Cultural exhaustion

[Samson]

um yeah, right, that gives you experience running a school



Again, typical of teachers, they think they could run a school because they stay in a classroom all day long, exposed to a small fraction of the students at the school.

Teachers and Parents have very little idea WTF kind of circus is going on down in the front office because they are sequestered in their little world until they have a SERIOUS PROBLEM, like, Pablo just WON'T STOP TALKING to Kashina, and then teachers send the kids to the office for discipline, for christssakes.

Those that can't teach administrate. Secretaries run schools in my experience. Administrators attend meetings, for the most part without parents or students present.

There's a lot of truth in that statement. At least it was my experience where I taught school.

Secretaries are great, and schools are notorious for working their best horses to death, but the buck stops at the Principal's Desk.

 

[Samson]

Wrong again, twice. I was a teacher for several years. Also, my kids attended a school much like the one described. I have loads of experience.

um yeah, right, that gives you experience running a school



Again, typical of teachers, they think they could run a school because they stay in a classroom all day long, exposed to a small fraction of the students at the school.

Teachers and Parents have very little idea WTF kind of circus is going on down in the front office because they are sequestered in their little world until they have a SERIOUS PROBLEM, like, Pablo just WON'T STOP TALKING to Kashina, and then teachers send the kids to the office for discipline, for christssakes.

Those that can't teach administrate. Secretaries run schools in my experience. Administrators attend meetings, for the most part without parents or students present.

You can only IMAGINE what goes on (how would you know the daily schedule of a principal?)

Again, you're opinion isn't that abnormal for most teachers that don't leave their room most of the day, and couldn't care less what happens outside their little world. As a consequence they refect upon their "martyrdom," each being cruelly treated by unfeeling administrators that couldn't possibly know how much they suffer: "Woe Is Me," is the constant refrain.

 

[Samson]

Wrong again, twice. I was a teacher for several years. Also, my kids attended a school much like the one described. I have loads of experience.

um yeah, right, that gives you experience running a school



Again, typical of teachers, they think they could run a school because they stay in a classroom all day long, exposed to a small fraction of the students at the school.

Teachers and Parents have very little idea WTF kind of circus is going on down in the front office because they are sequestered in their little world until they have a SERIOUS PROBLEM, like, Pablo just WON'T STOP TALKING to Kashina, and then teachers send the kids to the office for discipline, for christssakes.

What exactly is YOUR experience with the schools? I wasn't a teacher, but I was a community liaison for Parents are Vital in Education, I was a member of our school choice commit y, I volunteered at the schools on a regular basis. I attended school board meetings, heck I fought for the Teach program for autistic kids, starting when my son was in first grade and they finally instituted it when he was in 10th grade.

I attended PTA meetings, which should have been called PA meetings as the only time any teachers showed up was when they were giving a speech.

My oldest son had all kinds of problems in the public school. Twice the police were called on him because the public schools are STUPID!!! Once, when he was in forth grade, I came to get him and the cops asked if I could "handle him". I said "Of course I can, he's my son." I told him to go get in the car and he did exactly what I said. I'm not sure what the teacher and counselor did to cause his meltdown but I don't think the cops were necessary. The second time was when he was in highschool. He was being teased badly DURING class while the teacher ignored it, even when my son complained to her. A really bad thing about him went out on all the computers in the school and his teacher didn't do one darn thing to stop it or to discipline the students involved. My son made the mistake of saying "Now I understand why things like columbine happen." The cops were called. The asked me if he had a gun. I said "no". They asked me if he had access to a gun. I said "no." Public schools are STUPID!!!

BTW, my oldest so is now attending DeVry university and he's on the dean's list. Of course it is a geek school but he's treated with respect the way he should have been treated in the public schools.

Glad your son is doing well now, and he sounds like you and the school had your hands full with his disability.

 

[JenyEliza]

And something is wrong with school officials who punish American kids for supporting the American Flag.

Something's wrong with school officials that ignore potentials to disrupt the school.

And you are wrong. The school district admits the principal/administration were wrong to prohibit apparel bearing the American flag on Weds, May 5.

See below their communication that was sent to parents via e-mail and voice mail message.

School District: Flag Clothing Incident "Extremely Unfortunate" | NBC Bay Area

Good evening. This is Dr. Wesley Smith, Superintendent of the Morgan Hill Unified School District. The Morgan Hill Unified School District does not prohibit nor do we discourage wearing patriotic clothing. The incident on May 5 at Live Oak High School is extremely unfortunate. While campus safety is our primary concern and administrators made decisions yesterday in an attempt to ensure campus safety, students should not, and will not, be disciplined for wearing patriotic clothing. This situation and our response are under review.

We know that this is an emotionally charged topic. We would ask you to encourage your students to be safe and focus on their academics while in school. If conversations and/or activities are necessary to express their feelings on this issue, we will find appropriate venues that do not disturb student learning or jeopardize the safety of our students.

Furthermore, we encourage everyone to demonstrate respect for each other, open communication, and responsibility.

Thank you for your support and understanding.

Dr. Wesley Smith
Superintendent

 

[Samson]

I see you like to avoid some work instead of improving the system. It would be short term effort for long term gains. Typical view of folks like you Samson.

You're an fantatic optimist if you think this would be anything like a "Short term effort."

Typical of those with no experience.

Actually, he's right. Once everyone gets used to the rules, they will be automatic. Kind of like your mother teaching you to say "please" and "thank you".

Yes, now all we need is a island upon which to build this fantasy school where "everyone gets used to the rules."


By the end of May?

 

[JenyEliza]

um yeah, right, that gives you experience running a school



Again, typical of teachers, they think they could run a school because they stay in a classroom all day long, exposed to a small fraction of the students at the school.

Teachers and Parents have very little idea WTF kind of circus is going on down in the front office because they are sequestered in their little world until they have a SERIOUS PROBLEM, like, Pablo just WON'T STOP TALKING to Kashina, and then teachers send the kids to the office for discipline, for christssakes.

Those that can't teach administrate. Secretaries run schools in my experience. Administrators attend meetings, for the most part without parents or students present.

You can only IMAGINE what goes on (how would you know the daily schedule of a principal?)

Again, you're opinion isn't that abnormal for most teachers that don't leave their room most of the day, and couldn't care less what happens outside their little world. As a consequence they refect upon their "martyrdom," each being cruelly treated by unfeeling administrators that couldn't possibly know how much they suffer: "Woe Is Me," is the constant refrain.

Are you a school Principal?

If so, what district? Please provide your bona fides, or please drink a hefty cup of STFU.

Thank you.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If I were one of the parents of those horrible American flag wearing kids I would buy them a dozen identical shirts with Old Glory plastered across the front and have them wear it every single fucking day of the school year.

I might even rethink my opposition to tattoos and get them a nice, visible one of our flag. Let's see the school order them to take THAT off.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Having a riot at school is also slightly detrimental to educational goals and objectives.

No, it is not. But, there was no riot. Following authority is a good lesson. Teaching just authority is also a valuable lesson. And, when authority is unjust, teaching non-violent disobedience is a good lesson on how to effect change from unjust authority.

Finally, doing it right from the start is a great lesson.

You people haven't heard a word I've said.

Your world of theoretical teaching and administering is wonderful: of course, we would all love the luxury to live within it's ideal.

Unhappily, we manage schools in the REAL world.

On Earth we are trying to manage to get through each day in SOME US highschools without a fucking riot. If it takes asking a few kids to change their clothes on Sinko Day Mayo, then so be it.

And maybe that sort of "appeasement is practical" atttitude is why our schools - our country - are now stuffed with people who think it is acceptable to silence and oppress others through the threat of violence. We moved out of "nice theoretical luxury" territory in the US the day our abandonment of that "luxury" left a pile of smoking rubble in New York City. Too bad some people didn't get the memo.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If they had been wearing French Flags I might get that they were "trying to cause trouble" but the article clearly states that the Mexican AMERCIAN studens were offended by the American flag.

I wonder if the American flag which usually sits in the principal’s office and auditorium in schools was removed because it might be deemed offensive to the Mexican American students on the 5th of May?


Today the Mexican American Students ( about 200) held a protest waving Mexican Flags in support of the schools decision to send the boys home. Were they sent home for being "disruptive"?


American Flag Clothing Sparks New Protest

American Flag Clothing Sparks New Protest - NBCBAYAREA- msnbc.com

See Dante....those are the people I was talking about when I said "Mexicans". Sorry if you thought I was talking about all of them.

What?! You mean all the little brown brothers aren't exactly alike? When the hell did THAT happen? Damn, it's like they're PEOPLE, or something.

 

[Againsheila]

If I were one of the parents of those horrible American flag wearing kids I would buy them a dozen identical shirts with Old Glory plastered across the front and have them wear it every single fucking day of the school year.

I might even rethink my opposition to tattoos and get them a nice, visible one of our flag. Let's see the school order them to take THAT off.

Dang it, I gotta spread some rep around, but I really like that idea.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Are American Jews flying "the Star of David" on Sinko Day Mayo?

If they were do you think you could make them stop without a fight on your hands ?

I'm not sure.

If Jews "flying the Star of David on Sinko Day Mayo," did not cause a disruptive environment in the school, I wouldn't care.

But if it did, I'd warn them, then if they refused, I'd discipline them on the basis of their defiance of School Administration.

The safety of students is the priority of school administration, and student's individual rights of expression come in at a distant (second? third? forth?).

Because damn it, where the hell do they get the idea that they have a right to freedom of expression when they've been CLEARLY threatened with violence if they don't cower in fear?

To paraphrase, those who trade liberty for safety deserve - and have - neither.

 

[Samson]

If I were one of the parents of those horrible American flag wearing kids I would buy them a dozen identical shirts with Old Glory plastered across the front and have them wear it every single fucking day of the school year.

I might even rethink my opposition to tattoos and get them a nice, visible one of our flag. Let's see the school order them to take THAT off.

I'd have it covered, or have you keep the kid at home until it was removed. Tattoos and body piercing are considered to be an expression of thought and are protected by the first amendment right to free speech (United States Constitution).

However, people under 18, because of their age and status as minors, are subject to rules which adults are not. This true of school rules and attendance. At school, rules can be made that tattoos, piercing, clothes or hair-color must be covered or changed, and these rules are not unconstitutional.

Parents also have a right to control the behavior of children, and so can order their children to not display tattoos, piercing, or other things such as hair color

 

[Againsheila]

If they were do you think you could make them stop without a fight on your hands ?

I'm not sure.

If Jews "flying the Star of David on Sinko Day Mayo," did not cause a disruptive environment in the school, I wouldn't care.

But if it did, I'd warn them, then if they refused, I'd discipline them on the basis of their defiance of School Administration.

The safety of students is the priority of school administration, and student's individual rights of expression come in at a distant (second? third? forth?).

Because damn it, where the hell do they get the idea that they have a right to freedom of expression when they've been CLEARLY threatened with violence if they don't cower in fear?

To paraphrase, those who trade liberty for safety deserve - and have - neither.

Who died and made you Ben Franklin? <sorry, I couldn't resist!>

 

[Cecilie1200]

If they were do you think you could make them stop without a fight on your hands ?

I'm not sure.

If Jews "flying the Star of David on Sinko Day Mayo," did not cause a disruptive environment in the school, I wouldn't care.

But if it did, I'd warn them, then if they refused, I'd discipline them on the basis of their defiance of School Administration.

The safety of students is the priority of school administration, and student's individual rights of expression come in at a distant (second? third? forth?).

The sad part is, the disruption would not be made by the Jewish students... only those that hated them for daring to show pride in their culture. So the discipline would best fall on those 'tolerant' souls who refused others to be proud in their culture I guess.

Well that's how it'd go down on my bus with plenty of write ups to go around. But I'm with ya Sampson.

The sad part is that Samson wants the school administered to cater to the worst, most violent, antisocial elements. Remember the good old days, when kids who behaved violently were expelled so that everyone else could go on with their lives without fear?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Cinco de Mayo has been promoted by beverage companies and restaurants. It's a faux holiday to encourage consumption for the most part.

Cinco de Mayo... Like mothers day... only with beer, protests and race riots by criminals.

You mean you don't have a race riot on Mother's Day?

Maybe we should require all the childless women to stay home that day, so that seeing them won't offend the mothers among us. We wouldn't want a Mommy Riot, after all.

 

[Samson]

If they were do you think you could make them stop without a fight on your hands ?

I'm not sure.

If Jews "flying the Star of David on Sinko Day Mayo," did not cause a disruptive environment in the school, I wouldn't care.

But if it did, I'd warn them, then if they refused, I'd discipline them on the basis of their defiance of School Administration.

The safety of students is the priority of school administration, and student's individual rights of expression come in at a distant (second? third? forth?).

Because damn it, where the hell do they get the idea that they have a right to freedom of expression when they've been CLEARLY threatened with violence if they don't cower in fear?

To paraphrase, those who trade liberty for safety deserve - and have - neither.

Um, yeah.

Look, we don't want to fight about this in High Schools, m'k?

Get your fuckin' Senators and Representatives to pass a fuckin' law that says minors have the same rights as adults, and Principals will be happy to let their asses get cut up by hundreds of sinko day mayo celebrants.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Not in America, Samson.

That's the wrong answer. Do we expect other countries to not honor their own flags in their own countries when it's July 4th?

That's what's so sad about this. Mexico doesn't even really celebrate cinco de mayo. Their independence day is in Sept. We celebrate it because it's another excuse to go partying. The student's complaining about the American flag at an American school on Cinco de mayo are dumb. Something is wrong with their education.

Yes, many High School Student complaints are dumb.

Generally speaking, the age group between 14-18 isn't terribly rational, and this is why we don't allow them to wander about in the general public except during the summer.

Frankly, I think even this is being too lienient.

But apparently, you think we should let THEM decide how the school is administered and whether or not other people have their freedoms suppressed and when.

 

[Cecilie1200]

And something is wrong with school officials who punish American kids for supporting the American Flag.

Any society and its official representatives have no business punishing anyone, nor ordering human being what to wear. However, most humans are fascistly and terroristically ordered what to wear. That is perversely called "fashion".

You creatures do not even enjoy the freedom to wear what you want, because society told you what your are and made you before you were six. You dont know who you are, or what you want. You are told certain clothes are "in" and feel compelled to wear them,

One good example is the bra for women. The bra represents one of the most fascistly imposes garments of any societal system currently in operation today, if not the most fascist and harmful. Society orders women to cover-up their natural breasts in public at all times, and that they should wear a bra. And what happens? You brainwashed idiots think this actually makes sense and do it!

The short-sightedness of lack of insight into this issue is astounding.

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For more information on My posts, visit TM8k

Either you aren't a woman, or you have very small breasts. Trust me, bras are a necessary evil. Without them, they hang, they flop, they cause all kinds of problems. What's more, since my lumpectomy, mine are at two different levels, it looks really funny when I don't wear a bra. Try jogging with big breasts and get back to me on that idea that bras aren't needed...

This doesn't even cover the fact that bras can't be said to be "fascistically imposed" when no one's in the bedroom, holding a gun to my head and making me put it on. Nor would I be arrested should I choose not to wear one. I wear them because I find them more comfortable than not wearing them. Of course, I also voluntarily wear corsets, so I might not be the best example.

 

[Samson]

I'm not sure.

If Jews "flying the Star of David on Sinko Day Mayo," did not cause a disruptive environment in the school, I wouldn't care.

But if it did, I'd warn them, then if they refused, I'd discipline them on the basis of their defiance of School Administration.

The safety of students is the priority of school administration, and student's individual rights of expression come in at a distant (second? third? forth?).

The sad part is, the disruption would not be made by the Jewish students... only those that hated them for daring to show pride in their culture. So the discipline would best fall on those 'tolerant' souls who refused others to be proud in their culture I guess.

Well that's how it'd go down on my bus with plenty of write ups to go around. But I'm with ya Sampson.

The sad part is that Samson wants the school administered to cater to the worst, most violent, antisocial elements. Remember the good old days, when kids who behaved violently were expelled so that everyone else could go on with their lives without fear?

The sad part is, that no one has Superpowers that allow them to identify who will commit the worst, most violent, antisocial acts.

It sounds like you want administrators to wait until a fight breaks out, someone gets hurt, or killed, then react. OK, fine plan. Brilliant, then we can, and will expel the perp.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If I ran a high school, there would be a uniform dress code
Students would be called, Mr. or Miss and students would address teachers as Sir or Ma'am.

There would be no grading on a curve and i would enforce the same honor policy used at our military academies.

I shall not lie, cheat or steal nor tolerate those who do.

The penalty for violating the code would be summary expulsion. Period.

A. Increase your budget because 51% the parents will claim they cannot afford the uniform.
B. Make sure you carve out an extra 3 hours every day for dealing with students that don't follow the dress code
C. Carve out another day every week to deal with a "dress code committee" that will debate whether or not pink is red.
D. Prepare in advance for the ACLU lawsuit claiming that public gender identification harms the rights of Hermaphrodites.
E. Expand the school to make room for everyone that is retained because they fail a grade under your grading policy. More $$$ for teachers, and operational costs
F. Make sure you spend 12 hours a day enforcing the code, and meeting with parents, and their lawyers that claim you are being racist for expelling poor Juan Martin Luther Washington for stealing a book, but not similarly punishing Shaquanna Garza for stealing his pencil.

When I was a cubscout leader, uniform required, we went to a place where all the kids could get free cubscout uniforms. The only caveat was that they return their uniforms when they were done with them. No problem. I think uniforms for schools can work the same way. Or make them easy, blue jeans and a white shirt with nothing on it. Sweaters or coats must be blue with no marking also. Shoes can be white tennis shoes. You can't tell me the poor people don't have blue jeans, white t shirts and white tennis shoes.....

My school district operates a rather extensive community clothing bank for students whose families can't afford sufficient clothing for them. In addition, every Factory 2 U and cheap-ass clothing store in town carries the basic components of school uniforms. "I can't afford uniforms" is an excuse laid out by lazy-ass parents.