Biden, July 8: ‘The Taliban Overrunning Everything and Owning the Whole Country Is Highly Unlikely.’

[Oldestyle]

They let Al Qaeda operate there because Al Qaeda was key in helping them throw out the Soviets. Again put down the comic book and read some actual history.

Actually WE were key in helping them throw out the Soviets! A lot of good that did for us!

 

[Lesh]

Well golly gee, Lesh! WHY do you think they allowed Al Qaeda to operate there? Afghanistan is now going to be "terrorist Disneyworld"! The Taliban will allow Al Qaeda to set up terror camps again because Al Qaeda is radical Islam's means to an end.

So you finally understand what I wrote.

Now note...I finished with... " that we'll have to deal with"

By the way...didn't I read a post of yours saying that us leaving and the Taliban taking over was inevitable?

Yea...

 

[JoeB131]

The problem with our foreign policy is that we've got the dumbest man in the Senate for the better part of the last forty years RUNNING OURS!

You actually think that terrorists are going to leave us alone if we leave them alone? You might actually be dumber than Joe, Joey! Maybe it's the name?

The dumb thing is pretending we are sinless in our relationship with the middle east.

Okay, let's start at the beginning, the use of the word "Terrorist". One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. When Osama Bin Laden was in Afghanistan killing Russians, Ronald Reagan gave him a shitload of weapons and called him a "Freedom Fighter".

When he attacked the WTC, he gave three grievances against the US. Our support of Israel, our occupation of Saudi Arabia, and our use of economic warfare against Iraq killing hundreds of thousands of people. It doesn't justify the use of violence against civilians, but these were not religious goals. These were fairly legitimate policy complaints.

In short, the "Terrorists" are largely a problem we have created. Pretending that they want to conquer the world for their religion or hate our freedoms or some such shit is like something you would read in a comic book, but it doesn't reflect reality.

Hey, did you notice the Terrorist never attack Japan? Why do you think that is? Oh, that's right. Japan minds it's own fucking business.

 

[JoeB131]

Actually WE were key in helping them throw out the Soviets! A lot of good that did for us!

Yeah, it was actually pretty stupid, We should have minded our own business. See how that works.

It's kind of like when you raise a really nasty pitbull to sic on the neighbors kids, and then it ends up mauling your kids.

 

[Oldestyle]

So you finally understand what I wrote.

Now note...I finished with... " that we'll have to deal with"

By the way...didn't I read a post of yours saying that us leaving and the Taliban taking over was inevitable?

Yea...

It was...my problem isn't with the leaving...it's how we've done it! This makes the fall of Saigon look tame by comparison and the bloodbath is going to be even worse. We should have gotten those who supported us out. Now they'll be killed and anyone with any sense at all will think long and hard before they stick their necks out by cooperating with anything the US asks for. That doesn't go just for Afghanistan...that goes for anywhere in the world!

 

[Oldestyle]

Yeah, it was actually pretty stupid, We should have minded our own business. See how that works.

It's kind of like when you raise a really nasty pitbull to sic on the neighbors kids, and then it ends up mauling your kids.

Yet somehow you think the "pit bull" will be just fine if you pretend it's a kitty? (eye roll)

 

[Oldestyle]

The dumb thing is pretending we are sinless in our relationship with the middle east.

Okay, let's start at the beginning, the use of the word "Terrorist". One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. When Osama Bin Laden was in Afghanistan killing Russians, Ronald Reagan gave him a shitload of weapons and called him a "Freedom Fighter".

When he attacked the WTC, he gave three grievances against the US. Our support of Israel, our occupation of Saudi Arabia, and our use of economic warfare against Iraq killing hundreds of thousands of people. It doesn't justify the use of violence against civilians, but these were not religious goals. These were fairly legitimate policy complaints.

In short, the "Terrorists" are largely a problem we have created. Pretending that they want to conquer the world for their religion or hate our freedoms or some such shit is like something you would read in a comic book, but it doesn't reflect reality.

Hey, did you notice the Terrorist never attack Japan? Why do you think that is? Oh, that's right. Japan minds it's own fucking business.

We support Israel. We also support the Palestinians.
We didn't "occupy" Saudi Arabia...we staged troops there to help free Kuwait from an invasion by Iraq...something the Saudi's were completely behind. The Saudis didn't want Osama Bin Laden in their country. They saw him as a problem.
Economic warfare killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis? When did that happen? Sanctions were levied against Iraq because of THEIR actions.

 

[JoeB131]

It was...my problem isn't with the leaving...it's how we've done it! This makes the fall of Saigon look tame by comparison and the bloodbath is going to be even worse. We should have gotten those who supported us out. Now they'll be killed and anyone with any sense at all will think long and hard before they stick their necks out by cooperating with anything the US asks for. That doesn't go just for Afghanistan...that goes for anywhere in the world!

Why do we have an obligation to the quislings who sold out their own people to occupiers? You know, in World War II, they didn't let Quisling, Petain, Adrovscu and the other puppets go to Germany, they let their own people deal with them.

Come on, guy, it's not like you really want to bring thousands of brown Muslim people over here...

Yet somehow you think the "pit bull" will be just fine if you pretend it's a kitty? (eye roll)

Naw, when the neighbor (the Soviets) wanted to put the Pit bull down, we should have just agreed, not sheltered it and kept feeding it until it turned on us.

 

[JoeB131]

We support Israel. We also support the Palestinians.
We didn't "occupy" Saudi Arabia...we staged troops there to help free Kuwait from an invasion by Iraq...something the Saudi's were completely behind. The Saudis didn't want Osama Bin Laden in their country. They saw him as a problem.

The Saudi Royals were behind it....

The Saudi people, not so much. But that's the problem when you throw in with corrupt oligarchs. Eventually their people get fed up with them. It's like we learned nothing from the Shah of Iran.

Economic warfare killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis? When did that happen? Sanctions were levied against Iraq because of THEIR actions.

Economic sanctions against Iraq killed hundres of thousands of civilians. For instance, diseases like malaria ran rampant because Iraq could not buy insecticides because Saddam might turn them into nerve gases. It was a cruel and stupid policy and it made the region angry at us.

 

[Oldestyle]

Why do we have an obligation to the quislings who sold out their own people to occupiers? You know, in World War II, they didn't let Quisling, Petain, Adrovscu and the other puppets go to Germany, they let their own people deal with them.

Come on, guy, it's not like you really want to bring thousands of brown Muslim people over here...




Naw, when the neighbor (the Soviets) wanted to put the Pit bull down, we should have just agreed, not sheltered it and kept feeding it until it turned on us.

You're really an asshole, Joe! The people the Taliban will now be murdering are not "Quislings"...they were Afghans that wanted a different country from what the Taliban had given them. You're comparing us to the Nazis which is ludicrous on it's face.

Then you try and play the race card? Despicable! You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[Oldestyle]

The Saudi Royals were behind it....

The Saudi people, not so much. But that's the problem when you throw in with corrupt oligarchs. Eventually their people get fed up with them. It's like we learned nothing from the Shah of Iran.




Economic sanctions against Iraq killed hundres of thousands of civilians. For instance, diseases like malaria ran rampant because Iraq could not buy insecticides because Saddam might turn them into nerve gases. It was a cruel and stupid policy and it made the region angry at us.

Stupid policy? Saddam already HAD used chemical weapons both against his neighbors and against his own people! Why would any rational person give him the mean to produce more? That's on Saddam...not on the UN imposed sanctions!

 

[Lesh]

It was...my problem isn't with the leaving

Yea it is according to what you have written

 

[JoeB131]

You're really an asshole, Joe! The people the Taliban will now be murdering are not "Quislings"...they were Afghans that wanted a different country from what the Taliban had given them. You're comparing us to the Nazis which is ludicrous on it's face.

Then you try and play the race card? Despicable! You should be ashamed of yourself.

Okay, who was Vikund Quisling. He was a guy who wanted a different kind of Norway. He couldnt' get political power on his own, so he sided with foreign invaders who very quickly wore out their welcome.

Kind of sounds like a good description of these people who sided with us. Couldn't get to power on their own, sided with a foreign invader.

Let's not forget, the reason why Afghanistan failed is because the quislings were stealing the money we were sending over there as fast as we could ship it in... when they weren't shipping opium to Europe.

Come on, buddy, you were the ones who totally supported the Muslim Ban when Trump did it, but now you are claiming you want more Brown Muslims in this country.

Stupid policy? Saddam already HAD used chemical weapons both against his neighbors and against his own people! Why would any rational person give him the mean to produce more? That's on Saddam...not on the UN imposed sanctions!

NO, it was actually on us. If we were that worried about Saddam, we should have driven him out in 1991.

We had inspectors, we destroyed most of his WMD capability... and then we continued to punish the Iraqi people by denying them basic supplies.

 

[Likkmee]

China will own the place in a year-18 months

 

[Oldestyle]

Okay, who was Vikund Quisling. He was a guy who wanted a different kind of Norway. He couldnt' get political power on his own, so he sided with foreign invaders who very quickly wore out their welcome.

Kind of sounds like a good description of these people who sided with us. Couldn't get to power on their own, sided with a foreign invader.

Let's not forget, the reason why Afghanistan failed is because the quislings were stealing the money we were sending over there as fast as we could ship it in... when they weren't shipping opium to Europe.

Come on, buddy, you were the ones who totally supported the Muslim Ban when Trump did it, but now you are claiming you want more Brown Muslims in this country.



NO, it was actually on us. If we were that worried about Saddam, we should have driven him out in 1991.

We had inspectors, we destroyed most of his WMD capability... and then we continued to punish the Iraqi people by denying them basic supplies.

You're really going to double down on portraying the US as Nazis, Joe? The difference is that Norway wasn't like Afghanistan when the Taliban were in power before! They're going to slaughter the opposition. They did it before. They'll be even more brutal this time. Joe Biden didn't give a shit. Those Afghan lives are on him.

 

[JoeB131]

You're really going to double down on portraying the US as Nazis, Joe? The difference is that Norway wasn't like Afghanistan when the Taliban were in power before! They're going to slaughter the opposition. They did it before. They'll be even more brutal this time. Joe Biden didn't give a shit. Those Afghan lives are on him.

Here's the thing. If the Axis had won WWII, VIkund Quisling would be a national hero in Norway today, instead of a cheap gag of how to describe a sniveling traitor.

The Afghans have no one to blame but themselves. We could have and should have left at any time. They were the ones who had the responsibility to build a new kind of Afghanistan.

Instead, they stole American Aid as fast as it came in, smuggled tons of Heroin to Europe, sold the weapons we gave them to the Taliban, played both sides against the middle, and then managed to lose a war in a few weeks because even though they had a 4-1 numerical advantage, they couldn't get their shit together after 20 years.

We spent ten times as much propping up Afghanistan as we spent rebuilding Europe after WWII with the Marshall Plan.

Civil Wars kind of suck, because aftewards, you all still have to live with each other.

BUt still- not our problem.

 

[JoeB131]

China will own the place in a year-18 months

Awesome. Let them piss away a couple trillion dollars in the place.

 

[Oldestyle]

Here's the thing. If the Axis had won WWII, VIkund Quisling would be a national hero in Norway today, instead of a cheap gag of how to describe a sniveling traitor.

The Afghans have no one to blame but themselves. We could have and should have left at any time. They were the ones who had the responsibility to build a new kind of Afghanistan.

Instead, they stole American Aid as fast as it came in, smuggled tons of Heroin to Europe, sold the weapons we gave them to the Taliban, played both sides against the middle, and then managed to lose a war in a few weeks because even though they had a 4-1 numerical advantage, they couldn't get their shit together after 20 years.

We spent ten times as much propping up Afghanistan as we spent rebuilding Europe after WWII with the Marshall Plan.

Civil Wars kind of suck, because aftewards, you all still have to live with each other.

BUt still- not our problem.

You ignore the point here, Joe and I think you do so on purpose! What we're talking about right now is the FACT that thousands of Afghans are about to be slaughtered by the Taliban because they wanted a better life for the country and neither you nor Joe Biden care! They didn't do anything wrong. They aren't Nazi supporters that sold out their country. They were people that believed Afghanistan could be better than it had been.

 

[JoeB131]

You ignore the point here, Joe and I think you do so on purpose! What we're talking about right now is the FACT that thousands of Afghans are about to be slaughtered by the Taliban because they wanted a better life for the country and neither you nor Joe Biden care! They didn't do anything wrong. They aren't Nazi supporters that sold out their country. They were people that believed Afghanistan could be better than it had been.

I'm sorry, if they wanted a better life for their country, they wouldn't have stolen as much of the aid that got stolen and they wouldn't have encouraged the Opium Trade that made things so much worse.

These weren't idealists. They were opportunists who saw an opportunity to benefit from a foreign invasion.

They had 20 years to make a better Afghanistan... They didn't even bother.

 

[Oldestyle]

I'm sorry, if they wanted a better life for their country, they wouldn't have stolen as much of the aid that got stolen and they wouldn't have encouraged the Opium Trade that made things so much worse.

These weren't idealists. They were opportunists who saw an opportunity to benefit from a foreign invasion.

They had 20 years to make a better Afghanistan... They didn't even bother.

You're an idiot. The opportunists that stole money are gone. The people that are left are the ones that worked with us because they believed that Afghanistan could be a better country than it was under the Taliban. They didn't get rich doing what they did. They did it because they're good people.

Joe Biden didn't even bother to try and save them. Shame on him!