Christine Ford - The facts and their weight

[Stormy Daniels]

well I've always heard someone drunk doesn't have full recognition of their thoughts. so how can she remember if she was drunk?

Who said that she was drunk when this happened?

 

[iceberg]

well I've always heard someone drunk doesn't have full recognition of their thoughts. so how can she remember if she was drunk?

Who said that she was drunk when this happened?

she didn't know how she got to the party
she didn't know who's house it was
she doesn't recall what year it happened
she doesn't know how she got home

give me a better reason for why all this is true.

 

[Indeependent]

Your analysis and ratings notwithstanding, it is utterly absurd to disqualify an otherwise outstanding person for an incident that happened decades ago before he had reached legal age

That is a fair argument.

and while he was drunk.

That is not.

But the bigger problem I see at this point is one of honesty and integrity. Of course, the Democrats are screwing that up entirely and are once again highlighting their incredible talent for failing when victory is handed to them. There is already significant reason to believe that Kavanaugh has lied under oath during this confirmation process. Now, with these accusations coming forth, he is denying them. Given that the accusations are very credible, his denials appear to be more lies, which seems to put Kavanaugh in a position of being an untrustworthy liar. That is a disqualifying trait for a Supreme Court justice.

Honesty and integrity...
I see you want all Democrats removed from politics.

 

[Stormy Daniels]

The person claiming they heard it back in high school has taken back the claim and now states she knows nothing about it first hand.

She hasn't taken back her statement. If I recall correctly, she never claimed to have first hand knowledge of it, only saying that she had heard about it back then, and that many students heard about it. Since then, she has re-emphasized that she did not have first hand knowledge, and has asked news outlets to stop asking to interview her. Nothing about the classmate's claims has changed.

As you will note, I score the classmate's claims as having very little value.

 

[Pop23]

I believe Ford. The facts are pretty convincing and support her credibility. I am listing the facts, and scoring them for their probative value on a 1 - 5 scale.


Revealed the attack in 2012 - 5
There would be no reason for her to make up this story in 2012. She stated then that the two individuals involved had become prominent members of Washington society, and that is true for Kavanaugh and Judge.

Revealed Kavanaugh's name in 2012 - 2
That she revealed the name only to her husband drastically reduces the impact of this piece of information. We can't ignore the possibility that her husband is willing to lie to support her. But we also cannot discount his statements simply because he is her husband. If there were potential for some kind of tangible benefit for this couple to gain, I would score this a "1", but any possible benefit to be gained would be several steps removed, at best.

Anonymous July letter - 3
Anyone can submit an anonymous letter and say anything. In and of itself it doesn't mean much, and by itself it wouldn't doing much with. But what is significant here is that Ford is not, in any way, trying to launch a last minute torpedo to delay Kavanaugh's confirmation. She submitted an "FYI" letter to inform her Senator, but she didn't want to be in the spotlight. Feinstein's office probably handled this in a very partisan way, playing political games. But that is no reflection on Ford's credibility. Ford only came forward after the letter was leaked and made public.

Going into hiding - 3
In conjunction with the previous point, it is pretty clear that Ford is looking for 15 minutes of fame. To the contrary, she would rather stay out of the spotlight. She didn't have to step forward and reveal herself, and she doesn't like being in the spotlight, but she's done it anyway. What we're seeing is much more consistent with a sexual assault victim who is struggling for the strength to speak out, than a partisan who is making salacious lies. This doesn't speak directly to the veracity of her claims. But her reluctance to testify is consistent with the fact that she hadn't wanted to come forward in the first place, which supports her credibility.

Request for FBI, other investigations - 4
While not wanting to testify in front of the entire nation, she has said that she would want the FBI to investigate. This would be consistent with a sexual assault victim who longs for privacy. But perhaps more importantly, it would open her up to legal liability. And that fully neutralizes the suggestions by some that her reluctance to testify her way of trying to avoid perjury.

Classmate claims to have known about incident - 1
Contemporary knowledge of the incident would be a powerfully convincing fact. If what this classmate is saying is true, it's devastating and puts seals the deal. However, much more is needed before it can be afforded significant weight. As it stands now, this classmate could easily be lying and just trying to tip the scales for partisan reasons. This classmate suggests that the incident became general knowledge among much of the student body. So we should be able to expect there to be other classmates who would also remember hearing about the incident. If others come forward, this point could become strong enough to eliminate all doubt. Until then, it is a very weak piece of evidence. Especially because every indication from Ford thus far is that she kept the incident secret out of embarrassment.

Just about everything you wrote about is utter nonsense.

There is no therapist notes that are reliable. The notes themselves names 4 boys in the room, without Kavs name. Her letter states 2. The notes could not be used in a court of law, and neither her, nor her husband can amend a professional document.

The is no witness. The chick from Mexico redacted her original statement, laughable as it was, then posted again that all she wants to do is support Dr. Ford. She is no witness.

Dr. Ford did not then, nor does she want now, to come forward. A completely despicable sub human, Diane Feinstein, forced her to by back stabbing Ford after giving her the promise of confidentiality.

There is not a single reason to believe the allegations, and yet you do?

Explain

Go

 

[Stormy Daniels]

she didn't know how she got to the party
she didn't know who's house it was
she doesn't recall what year it happened
she doesn't know how she got home

give me a better reason for why all this is true.

She's in her 50s, it's an incident that happened over 35 years ago, and you're asking for the immaterial facts. I bet she doesn't remember what she had for breakfast that morning, either. Do you even remember what you had for breakfast yesterday?

 

[Pop23]

The person claiming they heard it back in high school has taken back the claim and now states she knows nothing about it first hand.

She hasn't taken back her statement. If I recall correctly, she never claimed to have first hand knowledge of it, only saying that she had heard about it back then, and that many students heard about it. Since then, she has re-emphasized that she did not have first hand knowledge, and has asked news outlets to stop asking to interview her. Nothing about the classmate's claims has changed.

As you will note, I score the classmate's claims as having very little value.

She made no claims to having first hand, or even second hand knowledge. What she stated was that there were rumors of an assault. It’s not even clear as to what kind of assault.

You wrote that entire OP without, obviously, knowing many material facts?

Why the hell would anyone care what your opinion is, when you don’t even attempt to gather the facts.

 

[Stormy Daniels]

Honesty and integrity...
I see you want all Democrats removed from politics.

I won't say all. I don't know enough about all of them. But I'm sure most would fall short of my expectations.

That aside, Supreme Court Justice isn't a political position.

 

[Indeependent]

Honesty and integrity...
I see you want all Democrats removed from politics.

I won't say all. I don't know enough about all of them. But I'm sure most would fall short of my expectations.

That aside, Supreme Court Justice isn't a political position.

De Facto, it is.

 

[Pop23]

she didn't know how she got to the party
she didn't know who's house it was
she doesn't recall what year it happened
she doesn't know how she got home

give me a better reason for why all this is true.

She's in her 50s, it's an incident that happened over 35 years ago, and you're asking for the immaterial facts. I bet she doesn't remember what she had for breakfast that morning, either. Do you even remember what you had for breakfast yesterday?

Iceberg is actually asking for MATERIAL FACTS. Don’t use phrases you have no clue as to their meaning.

Geez.

 

[iceberg]

she didn't know how she got to the party
she didn't know who's house it was
she doesn't recall what year it happened
she doesn't know how she got home

give me a better reason for why all this is true.

She's in her 50s, it's an incident that happened over 35 years ago, and you're asking for the immaterial facts. I bet she doesn't remember what she had for breakfast that morning, either. Do you even remember what you had for breakfast yesterday?

immaterial facts.

ok - so i'll go to the police station and tell them i was robbed.

if they ask when, i'll say i don't recall.
if they ask where i was when i was robbed, well again, i don't recall.

but they stole $10,000 worth of guns that i don't seem to have serial #'s for and i need insurance to buy them for me now. wonder how that will fly. i'll also have my neighbor say he's seen those guns but not lately and honestly, no, he can't remember seeing the guns after all.

and yes, i stopped at waffle house on the way to a customer meeting as i had an hour to kill and had 2 scrambled eggs, 2 sausage patties, a waffle and ate part of bisquets and gravy before i got full and left, i tried the grits but they were the horrible instant ones and i only ate a spoonful before giving up on them. i left my 1/2 drank cup of water on the counter, leaving a 40% tip cause the staff was very cool and fun to be around.

day before that was a chocolate cupcake with the white squiggly icing on top out of our vending machine and a white label monster beverage.

 

[2aguy]

I believe Ford. The facts are pretty convincing and support her credibility. I am listing the facts, and scoring them for their probative value on a 1 - 5 scale.


Revealed the attack in 2012 - 5
There would be no reason for her to make up this story in 2012. She stated then that the two individuals involved had become prominent members of Washington society, and that is true for Kavanaugh and Judge.

Revealed Kavanaugh's name in 2012 - 2
That she revealed the name only to her husband drastically reduces the impact of this piece of information. We can't ignore the possibility that her husband is willing to lie to support her. But we also cannot discount his statements simply because he is her husband. If there were potential for some kind of tangible benefit for this couple to gain, I would score this a "1", but any possible benefit to be gained would be several steps removed, at best.

Anonymous July letter - 3
Anyone can submit an anonymous letter and say anything. In and of itself it doesn't mean much, and by itself it wouldn't doing much with. But what is significant here is that Ford is not, in any way, trying to launch a last minute torpedo to delay Kavanaugh's confirmation. She submitted an "FYI" letter to inform her Senator, but she didn't want to be in the spotlight. Feinstein's office probably handled this in a very partisan way, playing political games. But that is no reflection on Ford's credibility. Ford only came forward after the letter was leaked and made public.

Going into hiding - 3
In conjunction with the previous point, it is pretty clear that Ford is looking for 15 minutes of fame. To the contrary, she would rather stay out of the spotlight. She didn't have to step forward and reveal herself, and she doesn't like being in the spotlight, but she's done it anyway. What we're seeing is much more consistent with a sexual assault victim who is struggling for the strength to speak out, than a partisan who is making salacious lies. This doesn't speak directly to the veracity of her claims. But her reluctance to testify is consistent with the fact that she hadn't wanted to come forward in the first place, which supports her credibility.

Request for FBI, other investigations - 4
While not wanting to testify in front of the entire nation, she has said that she would want the FBI to investigate. This would be consistent with a sexual assault victim who longs for privacy. But perhaps more importantly, it would open her up to legal liability. And that fully neutralizes the suggestions by some that her reluctance to testify her way of trying to avoid perjury.

Classmate claims to have known about incident - 1
Contemporary knowledge of the incident would be a powerfully convincing fact. If what this classmate is saying is true, it's devastating and puts seals the deal. However, much more is needed before it can be afforded significant weight. As it stands now, this classmate could easily be lying and just trying to tip the scales for partisan reasons. This classmate suggests that the incident became general knowledge among much of the student body. So we should be able to expect there to be other classmates who would also remember hearing about the incident. If others come forward, this point could become strong enough to eliminate all doubt. Until then, it is a very weak piece of evidence. Especially because every indication from Ford thus far is that she kept the incident secret out of embarrassment.

Romney, in 2012 stated Kavanaugh was on his list....

The actual victims of sexual assault tell friends and family at the time of the event...ask Juanita Broderick.....


Being in the spotlight was the goal.....playing at not wanting to come out was part of the game....

She is a rabid, bernie sanders supporter and anti Trump activist...at least she hasn't tried to murder the Republican baseball team.

The FBI has conducted 6 investigations into Kavanaugh and does not investigate local crimes, especially those from 35 years ago where the victim can't remember where or when the alleged attack happened and that the memory of the event came out as a "repressed memory".


She stated she told no one for 30 years...now there are those claiming to know about it? Really?

 

[2aguy]

So to summarize, the FBI should get involved in what is at worst a high school drunken event, an “almost” sexual assault. When did that become a Federal Crime?

Now, all accusers must be believed automatically. That seems strange considering that there are not only accounts from the era, but police reports regarding Kieth Ellison, and this fellow still has the full support of the same party that claims that this proves that the individual is a bad guy.

The absolute worst that can be said of this case was that it was a near sexual assault, while drinking, and partying. Nobody would find the fellow guilty at that time in our history. Before you start the rant, no I am not saying anyone deserved it. However, the mistake we make is to apply modern norms, to history. Even if the police had gotten involved over this “high school drunken escapade” no charges would have been filed. Because there was no assault according to the standards of the era.

So why does the FBI need to investigate? Even if everything that Ms. Ford says is absolutely Gospel Truth, and I have some doubts that it is as clear cut as she says, then there still wasn’t a crime at the time.

And yet these same democrats....are nowhere to be found with the allegations of violence and domestic abuse by keith ellison....does his accuser deserve to be heard and believed? He is running for the Attorney General of his state.....just like bill clinton was Attorney General when he raped Juanita Broderick.......controlling law enforcement is the key to their success...

 

[DrLove]

I believe Ford. The facts are pretty convincing and support her credibility. I am listing the facts, and scoring them for their probative value on a 1 - 5 scale.

Classmate claims to have known about incident - 1
Contemporary knowledge of the incident would be a powerfully convincing fact. If what this classmate is saying is true, it's devastating and puts seals the deal. However, much more is needed before it can be afforded significant weight. As it stands now, this classmate could easily be lying and just trying to tip the scales for partisan reasons. This classmate suggests that the incident became general knowledge among much of the student body. So we should be able to expect there to be other classmates who would also remember hearing about the incident. If others come forward, this point could become strong enough to eliminate all doubt. Until then, it is a very weak piece of evidence. Especially because every indication from Ford thus far is that she kept the incident secret out of embarrassment.

Solid post - I'd actually give the classmate post a 2 or 2.5. FBI needs to put a few agents out on the road. Talk to the classmate first and then her circle of closest friends. Could end up being a 5.

 

[iceberg]

I believe Ford. The facts are pretty convincing and support her credibility. I am listing the facts, and scoring them for their probative value on a 1 - 5 scale.

Classmate claims to have known about incident - 1
Contemporary knowledge of the incident would be a powerfully convincing fact. If what this classmate is saying is true, it's devastating and puts seals the deal. However, much more is needed before it can be afforded significant weight. As it stands now, this classmate could easily be lying and just trying to tip the scales for partisan reasons. This classmate suggests that the incident became general knowledge among much of the student body. So we should be able to expect there to be other classmates who would also remember hearing about the incident. If others come forward, this point could become strong enough to eliminate all doubt. Until then, it is a very weak piece of evidence. Especially because every indication from Ford thus far is that she kept the incident secret out of embarrassment.

Solid post - I'd actually give the classmate post a 2 or 2.5. FBI needs to put a few agents out on the road. Talk to the classmate first and then her circle of closest friends. Could end up being a 5.

you keep asking for things you know you're not going to get simply so you can say THEY'RE NOT DOING THEIR JOB when in fact it was never their job to do.

quite the leftist tactic.

 

[DrLove]

well I've always heard someone drunk doesn't have full recognition of their thoughts. so how can she remember if she was drunk?

Who said that she was drunk when this happened?

Nobody - they made it up and they're sticking to it.

 

[2aguy]

This was funny, I heard it on Rush, yesterday....a friend of the accuser is interviewed by a democrat journalist and says she heard about things like this happening.....but nothing about Kavanaugh....but she had heard stories, just not about kavanaugh......it broke the heart of that left wing, democrat journalist..

WATCH: CNN's Acosta Interviews Friend Of Kavanaugh's Accuser. Then She Admits Knowing Nothing.

Finally, Acosta got down to what mattered, asking, “What Dr. Ford is alleging, is this the first time you heard anything like that with respect to Judge Kavanaugh?” This exchange followed:

Guerry: Absolutely, It’s not the first time I’ve heard anything like that in terms of the community of women I know, and not regarding him but —

Acosta: Those sorts of things went on?

Guerry: A lot… You know, one of the things that’s surprising to me as I’ve gotten involved in this in the last couple days is how many women of my class have come forward to me in this last few days and said, “I had similar experiences in high school,” and this hits me very deeply and it’s very —

ACOSTA: Not with Brett Kavanaugh, but with other boys?

GUERRY: Not with Brett Kavanaugh. But with other boys in our community, and we all feel that if we were in her shoes, we’d want to be taken seriously as well.

 

[Pop23]

I believe Ford. The facts are pretty convincing and support her credibility. I am listing the facts, and scoring them for their probative value on a 1 - 5 scale.

Classmate claims to have known about incident - 1
Contemporary knowledge of the incident would be a powerfully convincing fact. If what this classmate is saying is true, it's devastating and puts seals the deal. However, much more is needed before it can be afforded significant weight. As it stands now, this classmate could easily be lying and just trying to tip the scales for partisan reasons. This classmate suggests that the incident became general knowledge among much of the student body. So we should be able to expect there to be other classmates who would also remember hearing about the incident. If others come forward, this point could become strong enough to eliminate all doubt. Until then, it is a very weak piece of evidence. Especially because every indication from Ford thus far is that she kept the incident secret out of embarrassment.

Solid post - I'd actually give the classmate post a 2 or 2.5. FBI needs to put a few agents out on the road. Talk to the classmate first and then her circle of closest friends. Could end up being a 5.

You investigating a rumor about a rumor fits well with your love of nazism.

 

[DrLove]

well I've always heard someone drunk doesn't have full recognition of their thoughts. so how can she remember if she was drunk?

Who said that she was drunk when this happened?

she didn't know how she got to the party
she didn't know who's house it was
she doesn't recall what year it happened
she doesn't know how she got home

give me a better reason for why all this is true.

You don't know any of those things. Made up garbage simply because not every detail was in the letter.

 

[Pop23]

well I've always heard someone drunk doesn't have full recognition of their thoughts. so how can she remember if she was drunk?

Who said that she was drunk when this happened?

Nobody - they made it up and they're sticking to it.

Teenagers that go to drinking parties, typically drink.

You need to get out more.