Bjj is too complex

[Aldo Raine]

freyasman
Totally agree, I love judo as well. Jujutsu really has far more wrist locks because it was developed to control the hands so that the enemy could not draw his sword.

Kano developed judo to be a sport that was kinder and could be practiced without maiming your training partner. But yes it can be made an evil and effective self defense system for sure. I didn't want to make sound like I was disrespecting judo in previous post if it came across that way I apologize. Like I said I love judo as well.

 

[Unkotare]

Quasar44
Agreed and try to control opponents wrists when possible.

The Japanese arts seem to be the best at that, both jujutsu and judo. Although judo kind of got rid of wrist control and locks.

I find a lot of Judo to be very effective and more applicable in the real than BJJ often is, but you really need to do as much of both as you can, IMO.
In actual situations, I find that being able to put someone on the ground very suddenly (and often very hard) resolves most incidents. (I learned this a long time ago bouncing drunks. I was studying a form of Shotokan Karate taught by a tough dude from San Pedro Sula, which is a notoriously rough town in Honduras, and found that foot sweeps and takedowns worked really well. It made me a lot more interested in learning arts like Judo, well before the UFC came around).
At the least a takedown or throw will give you room to escape or access your tools, if it doesn't end things. Also, there is a lot of grip fighting and hand and wrist control in Judo and you really want to keep control of a guy's hands to keep him from accessing a weapon. He starts sticking you in the neck with a shank in the clinch and your martial arts skills aren't going to keep you from bleeding out.

Another argument for wrestling because most of the time if you take the back it's all but over. Importantly, you are taught to keep close to the opponent's body while controlling position. It is of practical use to control position from the back without putting yourself on your own back on the floor of a bar or a filthy alley. Take the back, get at least cross-wrist control on one side, and even the biggest guy will go down if you know what the hell you're doing. Maintain position such that you can move off when his friends start swinging bottles at your head or if they don't, just grind your elbow into the base of his head (which in turn grinds his face into said alley or floor) while driving your shoulder into his back (forcing the air out of his lungs) until he decides he needs to find something else to do with his day. You don't have to kill the guy, you don't even have to hurt him any more than you want to, which maintains more positive energy in the universe. Of course if you want to, there's lots more.

 

[Unkotare]

Unkotare
Depends, I used to bait people with it. Inexperienced wrestlers would "reach back" or you can call it headhunting, looking for the big throw to the back. Then it was easy to take them to their back.

Ah! Reaching back!!!!! You don't know how many hours of my life I have spent barking at my wrestlers not to reach back. It's such a natural instinct, but it is a ticket to the end of the match real quick. A hard habit to break among more beginner wrestlers no matter how many times we cover it in practice.

 

[Unkotare]

freyasman
Totally agree, I love judo as well. Jujutsu really has far more wrist locks because it was developed to control the hands so that the enemy could not draw his sword.

Kano developed judo to be a sport that was kinder and could be practiced without maiming your training partner. But yes it can be made an evil and effective self defense system for sure. I didn't want to make sound like I was disrespecting judo in previous post if it came across that way I apologize. Like I said I love judo as well.

There is an old Chinese form of wushu called Shuai Jiao that focuses on ending throws that has some interesting technical and historical parallels to Judo.

 

[freyasman]

freyasman
Totally agree, I love judo as well. Jujutsu really has far more wrist locks because it was developed to control the hands so that the enemy could not draw his sword.

Kano developed judo to be a sport that was kinder and could be practiced without maiming your training partner. But yes it can be made an evil and effective self defense system for sure. I didn't want to make sound like I was disrespecting judo in previous post if it came across that way I apologize. Like I said I love judo as well.

There is an old Chinese form of wushu called Shuai Jiao that focuses on ending throws that has some interesting technical and historical parallels to Judo.

I've heard of it. IIRC, didn't Matt Furey the Combat Conditioning guy, do that?



edited to add; Bio

 

[freyasman]

Truth is, any grappling sport is going to be a great base style..... I'm still pissed I didn't realize this and wrestle in school, but nothing to be done for that now.
I still love boxing and muay thai as well, but I just can't keep taking shots to the head. I don't want to end up like Biden.

 

[Unkotare]

freyasman
Totally agree, I love judo as well. Jujutsu really has far more wrist locks because it was developed to control the hands so that the enemy could not draw his sword.

Kano developed judo to be a sport that was kinder and could be practiced without maiming your training partner. But yes it can be made an evil and effective self defense system for sure. I didn't want to make sound like I was disrespecting judo in previous post if it came across that way I apologize. Like I said I love judo as well.

There is an old Chinese form of wushu called Shuai Jiao that focuses on ending throws that has some interesting technical and historical parallels to Judo.

I've heard of it. IIRC, didn't Matt Furey the Combat Conditioning guy, do that?



edited to add; Bio

I thought he did Sambo.

 

[Unkotare]

Truth is, any grappling sport is going to be a great base style..... I'm still pissed I didn't realize this and wrestle in school, but nothing to be done for that now.
I still love boxing and muay thai as well, but I just can't keep taking shots to the head. I don't want to end up like Biden.

It would take more than some shots to the head to end up like Biden.

 

[freyasman]

Truth is, any grappling sport is going to be a great base style..... I'm still pissed I didn't realize this and wrestle in school, but nothing to be done for that now.
I still love boxing and muay thai as well, but I just can't keep taking shots to the head. I don't want to end up like Biden.

It would take more than some shots to the head to end up like Biden.

Still, I plan on keeping my act together until I die in a motorcycle accident or get shot by some lady's husband, rather than slowly withering away in a care facility, shuffling around with a full diaper and mumbling to myself as a result of pugilistic dementia.

 

[Unkotare]

Truth is, any grappling sport is going to be a great base style..... I'm still pissed I didn't realize this and wrestle in school, but nothing to be done for that now.
I still love boxing and muay thai as well, but I just can't keep taking shots to the head. I don't want to end up like Biden.

It would take more than some shots to the head to end up like Biden.

Still, I plan on keeping my act together until I die in a motorcycle accident or get shot by some lady's husband, rather than slowly withering away in a care facility, shuffling around with a full diaper and mumbling to myself as a result of pugilistic dementia.

Don't knock it till you've tried it! If you don't like it, you can always arrange a fiery grocery store scooter crash. Silver ticket to Valhalla.

 

[freyasman]

 

[freyasman]

 

[Quasar44]

HereWeGoAgain
Mossad won’t hurt me lol
They don’t harm other Jews lol
Anyone else you may get the uzi and motorcycle

 

[Quasar44]

Aldo Raine
Do you still train
Yes my many hours of ytube paid off this morning as I was able to get in my frames from bottom side

 

[Quasar44]

freyasman
Don’t u also train grappling ??

 

[freyasman]

freyasman
Don’t u also train grappling ??

Yeah when my schedule allows it.

I recently changed jobs though so I'm looking forward to getting more mat time. I might be teaching some basic boxing classes as well soon; we'll see.

 

[Aldo Raine]

Unkotare
We had a very good instructor in this area that taught Shuai Jiao. But alas he was an asshole of a human being so never had any interest in learning from him.

 

[Aldo Raine]

Unkotare@Quasar44
Not much anymore, with work n arthritis in hips and knees it is a painful endeavor.
Glad you were able to get there, keep drilling brother.

 

[freyasman]

Unkotare@Quasar44
Not much anymore, with work n arthritis in hips and knees it is a painful endeavor.
Glad you were able to get there, keep drilling brother.

I hear you.

That whole getting back up thing is taking a little longer, and hurts a bit more, every year.



But I keep seeing these folks who are my age, or maybe just a bit older, who are just physical wrecks...... frail, weak, really limited mobility, etc. And I can tell that at some point, they stopped moving and took up a position on a couch and that was it...... game over.

So yeah, it hurts and it takes a while to warm up but you gotta keep moving....... stillness is death.

 

[Unkotare]

Unkotare@Quasar44
Not much anymore, with work n arthritis in hips and knees it is a painful endeavor.
Glad you were able to get there, keep drilling brother.

I hear you.

That whole getting back up thing is taking a little longer, and hurts a bit more, every year.



But I keep seeing these folks who are my age, or maybe just a bit older, who are just physical wrecks...... frail, weak, really limited mobility, etc. And I can tell that at some point, they stopped moving and took up a position on a couch and that was it...... game over.

So yeah, it hurts and it takes a while to warm up but you gotta keep moving....... stillness is death.

The price you pay. I abused my joints and bones and organs something terrible in my intemperate youth. When I get out of bed these days it sounds like someone stepping on bubble wrap. Then there's the kidney stones, scar tissue on one eye, misshapen fingers, etc. However, I did for the most part avoid cauliflower ear somehow. In practice, I have to pop right up every time (can't let the kids see any weakness), but when I get home I gotta soak the machine for at least an hour.

Time is a bitch.