At What Percent Taxation Does One Become a Slave?

[JimBowie1958]

Do you really think that our federal government could run the programs it has without an income tax?

The programs it has? No, but then SO many of the programs it has it should not be running and others it spends WAY too much on.

What programs would you end to be able to drop federal income taxes?

Every single one that is not directly related to the enumerated powers granted to the federal government in the Constitution. The fact Progressives have broadly interpreted these provisions it the reason we have the crippling debt, taxes, spending, and burdensome meddling we do.



The government can collect revenues without imposing an income tax sufficient to defend against invasions. I know this because that's exactly what we did from 1780 until 1913.

Why do you think paying a single cent in taxes is to be a slave?

Because forcing some men to labor on the behalf of others is the very essence of slavery.

I am talking about REAL practical slavery that is not official but that has reduced the population to total dependence on the government to be able to simply exist. THAT is without doubt slavery in all practical terms, but to say that the Duke of York was a slave is just absurd.

If the Duke of York was subject to the kind of taxes that existed in America before the 16th amendment, which were indirect taxes, then those were voluntary and therefore not akin to slavery. When federal revenues came not from labor, but from usury fees and taxes on goods, tariffs on imported products, or excise taxes on certain items like alcohol and tobacco, people could chose not to pay any and all federal taxes by choosing not to buy the goods. That is VOLUNTARY, which makes all the difference in the world.

If the good Duke, or anyone else, was subject to an income tax, well that is not voluntary. Everyone must labor to survive. A government that forces some men, but not all, to direct some of their labor towards others they don't even know, as I said, that is the essence of slavery. Call it 'economic slavery' if you like, taxing a man's labor is immoral.

The people of England were subject to taxes of all kinds, even taxing them for how many windows they had on their cottages, to include the Duke. Taxes have NEVER been completely voluntary, so therefore according to your logic EVERYONE has ALWAYS been a slave throughout human history except for the one dude at the top of the pyramid; the emporer, absolute monarch, dictator, etc.

You effectively are trying to make the word slave meaningless.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Most people pay effectively 50% of their income in taxes if you include them all. You have state, federal, local taxes on your phone bill, products, services, etc. That's like working until June to put money in your pocket. It's way too high, it empowers government to become even more powerful. I think we are close to the point of no return where the stranglehold of government is too overwhelming and the masses too compliant. I think our founders would roll over in their graves.

I totally agree. I think we are approaching effective slavery.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Suppose the RINOS and libtards have their way and keep on funding the political patronage system for another century.

Ignoring the practical impacts of such a disaster to America, taxes will climb until they can climb no more.

But at what point do they amount to slavery? Suppose you make $100,000 annually, about twice the average house hold income.

100%? Some would argue that that still does not make one a slave since one can still leave the country, but the feds have passed a law that will tax you for years after you leave.

Expatriation tax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

80%? At 20% of remaining income, one could be looking at subsistence level income, meaning you have enough money left, maybe, to be above the poverty rate *if* you make close to $100,000 annually or more. That is a slave that buys his own essentials, and is even cheaper for the slave owners.

70%? A person could survive but not thrive on $30,000, but why make all that money if the government takes it all away about as quickly as you make it? And what of those who have average incomes? Can they be considered able to oay for more than merely surviving at $15,000 a year?

Note: this calculation completely ignores the taxation passed on to consumers by corporations, and some already pay well over 50% net income taxes if they live in New York City.

Americans for Tax Reform : Yankees Pitcher To Lose Over Half of $155 Million Contract to Taxes

I pay more in taxes than you earn in five years, so STFU.

You're a taker-- I pay for your roads, your clean air, clean water… I pay for your fucking internet.

So say thank you and go away.

Lol, you have no idea how much money I make and yet you make that statement like an idiot.

But then again, you are an idiot so I guess it is appropriate.

 

[JimBowie1958]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

I disagree. Some level of taxation is understood to be necessary to afford government, a necessary evil. It is termed 'necessary evil' because without it we get a foreign government that will not heed the will of the people.

Oh, wait.....

 

[JimBowie1958]

At what tax percent does one become effectively a slave to the government?

When the percent levied includes the government's right to buy you sell you, maim you, or kill you as they choose.

THAT is slavery, lad.

TAxes that are too high or unfairly levied are THEFT, not slavery.

So by your definition, lad, debt slavery is not slavery?

Indentured servitude is not a temporary form of slavery?

Buying and selling a person is not a requirement to be a slave. The Janisaries and Mamlukes were slaves and ran their respective countries.

You really should read up on the topic, dude.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Reporting your personal information to the government under penalty of imprisonment makes you their slave

No it doesn't

You can vote for your government representative....a slave can't

Thoughout history the ability to vote or efven run governments had nothing to do with their status as slaves. The Mamlukes WERE the Egyptian government for centuries and they were slaves.

Sheesh, there is so much abysmal ignorance on this topic.

Crack open some books and read.

 

[rightwinger]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

 

[JimBowie1958]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

That government no longer works for the American people.

I could give you a list of examples but you wouldn't read them anyway so I wont bother.

And you don't give a shit anyway as long as your party is the party on top.

 

[eflatminor]

Do you really think that our federal government could run the programs it has without an income tax?

The programs it has? No, but then SO many of the programs it has it should not be running and others it spends WAY too much on.



Every single one that is not directly related to the enumerated powers granted to the federal government in the Constitution. The fact Progressives have broadly interpreted these provisions it the reason we have the crippling debt, taxes, spending, and burdensome meddling we do.



The government can collect revenues without imposing an income tax sufficient to defend against invasions. I know this because that's exactly what we did from 1780 until 1913.



Because forcing some men to labor on the behalf of others is the very essence of slavery.

I am talking about REAL practical slavery that is not official but that has reduced the population to total dependence on the government to be able to simply exist. THAT is without doubt slavery in all practical terms, but to say that the Duke of York was a slave is just absurd.

If the Duke of York was subject to the kind of taxes that existed in America before the 16th amendment, which were indirect taxes, then those were voluntary and therefore not akin to slavery. When federal revenues came not from labor, but from usury fees and taxes on goods, tariffs on imported products, or excise taxes on certain items like alcohol and tobacco, people could chose not to pay any and all federal taxes by choosing not to buy the goods. That is VOLUNTARY, which makes all the difference in the world.

If the good Duke, or anyone else, was subject to an income tax, well that is not voluntary. Everyone must labor to survive. A government that forces some men, but not all, to direct some of their labor towards others they don't even know, as I said, that is the essence of slavery. Call it 'economic slavery' if you like, taxing a man's labor is immoral.

The people of England were subject to taxes of all kinds, even taxing them for how many windows they had on their cottages, to include the Duke.

Yes...and we started, and won, a war against that kind of shit.

Taxes have NEVER been completely voluntary,

Historians that have studied the period in America before the 16th amendment would disagree with you. There was one attempt to tax income involuntarily in the late 1800s...it was struck down as unconstitutional, and I would argue, immoral.

so therefore according to your logic EVERYONE has ALWAYS been a slave throughout human history except for the one dude at the top of the pyramid; the emporer, absolute monarch, dictator, etc.

As I said, I disagree with you that all taxes are involuntary. For instance, if the government imposes an excise tax on certain items, I can choose to not buy those items. Such indirect taxes are voluntary. Sorry, they just are.

You effectively are trying to make the word slave meaningless.

Let's not get into semantics. Call it whatever you want, I believe the idea of taxing a person's labor by threat of incarceration to be immoral. In essence, it is the government forcing some to labor on behalf of others, be they members of the recipient class or government bureaucrats. However the fruit of that involuntary labor is used, it's wrong in my opinion.

 

[eflatminor]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

Many times throughout history, people have voted for slavery...the actual owning of other people. By your logic, because there was a vote, it wasn't slavery. Sorry, your logic has failed you.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

I disagree. Some level of taxation is understood to be necessary to afford government, a necessary evil. It is termed 'necessary evil' because without it we get a foreign government that will not heed the will of the people.

Oh, wait.....

Objection. First of all, giving excuses for the theft doesn't make it any less theft. LOLberals use the same excuse for theft as necessary when it suits them. As for a foreign government taking over here without having one, you do realize that in WWII, the Japanese abandoned any plans to invade the US mainland. Do you know why that is? I'll give you a hint, it didn't have shit on a shingle to do with the US military.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

I didn't vote for it. In fact, less than half of the people who are mandated to participate didn't vote for it. Voting is simply tyranny of the majority, or if you look at some recent local cases like the NYC mayoral race, tyranny of the minority.

It doesn't make it any less theft and making excuses for it is, of course, a failure in logic.

 

[DennyO]

In simple words - cry me a river!

To put some historic perspective on this subject, the reality is the top marginal income tax rate in the United States was 70% or higher from 1936 to 1981. It reached 92% in 1952 and 1953. So, likely most of the people on this forum lived though what most who answered the poll would consider to be a period of "slavery". In fact, looking back, most would say the 50's were great days in America, both for the owners and the workers. I lived through this period too, and I don't recall even the top end income people ever using that term. Believe me, the chairman of General Motors back in 1970 did not end up being forced to patch the tires on the limo on Saturdays, or have his wife darn his socks due to the economic state of things.

So, we seem to fallen into histrionics. Slavery is the condition when your personal freedom is curtailed more or less completely, when you live a life with no choices as to where you live or where you work.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

In simple words - cry me a river!

To put some historic perspective on this subject, the reality is the top marginal income tax rate in the United States was 70% or higher from 1936 to 1981. It reached 92% in 1952 and 1953. So, likely most of the people on this forum lived though what most who answered the poll would consider to be a period of "slavery". In fact, looking back, most would say the 50's were great days in America, both for the owners and the workers. I lived through this period too, and I don't recall even the top end income people ever using that term. Believe me, the chairman of General Motors back in 1970 did not end up being forced to patch the tires on the limo on Saturdays, or have his wife darn his socks due to the economic state of things.

So, we seem to fallen into histrionics. Slavery is the condition when your personal freedom is curtailed more or less completely, when you live a life with no choices as to where you live or where you work.

Excuses, compare/contrast and fallacy do not change what it is.

 

[rightwinger]

All taxation is theft. Regardless of "how high or unfair" they are. Any tax is "unfair".

The act of stealing another man's labor, under the threat of violence against him for noncompliance, is slavery. Apparently being on a chain gang after failure to pay taxes, doesn't constitute slavery to you.

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

That government no longer works for the American people.

I could give you a list of examples but you wouldn't read them anyway so I wont bother.

And you don't give a shit anyway as long as your party is the party on top.

Thats the crux isn't it?

Your party was voted out of power and you whine becase you no longer get to call the shots. That is why we get threads about "slavery"

 

[eflatminor]

To put some historic perspective on this subject, the reality is the top marginal income tax rate in the United States was 70% or higher from 1936 to 1981.

And it was 0% from 1780 until 1913.

Neither is germane to the point, but thanks for playing.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Not when you vote for it

You elect representatives to decide how revenue will be accumulated and how it is dispersed

That is not slavery and not theft

That government no longer works for the American people.

I could give you a list of examples but you wouldn't read them anyway so I wont bother.

And you don't give a shit anyway as long as your party is the party on top.

Thats the crux isn't it?
Your party was voted out of power and you whine becase you no longer get to call the shots

Ironic, considering your group said the same thing when Bush was president. Fuck, most of you still say it. But, hypocrisy is a LOLberal forte. They do that shit like they learned it from some ancient god and passed it down through millions of years.

 

[Indeependent]

One day the Tax and Make War Party will be back in power.
Also known as the Tax and build Foreign Infrastructure Party.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

One day the Tax and Make War Party will be back in power.
Also known as the Tax and build Foreign Infrastructure Party.

Not sure what planet you hail from, but the "war party" never left power. And we continue to fund foreign nation infrastructure building.