Collective punishment in Israel: Should only the guilty pay?

[Beelzebub]

But what about collective punishment,
Are you for it, or against it?

 

[Daniyel]

But what about collective punishment,
Are you for it, or against it?

What collective punishment are you talking about again?

 

[Indeependent]

But what about collective punishment,
Are you for it, or against it?

I'm for it when brave Muslim soldiers protect themselves with civilians.

 

[montelatici]

In the middle east people have begun to figure it out.

An enemy left alive is an enemy who can kill you. The children of your enemies grow up to become your then-current enemies.

Does that mean that the non-Jews should kill all the Jews? Even children?

 

[Indeependent]

In the middle east people have begun to figure it out.

An enemy left alive is an enemy who can kill you. The children of your enemies grow up to become your then-current enemies.

Does that mean that the non-Jews should kill all the Jews? Even children?

They're not already trying?

 

[montelatici]

And what about collective punishment?

You can complain about that elsewhere, Israel is a state of law, civil duty is what we do to support the state, keep the selfish opinion behind.

Israel is a disgusting racist theocracy. The Jewish version of Iran, except more warlike.

 

[toastman]

Well, according to the israeli mass murdering scumbags - one guy launching a rocket positioned 200 yards away from school is justification to retaliate on school children with air strikes.

Israel seems to be skiddish about sending boots into gaza, because when they do they come out with their clocks cleaned:

Palestinian militants inflict substantial casualties on Israeli forces in Gaza - IHS Jane s 360

An armored bulldozer operator gets fragged by an anti-tank missile!! Probably while bulldozing the homes of civilian non-combatants making way for another illegal jewish settlement.

It seems to me like theyre having great difficulties defeating hamas fighters, so they tally up the body counts by killing mostly women and children with air strikes.

What are you even TALKING ABOUT?

Anyone who calls Israel 'mass murdering' has zero credibility on the subject.

 

[Daniyel]

And what about collective punishment?

You can complain about that elsewhere, Israel is a state of law, civil duty is what we do to support the state, keep the selfish opinion behind.

Israel is a disgusting racist theocracy. The Jewish version of Iran, except more warlike.

More Israeli Arabs Doing National Service Than Ever Before - Israel Today Israel News

 

[toastman]

And what about collective punishment?

You can complain about that elsewhere, Israel is a state of law, civil duty is what we do to support the state, keep the selfish opinion behind.

Israel is a disgusting racist theocracy. The Jewish version of Iran, except more warlike.

I dismantled your 'theocracy' accusation yesterday and yet you still spew the same lie.
Fuck you're dumber than I thought.

The Palestinians are disgusting racist anti Semites.

 

[toastman]

This is what I mean by collective punishment:

So, one muslim makes a comment and that applies to islam in general? Like, you know its not possible for one sheik to make a comment that isnt held by the majority? You all seem to be grasping at straws here to defend israel.

Palestinians just wanna be treated like theyre humans, and not animals that need to be locked behind a cage by racist white people.

If they won't want to be treated as animals, they should stop behaving as such.

So you justify punishing the many for the actions of a few? Instead of rooting up the fighters they should bulldoze neighborhoods and bomb schools, hospitals, etc?

I just love how idiots like you think you know better than Israel how to fight against guerilla militants
They don't have an army to fight face to face with Israel. So they insert themselves among civilians like the cowards that they are.

 

[teddyearp]

And what about collective punishment?

Hell, Bub, from the content of your posts, maybe you should pay. Oh but what do you know. You don't live there and never went there. So you know nothing. At. All.

 

[Beelzebub]

I speak of collective punishment in Israel.

Taxing you for the war is one example. Settler and zealot 'price tags' are another. IDF destroying utilities and killing innocent people is one more. There are many. I suppose civilians like yourself having to put up with rocket sirens (rockets or no) are a collective punishment on you for Hamas gripe with Israeli politicians.

Do I take it then that you are for, or against collective punishment Lipush?

Paying tax after the war is inconvinient, but needed. War costs money. We're no fools

That's not convincing.
You now pay for the war. That will be a 2% reduction in schooling. A 2% reduction in healthcare. A 2% reduction in cleaning services. A 2% reduction in just about everything that you can think of.

Of course, some of those will be found 'too essential to cut'. But that will mean a 2% increase in tax on your income - for those who pay tax that is. Which is normally the middle classes and the poor.

And what do you get for your 2% of everything that you pay for "because you are no fools"?

You get 2200 dead Palestinians. Which is, lets see, 0.05% of Palestinians and 0.12% of Gazans.
You get the same peace as you had for the last 2 years, when Hamas stopped firing rockets, by treaty.
You get renewed hatred from all Palestinians, and Arabs.
You get America more aware of how murderous and extremist your state is.
You get Europeans who are coming round to notice you really are fascist, and uninterested in peace.
You get your own politicians saying that the state is not right wing enough, and didn't kill enough Palestinians.
Future generations will look back on you in shame.

You have persuaded the P.A. to stop with the pretend 'Peace Talks' and go the ICC route.
The ICC are likely to add to your tourist quota, as they investigate your state for war crimes.

You get a major enhancements of Jews For Peace, for US Campaign to End The Occupation, And similar groups.
You have grown the BDS movement by 5 times what it was.
You have made Hamas heroes amongst resistance fighters, from Hezbollah, through to Isis, and impressed every anti-colonialist in the world.
You have caused pressure such that Israel HAS to and has eased border restrictions on Gaza, with lots more pressure to come. (With more costs if you don't).

So you are not fools. You pay your 2% happily.
What did you get for it?

And guess what.
The next war is already being planned, and you will have to pay 2% more for that one too.
Then the one after that.

Keep going like this and you might find you only have 2% to live on.

 

[Lipush]

And what about collective punishment?

You can complain about that elsewhere, Israel is a state of law, civil duty is what we do to support the state, keep the selfish opinion behind.

Israel is a disgusting racist theocracy. The Jewish version of Iran, except more warlike.

Sound like someone who never visited Iran OR Israel.

Keep sounding like a crazy person, though. It will help you in the future, no doubt

 

[Daniyel]

I speak of collective punishment in Israel.

Taxing you for the war is one example. Settler and zealot 'price tags' are another. IDF destroying utilities and killing innocent people is one more. There are many. I suppose civilians like yourself having to put up with rocket sirens (rockets or no) are a collective punishment on you for Hamas gripe with Israeli politicians.

Do I take it then that you are for, or against collective punishment Lipush?

Paying tax after the war is inconvinient, but needed. War costs money. We're no fools

That's not convincing.
You now pay for the war. That will be a 2% reduction in schooling. A 2% reduction in healthcare. A 2% reduction in cleaning services. A 2% reduction in just about everything that you can think of.

Of course, some of those will be found 'too essential to cut'. But that will mean a 2% increase in tax on your income - for those who pay tax that is. Which is normally the middle classes and the poor.

And what do you get for your 2% of everything that you pay for "because you are no fools"?

You get 2200 dead Palestinians. Which is, lets see, 0.05% of Palestinians and 0.12% of Gazans.
You get the same peace as you had for the last 2 years, when Hamas stopped firing rockets, by treaty.
You get renewed hatred from all Palestinians, and Arabs.
You get America more aware of how murderous and extremist your state is.
You get Europeans who are coming round to notice you really are fascist, and uninterested in peace.
You get your own politicians saying that the state is not right wing enough, and didn't kill enough Palestinians.
Future generations will look back on you in shame.

You have persuaded the P.A. to stop with the pretend 'Peace Talks' and go the ICC route.
The ICC are likely to add to your tourist quota, as they investigate your state for war crimes.

You get a major enhancements of Jews For Peace, for US Campaign to End The Occupation, And similar groups.
You have grown the BDS movement by 5 times what it was.
You have made Hamas heroes amongst resistance fighters, from Hezbollah, through to Isis, and impressed every anti-colonialist in the world.
You have caused pressure such that Israel HAS to and has eased border restrictions on Gaza, with lots more pressure to come. (With more costs if you don't).

So you are not fools. You pay your 2% happily.
What did you get for it?

And guess what.
The next war is already being planned, and you will have to pay 2% more for that one too.
Then the one after that.

Keep going like this and you might find you only have 2% to live on.

Not really, its also a temporarily cut, and like I said, the money goes to the Israelis, most of the Southern residents, building new neighbors, schools, civil infrastructure, security is sadly something we all need.

 

[Beelzebub]

No.

The money goes to pay for the equipment Hamas destroyed, and to the soldiers and the medical staff and the funeral directors.

It WOULD be temporary, if Israel's wars were not continuous.

 

[Daniyel]

No.

The money goes to pay for the equipment Hamas destroyed, and to the soldiers and the medical staff and the funeral directors.

It WOULD be temporary, if Israel's wars were not continuous.

Many tend to forget the budget cut came past 2 milliard NIS cut in 2013..however, the "equipment" Hamas destroyed is 90% civil infrastructure, some of it also goes to subsidy new neighborhoods in the south, along with repairing the old ones damaged, and compensation damage to the south residents and private sector.
In generally you right saying some will suffer for that, but even the Finance Minister Yair Lapid [Netanyahu's biggest opposition] agree that only demilitarization of Gaza would restore the peace, a reduction of 650 million NIS off education is fine with me, since it goes back to supporting the kids who couldn't even go to school last year.
Security is above all, and with the current agenda of Hamas&Co victories there would be no Palestinians left in Gaza at all.

 

[Beelzebub]

All very good.
(apart from "kids who couldn't even go to school last year" - What's THAT about?)

But your security situation hasn't changed.
Well, it has changed, but not for the better. You were more secure in April of this year.

So you pay. And have nothing to show for it.

 

[Daniyel]

All very good.
(apart from "kids who couldn't even go to school last year" - What's THAT about?)

But your security situation hasn't changed.
Well, it has changed, but not for the better. You were more secure in April of this year.

So you pay. And have nothing to show for it.

This is all about the southern residents, the security changed far beyond what you think, of course everyone lose SOMETHING because of that, but the security is above all and except all the tunnels, rocket arsenals, WB Cell, and less Hamas members (HQ) The security changed for good, I would give away all my property just to live safe and secure, and so for my fellow Israelis, the "defeat" you are trying so hard to prove is lack of base at all, serving Hamas psychological warfare indeed, as you know you not necessarily get something in return for paying, sometimes it is something you owe, and we pay now because we didn't dealt with Hamas earlier, but if you really curious, we earned security in such a low price after all.

 

[Beelzebub]

Hamas are still there.

If you want security, make peace. And not the peace of the grave, but a peace with justice, recognising how much you have stolen from Palestinians.

You will never have peace while you continue to steal from them. You need to make massive reparations.
THAT is the price you have to pay. Well the start of it.

 

[montelatici]

In the middle east people have begun to figure it out.

An enemy left alive is an enemy who can kill you. The children of your enemies grow up to become your then-current enemies.

Does that mean that the non-Jews should kill all the Jews? Even children?

They're not already trying?

Are they? It seems the Israeli Jews are trying harder, given the results.