Both Sides Say Ireland Has Voted to Legalize Gay Marriage

[C_Clayton_Jones]

REDFISH SAID:

“that is your opinion, not everyone agrees with you on the "harm" question. Why should your opinion carry more weight than anyone else's?”

It doesn't.

What 'carries more weight' is the fact that no objective, documented evidence has been presented to any court supporting the notion that allowing same-sex couples to marry in accordance with the 14th Amendment 'harms' society; it's this lack of a compelling governmental interest and proper legislative end which has compelled the courts to invalidate measures denying same-sex couples access to marriage law.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Marriage is a state contract between two consenting adults.

Holy Matrimony is a ceremony that religions use to "sanctify" the state contract of marriage.

Those participating in a Holy Matrimony ceremony are still required to sign the state marriage contract in order to be legally married.

No one is forced to undergo the religious ceremony in order to be legally married.

No religion is forced to conduct a Holy Matrimony ceremony that violates it's own dogma.

The state can define who can marry and at what ages they can marry under the laws of the state as long as they do not violate equal protection under the law.

Extending the state marriage contract to no longer discriminate against men and women is constitutional.

The legalization of gay marriage has nothing whatsoever to do with religion and does not violate the Holy Matrimony ceremony since there is no requirement that religions must perform their ceremony.

NOPE.

For as long as this nation has existed, Marriage has been a state contract between a man and a woman.

Utterly irrelevant and meaningless.

But thanks for tacitly admitting that you could not refute a single fact that I posted.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Same sex marriage is benign. It neither harms nor helps the greater society in which it exists. Once the abberation of homosexuality is accepted as normal behavior by the greater society it becomes toxic. Thereafter all other forms of degeneracy are also accepted as normal behavior and the culture becomes depraved in its entirety.

This fails as a slippery slope fallacy, representing the ignorance and unwarranted hatred of gay Americans repugnant to the Constitution.

 

[Silhouette]

Same sex marriage is benign. It neither harms nor helps the greater society in which it exists. Once the abberation of homosexuality is accepted as normal behavior by the greater society it becomes toxic. Thereafter all other forms of degeneracy are also accepted as normal behavior and the culture becomes depraved in its entirety.

^^ Way to access the Source!!^^

That was a statement derived directly from Knowledge.

 

[HappyJoy]

What a shitty fucking mess. I hope they all get aids!

You mean like a how-to manual? Do you think

Yes, a great victory for the men who prefer to suck their own shit off other men's cocks. BRAVO!

You do seem to fantasize about that a lot. Pretty much that is all your post about when it comes to gay marriage......

That's what faggots do. Are you homophobic?

Issues.

 

[Silhouette]

What's going to be fun is watching Ireland's justice system frame reasons why polygamists and incest marriage must still be denied. They will recall of course that the premise of "equality" was cited. Unless "equality" means "just some people we decide to favor, but not others"...

Good luck with that one Ireland. How equal is equal?

 

[Katzndogz]

Same sex marriage is benign. It neither harms nor helps the greater society in which it exists. Once the abberation of homosexuality is accepted as normal behavior by the greater society it becomes toxic. Thereafter all other forms of degeneracy are also accepted as normal behavior and the culture becomes depraved in its entirety.

This fails as a slippery slope fallacy, representing the ignorance and unwarranted hatred of gay Americans repugnant to the Constitution.

Gay isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

 

[Katzndogz]

What's going to be fun is watching Ireland's justice system frame reasons why polygamists and incest marriage must still be denied. They will recall of course that the premise of "equality" was cited. Unless "equality" means "just some people we decide to favor, but not others"...

Good luck with that one Ireland. How equal is equal?

There is no end to the aberrations that will have to be accepted as normal behavior. It's just getting started. In a few years Armin Marweis will be an injustly imprisoned gay chef.

 

[Political Junky]

Surprising.

It will be interesting to see the numbers coming out on how this works out for them.

It's worked out in 18 countries, Ireland is number 19.

 

[NoNukes]

It was Irish expats that turned the vote. Irish that left the country and don't have to live with the results.

Many expats returned to vote.

 

[NoNukes]

Congrats to Ireland. The first country to legalise gay marriage by popular vote.

Now lets see if Ireland spontaneously combust.

Nice to see the Catholic Church saying they have lost touch with the people. This has been happening for a while and it is about time.

The votes results
A total of 1,201,607 people (62.1%) voted Yes and 734,300 (37.9%) voted No.

The surprise was that while a lot of young voters registered for the first time. There was no notable divide between urban(more Liberal) or rural(More Conservative) OR between old and young.

I think the big think in Ireland while the No side tried a lot of scaremongering which was mainly shown to be inaccurate. The more religious saw this issue as a 'Love thy Neighbour..'

The Irish don't realize that they will be compelled to love their neighbors in every sense of the word.

Next up polygamy, bestiality, some other perversion is waiting in the wings to fight for their rights too.

Being gay is not perversion.

 

[NoNukes]

Don't want to be a bigot.

Too late, that ship sailed a long time ago.

And now the full quote.

"

Not gay marriage, but same sex marriage, YES

Don't want to be a bigot.

Anyone who can't accept that is a bigot

Sorry DT, you are today's bigot I guess

Your lack of any sense of humor is duly noted!

Humor? When talking equality? Inclusiveness?

You can't make this shit up folks

everyone is already EQUAL in this country
MARRIAGE isn't a RIGHT. We should bend over for .5% of the population in this country? that MOB RULE

That 5% deserve equal rights.

 

[NoNukes]

It was pretty simple for the Irish people 'Love thy Neighbour'

Some might ridicule such a simple message but to a lot of people who believe in christianity this was very important as this was the single most important thing Jesus said...

Some people are using the pulpit as a reason to object to Gay Marriage when Jesus's message was quite the opposite.

Today is a day when it is proud to be Irish... A country which has been so linked with Catholic culture has shown that not only did we listen to the Christian message but also acted on it...

Ireland is a very proud country today.

 

[deltex1]

If the people of Ireland voted to make gay marriage legal good for them I have said more than a few times put the issue of gay marriage on the national ballot here and let the people decide. If the nation votes yes I will accept the decision and live my life the question is if the vote was no would the gay marriage supporters do the same?

As already correctly noted: the Untied States is a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy, whose citizens are subject to the rule of law, not men, as men are incapable of ruling justly – measures denying same-sex couples access to marriage law in violation of the 14th Amendment are evidence of that.

Consequently, one's rights are not subject to 'majority rule,' as they are inalienable and fundamental, immune from attack by government or popular referenda.

Except that marriage, has for the entire existence of this nation, meant between a man and a woman.

YOu cannot have a same sex couple from an union between a man and a woman.

Thus, this is not about denying people access to marriage. This is about changing the institution of marriage.

And doing it dishonestly.

Incorrect.

Marriage is the union of two equal, consenting adult partners not related to each other in a committed relationship recognized by the state – same- or opposite-sex.

To seek to deny same-sex couples access to marriage law they're eligible to participate in violates the 14th Amendment, where to perceive something as being 'traditional' is not justification to deny citizens their civil rights (Lawrence v. Texas).

Same-sex couples are eligible to enter in to marriage contracts, marriage unchanged, unaltered, and not 'redefined.' To attempt to advance the lie that allowing same-sex couples access to marriage law 'changes' marriage is to be dishonest.

Where did you get that definition, Clayton...pull it out yo ass?

 

[auditor0007]

Gays

What a shitty fucking mess. I hope they all get aids!

Matthew,

What are you at? This is not some evil plan, this is simply a love thy neighbour issue... Two people want to commit to each other and want it recognised in law...

Why hope those people die?

You seem open minded when it comes to scientific research and outcomes of that research... Gay people are born gay, why would we punish them for that?

People are born with all kinds of compulsions. There are born pedophiles, serial killers, zoophiles, why would you punish them for that? One thing we do not do is accept these compulsions as normal behavior. Ireland did what it wanted to do. It voted to become a land of degenerates. We will soon follow. Perhaps the sickness is throughout the whole of western civilization.

Well we don't punish heterosexuals for their compulsions, do we? Of course not, because we view those compulsions as being normal. Homosexual compulsions are just as normal for those who are gay. You seem to want to group gays with pedophiles, serial killers, and others who commit crimes and harm other people in doing so. You seem to completely miss the fact that two consenting gay adults are harming absolutely no one by being gay. Pedophiles are harming children. Serial killers are killing people. Maybe you just cannot understand the difference, but it is more than significant.

 

[Correll]

Surprising.

It will be interesting to see the numbers coming out on how this works out for them.

What's not to work out?

Low rates of marriage, high rates of divorce, high rates of spouse abuse, bad outcomes for children, off the top of my head.

Gays have been marring in the US for a decade...in European countries much longer than that. Provide evidence to support your claims that gays marrying leads to those things?

Let's start with high divorce rates...Massachusetts has had gay marriage the longest...and has one of the lowest divorce rates in the United States. Fail

"High rates of spousal abuse". Let's look at the numbers shall we?

• Nearly 25% of women and 7.6% of men were raped and/or physically assaulted by a current or former spouse, cohabiting partner, or dating partner/acquaintance at some time in their lifetime (based on survey of 16,000 participants, equally male and female).
• Intimate partner violence made up 20% of all nonfatal violent crime experienced by women in 2001.

• Of the almost 3.5 million violent crimes committed against family members, 49% of these were crimes against spouses.
• 84% of spouse abuse victims were females, and 86% of victims of dating partner abuse at were female.
• Males were 83% of spouse murderers and 75% of dating partner murderers
• 50% of offenders in state prison for spousal abuse had killed their victims. Wives were more likely than husbands to be killed by their spouses: wives were about half of all spouses in the population in 2002, but 81% of all persons killed by their spouse.

Conversely...

• 11% of lesbians reported violence by their female partner and 15% of gay men who had lived with a male partner reported being victimized by a male partner.

Another FAIL

"Bad outcomes for children". Nope, fail again. All studies show that there is no difference in outcomes between the children of gays and the children of straights.

From the American Academy of Pediatrics
Technical Report
Promoting the Well-Being of Children Whose Parents Are Gay or Lesbian

Extensive data available from more than 30 years of research reveal that children raised by gay and lesbian parents have demonstrated resilience with regard to social, psychological, and sexual health despite economic and legal disparities and social stigma. Many studies have demonstrated that children's well-being is affected much more by their relationships with their parents, their parents' sense of competence and security, and the presence of social and economic support for the family than by the gender or the sexual orientation of their parents.​

My response was about the issues in gay marriage.

And I note that you also use misleading stats.

Lumping boyfriends in with husbands, and then moving on to the subset of "crimes committed against family members" then discussing a percentage of THAT.

Cute.

Your response was lacking any proof or evidence. You citing you is not evidence...that's what we call "Ass Facts".

Why is that misleading? Aren't you "lumping boyfriends and girlfriends" into the LGBT statistics? You have to be since not all gays can marry.

Domestic violence is statistically more prevalent in heterosexual relationships than in gay relationships...but you don't see gays trying to keep straights from marrying as a result. I know...let's just work on ending Domestic Violence instead.

(Your blowing off of the other responses to your ridiculously false claims is noted)

No, I was making a prediction about what gay marriage will be.

Link to support your claim Married couples have more domestic violence than Gay Married couples?

 

[Correll]

If the people of Ireland voted to make gay marriage legal good for them I have said more than a few times put the issue of gay marriage on the national ballot here and let the people decide. If the nation votes yes I will accept the decision and live my life the question is if the vote was no would the gay marriage supporters do the same?

As already correctly noted: the Untied States is a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy, whose citizens are subject to the rule of law, not men, as men are incapable of ruling justly – measures denying same-sex couples access to marriage law in violation of the 14th Amendment are evidence of that.

Consequently, one's rights are not subject to 'majority rule,' as they are inalienable and fundamental, immune from attack by government or popular referenda.

Except that marriage, has for the entire existence of this nation, meant between a man and a woman.

YOu cannot have a same sex couple from an union between a man and a woman.

Thus, this is not about denying people access to marriage. This is about changing the institution of marriage.

And doing it dishonestly.

Incorrect.

Marriage is the union of two equal, consenting adult partners not related to each other in a committed relationship recognized by the state – same- or opposite-sex.

To seek to deny same-sex couples access to marriage law they're eligible to participate in violates the 14th Amendment, where to perceive something as being 'traditional' is not justification to deny citizens their civil rights (Lawrence v. Texas).

Same-sex couples are eligible to enter in to marriage contracts, marriage unchanged, unaltered, and not 'redefined.' To attempt to advance the lie that allowing same-sex couples access to marriage law 'changes' marriage is to be dishonest.

How do you support your claim that marriage was considered a union of two equal consenting partners?

Because that is not what I was taught growing up in 20th century America.

 

[Correll]

Marriage is a state contract between two consenting adults.

Holy Matrimony is a ceremony that religions use to "sanctify" the state contract of marriage.

Those participating in a Holy Matrimony ceremony are still required to sign the state marriage contract in order to be legally married.

No one is forced to undergo the religious ceremony in order to be legally married.

No religion is forced to conduct a Holy Matrimony ceremony that violates it's own dogma.

The state can define who can marry and at what ages they can marry under the laws of the state as long as they do not violate equal protection under the law.

Extending the state marriage contract to no longer discriminate against men and women is constitutional.

The legalization of gay marriage has nothing whatsoever to do with religion and does not violate the Holy Matrimony ceremony since there is no requirement that religions must perform their ceremony.

NOPE.

For as long as this nation has existed, Marriage has been a state contract between a man and a woman.

Utterly irrelevant and meaningless.

But thanks for tacitly admitting that you could not refute a single fact that I posted.

The fact that the word does not have the meaning that you lefties have been claiming, is pretty relevant and meaningful.

It means your entire argument is based on a lie.

 

[Correll]

Surprising.

It will be interesting to see the numbers coming out on how this works out for them.

It's worked out in 18 countries, Ireland is number 19.

Got any good numbers showing good outcomes?

 

[Derideo_Te]

It means your entire argument is based on a lie.

Ironic!