Blind Faith in Obama

[daveman]

Liberals sat around for 8 years contemplating why conservatives wouldn't give up on Bush. It boggled their minds. Many did eventually give up on him. You'd think the left would wake up faster than the right did. Fortunately there were so many in the middle who voted for Obama, and they are already snapping out of it.

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to vote Democrat.

Interesting. So when was the last time the Republicans had a successful run at driving the boat? Reagan? Thirty years ago. Oh, nice record.

Just because you think Bush was terrible doesn't mean he was.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Just to give you a chance to disprove any obvious hypocricies on your part. (And I don't know why the fuck I'm even allowing you to do so.) What are your thoughts on Rev. Wright?

I've got NO time for ANY Clerics!!

Preying-on-the-ignorant is hardly an honorable-pursuit....

​

Nice dodge you fucking troll. You are seriously one load your mom should have swallowed.

Dodge?????



O.K., how's this......Wright is no different than any other man-o'-God (who sells fantasy/fairy-tales to the ill-educated)....rather than getting a real job.

You wanna defend Pat Robertson, now????

​

"Neil Volder, president of Robertson Financial and director of the new bank venture, emphasises that Robertson selflessly donated between 65 and 75 per cent of his salary as head of International Family Entertainment. But that amounted to only a few hundred thousand dollars a year - pocket change for a man of Robertson's means.

There was also, says Volder, the $7m he gave to 'Operation Blessing' to alleviate the woes of refugees fleeing genocide in Rwanda. Robertson's press operation puts the sum at only $1.2m. More interesting is the way the Operation Blessing funds were used in Africa. Through an emotional fundraising drive on his TV station, Robertson raised several million dollars for the tax-free charitable trust. Operation Blessing bought planes to shuttle medical supplies in and out of the refugee camp in Goma, Congo (then Zaire).

But investigative reporter Bill Sizemore of the Virginian Pilot discovered that over a six-month period - except for one medical flight - the planes were used to haul equipment for something called African Development Corporation, a diamond mining operation a long way from Goma. African Development is owned by Pat Robertson.

Did Robertson know about the diversion of the relief planes? According to pilots' records, he actually flew on one plane ferrying equipment to his mines.

One of Robertson's former business partners recalled that, although he often traveled in the minister's jet, he never saw Robertson crack open a Bible. "Everywhere we were flying he had the Wall Street Journal and Investors' Daily."

 

[Mr. Shaman]

You know Bill Clinton didn't pass any of those rates. Presidents don't pass laws. He simply didn't veto them. A Republican controlled Congress ushered in that success.

Yeah.....they were BIG FANS OF IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!​

Here’s what conservative politicians said about the 1993 deficit reduction legislation that raised taxes on the top 1.2% of our wealthiest citizens:​

"Clearly, this is a job-killer in the short-run. The impact on job creation is going to be devastating." - Rep. Dick Armey, (Republican, Texas)

"The tax increase will…lead to a recession…and will actually increase the deficit." - Rep. Newt Gingrich (Republican, Georgia)

"I will make you this bet. I am willing to risk the mortgage on it…the deficit will be up; unemployment will be up; in my judgment, inflation will be up." - Sen. Robert Packwood (Republican, Oregon)

"The deficit four years from today will be higher than it is today, not lower." - Sen. Phil Gramm (Republican, Texas)

"The President promised a middle-class tax cut, yet he and his party imposed the largest tax increase in American history. We hope his higher taxes will not cut short the economic recovery and declining interest rates he inherited… Instead of stifling growth through higher taxes and increased government regulations, Republicans would take America in a different direction." - Sen. Robert Dole (Republican, Kansas)

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, they passed it. So rather than being the "Party of no" as you like to call them, they did pass it. Had they not, Clinton would've been powerless to pass it himself, because he can't. President's don't pass laws.

And, yes, it did lead to a recession that Bush inherited, did it not?

Yeah.....THAT'S what happened......

 

[EriktheRed]

That is of course anything but honest and real.
And Obama seems to have continued Bush's "failed policies."

You mean like promoting sweeping healthcare and financial reform or maybe an overhaul of the student loan system? I suppose I might have missed the Shrub admin doing those things....

Boooooooooooosh!!!!


You could catch Barry fucking your cat and you'd be trying to have someone take a picture of you with your arm around him....

The 0ssiah worshipers like you are to be laughed at....

I just mentioned actual policy differences between him and his predecessor and all you can do is come back with the same lame shit?


Typical...

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Hope sure beats fearmongering. At least in my book.

Look at the facts, Obama's attempt to shut down deep sea drilling, is a job killer, cap and trade another job killer, now explain to me what Obama is doing to help the economy. And please be specific.

The oil spill is creating jobs. By your logic, plugging the leak is a bad idea because it's a job killer.

Another example of an idiot that can't defend Obama on his job making promises. Fact is the oil spill has created some jobs, but that's no reason to prolong the leak. Only an idiot such as yourself would suggest such a thing.

House Republicans are offering a better solution: an economic recovery plan that will create 6.2 million new American jobs over the next two years, according to a methodology used by President Obama’s own nominee as Chair of the White House Council of Economic Advisors, Dr. Christina Romer. The Camp-Cantor alternative – crafted by House Ways & Means Committee ranking member Dave Camp (R-MI), Republican Whip Eric Cantor (R-VA), and the members of the House GOP Economic Recovery Working Group – will provide fast-acting tax relief to help the economy create jobs, as opposed to the congressional Democrats’ bill, which is loaded with government spending on programs and projects. Here’s a quick summary of the House GOP’s Economic Recovery alternative:



•Immediate Tax Relief for Working Families: House Republicans propose reducing the lowest individual tax rates from 15 percent to 10 percent and from 10 percent to five percent. Under the proposal, a married couple filing jointly could save up to $3,400 a year in taxes. The alternative also ensures that no additional middle class taxpayers will fall victim to the Alternative Minimum Tax.


•Help for America’s Small Businesses: House Republicans propose to allow small businesses to take a tax deduction equal to 20 percent of their income. This will immediately encourage investment and free up funds for small businesses to hire new employees and create jobs.


•Assistance for the Unemployed: House Republicans propose to make unemployment benefits tax free so that those looking for work can focus on providing for their families.


•Extension of Unemployment Insurance Benefits: The alternative extends through December 2009 the current temporary federal extended unemployment benefits program to help more long-term unemployed workers.


•Stabilizing Home Values: In order to encourage responsible buyers to enter the market and stabilize prices, House Republicans propose a home-buyers credit of $7,500 for those buyers who make a minimum down-payment of five percent.


•Expanded Net Operating Losses (NOLs): The proposal expands the NOL carryback rules, permitting businesses to carry back their NOL deductions for five years, rather than two. This would provide many previously profitable companies the opportunity to seek immediate refunds of past taxes paid, giving them cash infusions that would help them weather the current economic storm.


•Bonus Depreciation / Small Business Expensing: The House GOP alternative extends the favorable depreciation rules contained in the 2008 economic stimulus package, providing businesses, both large and small, enhanced incentives to make critical investments that they might otherwise forgo during these challenging economic times.


•Repeal of Three Percent Withholding Requirement for Government Contractors: The measure repeals the rule requiring three percent withholding on certain payments made to taxpayers under contracts with federal, state, and local governments.


•Health Insurance Deduction: The alternative levels the playing field regarding the tax treatment of health insurance by providing a new above-the-line deduction for those Americans who do not receive tax-preferred, employer-sponsored health coverage. This provision would provide a critical tax benefit to Americans who must purchase insurance on their own, regardless of whether they itemize their taxes or take the standard deduction.


•No Tax Increases to Pay for Spending: House Republicans are concerned that the level of spending in the congressional Democrats’ trillion dollar package could result in near-term tax increases on American families and are insisting that any economic package include a provision precluding any tax increases now or in the future to pay for this new spending.

House Republican Leader John Boehner

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Well, my answer to that is simple... it always does and it will again.

The economy is bound to recover and the odds are good that it will be during the Obama Presidency. Therefore, I can guarantee you that we will be hearing the left bragging about Obama having saved the nation. Count on it.

However, the simple fact of the matter is that things always do bottom out and then improve. The next technological breakthrough that will spur a recovery is just a heartbeat away.

Immie

Wake up dude!! I think you're dreaming.

What good does negative thinking do?

If you consider facing reality as negative, then cling to your hope and change mantra. By the way, how is that hope and change thing working for you?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Hope sure beats fearmongering. At least in my book.

Look at the facts, Obama's attempt to shut down deep sea drilling, is a job killer, cap and trade another job killer, now explain to me what Obama is doing to help the economy. And please be specific.

The ban imposed on deep water drilling was lifted by court order, so none of the other rigs has yet been shut down. According to the Interior Department, there are 3,500 drilling rigs and platforms in the Gulf, 79 of them deepwater wells, and they are operating at 97% capacity.

And I fail to see how cap and trade will be a job killer when production will go on as usual.

That's not true. Please provide the link to the Interior Departments rig count and status.

The list indicates that nine rigs have already shut down operations as a result of the May 27 directive from Interior Secretary Ken Salazar in his 30-day report on the blowout of the Deepwater Horizon well and the oil spill, the worst in U.S. history, that has followed. Another 16 will cease operations at the first safe opportunity.

Cap and trade is a job killer and even the democrats acknowledge it. Obviously only idiots like you can't accept that fact.

Democrats Admit That Their Cap and Trade Bill Is a Job Killer

Why are you liberals incapable of being honest?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Look at the facts, Obama's attempt to shut down deep sea drilling, is a job killer, cap and trade another job killer, now explain to me what Obama is doing to help the economy. And please be specific.

The oil spill is creating jobs. By your logic, plugging the leak is a bad idea because it's a job killer.

Another example of an idiot that can't defend Obama on his job making promises. Fact is the oil spill has created some jobs, but that's no reason to prolong the leak. Only an idiot such as yourself would suggest such a thing.

No you supported it with your foolish notion that we should continue deepwater drilling, even now that we know beyond a reasonable doubt that the drillers have NO means of effectively fixing a blowout before it causes massive JOB KILLING damage, just for the sake of a few oil drilling jobs.

That is insanity, and I've yet to hear anyone made a good case that it isn't.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

No. BP's oil leak is a job killer. Cap and trade is not in effect and hasn't killed any jobs. Obama is pushing green energy and jobs. Obama and the Democrat led Congress just recently passed a jobs bill as well as a small business lending intiative.

BP is actually hiring 2000+ people to help with the cleanup and has not laid anyone off. Cap and trade will kill jobs if it ever passes. What specifically has Obama done to create jobs, and where are these jobs? Unemployment rate is in fact rising, so again what specific jobs in the private sector has Obama created.

Again, how do you figure cap and trade will kill jobs? Currently, it's beginning to look as though cap and trade will be strictly an energy initiative and have nothing to do with promoting global warming projects. So show me your proof that it will "kill" jobs.

As for Obama creating jobs in the private sector, he cannot FORCE businesses to hire. He has provided a slew of tax credits and hiring initiatives, which is the extent of authority the executive branch has over "creating jobs" for the private sector. Another reality is that private businesses have discovered that using temporary help keeps their costs down and still maintains productivity, so it's possible many of the old jobs won't be coming back at all. What should Obama do about that? Does he have some special authority to demand that businesses re-employ laid off workers? Of course not. What would a Republican president do in that situation?

You want proof? Hell google it yourself and listen to you rfellow democratic idiots, they even acknowledge it's a job killer.

Obama promised he would create jobs and I'm holding him to his promise. Did you even listen to his State of the Union Address where he laid out his plan for creating jobs?

Obama claimed that his stimulus policies worked and “saved jobs.” He also said that his policies staved off another Great Depression. But lets take a look at some of the graft, waste and pointless, useless, wild-eyed spending that was in his so-called stimulus.

•$5 million to create a geothermal energy system for a shopping mall in Tennessee. The mall is over half empty of tenants and has had falling shopper attendance for years *
•$1.57 million to Penn State University study fossils in Argentina *
•$100,000 to a puppet theater in Minnesota *
•$2 million to build a replica railroad tourist trap in Carson City, Nev. *
•A boat cruise company in Chicago got almost $1 million to “combat terrorism” *
•$500,000 went to Ariz. State Univ. to study ant genetics *
•Another $450,000 went to Uinv. of Arizona to study ants *
•Almost $400,000 went to Univ. of New York to pay students to drink beer and smoke marijuana for a study there *
•$219,000 to the Nat’l Institute of Health to study if young people “hook-up” after getting drunk *
•$210,000 to the Univ. of Hawaii to study bees *
•$700,000 to crab fishermen in Oregon to pay for lost crab pots *
•$5,000 a person tax rebate if you buy a new electric golf cart (Wall Street Journal)
•Up to $1 million went to prisoners in $250 stimulus checks (FoxNews)
•$54 mil to a New York Indian tribe to run its casino (New York Post)
•$1 billion for a power plant in Mattoon, Illinois that is based on speculative science and may not even work **
•$15 million to back-road bridges that get little traffic in Wisconsin **
•$800,000 for a practically unused airport in Pennsylvania **
•$3.4 million for an animal walk way under a road in Florida **
•$1.15 million to install a guard rail for a lake that doesn’t even exist in Oklahoma **
•$10 million to renovate a rail station that has stood unused for a decade **
•$578,000 to battle homelessness in Union, New York even though the town says they have no homeless people there **
•$233,000 to the Univ. of Calif. to study why Africans vote… in Africa ***
•$2 million to build a new fire house in a Nevada town that has no firemen ***
•North Carolina schools got $4.4 million for literacy and math coaches… to teach their teachers! ***
•$54 million for a railroad project in Napa Valley went to a minority-owned company that then hired a local construction company for half the price, pocketing the rest ***
•A California company was given $15 million in stimulus money to monitor water quality in a stream it was under indictment for polluting previously***

 

[ba1614]

"•Extension of Unemployment Insurance Benefits: The alternative extends through December 2009 the current temporary federal extended unemployment benefits program to help more long-term unemployed workers. "

Did they make mention of how they'll pay for it?

Just curious, they've been pretty vocal and adamant about that so I think it only right they back it up.
FTR, I don't support extending it anymore whether it's paid for or not. Hopefully welfare would shame some of them back to work if they haven't found any in fuckin' near 2 years.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Those aren't "Facts." Those are hyperbole. Job shifters at best. Our consumption of energy is not going to evaporate due to either of those things. Cap and trade may even create new economic sectors in the areas of engineering (For greater efficiencies), alternative energies, and carbon consumption (Firms that produce ways to consume carbon, creating credits that could then be sold).

What exactly do you want him to do? Republicans will block anything he tries, even if (and perhaps "especially if") it's legislation that will ease economic suffering. You don't grasp how badly vested your corporate masters are in this man's failure.

A six month moratorium on deepwater drilling would kill jobs, that is a fact, even though your dumbass won't admit it.

As for the cap and trade? Study: Cap and trade would hurt economy About 35 percent of crude-oil-related jobs and 40 percent of coal-related jobs would be lost in 2025, according to the analysis. It assumes that the majority of workers would find new jobs, but the net job loss would be 0.5 percent over the first 10 years that the legislation is in effect.

Perhaps you can tell me which specific private sector jobs Obama has created since the last stimulus package was passed.

Cite some energy publications on cap and trade killing jobs instead of the right-wing Washington Times, and I'll award you a gold star for having at least a modicum of credibility.

WHy bother? You sill wouldn't believe it. The Times cited a study by the Brookings Institute, it wasn't a "Times" study.

The National Association of Manufacturers, with the National Federation of Independent Business and several small local business associations, launched an advertising campaign in August that painted the House bill as a job killer that "will cost up to 2.4 million U.S. jobs." That figure was based on a report commissioned by NAM and the American Council for Capital Formation which estimated that the bill could cause between 1.8 million and 2.4 million job losses by 2030.

More recently, EnergyCitizens.org, an alliance of mostly conservative and business groups including NAM and the American Petroleum Institute, has run a TV ad and full-page print ads in The Washington Post warning that the "unfortunate truth about Congress’s climate bill" is that it could result in "2 million jobs lost." That figure comes from a report prepared by the consulting group Charles River Associations (formerly CRA International) for the National Black Chamber of Commerce, which does not support the House legislation.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

You mean like promoting sweeping healthcare and financial reform or maybe an overhaul of the student loan system? I suppose I might have missed the Shrub admin doing those things....

Boooooooooooosh!!!!


You could catch Barry fucking your cat and you'd be trying to have someone take a picture of you with your arm around him....

The 0ssiah worshipers like you are to be laughed at....

I just mentioned actual policy differences between him and his predecessor and all you can do is come back with the same lame shit?


Typical...

Creative, aren't they??



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h3cJQJkc_o&feature=related]YouTube - Right America: Feeling Wronged - Some Voices from the Campaign Trail[/ame]

Let's hear it, for Elementary School education.​

 

[Lonestar_logic]

The oil spill is creating jobs. By your logic, plugging the leak is a bad idea because it's a job killer.

Another example of an idiot that can't defend Obama on his job making promises. Fact is the oil spill has created some jobs, but that's no reason to prolong the leak. Only an idiot such as yourself would suggest such a thing.

No you supported it with your foolish notion that we should continue deepwater drilling, even now that we know beyond a reasonable doubt that the drillers have NO means of effectively fixing a blowout before it causes massive JOB KILLING damage, just for the sake of a few oil drilling jobs.

That is insanity, and I've yet to hear anyone made a good case that it isn't.

Yes I fully support deepwater drilling. You wouldn't suggest that trucks stop driving on the interstate because of one major accident , would you?

How many drilling rigs have you worked on?

 

[The Rabbi]

Another example of an idiot that can't defend Obama on his job making promises. Fact is the oil spill has created some jobs, but that's no reason to prolong the leak. Only an idiot such as yourself would suggest such a thing.

No you supported it with your foolish notion that we should continue deepwater drilling, even now that we know beyond a reasonable doubt that the drillers have NO means of effectively fixing a blowout before it causes massive JOB KILLING damage, just for the sake of a few oil drilling jobs.

That is insanity, and I've yet to hear anyone made a good case that it isn't.

Yes I fully support deepwater drilling. You wouldn't suggest that trucks stop driving on the interstate because of one major accident , would you?

How many drilling rigs have you worked on?

Using the same logic we should close all coal mines now since we've had mining accidents.
No activity is risk free. But in the attempt to make things risk free we sacrifice much else. The Left believes in the fallacy of unlimited resources so is unconcerned with this.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

"•Extension of Unemployment Insurance Benefits: The alternative extends through December 2009 the current temporary federal extended unemployment benefits program to help more long-term unemployed workers. "

Did they make mention of how they'll pay for it?

Just curious, they've been pretty vocal and adamant about that so I think it only right they back it up.
FTR, I don't support extending it anymore whether it's paid for or not. Hopefully welfare would shame some of them back to work if they haven't found any in fuckin' near 2 years.

I provided the link, but I imagine tax dollars would pay for it. Tax dollars that are now being wasted by Obama stimuls package such as :

Create interactive dance performance technology: $762,372

This grant to UNC-Charlotte will fund the development of computer technology to digitally record the dance moves of performers. The recorded movements can then be reviewed and manipulated by a computer program. Although creating virtual-reality type technology for dance movements may be interesting to those involved, how does this serve to “protect the education of our children”? At an average salary of roughly $47,000, this money could have saved 16 North Carolina teacher jobs

Collecting, researching and reporting on the stimulus act: $115,000; $150,000; $227,940
Total: $492,940

Nearly half a million taxpayer dollars will go toward funding more propaganda selling the “benefits” of the stimulus plan. The federal government created the Recovery Accountability and Transparency Board, while North Carolina established the Office of Economic Recovery & Investment for these very purposes. Apparently, that’s just not enough propaganda.

Reducing hot flashes through yoga: $147,694

Funds granted to Wake Forest University to study “preliminary data on the efficacy of integral yoga for reducing menopausal hot flashes.” The President warned us that the stimulus plan was needed to avoid an economic “catastrophe.” How does this study help revive the economy?

American Dance Festival, Inc.: $50,000

A graphic designer and archivist will retain their jobs thanks to this grant. The American Dance Festival hosts dance classes, workshops and engages in other charitable activities to help support dancers. How will this help reverse a major international financial crisis, exactly?

This is just examples of wasted stimulus spending in North Carolina.

 

[The Rabbi]

The stimulus is the biggest waste of money since Katrina reconstruction. It is inevitable than whenever gov't throws large sums of money at something there will be huge wastge.

 

[Cuyo]

"Thank you, Rabbi!" "No, Thank you, Lonestar!" "You're soooo smart!" "No, you are!" "Why doesn't everyone else 'get it?'" "Well, they're just not as smart as us I guess!"

 

[Lonestar_logic]

"Thank you, Rabbi!" "No, Thank you, Lonestar!" "You're soooo smart!" "No, you are!" "Why doesn't everyone else 'get it?'" "Well, they're just not as smart as us I guess!"

Maybe when you grow up you'll be as smart as us. In the meantime, stay stupid.

 

[Cuyo]

"Thank you, Rabbi!" "No, Thank you, Lonestar!" "You're soooo smart!" "No, you are!" "Why doesn't everyone else 'get it?'" "Well, they're just not as smart as us I guess!"

Maybe when you grow up you'll be as smart as us. In the meantime, stay stupid.

Yeah, that's it. I aspire to be as smart as you and Ribeye.

 

[The Rabbi]

"Thank you, Rabbi!" "No, Thank you, Lonestar!" "You're soooo smart!" "No, you are!" "Why doesn't everyone else 'get it?'" "Well, they're just not as smart as us I guess!"

Maybe when you grow up you'll be as smart as us. In the meantime, stay stupid.

Yeah, that's it. I aspire to be as smart as you and Ribeye.

You could go a long way there if you started reading some basic books on economics and political science instead of spewing your ignorance all over this board.