I believe Jesus was born of a virgin, but Mary was not a perpetual virgin as Catholics believe. Nowhere in the bible does it indicate that, as far as I've seen, and why would she have to be? I mean, after giving birth to the Messiah. That doesn't even make sense.

 

[Road Runner]

With IVF, one can have biological children without having sex.... but of course that's in this day and age. Pretty sure that didn't exist in Jesus' day.

How does that work if it's somebody else's sperm though because then that makes them the biological father doesn't it?

 

[buttercup]

How does that work if it's somebody else's sperm though because then that makes them the biological father doesn't it?

Well some couples do IVF when they can't conceive.... but it's still the sperm of the father and the egg of the mother.

I'm no expert but I think sometimes yes, they use the sperm of a donor if for whatever reason the father is impotent... or the other way around if the mother is infertile.

 

[Road Runner]

Well some couples do IVF when they can't conceive.... but it's still the sperm of the father and the egg of the mother.

I'm no expert but I think sometimes yes, they use the sperm of a donor if for whatever reason the father is impotent... or the other way around if the mother is infertile.

Makes sense.

 

[Here and there]

Jesus was baptized because He was trying to set an example for His followers and He was virgin born because that's the only way that He could escape being a sinner like the rest of us? Just curious because that's what I have been told, but those are a couple of biblical accounts that I'm not sure if I understand or not.

We know immaculate conceptions and virgin births are impossible in mammals. It’s called parthenogenesis.
Spirits do not inseminate anything.
Take it with a grain of salt but it’s a fiction novel.

 

[Woodznutz]

...and I was just told that all original sin comes from the father.

Original sin comes from Lucifer, who was the antetype of Eve, who is the antetype of today's women.

1 Timothy 2:14

 

[Road Runner]

Original sin comes from Lucifer, who was the antetype of Eve, who is the antetype of today's women.

1 Timothy 2:14

I know, but I was talking about the original sin of Adam.

 

[Woodznutz]

I know, but I was talking about the original sin of Adam.

I know, but I was talking about the original sin of Adam.

Adam took the sin of Eve upon himself, Christlike.

1 Timothy 2:14

 

[Road Runner]

Adam took the sin of Eve upon himself, Christlike.

1 Timothy 2:14

I think I get what you're saying, but I'm not quite sure how the Bible verse you quoted matches up.

 

[Woodznutz]

I think I get what you're saying, but I'm not quite sure how the Bible verse you quoted matches up.

The story in Genesis has Eve committing the 'original' sin, on earth (Lucifer committed it first, in heaven). Adam was cajoled into sharing in it. . God didn't condemn Adam for eating the forbidden fruit, but for 'hearkening to voice of his wife', thus forsaking his authority.

 

[Indeependent]

I didn't translate or mistranslate anything, I didn't even reply to her questions in the OP, so you're barking up the wrong tree.

My response is pertinent to your post.

 

[SweetSue92]

The story in Genesis has Eve committing the 'original' sin, on earth (Lucifer committed it first, in heaven). Adam was cajoled into sharing in it. . God didn't condemn Adam for eating the forbidden fruit, but for 'hearkening to voice of his wife', thus forsaking his authority.

Both a specific and particular kind of weakness and propensity to sin--both Adam and Eve.

 

[Woodznutz]

Both a specific and particular kind of weakness and propensity to sin--both Adam and Eve.

It's also a common human pattern, that of one leading others into sin.

 

[Meriweather]

It's also a common human pattern, that of one leading others into sin.

It is uncomfortable living with people who truly are better than who we are. We want to quietly slip away from them...or bring them down to our level.

 

[Woodznutz]

It is uncomfortable living with people who truly are better than who we are. We want to quietly slip away from them...or bring them down to our level.

True, and sadly they often succeed.

Place a drunkard and a teetotaler on an island with a good supply of booze, and soon you'll have two drunkards.

 

[surada]

I know, but I was talking about the original sin of Adam.

There's no original sin in Judaism or Islam.

 

[surada]

Cougarbear

Does Isaiah 7:14 Refer to a Virgin Birth? - Aish.com

aish.com

The Aish Rabbi Replies

Thank you for your important question. Yes, it is well-known that the actual word in that verse is “almah” – which throughout the Torah refers to a young woman without reference to her virginity, see for example Genesis 24:43, Exodus 2:8, and Song of Songs 1:3.

See especially Proverbs 30:19 which refers to “the way of a man with a young woman (almah)” where, as the commentators to Isaiah note, the intent is clearly for a non-virgin – as the verse uses this as an example of an act which leaves no trace. (See Rabbi Tovia Singer’s lecture on this here.)

Almah thus parallels the male version of that word, elem, which appears twice in the Torah having nothing to do with a young man’s marital status (I Samuel 17:56, 20:22).Further, the Torah does have a specific word for a virgin – betulah – which it consistently uses in reference to a woman’s virginity (e.g., Genesis 24:16, Exodus 22:15, Leviticus 21:14, and especially Deuteronomy 22:13-21) – and that is not the word used by Isaiah.

Matthew 1:23 claims that Jesus’s immaculate conception was the fulfillment of Isaiah’s prophecy that a virgin shall give birth, but it is immediately clear that this is not what Isaiah had in mind.

 

[Woodznutz]

Cougarbear

Does Isaiah 7:14 Refer to a Virgin Birth? - Aish.com

aish.com

The Aish Rabbi Replies

Thank you for your important question. Yes, it is well-known that the actual word in that verse is “almah” – which throughout the Torah refers to a young woman without reference to her virginity, see for example Genesis 24:43, Exodus 2:8, and Song of Songs 1:3.

See especially Proverbs 30:19 which refers to “the way of a man with a young woman (almah)” where, as the commentators to Isaiah note, the intent is clearly for a non-virgin – as the verse uses this as an example of an act which leaves no trace. (See Rabbi Tovia Singer’s lecture on this here.)

Almah thus parallels the male version of that word, elem, which appears twice in the Torah having nothing to do with a young man’s marital status (I Samuel 17:56, 20:22).Further, the Torah does have a specific word for a virgin – betulah – which it consistently uses in reference to a woman’s virginity (e.g., Genesis 24:16, Exodus 22:15, Leviticus 21:14, and especially Deuteronomy 22:13-21) – and that is not the word used by Isaiah.

Matthew 1:23 claims that Jesus’s immaculate conception was the fulfillment of Isaiah’s prophecy that a virgin shall give birth, but it is immediately clear that this is not what Isaiah had in mind.

The "Immaculate Conception" refers to the purity of Mary, not of the virgin birth of Jesus. That Mary was indeed a virgin is stated by herself, that she had 'never known a man'.