Arminian Calvinist Universalist: Right ways to teach these vs Wrong ways inconsistent with the Bible

[PostmodernProph]

That Buddhism, developed completely independently of Christian Trinity
also has the THREE Refuges, and all it takes to be Buddhist is to
take Refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha.

the problem with your argument (and the problem with universalism) is that just because Buddhism has three things 1) doesn't mean that one of them is the Christ that died on the cross to save your sins and 2) doesn't mean that someone who believes in Buddhism's second thing also believes in the Trinity's second thing.....believing in someone else's second thing is not salvific.......

 

[emilynghiem]

That Buddhism, developed completely independently of Christian Trinity
also has the THREE Refuges, and all it takes to be Buddhist is to
take Refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha.

the problem with your argument (and the problem with universalism) is that just because Buddhism has three things 1) doesn't mean that one of them is the Christ that died on the cross to save your sins and 2) doesn't mean that someone who believes in Buddhism's second thing also believes in the Trinity's second thing.....believing in someone else's second thing is not salvific.......

Hi PostmodernProph
No, agreed, because that's not the point.
Neither did Moses Ten Commandments explain all this when those laws were first given.
The pattern is to give the laws in writing first, then go through a process of trials and errors,
tribulations etc. and reach the end stage where these laws are Fulfilled in Christ as the mature development stage of humanity.

So Buddha was like an Eastern Moses or prophet for natural laws for the gentiles who hear that path,
and the fulfillment in the end times is still taught in Christianity through Jesus and the salvation steps.

The way Jews have received Jesus is learning that the NT FULFILLS and completes the law given at the beginning.
So we can follow this same pattern with
fulfilling the spirit of the
teachings in Buddhism
and the laws in Constitutionalism, etc.

 

[PostmodernProph]

That Buddhism, developed completely independently of Christian Trinity
also has the THREE Refuges, and all it takes to be Buddhist is to
take Refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha.

the problem with your argument (and the problem with universalism) is that just because Buddhism has three things 1) doesn't mean that one of them is the Christ that died on the cross to save your sins and 2) doesn't mean that someone who believes in Buddhism's second thing also believes in the Trinity's second thing.....believing in someone else's second thing is not salvific.......

Hi PostmodernProph
No, agreed, because that's not the point.
Neither did Moses Ten Commandments explain all this when those laws were first given.
The pattern is to give the laws in writing first, then go through a process of trials and errors,
tribulations etc. and reach the end stage where these laws are Fulfilled in Christ as the mature development stage of humanity.

So Buddha was like an Eastern Moses or prophet for natural laws for the gentiles who hear that path,
and the fulfillment in the end times is still taught in Christianity through Jesus and the salvation steps.

The way Jews have received Jesus is learning that the NT FULFILLS and completes the law given at the beginning.
So we can follow this same pattern with
fulfilling the spirit of the
teachings in Buddhism
and the laws in Constitutionalism, etc.

but it isn't a common pattern....because Buddhism does NOT teach that salvation is available for those who accept the grace available from Jesus Christ, thus following the teachings of Buddhist law does not result in salvation, nor does following the teachings of Moses' law......

 

[Parture]

"They will be punished with eternal destruction, forever separated from the Lord and from his glorious power" (2 Thess. 1.9).

 

[Parture]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

 

[emilynghiem]

Hi PostmodernProph I don't disagree with you at all - what you are saying does
NOT conflict with the patterns I am showing all lead to the same stages at the end:

2. Of course -- Jesus is the Unique Connection and there is no other substitute for the Culmination at the end that is the sole role of Christ Jesus.

1. What I am SAYING is the common pattern is the PROGRESSION
from when laws are first given, to when ALL laws culminate in Christ Jesus at the end.

The Joining and fulfillment step is unique in Christ while the Pattern and Process to get to the point of reception is universal to all paths whether by church law or by secular laws. People use their native or cultural laws to understand and agree on the process, people establish truth with fellow members using the cultural laws common to them.

The spirit of restorative justice and truth that fulfills all these laws comes from God through Christ regardless which laws or language they use to connect culturally.

Is this more clear?
Yes I am agreeing to what you say at the end. What I am saying is the Process from start to progression to the end is following the same pattern of human development in stages.

0. SO YES I ALSO agree that neither the laws given by Moses
NOR the laws given by Buddha teach the final fulfillment process in Christ.
They "lay the foundation or path" that is LATER fulfilled with the teachings in Christianity.

I AGREE with all that you posted which is NOT against what I am saying, too!

That Buddhism, developed completely independently of Christian Trinity
also has the THREE Refuges, and all it takes to be Buddhist is to
take Refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma and the Sangha.

the problem with your argument (and the problem with universalism) is that just because Buddhism has three things 1) doesn't mean that one of them is the Christ that died on the cross to save your sins and 2) doesn't mean that someone who believes in Buddhism's second thing also believes in the Trinity's second thing.....believing in someone else's second thing is not salvific.......

Hi PostmodernProph
No, agreed, because that's not the point.
Neither did Moses Ten Commandments explain all this when those laws were first given.
The pattern is to give the laws in writing first, then go through a process of trials and errors,
tribulations etc. and reach the end stage where these laws are Fulfilled in Christ as the mature development stage of humanity.

So Buddha was like an Eastern Moses or prophet for natural laws for the gentiles who hear that path,
and the fulfillment in the end times is still taught in Christianity through Jesus and the salvation steps.

The way Jews have received Jesus is learning that the NT FULFILLS and completes the law given at the beginning.
So we can follow this same pattern with
fulfilling the spirit of the
teachings in Buddhism
and the laws in Constitutionalism, etc.

but it isn't a common pattern....because Buddhism does NOT teach that salvation is available for those who accept the grace available from Jesus Christ, thus following the teachings of Buddhist law does not result in salvation, nor does following the teachings of Moses' law......

P.S. does this help:
You are saying just teaching "Algebraic patterns" is NOT teaching Calculus and how change is measured and taught.

I am saying Algebra patterns are the PRECURSOR BEFORE you teach Calculus.
These are NOT the Calculus itself but teach relationships between variables.

The purpose of the Algebra is to show that
RELATIONSHIPS between X Y Z
are parallel to RELATIONSHIPS between A B C
if these are the CENTRAL coordinates.

So to answer your other post, NO
you cannot stick in RANDOM sets of three values.

It has to be the PARALLEL relations for these to work in PARALLEL.

judge
jury
executioner

Is NOT EXACTLY the SAME as

judicial
legislative
executive

But they are parallels and can be used to COMPARE AND CONTRAST
differences and similarities (both, not just trying to find commonality)
so you can work with both systems by seeing how they are the same or different.
(in the case above, legislature is formally elected reps and jury is chosen citizens,
but you can see the PARALLEL and then compare/contrast what is same/different)

Maybe you need this to be more specific, like INTERNAL trinities vs EXTERNAL ones:

External structures that are superficial:
local
state
federal
is more like:
individual
relationships/institutions in society
collective humanity

While INTERNAL trinities that get to the CORE of the laws and
CONNECTION with the PROCESS of truth/justice/peace:
executive
legislative
judicial

Would it help to make THAT distinction between superficial
structures and INTERNAL workings/process WITHIN these structures?

 

[Parture]

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

 

[emilynghiem]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

When Buddhists are sent through hell it is to assist people who don't know where they are, w hy, and how to get out.

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

Thanks Parture Whenever I am sent through hell it is to fish people out like you who hang yourself on your own rope.
You mean well, but when you reject people, they reject you, in a vicious cycle that keeps you "eternally separated."

Now, Parture, if you do your job RIGHT then SURE
you can help serve as gatekeeper and direct traffic back upstairs. I'd love to help you do that,
and I believe that is your TRUE intention and purpose, you DO mean to correct people!

But the way you foster Unforgiveness you are setting up the tests you present to FAIL people.
The point of teaching is to help people PASS.

You are like the teacher with trick questions trying to flunk as many people as you can.
You have a place in the school of life, but you need help to make sure people PASS your tests not fail them and run away from school and miss out on your wonderful lessons....

 

[Parture]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

When Buddhists are sent through hell it is to assist people who don't know where they are, w hy, and how to get out.

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

Thanks Parture Whenever I am sent through hell it is to fish people out like you who hang yourself on your own rope.
You mean well, but when you reject people, they reject you, in a vicious cycle that keeps you "eternally separated."

Now, Parture, if you do your job RIGHT then SURE
you can help serve as gatekeeper and direct traffic back upstairs.

But the way you foster Unforgiveness you are setting up the tests you present to FAIL people.
the point of teaching is to help people PASS.

You are like the teacher with trick questions trying to flunk as many people as you can.

Nobody is in Hell yet. The people that go to Hell are sent there 1000 years after the saved go to Heaven. When a person goes to Hell they stay there forever, because they were sent there in their desire to be eternally separated from God. That's where you going because you will forever reject God of the Bible. Free will is not truly free if you don't have this free choice. It would be evil of God to allow you into Heaven because you would bring your sinful thoughts of universalism with you and call Jesus a liar who died on the cross to give us the free and eternal choice to accept or reject God's forgiveness. Everyone who goes to Hell locks themselves in Hell from the inside eternally. You have always rejected God's forgiveness for your universalism instead, not so much unlike robots.

 

[emilynghiem]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

When Buddhists are sent through hell it is to study and help other souls to understand.

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

A. It says THESE
Just like These people who commit capital crimes shall be put to death.

Yes. And if all people are saved from committing capital crimes then all of them are saved from capital punishment.

The law is still true, even if all people can be saved from falling into this category where they commit capital crimes and get capital punishment.

The point is to save all people.

And this is done by forgiveness so prayers in Christ Jesus can cnnect all people with God for Salvation to be received.
God decides not you or me.
When we agree in Christ then Gods will is done. It only takes 2 or 3 agreeing for God will to be done. So I join in prayers for all the be forgiven and all to receive Christ Jesus
and God will correct me, you, everyone so we all receive Salvation. As long as we forgive then we can receive, so keep forgiving all.

It is not selfish to believe in Gods will that allbe saved in Christ. That saves everyone so that isnt selfish but including forgiving and loving all people equally which is Gods ideal will.

The path of destruction is broad that says other people are going to hell and dont deserve to receive grace to have heavenly peace, most people think that way and it is selfish.

Very few see how we can all be saved by grace but it only takes a few ahreeing and praying in Christ for Gods will to be done.

Thank you Parture
Keep working through your salvation with love that conquers fear and peace tgat surpasses any trembilng trials or tribulations you run across.

You are one of the gatekeepers so thanks for doing your job. May all who pass through your doors find the path the way and the life through the saving grace of Christ Jesus. Amen and abundance of blessings and grace to you and all within your outreach and influence. Take care, Yours truly, Emily

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

 

[emilynghiem]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

When Buddhists are sent through hell it is to assist people who don't know where they are, w hy, and how to get out.

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

Thanks Parture Whenever I am sent through hell it is to fish people out like you who hang yourself on your own rope.
You mean well, but when you reject people, they reject you, in a vicious cycle that keeps you "eternally separated."

Now, Parture, if you do your job RIGHT then SURE
you can help serve as gatekeeper and direct traffic back upstairs.

But the way you foster Unforgiveness you are setting up the tests you present to FAIL people.
the point of teaching is to help people PASS.

You are like the teacher with trick questions trying to flunk as many people as you can.

Nobody is in Hell yet. The people that go to Hell are sent there 1000 years after the saved go to Heaven. When a person goes to Hell they stay there forever, because they were sent there in their desire to be eternally separated from God. That's where you going because you will forever reject God of the Bible. Free will is not truly free if you don't have this free choice. It would be evil of God to allow you into Heaven because you would bring your sinful thoughts of universalism with you and call Jesus a liar who died on the cross to give us the free and eternal choice to accept or reject God's forgiveness. Everyone who goes to Hell locks themselves in Hell from the inside eternally. You have always rejected God's forgiveness for your universalism instead, not so much unlike robots.

You are talking about human time.
In God's time some people have already seen heaven and hell.

The overall process is happening on many spiritual levels.

The part even secular gentiles can know is that forgiveness brings healing grace.

So all it takes to receive Divine Grace and healing is to forgive and ask to receive.

So we keep doing this and the forgiveness healing and receiving multiplies.

Thanks Parture
The more you forgive the more you receive.

 

[Parture]

Buddhists are going to Hell. They are atheists. Not to mention Buddha was a fat pig, gluttonous to the end. Atheists reject God and His only begotten Son who died on the cross for the sins of the world. Nirvana is also false, for shutting your mind down in repetitive mantras as a result to suffering is not how God wants us to respond to suffering, but to deal with it directly, and take care of matters, actively engaging our mind, will and emotion.

The Bible says there is no other name under heaven by which one can be saved. So why do you call Jesus a liar? It's a very important fact most people who call themselves Christian are actually going to Hell, because they change Jesus into something else even make him a monster, e.g. Calvinist, Universalist, Ecumenical, Polytheistic and Pantheistic.

When Buddhists are sent through hell it is to assist people who don't know where they are, w hy, and how to get out.

Emily you are going to Hell according to the Bible since there are no universalists in heaven.

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matt. 25.46).

You have created for yourself a false Christ that is not the Jesus of the Bible. You do this selfishly for selfish reasons.

Thanks Parture Whenever I am sent through hell it is to fish people out like you who hang yourself on your own rope.
You mean well, but when you reject people, they reject you, in a vicious cycle that keeps you "eternally separated."

Now, Parture, if you do your job RIGHT then SURE
you can help serve as gatekeeper and direct traffic back upstairs.

But the way you foster Unforgiveness you are setting up the tests you present to FAIL people.
the point of teaching is to help people PASS.

You are like the teacher with trick questions trying to flunk as many people as you can.

Nobody is in Hell yet. The people that go to Hell are sent there 1000 years after the saved go to Heaven. When a person goes to Hell they stay there forever, because they were sent there in their desire to be eternally separated from God. That's where you going because you will forever reject God of the Bible. Free will is not truly free if you don't have this free choice. It would be evil of God to allow you into Heaven because you would bring your sinful thoughts of universalism with you and call Jesus a liar who died on the cross to give us the free and eternal choice to accept or reject God's forgiveness. Everyone who goes to Hell locks themselves in Hell from the inside eternally. You have always rejected God's forgiveness for your universalism instead, not so much unlike robots.

You are talking about human time.
In God's time some people have already seen heaven and hell.

The overall process is happening on many spiritual levels.

The part even secular gentiles can know is that forgiveness brings healing grace.

So all it takes to receive Divine Grace and healing is to forgive and ask to receive.

So we keep doing this and the forgiveness healing and receiving multiplies.

Thanks Parture
The more you forgive the more you receive.

Nobody has ever gone to Hell or Heaven. Read Acts 2.34 not even David a man after God's own heart is in Heaven yet. 1 Thess. 4.14-18 says we whom are saved are raptured together; none go ahead of us. The Bible says the first person who goes to Hell will be the Antichrist at the end of the Great Tribulation.

You are going to Hell because you reject Jesus since Jesus is not a universalist. For eternity you are going to reject Jesus so for eternity you are going to be in the Lake if Fire. You're a bad person to take your stance, beside Hitler, Stalin, Mao, rapists, etc.

"And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever" (Rev. 12.10).

"The beast" here is the Antichrist. The Antichrist is Nero. Nero is a human being who has died, but will be resurrected as the Antichrist. The False Prophet is a person also. He is Judas. Judas will be resurrected to fight against Jesus also.

 

[PostmodernProph]

Hi SO YES I ALSO agree that neither the laws given by Moses
NOR the laws given by Buddha teach the final fulfillment process in Christ.
They "lay the foundation or path" that is LATER fulfilled with the teachings in Christianity.

sorry, but that is not logical.......a path going north is not a path going south unless you stop following it, turn around, and head in the opposite direction........

 

[PostmodernProph]

The point is to save all people.

but do you recognize that there are some who reject that salvation?.......

 

[PostmodernProph]

So all it takes to receive Divine Grace and healing is to forgive and ask to receive.
.

is that not a single path?..........

 

[emilynghiem]

Hi SO YES I ALSO agree that neither the laws given by Moses
NOR the laws given by Buddha teach the final fulfillment process in Christ.
They "lay the foundation or path" that is LATER fulfilled with the teachings in Christianity.

sorry, but that is not logical.......a path going north is not a path going south unless you stop following it, turn around, and head in the opposite direction........

This is a very good analogy.
No, Buddhism is about AVOIDING suffering by recognizing the causes and detaching from
materialism or coveting/false desire/greed. In Christianity this is called Mammon.

Christianity is about seeking God through Christ.

so one is about avoiding the negative
the other is about seeking the positive.

These are not opposites but work in complements.
Buddhism focuses on the mind
Christianity on the spirit
and both are needed to love God with all our heart mind and soul.

The Constitutional laws don't work by themselves but run into problems.
Neither is Buddhism sufficient unto itself or we would all be Buddhists.

These natural laws exist and work WITH Christianity.

They only work against if you reject Christ.
In Buddhism as with any other group, it depends on the person if they reject Christ
and I do not.

If other Buddhists reject Christ, you are right, they will teach this wrong
and that contradicts Buddhism to teach false things, so that defeats Buddhism as well if it isn't teaching true wisdom.

 

[emilynghiem]

The point is to save all people.

but do you recognize that there are some who reject that salvation?.......

Yes of course during the process
but I'm saying that once everyone can see and understand
the choices, the consequences and causes of problems,
of course we will all choose what liberates us from suffering and pain.

Only sick addicted people refuse help because they can't help but self-destruct.
But even those people can be cured of demons and addictions by spiritual healing in Christ Jesus.
That's another reason I push for scientific proof of that, so criminal illness can be cured.
If people can see that the healthy mind naturally gravitates toward life and health,
and the power of forgiveness to heal, then everyone will choose forgiveness to solve problems.

Once people truly understand, they don't choose anything less.

 

[PostmodernProph]

They only work against if you reject Christ.
In Buddhism as with any other group, it depends on the person if they reject Christ
and I do not.

If other Buddhists reject Christ, you are right, they will teach this wrong

but why do you call yourself a universalist if you believe one must accept Christ to be saved......that is not the expected conclusion of universalism.....l

 

[emilynghiem]

So all it takes to receive Divine Grace and healing is to forgive and ask to receive.
.

is that not a single path?..........

Yes that's what I'm saying it is universal
and also that each person's unique culture and relations in life
will make their path different. the path of the Buddhist in receiving Christ
and changing how they see and teach the Buddhist principles
is different from Muslims who change how they see and teach Islam
and Jewish who teach and understand their laws differently when they receive Christ.

They won't all suddenly "drop their culture" just because they receive and understand Christ.
They will keep their cultural heritage, still honor their mothers and fathers
and practice many of the same customs, but in the spirit of Christ where it is free not conditioned.

 

[PostmodernProph]

The point is to save all people.

but do you recognize that there are some who reject that salvation?.......

Yes of course during the process
but I'm saying that once everyone can see and understand
the choices, the consequences and causes of problems,
of course we will all choose what liberates us from suffering and pain.

but this has not proved to be true.....people have been making bad choices for a very long time......