CDZ Canada to legalise recreational pot:pros and cons

Justin Trudeau launching plan to legalise marijuana in Canada

legislation is being presented in Canada to legalise the recreational use of marijuana. It's a controversial topic, as there are many moving parts to this issue.

On one hand, the war on drugs has been an abysmal failure, and an expensive one, at that. Enforcement of this so called war has fallen mostly on minority shoulders, even though non minorities are statistically more likely to be cannabis users.

On the other hand, is it correct to just surrender to the issue of drug abuse, merely because it seems to be unenforceable with the tools we currently have at hand?

This is a major step to take, and the consequences may be far-ranging. Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
I'm apprehensive about responding to the OP above for seeing loaded language like "surrender to the issue of drug abuse" does not suggest the OP actually wants, as stipulated in the thread title, a factually dispassionate discussion of pros and cons. Instead, it intimates that s/he has an axe to grind, for the pros and cons, along with comparisons and descriptions of various jurisdictions' policy and legalization terms, are widely available from myriad sources on the Internet.
Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
The specific ideas I would share can be found in or inferred from the linked content above, and I have nothing new or different to add to that content that directly addresses the matter of cannabis legalization, its incidence and impacts.

Overall, I favor legalizing marijuana use and possession, or at least decriminalizing it. [1] I have a concern about marijuana's "gateway effect," but I also don't cotton to the principle of protecting individuals (adults) from themselves, so I weigh that concern as very low among the reasons for not legalizing/decriminalizing cannabis. I might assign greater weight to the concern and its consequences were cannabis as addictive as is nicotine [2], but it is not. Moreover, it's not clear to me that, and the extent that, the "gateway effect" of cannabis derives from its being "forbidden fruit." [3]


What strikes me as "special" about Canada and its legalization of cannabis, thus what I suspect gives rise to the somewhat vocal concerns and discussion of Canada's stance on the matter, is that among nations that (would) grant legal status to cannabis, or that have a laissez faire approach (in law and in law enforcement) to it and its users, Canada abuts the U.S., and travel by "typical Americans" between the two countries is relatively frequent and common. In contrast, not many "typical Americans" go to, or go often to, Spain, Iran or Uruguay, or the Netherlands, where "Mary Jane" is legally obtainable for recreational purposes by non-citizens in some jurisdictions and not in others.

Note:
  1. I think the distinction between "legal" and "decriminalized" substances, objects and behaviors is absurd, but nobody solicited me in the fabrication and "socialization" of that distinction, so it exists widely enough that it is "a thing" now, and I therefore acquiesce to the accepted distinction.
  2. Linked table is part of this study: Comparative risk assessment of alcohol, tobacco, cannabis and other illicit drugs using the margin of exposure approach
  3. Thinking back to my youth, my peers who were inclined to drink a lot and later, when they could legally buy booze, did drink a lot, were the kids whose parents made a big deal about their kids not drinking alcohol. My own parents never locked or stored the hootch away from my reach or sight and routinely allowed me a sip or two of it when they were drinking it and at "special occasion" dinners.

    didn't, at the time, care much for the taste of most alcoholic beverages I encountered, especially beer, so it wasn't a big deal for me to not drink much of it later in my life. (The very sweet wine served at church with communion was okay, but that isn't what my parents had at home.) It took only one college instance of my over imbibing, thus progressing from "buzzed" to "wasted," for me to know I was not ever going to let that happen again, for I didn't enjoy it. In fact, I thought, "why do people actually do this on purpose."
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis.

That is the salient issue.

In Colorado so far this legalization seems to have accomplished what was intended. There are still some doubts and reservations about it by a significant portion of the population there however.

I suspect that the high concentration of Catholics and Mormons in the Rocky Mountain states will always have reservations about cannabis.

It will take time and further observation about Colorado to find out if any such doubts are warranted.

Colorado is the test case. The people there are our lab rats.
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

Well, I'm not sure what to say to or about that. I read the stuff to which I link (except when I not that I have not done so). The "pit" doesn't seem so bottomless to me. Mostly, one need only read the introduction/framework and conclusions or discussion sections of the papers to which I link. If, however, one takes exception with the conclusions, discussion and/or results, well, then one needs to read the whole paper so as to have a sound basis for refuting the methodology that gave rise to the researchers' conclusions and so on.

If one endeavors to take on discussing a complex topic that has many variables to consider and to which one must rationally assign weights, there's usually a lot to think about and read. I say "read" because reading well developed work by others is generally more efficient than figuring out all that stuff on one's own. Don't you also think that availing oneself of the existing body of knowledge is better that "reinventing" it oneself?

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis. That is the salient issue.

What I shared as being my position, just as with others and their stated position, on the matter is the least important thing I wrote in the whole post. What I think, or what any other non policy maker or topical expert thinks isn't really all that important/worth knowing, except when a ballot is offered and the quantity of people who hold a given position determines what policy action(s) will ensue as a result of our learning the collective stance held by the polled population/sample.
I think it will just be a matter of time before Colorado gives us a complete case study of the whole issue of recreational cannabis legalization.

Trudeau does not seem inclined to wait however. He wants to smoke his dope now.

That's the bottom line on this, for the O/P up in O Canada.
 
...Is it legal where you reside? I love the painting, btw
Recreational MJ is legal in the following:

Alaska
California
Oregon
Wash State
Nevada
Colorado
Maine
Connecticut

Medical MJ is legal in the following:

Arizona
Hawaii
Montana
New Mexico
North Dakota
Minnesota
Michigan
Illinois
Arkansas
Louisiana
Ohio
All New England States
All Mid Atlantic States
Florida

MJ is illegal everywhere else and Federally.

Of the Rocky Mountain states only Colorado has legalized recreational MJ.

Of the Rocky Mountain states, Montana has legalized medical MJ.

Of the desert Southwest states, Arizona and New Mexico have legalized medical MJ.

Idaho, Utah, and Wyoming have not legalized MJ in any way.

State Marijuana Laws in 2017 Map
Thank you for your list. It's an interesting collection. Do you foresee any others joining?
It's hard to guess what each of the American States is going to do on this.

I am only familiar with my own region of the Nation.

Idaho, Utah, and Wyoming are Rocky Mountain Bible Belt states.

The Catholic and Mormon churches are very strong and influential here.

They don't like dope of any kind, not even weed.

Although you live in a largely Anglican/Episcopalian nation (Canada) I'm sure you have heard of the Vatican and also of the Mormons.

The Mormons are a quasi-Protestant group whose views are very similar to the Vatican's. They are both anti abortion, anti birth control, anti dope, anti weed, anti divorce, etc.
 
...Is it legal where you reside? I love the painting, btw
Recreational MJ is legal in the following:

Alaska
California
Oregon
Wash State
Nevada
Colorado
Maine
Connecticut

Medical MJ is legal in the following:

Arizona
Hawaii
Montana
New Mexico
North Dakota
Minnesota
Michigan
Illinois
Arkansas
Louisiana
Ohio
All New England States
All Mid Atlantic States
Florida

MJ is illegal everywhere else and Federally.

Of the Rocky Mountain states only Colorado has legalized recreational MJ.

Of the Rocky Mountain states, Montana has legalized medical MJ.

Of the desert Southwest states, Arizona and New Mexico have legalized medical MJ.

Idaho, Utah, and Wyoming have not legalized MJ in any way.

State Marijuana Laws in 2017 Map
Thank you for your list. It's an interesting collection. Do you foresee any others joining?
It's hard to guess what each of the American States is going to do on this.

I am only familiar with my own region of the Nation.

Idaho, Utah, and Wyoming are Rocky Mountain Bible Belt states.

The Catholic and Mormon churches are very strong and influential here.

They don't like dope of any kind, not even weed.

Although you live in a largely Anglican/Episcopalian nation (Canada) I'm sure you have heard of the Vatican and also of the Mormons.

The Mormons are a quasi-Protestant group whose views are very similar to the Vatican's. They are both anti abortion, anti birth control, anti dope, anti weed, anti divorce, etc.
We don't have many mormons, but we do have masses of mennonites and hutterites, who are very oldey- fashioned and strict. Quebec used to be more catholic than the pope, but they have secularised themselves quite drastically. Our Bible Belt is in the prairie provinces of Manitoba, Saskatchewan and Alberta.
 
Justin Trudeau launching plan to legalise marijuana in Canada

legislation is being presented in Canada to legalise the recreational use of marijuana. It's a controversial topic, as there are many moving parts to this issue.

On one hand, the war on drugs has been an abysmal failure, and an expensive one, at that. Enforcement of this so called war has fallen mostly on minority shoulders, even though non minorities are statistically more likely to be cannabis users.

On the other hand, is it correct to just surrender to the issue of drug abuse, merely because it seems to be unenforceable with the tools we currently have at hand?

This is a major step to take, and the consequences may be far-ranging. Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
I'm apprehensive about responding to the OP above for seeing loaded language like "surrender to the issue of drug abuse" does not suggest the OP actually wants, as stipulated in the thread title, a factually dispassionate discussion of pros and cons. Instead, it intimates that s/he has an axe to grind, for the pros and cons, along with comparisons and descriptions of various jurisdictions' policy and legalization terms, are widely available from myriad sources on the Internet.
Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
The specific ideas I would share can be found in or inferred from the linked content above, and I have nothing new or different to add to that content that directly addresses the matter of cannabis legalization, its incidence and impacts.

Overall, I favor legalizing marijuana use and possession, or at least decriminalizing it. [1] I have a concern about marijuana's "gateway effect," but I also don't cotton to the principle of protecting individuals (adults) from themselves, so I weigh that concern as very low among the reasons for not legalizing/decriminalizing cannabis. I might assign greater weight to the concern and its consequences were cannabis as addictive as is nicotine [2], but it is not. Moreover, it's not clear to me that, and the extent that, the "gateway effect" of cannabis derives from its being "forbidden fruit." [3]


What strikes me as "special" about Canada and its legalization of cannabis, thus what I suspect gives rise to the somewhat vocal concerns and discussion of Canada's stance on the matter, is that among nations that (would) grant legal status to cannabis, or that have a laissez faire approach (in law and in law enforcement) to it and its users, Canada abuts the U.S., and travel by "typical Americans" between the two countries is relatively frequent and common. In contrast, not many "typical Americans" go to, or go often to, Spain, Iran or Uruguay, or the Netherlands, where "Mary Jane" is legally obtainable for recreational purposes by non-citizens in some jurisdictions and not in others.

Note:
  1. I think the distinction between "legal" and "decriminalized" substances, objects and behaviors is absurd, but nobody solicited me in the fabrication and "socialization" of that distinction, so it exists widely enough that it is "a thing" now, and I therefore acquiesce to the accepted distinction.
  2. Linked table is part of this study: Comparative risk assessment of alcohol, tobacco, cannabis and other illicit drugs using the margin of exposure approach
  3. Thinking back to my youth, my peers who were inclined to drink a lot and later, when they could legally buy booze, did drink a lot, were the kids whose parents made a big deal about their kids not drinking alcohol. My own parents never locked or stored the hootch away from my reach or sight and routinely allowed me a sip or two of it when they were drinking it and at "special occasion" dinners.

    didn't, at the time, care much for the taste of most alcoholic beverages I encountered, especially beer, so it wasn't a big deal for me to not drink much of it later in my life. (The very sweet wine served at church with communion was okay, but that isn't what my parents had at home.) It took only one college instance of my over imbibing, thus progressing from "buzzed" to "wasted," for me to know I was not ever going to let that happen again, for I didn't enjoy it. In fact, I thought, "why do people actually do this on purpose."
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis.

That is the salient issue.

In Colorado so far this legalization seems to have accomplished what was intended. There are still some doubts and reservations about it by a significant portion of the population there however.

I suspect that the high concentration of Catholics and Mormons in the Rocky Mountain states will always have reservations about cannabis.

It will take time and further observation about Colorado to find out if any such doubts are warranted.

Colorado is the test case. The people there are our lab rats.
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

Well, I'm not sure what to say to or about that. I read the stuff to which I link (except when I not that I have not done so). The "pit" doesn't seem so bottomless to me. Mostly, one need only read the introduction/framework and conclusions or discussion sections of the papers to which I link. If, however, one takes exception with the conclusions, discussion and/or results, well, then one needs to read the whole paper so as to have a sound basis for refuting the methodology that gave rise to the researchers' conclusions and so on.

If one endeavors to take on discussing a complex topic that has many variables to consider and to which one must rationally assign weights, there's usually a lot to think about and read. I say "read" because reading well developed work by others is generally more efficient than figuring out all that stuff on one's own. Don't you also think that availing oneself of the existing body of knowledge is better that "reinventing" it oneself?

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis. That is the salient issue.

What I shared as being my position, just as with others and their stated position, on the matter is the least important thing I wrote in the whole post. What I think, or what any other non policy maker or topical expert thinks isn't really all that important/worth knowing, except when a ballot is offered and the quantity of people who hold a given position determines what policy action(s) will ensue as a result of our learning the collective stance held by the polled population/sample.
I think it will just be a matter of time before Colorado gives us a complete case study of the whole issue of recreational cannabis legalization.

Trudeau does not seem inclined to wait however. He wants to smoke his dope now.

That's the bottom line on this, for the O/P up in O Canada.
Trudeau does not seem inclined to wait however.
I don't know why the Canadian Prime Minister should or would wait on whatever might be said about Colorado's experience with legalized recreational weed. The behavior of Coloradans (or people in other nations), and perhaps by extension, Americans, in the aftermath of legalized cannabis is either, with regard to Canadians' behavior patterns (1) unique, in which case whatever is learned from Colorado isn't applicable to Canada, or (2) not unique, in which case the learnings from the other places in the world are likely as good as what be found from the "Colorado experience." The learnings from those other countries can be found among the documentation I earlier linked in my initial post in this thread.
 
Justin Trudeau launching plan to legalise marijuana in Canada

legislation is being presented in Canada to legalise the recreational use of marijuana. It's a controversial topic, as there are many moving parts to this issue.

On one hand, the war on drugs has been an abysmal failure, and an expensive one, at that. Enforcement of this so called war has fallen mostly on minority shoulders, even though non minorities are statistically more likely to be cannabis users.

On the other hand, is it correct to just surrender to the issue of drug abuse, merely because it seems to be unenforceable with the tools we currently have at hand?

This is a major step to take, and the consequences may be far-ranging. Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
I'm apprehensive about responding to the OP above for seeing loaded language like "surrender to the issue of drug abuse" does not suggest the OP actually wants, as stipulated in the thread title, a factually dispassionate discussion of pros and cons. Instead, it intimates that s/he has an axe to grind, for the pros and cons, along with comparisons and descriptions of various jurisdictions' policy and legalization terms, are widely available from myriad sources on the Internet.
Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
The specific ideas I would share can be found in or inferred from the linked content above, and I have nothing new or different to add to that content that directly addresses the matter of cannabis legalization, its incidence and impacts.

Overall, I favor legalizing marijuana use and possession, or at least decriminalizing it. [1] I have a concern about marijuana's "gateway effect," but I also don't cotton to the principle of protecting individuals (adults) from themselves, so I weigh that concern as very low among the reasons for not legalizing/decriminalizing cannabis. I might assign greater weight to the concern and its consequences were cannabis as addictive as is nicotine [2], but it is not. Moreover, it's not clear to me that, and the extent that, the "gateway effect" of cannabis derives from its being "forbidden fruit." [3]


What strikes me as "special" about Canada and its legalization of cannabis, thus what I suspect gives rise to the somewhat vocal concerns and discussion of Canada's stance on the matter, is that among nations that (would) grant legal status to cannabis, or that have a laissez faire approach (in law and in law enforcement) to it and its users, Canada abuts the U.S., and travel by "typical Americans" between the two countries is relatively frequent and common. In contrast, not many "typical Americans" go to, or go often to, Spain, Iran or Uruguay, or the Netherlands, where "Mary Jane" is legally obtainable for recreational purposes by non-citizens in some jurisdictions and not in others.

Note:
  1. I think the distinction between "legal" and "decriminalized" substances, objects and behaviors is absurd, but nobody solicited me in the fabrication and "socialization" of that distinction, so it exists widely enough that it is "a thing" now, and I therefore acquiesce to the accepted distinction.
  2. Linked table is part of this study: Comparative risk assessment of alcohol, tobacco, cannabis and other illicit drugs using the margin of exposure approach
  3. Thinking back to my youth, my peers who were inclined to drink a lot and later, when they could legally buy booze, did drink a lot, were the kids whose parents made a big deal about their kids not drinking alcohol. My own parents never locked or stored the hootch away from my reach or sight and routinely allowed me a sip or two of it when they were drinking it and at "special occasion" dinners.

    didn't, at the time, care much for the taste of most alcoholic beverages I encountered, especially beer, so it wasn't a big deal for me to not drink much of it later in my life. (The very sweet wine served at church with communion was okay, but that isn't what my parents had at home.) It took only one college instance of my over imbibing, thus progressing from "buzzed" to "wasted," for me to know I was not ever going to let that happen again, for I didn't enjoy it. In fact, I thought, "why do people actually do this on purpose."
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis.

That is the salient issue.

In Colorado so far this legalization seems to have accomplished what was intended. There are still some doubts and reservations about it by a significant portion of the population there however.

I suspect that the high concentration of Catholics and Mormons in the Rocky Mountain states will always have reservations about cannabis.

It will take time and further observation about Colorado to find out if any such doubts are warranted.

Colorado is the test case. The people there are our lab rats.
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

Well, I'm not sure what to say to or about that. I read the stuff to which I link (except when I not that I have not done so). The "pit" doesn't seem so bottomless to me. Mostly, one need only read the introduction/framework and conclusions or discussion sections of the papers to which I link. If, however, one takes exception with the conclusions, discussion and/or results, well, then one needs to read the whole paper so as to have a sound basis for refuting the methodology that gave rise to the researchers' conclusions and so on.

If one endeavors to take on discussing a complex topic that has many variables to consider and to which one must rationally assign weights, there's usually a lot to think about and read. I say "read" because reading well developed work by others is generally more efficient than figuring out all that stuff on one's own. Don't you also think that availing oneself of the existing body of knowledge is better that "reinventing" it oneself?

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis. That is the salient issue.

What I shared as being my position, just as with others and their stated position, on the matter is the least important thing I wrote in the whole post. What I think, or what any other non policy maker or topical expert thinks isn't really all that important/worth knowing, except when a ballot is offered and the quantity of people who hold a given position determines what policy action(s) will ensue as a result of our learning the collective stance held by the polled population/sample.
Xelor some of your run-on sentences are as bad as mine are !!

:D
LOL

Well, let's hope we both correctly use punctuation so that readers can follow/dissect our sentences so as to obtain the "correct as written" meanings from them.

BTW, I try not to write run-on sentences, which, if memory serves, are sentences, or sentences that contain ostensibly independent clauses, that lack either an explicit or implied subject or a predicate.

Yes, I do write many compound, complex, and compound-complex sentences. I doubt that will change. Fortunately, I think, my sentences aren't often Faulknerian in their complexity and compounding.
 
Last edited:
Justin Trudeau launching plan to legalise marijuana in Canada

legislation is being presented in Canada to legalise the recreational use of marijuana. It's a controversial topic, as there are many moving parts to this issue.

On one hand, the war on drugs has been an abysmal failure, and an expensive one, at that. Enforcement of this so called war has fallen mostly on minority shoulders, even though non minorities are statistically more likely to be cannabis users.

On the other hand, is it correct to just surrender to the issue of drug abuse, merely because it seems to be unenforceable with the tools we currently have at hand?

This is a major step to take, and the consequences may be far-ranging. Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
I'm apprehensive about responding to the OP above for seeing loaded language like "surrender to the issue of drug abuse" does not suggest the OP actually wants, as stipulated in the thread title, a factually dispassionate discussion of pros and cons. Instead, it intimates that s/he has an axe to grind, for the pros and cons, along with comparisons and descriptions of various jurisdictions' policy and legalization terms, are widely available from myriad sources on the Internet.
Any ideas from states that have already started this process, and can offer some advice?
The specific ideas I would share can be found in or inferred from the linked content above, and I have nothing new or different to add to that content that directly addresses the matter of cannabis legalization, its incidence and impacts.

Overall, I favor legalizing marijuana use and possession, or at least decriminalizing it. [1] I have a concern about marijuana's "gateway effect," but I also don't cotton to the principle of protecting individuals (adults) from themselves, so I weigh that concern as very low among the reasons for not legalizing/decriminalizing cannabis. I might assign greater weight to the concern and its consequences were cannabis as addictive as is nicotine [2], but it is not. Moreover, it's not clear to me that, and the extent that, the "gateway effect" of cannabis derives from its being "forbidden fruit." [3]


What strikes me as "special" about Canada and its legalization of cannabis, thus what I suspect gives rise to the somewhat vocal concerns and discussion of Canada's stance on the matter, is that among nations that (would) grant legal status to cannabis, or that have a laissez faire approach (in law and in law enforcement) to it and its users, Canada abuts the U.S., and travel by "typical Americans" between the two countries is relatively frequent and common. In contrast, not many "typical Americans" go to, or go often to, Spain, Iran or Uruguay, or the Netherlands, where "Mary Jane" is legally obtainable for recreational purposes by non-citizens in some jurisdictions and not in others.

Note:
  1. I think the distinction between "legal" and "decriminalized" substances, objects and behaviors is absurd, but nobody solicited me in the fabrication and "socialization" of that distinction, so it exists widely enough that it is "a thing" now, and I therefore acquiesce to the accepted distinction.
  2. Linked table is part of this study: Comparative risk assessment of alcohol, tobacco, cannabis and other illicit drugs using the margin of exposure approach
  3. Thinking back to my youth, my peers who were inclined to drink a lot and later, when they could legally buy booze, did drink a lot, were the kids whose parents made a big deal about their kids not drinking alcohol. My own parents never locked or stored the hootch away from my reach or sight and routinely allowed me a sip or two of it when they were drinking it and at "special occasion" dinners.

    didn't, at the time, care much for the taste of most alcoholic beverages I encountered, especially beer, so it wasn't a big deal for me to not drink much of it later in my life. (The very sweet wine served at church with communion was okay, but that isn't what my parents had at home.) It took only one college instance of my over imbibing, thus progressing from "buzzed" to "wasted," for me to know I was not ever going to let that happen again, for I didn't enjoy it. In fact, I thought, "why do people actually do this on purpose."
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis.

That is the salient issue.

In Colorado so far this legalization seems to have accomplished what was intended. There are still some doubts and reservations about it by a significant portion of the population there however.

I suspect that the high concentration of Catholics and Mormons in the Rocky Mountain states will always have reservations about cannabis.

It will take time and further observation about Colorado to find out if any such doubts are warranted.

Colorado is the test case. The people there are our lab rats.
Xelor you are the only person I have ever seen who gives TOO MUCH documentation and links to support your views.

It creates a bottomless pit that nobody can possibly dive into, sort of like the bibliography after a book.

Well, I'm not sure what to say to or about that. I read the stuff to which I link (except when I not that I have not done so). The "pit" doesn't seem so bottomless to me. Mostly, one need only read the introduction/framework and conclusions or discussion sections of the papers to which I link. If, however, one takes exception with the conclusions, discussion and/or results, well, then one needs to read the whole paper so as to have a sound basis for refuting the methodology that gave rise to the researchers' conclusions and so on.

If one endeavors to take on discussing a complex topic that has many variables to consider and to which one must rationally assign weights, there's usually a lot to think about and read. I say "read" because reading well developed work by others is generally more efficient than figuring out all that stuff on one's own. Don't you also think that availing oneself of the existing body of knowledge is better that "reinventing" it oneself?

The one sentence that I got out of your long spiel is that you support the "legalization" of cannabis. That is the salient issue.

What I shared as being my position, just as with others and their stated position, on the matter is the least important thing I wrote in the whole post. What I think, or what any other non policy maker or topical expert thinks isn't really all that important/worth knowing, except when a ballot is offered and the quantity of people who hold a given position determines what policy action(s) will ensue as a result of our learning the collective stance held by the polled population/sample.
I think it will just be a matter of time before Colorado gives us a complete case study of the whole issue of recreational cannabis legalization.

Trudeau does not seem inclined to wait however. He wants to smoke his dope now.

That's the bottom line on this, for the O/P up in O Canada.
Trudeau does not seem inclined to wait however.
I don't know why the Canadian Prime Minister should or would wait on whatever might be said about Colorado's experience with legalized recreational weed. The behavior of Coloradans (or people in other nations), and perhaps by extension, Americans, in the aftermath of legalized cannabis is either, with regard to Canadians' behavior patterns (1) unique, in which case whatever is learned from Colorado isn't applicable to Canada, or (2) not unique, in which case the learnings from the other places in the world are likely as good as what be found from the "Colorado experience." The learnings from those other countries can be found among the documentation I earlier linked in my initial post in this thread.
I don't think he is waiting. He hopes that by Canada Day 2018, the legislation will be enacted and in force, so little over a year from now
 
Well, let's hope we both correctly use punctuation so that readers can follow/dissect our sentences so as to obtain the "correct as written" meanings from them.

BTW, I try not to write run-on sentences, which, if memory serves, are sentences, or sentences that contain ostensibly independent clauses, that lack either an explicit or implied subject or a predicate.

Yes, I do write many compound, complex, and compound-complex sentences. I doubt that will change. Fortunately, I think, my sentences aren't often Faulknerian in their complexity and compounding.

I try not to write run-on sentences which if memory serves me are long sentences or sentences that contain ostensibly independent clauses that lack either an explicit or implied subject or a predicate.
 
I always minimize punctuation since Moses and the ancient Hebrew prophets as well as the Medieval transcribers of the Greek New Testament did not use punctuation at all not even capitalization or miniscule.
 
Well, let's hope we both correctly use punctuation so that readers can follow/dissect our sentences so as to obtain the "correct as written" meanings from them.

BTW, I try not to write run-on sentences, which, if memory serves, are sentences, or sentences that contain ostensibly independent clauses, that lack either an explicit or implied subject or a predicate.

Yes, I do write many compound, complex, and compound-complex sentences. I doubt that will change. Fortunately, I think, my sentences aren't often Faulknerian in their complexity and compounding.

I try not to write run-on sentences which if memory serves me are long sentences or sentences that contain ostensibly independent clauses that lack either an explicit or implied subject or a predicate.

??? I'm sure I don't understand why you roughly copied the sentence I wrote.
 
For anyone who like cannabis I think a vaping stick with canibol oil is better than smoke.

My own drug of choice is alcohol -- moonshine and/or wine to be more specific.

EverClear and/or Sangria and/or Pinot Grigio to be most specific.
 
Yep- legalizing alcohol use didn't solve cancer, or end all deaths from alcohol.

See, stoners think this sort of reply makes them look smart, even though it isn't what anybody said, it's just the voices in their heads ...

But those of us who have read our history can see the direct parallels to the evils of Prohibition- and learn from them- and then there are people like you.

If you knew anything about Prohibition you wouldn't make such stupid claims. You probably think the Prohibition Amendment made alcohol illegal, like most semi-literates who can't be bothered to look into anything and prefer to just repeat whatever nonsense sounded good to them when they read it.

The Amendment and restrictions on alcohol remained popular enough that it was only repealed for money reasons, a government desperate for any kind tax revenue; it also remained in force in many states for decades afterwards. It in fact lowered consumption significantly compared to pre-Amendment years when booze consumption in the U.S. was 3 times the per capita consumption in Europe for most of the 19th century. It didn't get back to those levels until the 1960's, and drunk drivers were making the roads and highways slaughterhouses.
 
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The 'libertoons' are always telling us stuff like 'legalizing it will reduce crime n stuff', but it's doubtful, and for some reason they think it's not the same as just legalizing rape, robbery, murder, and the like, even though legalizing all that would certainly reduce crime if it were legalized, too.

The "Big Brother must protect us toons" keep telling us to keep doing the same drug war will somehow protect us- from the murders and theft that are caused by the Drug war.

Why are you so determined that Big Brother knows better than you- or I do- when it comes to the consumption of pot- or alcohol?

Pretty funny, coming from a left wing puppet who is all about Big Brother, PC Nazism, and Nazi style street thuggery.
 
If the black market diminished, why wouldn't crime go down?

Why would it? Ever been in a ghetto? You think all the violence and crime is just over drugs?

Are criminals out there killing people over black market liquor?

They kill over tennis shoes.


If weed was legal and not taxed to high heaven, what incentive would the cartels have to ship stuff over here?

You think they can't take over legitimate businesses? Want to bet many of the pot boutiques aren't run by biker gangs and other organized crime syndicates?
 
it also stops the criminalization of thousands of citizens who are otherwise harmless and law abiding. (disproportionately minorities of course)

They're disproportionately violent criminals; whether that fits the PC fantasies or not is unimportant. Black politicians wanted to War On Drugs, and they wanted black neighborhoods to get special attention. Take it up with Charles Rangel and the Congressional Black Caucus; they lobbied for it and Nixon obliged them.

It always pisses me off how a guy with an ounce of weed gets more prison time than the bankers that purposefully crashed our economy and screwed over thousands and thousands of people..

How many of those are there, and why do you think there aren't other circumstances behind the sentences?

or how a pothead serves more time than a rapist!

Ah, the usual anecdotal stories, which of course never seem to actually match the exaggerated 'outrage' intended.
 
it also stops the criminalization of thousands of citizens who are otherwise harmless and law abiding. (disproportionately minorities of course)

They're disproportionately violent criminals; whether that fits the PC fantasies or not is unimportant. Black politicians wanted to War On Drugs, and they wanted black neighborhoods to get special attention. Take it up with Charles Rangel and the Congressional Black Caucus; they lobbied for it and Nixon obliged them.

It always pisses me off how a guy with an ounce of weed gets more prison time than the bankers that purposefully crashed our economy and screwed over thousands and thousands of people..

How many of those are there, and why do you think there aren't other circumstances behind the sentences?

or how a pothead serves more time than a rapist!

Ah, the usual anecdotal stories, which of course never seem to actually match the exaggerated 'outrage' intended.
If you have to fake outrage at a pothead getting longer sentences than a rapist you are a POS
 
My own drug of choice is alcohol -- moonshine and/or wine to be more specific.
OT:
My kin make peach, orange and pear fruit infused 'shine. It's amazing! The peach is the easiest to make. Core and peel the fruit, drop it in the jar with the hootch, and let it sit in the root cellar for a few years. The orange flavored one takes more effort -- the inner membranes, along with the peel, have to be removed and the liquor strained after it's set up. Otherwise the process is the same. (One whole fruit per quart jar.)
 
The 'libertoons' are always telling us stuff like 'legalizing it will reduce crime n stuff', but it's doubtful, and for some reason they think it's not the same as just legalizing rape, robbery, murder, and the like, even though legalizing all that would certainly reduce crime if it were legalized, too.

The "Big Brother must protect us toons" keep telling us to keep doing the same drug war will somehow protect us- from the murders and theft that are caused by the Drug war.

Why are you so determined that Big Brother knows better than you- or I do- when it comes to the consumption of pot- or alcohol?

Pretty funny, coming from a left wing puppet who is all about Big Brother, PC Nazism, and Nazi style street thuggery.

And of course you can't answer why you think that Big Brother should be telling all of us- you- me- everyone- about what you can- or cannot injest.
 
If the black market diminished, why wouldn't crime go down?

Why would it? Ever been in a ghetto? You think all the violence and crime is just over drugs?

Apples and oranges.

We are talking about the violence caused by the black market of pot- just as there was violence associated with the black market for alcohol during prohibition.

The end of prohibition essentially ended the spree of violence of gangs fighting for the lucrative illegal alcohol trade. It didn't end all violence- but it did end the violence that was caused by alcohol being illegal.

Making pot legal will likewise in the end- eliminate virtually all the violence caused by pot being illegal. It won't stop all violence- but why wouldn't you prefer that violence to continue- and for that money to continue to flow to criminals?
 

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