Alaska is the first red state to legalize recreational Marijuana

[Steinlight]

Yea, some guy on the internet said weed is harmless because of SCIENCE! or something. Well better support legalizing it.

Some people have actually read history and science.

History tells us that drug prohibition leads to money flowing to criminals, and the violence that accompanies criminals fighting for that money.

Science tells us that marijuana is less dangerous than alcohol.

Three states now have decided to pay attention to history and science rather than histrionics.

The rest of the United States can watch and see what happens. So far it looks like the biggest effect is more tax money for the States.

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.
.

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

Also, you never answered the question. Since there is much organized violence behind heroin and cocaine, the solution should be to legalize these substances, yes?

 

[Derideo_Te]

it is a gateway drug to hashish, opium, and eventually the Hook.

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

So according to that fallacy of yours soda is a gateway to becoming an alcoholic because you can't show me a single alcoholic who never started by drinking a soda, right?

Your false equivalence fails because there is no causality. Addicts become addicts because they have addictive personalities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the substances they abuse either. People who are addicted to gambling or cutting themselves or bulimia didn't all smoke pot first.

It isn't a fallacy.

It is just a fact someone who smokes marijuana is at a higher risk of using hard drugs than someone who doesn't use marijuana. Gateway drug theory isn't about gambling or bulimia so stop confusing the issue.

The only confusion is yours.

Cannabis is not in the least bit "addictive" to those without addictive personalities to begin with. There are no "withdrawal symptoms" from cannabis even for heavy users. There is also no proven causality. The onus is on you to provide it you can't.

 

[Derideo_Te]

But is marijuana in moderate doses harmful to one's health? Yes it is, and the studies show this.

Assumes facts not in evidence.

Onus is on you to provide credible links proving your claim.

I already provided multiple links in this thread that even moderate use of marijuana harms cognitive function, whereas even regular heavy drinking doesn't, just look through the thread.

Your links are self serving and not evidence based. Those "studies" are done by people "addicted" to funding grants that pay their salaries.

 

[Derideo_Te]

For example The fact is, regular marijuana use is far more damaging than regular use of alcohol, particularly in the area of cognitive function.

Assumes facts not in evidence.

No, you are simply wrong.

Ironic given that you cannot prove your fallacious allegations.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Some people have actually read history and science.

History tells us that drug prohibition leads to money flowing to criminals, and the violence that accompanies criminals fighting for that money.

Science tells us that marijuana is less dangerous than alcohol.

Three states now have decided to pay attention to history and science rather than histrionics.

The rest of the United States can watch and see what happens. So far it looks like the biggest effect is more tax money for the States.

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.
.

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

Also, you never answered the question. Since there is much organized violence behind heroin and cocaine, the solution should be to legalize these substances, yes?

The argument for legalizing those substances makes more sense and costs far less than the insane phony "war on drugs" that you mindlessly support.

 

[Syriusly]

Some people have actually read history and science.

History tells us that drug prohibition leads to money flowing to criminals, and the violence that accompanies criminals fighting for that money.

Science tells us that marijuana is less dangerous than alcohol.

Three states now have decided to pay attention to history and science rather than histrionics.

The rest of the United States can watch and see what happens. So far it looks like the biggest effect is more tax money for the States.

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.

As for the SCIENCE!, even casual use of marijuana(once a week), results in structural brain changes that effect cognitive function..

And alcohol is toxic- and kills Americans every year.

Study Marijuana much safer than alcohol KOBI-TV NBC5 KOTI-TV NBC2 Local news for Southern Oregon Northern California
A new international study suggests some legal substances could be more deadly than illegal ones, and marijuana may be safer than previously thought.


The study in “Scientific Reports” journal looks at one main thing, how deadly is a drug?


The Study - Scientific Reports


The results show alcohol as more lethal than even meth or heroin and over a hundred times more deadly than weed.


"The chances for mortality from other drugs is much much higher than for marijuana," said Medical Expert Dr. Robin Miller.


As July 1st approaches and marijuana legalization nears for Oregonians 21 and up we're getting a better look at how dangerous recreational drugs can be.


"Alcohol, cocaine, heroin, amphetamines, tobacco long term, are incredibly hard on your health," said Dr. Miller.


A study by the research journal 'Scientific Reports' found that compared to other recreational drugs marijuana comes dead last in terms of risk.


That's not surprising to medical experts like Dr. Miller.


"The chances of dying from smoking or taking in marijuana is very very low," said Dr. Miller.


A team of international scientists compared the typical usage of a drug against the amount in a lethal dose.


The findings show that individually, alcohol was the deadliest substance followed by heroin and cocaine. At the bottom of the list, and least deadly, was marijuana.

Legally banning marijuana is frankly irrational. We have seen that Prohibition doesn't work.

Treat marijuana exactly how we treat alcohol- regulate, tax- and the money will stop flowing to criminals and people will not get killed by criminals fighting over marijuana profits.

That study is redundant and doesn't speak to your case at all. Of course more individuals die from alcohol than from drugs like heroin and cocaine, more people drink alcohol than use those drugs. However even your study states these drugs are more lethal and addictive, and in much smaller doses.

And how casually you ignore that alcohol directly kills people.

Alcohol is toxic- marijuana is not.
2,200 deaths from alcohol poisoning per year versus none from marijuana poisoning.

Alcohol Poisoning Deaths Vital Signs

Alcohol is physically addictive- persons who become addicted to alcohol can die from withdrawal- again unlike marijuana.

Does that mean that marijuana is necessarily safe? No- but it does mean that alcohol is more deadly- and shows the hypocrisy of treating marijuana differently from alcohol.

I am not ignoring it. But you are being entirely disingenuous in your characterization of alcohol.

Regular alcohol use does not kill an individual. You can die of an overdose from doctor prescribed medications, should marijuana be legalized on that basis? Are prescription pills harmful when medicated properly? Of course not. Is alcohol when consumed in proper amounts harmful? Not it is not. But is marijuana in moderate doses harmful to one's health? Yes it is, and the studies show this.

Marijuana vs. Alcohol Which Is Really Worse for Your Health

Actually the studies are mixed.
Again- we know alcohol can- and does kill people- and marijuana can't- and doesn't.

As far as overall harm?

Marijuana vs. Alcohol Which Is Really Worse for Your Health

The question of whether alcohol or marijuana is worse for health is being debated once again, this time, sparked by comments that President Barack Obama made in a recent interview with The New Yorker magazine.


"As has been well documented, I smoked pot as a kid, and I view it as a bad habit and a vice, not very different from the cigarettes that I smoked as a young person up through a big chunk of my adult life," Obama said during the interview. "I don't think it is more dangerous than alcohol."


But how apt is the comparison between these substances? While both are intoxicants used recreationally, their legality, patterns of use and long-term effects on the body make the two drugs difficult to compare.




Both alcohol consumption and pot smoking can take a toll on the body, showing both short- and long-term health effects, though alcohol has been linked to some 88,000 deaths per year, according to the CDC, while for a number of reasons those associated with marijuana use are harder to come by. And research into marijuana's health effects is still in its infancy, compared with the rigorous studies looking at alcohol and human health.


Short-term health consequences


Drinking too much alcohol can quickly kill a person. The inability to metabolize alcohol as quickly as it is consumed can lead to a buildup of alcohol in the brain that shuts down areas necessary for survival, such as those involved with heartbeat and respiration. [7 Ways Alcohol Affects Your Health]


"You can die binge-drinking five minutes after you've been exposed to alcohol. That isn't going to happen with marijuana," said Ruben Baler, a health scientist at the National Institute on Drug Abuse. "The impact of marijuana use is much subtler."


(Of course, subtle effects don't equate with no danger, as is the case with smoking cigarettes, which is linked with 440,000 deaths per year in the U.S.)


Marijuana affects the cardiovascular system, increasing heart rate and blood pressure, but a person can't fatally overdose on pot like they can with alcohol, Baler said.


Alcohol is more likely than marijuana to interact with other drugs. The way that alcohol is metabolized, or broken down, in the body, is common to many drugs that are taken for a variety of conditions, said Gary Murray, acting director of the Division of Metabolism and Health Effects at the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism.


This means that for people taking drugs or medications while drinking, the alcohol can increase or decrease levels of the active drug in the body.


"Those things can make it very hit and miss, whether you're getting an active dose of a medication," Murray said.


Still, both drugs can affect health in indirect ways, too.

The question of whether alcohol or marijuana is worse for health is being debated once again, this time, sparked by comments that President Barack Obama made in a recent interview with The New Yorker magazine.


"As has been well documented, I smoked pot as a kid, and I view it as a bad habit and a vice, not very different from the cigarettes that I smoked as a young person up through a big chunk of my adult life," Obama said during the interview. "I don't think it is more dangerous than alcohol."


But how apt is the comparison between these substances? While both are intoxicants used recreationally, their legality, patterns of use and long-term effects on the body make the two drugs difficult to compare.


Both alcohol consumption and pot smoking can take a toll on the body, showing both short- and long-term health effects, though alcohol has been linked to some 88,000 deaths per year, according to the CDC, while for a number of reasons those associated with marijuana use are harder to come by. And research into marijuana's health effects is still in its infancy, compared with the rigorous studies looking at alcohol and human health.


Short-term health consequences


Drinking too much alcohol can quickly kill a person. The inability to metabolize alcohol as quickly as it is consumed can lead to a buildup of alcohol in the brain that shuts down areas necessary for survival, such as those involved with heartbeat and respiration. [7 Ways Alcohol Affects Your Health]


"You can die binge-drinking five minutes after you've been exposed to alcohol. That isn't going to happen with marijuana," said Ruben Baler, a health scientist at the National Institute on Drug Abuse. "The impact of marijuana use is much subtler."


(Of course, subtle effects don't equate with no danger, as is the case with smoking cigarettes, which is linked with 440,000 deaths per year in the U.S.)


Marijuana affects the cardiovascular system, increasing heart rate and blood pressure, but a person can't fatally overdose on pot like they can with alcohol, Baler said.


Alcohol is more likely than marijuana to interact with other drugs. The way that alcohol is metabolized, or broken down, in the body, is common to many drugs that are taken for a variety of conditions, said Gary Murray, acting director of the Division of Metabolism and Health Effects at the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism.


This means that for people taking drugs or medications while drinking, the alcohol can increase or decrease levels of the active drug in the body.


"Those things can make it very hit and miss, whether you're getting an active dose of a medication," Murray said.


Still, both drugs can affect health in indirect ways, too.


Because marijuana can impair coordination and balance, there is the risk of hurting oneself, particularly if someone drives or chooses to have unprotected sex while their inhibitions are lowered, Baler said. These are two areas where people using marijuana could hurt themselves for the short and long term.







The long-term effects of drinking heavily are well known. "Excess alcohol is going to lead to very severe consequences, and chronic excess alcohol is the most likely to lead to a lot of threatening issues," Murray said.


Drinking can lead to alcoholic liver disease, which can progress to fibrosis of the liver, which in turn can potentially lead to liver cancer, Murray said.


"I emphasize 'can' – it's not even clear to the best scientists what are the triggers that allow that progression to happen," he said, noting that why some people have a higher risk than others of developing liver disease from drinking is not understood medically or biochemically.


Unlike alcohol, Baler said, the effects of chronic marijuana use are not as well established. Animal studies have indicated some possible impact on reproduction. Additionally, there is evidence marijuana can worsen psychiatric issues for people who are predisposed to them, or bring them on at a younger age. Finally, Baler said, because the drug is typically smoked, it can bring on bronchitis, coughing and chronic inflammation of the air passages.


But while early studies showed some evidence linking marijuana to lung cancer, subsequent studies have debunked that association. Baler said it's unclear why marijuana smoke does not have the same result as tobacco smoke on the lungs, but perhaps some beneficial compounds in the marijuana smoke cancel out the ill effects, or perhaps the other health habits of marijuana smokers are different from those of cigarette smokers.


But cigarette smoking plays a complicated role in studying the impact of marijuana smoke, Baler said. Marijuana smokers tend to smoke much less than cigarette smokers, as some may smoke one joint a few times a week.


"It's a very tough epidemiological nut to break," Baler said.


Additionally, researchers looking to study long-term marijuana use have had difficulty in finding people who regularly smoke marijuana but don’t also smoke tobacco cigarettes. And the illegality of marijuana has also limited research in this field.


For marijuana, much of the concern is with young people who use the drug, because the drug interferes with the development of the brain while it is still maturing, Baler said. [10 Facts Every Parent Should Know About Their Teen's Brain]


Smoking marijuana interferes with connections being made in the brain "at a time when the brain should be at a clear state of mind, and accumulating, memory and data and good experiences that should be laying out the foundation for the future," Baler said.


"How much you're impaired depends on the person, and how much you smoke," Baler said. Because some people are stoned a lot of the time, while others may use marijuana only on weekends, the health effects become difficult to generalize.


"You're cumulatively impairing your cognitive function. What's going to be the ultimate result, nobody can say."

 

[Steinlight]

it is a gateway drug to hashish, opium, and eventually the Hook.

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

Show me any heroin addict and I will show you someone how drank alcohol first, and smoked cigarettes first. Most people who do heavier drugs started with alcohol and or cigarettes- both far more addictive than marijuana.

Many people from other countries are self rightious amoral, selfish narcisstic pricks.

Those that consume alcohol exclusively are less likely than those who use marijuana to use hard drugs.

Alcohol and cigarettes may have higher rates of addiction, but are less harmful as far as cognitive function goes. Moderate Marijuana use in the immediate term is far more harmful than cigarette use and certainly more so than moderate alcohol consumption.

 

[Steinlight]

Some people have actually read history and science.

History tells us that drug prohibition leads to money flowing to criminals, and the violence that accompanies criminals fighting for that money.

Science tells us that marijuana is less dangerous than alcohol.

Three states now have decided to pay attention to history and science rather than histrionics.

The rest of the United States can watch and see what happens. So far it looks like the biggest effect is more tax money for the States.

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.
.

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

The unintended consequences of the rightwing "do-gooder" mentality of trying to ban alcohol and drugs has created the violent criminal gangs of today.

Where are all those violent marijuana gangs in the US states where it is illegal?

 

[Derideo_Te]

Alcohol and cigarettes may have higher rates of addiction, but are less harmful as far as cognitive function goes. Moderate Marijuana use in the immediate term is far more harmful than cigarette use and certainly more so than moderate alcohol consumption.

 

[Steinlight]

it is a gateway drug to hashish, opium, and eventually the Hook.

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

So according to that fallacy of yours soda is a gateway to becoming an alcoholic because you can't show me a single alcoholic who never started by drinking a soda, right?

Your false equivalence fails because there is no causality. Addicts become addicts because they have addictive personalities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the substances they abuse either. People who are addicted to gambling or cutting themselves or bulimia didn't all smoke pot first.

It isn't a fallacy.

It is just a fact someone who smokes marijuana is at a higher risk of using hard drugs than someone who doesn't use marijuana. Gateway drug theory isn't about gambling or bulimia so stop confusing the issue.

You're wrong bud. Your just spewing propoganda. I promise you all the cokeheads and heroine users of the world tried alcohol first. And probably cigarettes.

But I CAN think of a way that marijuana IS a gateway drug! Because it's so illegal the only way to get it is to get mixed up with criminals. And those criminals have access to other drugs! So it makes getting into further illegal activities seem not so bad!

But I can think of one very easy way to end that...

Someone that just drinks alcohol is less likely than someone who uses marijuana to use hard drugs

 

[Derideo_Te]

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.
.

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

The unintended consequences of the rightwing "do-gooder" mentality of trying to ban alcohol and drugs has created the violent criminal gangs of today.

Where are all those violent marijuana gangs in the US states where it is illegal?

Cash From Marijuana Fuels Mexico s Drug War NPR

Petition Legalize Marijuana Stop Violent Mexican Drug Cartels Change.org

 

[Derideo_Te]

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

So according to that fallacy of yours soda is a gateway to becoming an alcoholic because you can't show me a single alcoholic who never started by drinking a soda, right?

Your false equivalence fails because there is no causality. Addicts become addicts because they have addictive personalities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the substances they abuse either. People who are addicted to gambling or cutting themselves or bulimia didn't all smoke pot first.

It isn't a fallacy.

It is just a fact someone who smokes marijuana is at a higher risk of using hard drugs than someone who doesn't use marijuana. Gateway drug theory isn't about gambling or bulimia so stop confusing the issue.

You're wrong bud. Your just spewing propoganda. I promise you all the cokeheads and heroine users of the world tried alcohol first. And probably cigarettes.

But I CAN think of a way that marijuana IS a gateway drug! Because it's so illegal the only way to get it is to get mixed up with criminals. And those criminals have access to other drugs! So it makes getting into further illegal activities seem not so bad!

But I can think of one very easy way to end that...

Someone that just drinks alcohol is less likely than someone who uses marijuana to use hard drugs

Only because marijuana was criminalized. Remove your phony "war on drugs" and that connection disappears.

 

[Steinlight]

Alcohol and cigarettes may have higher rates of addiction, but are less harmful as far as cognitive function goes. Moderate Marijuana use in the immediate term is far more harmful than cigarette use and certainly more so than moderate alcohol consumption.

Read the studies I linked in the thread, they aren't but a couple pages back. But in reality, you don't care about the science behind the issue, so what's the point? Your view wouldn't change even if you read the studies and admitted marijuana is more harmful. Because at the end of the day, you just don't think the government has the right to tell someone not to toke, regardless of harm level. I would be curious to see if that logic applies to cocaine and heroin as well? We shouldn't be inconsistent right?

 

[Katzndogz]

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

The unintended consequences of the rightwing "do-gooder" mentality of trying to ban alcohol and drugs has created the violent criminal gangs of today.

Where are all those violent marijuana gangs in the US states where it is illegal?

Cash From Marijuana Fuels Mexico s Drug War NPR

Petition Legalize Marijuana Stop Violent Mexican Drug Cartels Change.org

NPR. Change.org.

May as well have an article from The Advocate that butt fucking is good for you and doesn't cause anal leakage.

 

[Steinlight]

it is a gateway drug to hashish, opium, and eventually the Hook.

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

So according to that fallacy of yours soda is a gateway to becoming an alcoholic because you can't show me a single alcoholic who never started by drinking a soda, right?

Your false equivalence fails because there is no causality. Addicts become addicts because they have addictive personalities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the substances they abuse either. People who are addicted to gambling or cutting themselves or bulimia didn't all smoke pot first.

It isn't a fallacy.

It is just a fact someone who smokes marijuana is at a higher risk of using hard drugs than someone who doesn't use marijuana. Gateway drug theory isn't about gambling or bulimia so stop confusing the issue.

The only confusion is yours.

Cannabis is not in the least bit "addictive" to those without addictive personalities to begin with. There are no "withdrawal symptoms" from cannabis even for heavy users. There is also no proven causality. The onus is on you to provide it you can't.

Yes there are withdrawal symptoms.

Contrary to common belief, marijuana is addictive. Estimates from research suggest that about 9 percent of users become addicted to marijuana; this number increases among those who start young (to about 17 percent, or 1 in 6) and among people who use marijuana daily (to 25-50 percent).

Long-term marijuana users trying to quit report withdrawal symptoms including irritability, sleeplessness, decreased appetite, anxiety, and drug craving, all of which can make it difficult to abstain.

DrugFacts Marijuana National Institute on Drug Abuse NIDA

 

[Steinlight]

But is marijuana in moderate doses harmful to one's health? Yes it is, and the studies show this.

Assumes facts not in evidence.

Onus is on you to provide credible links proving your claim.

I already provided multiple links in this thread that even moderate use of marijuana harms cognitive function, whereas even regular heavy drinking doesn't, just look through the thread.

Your links are self serving and not evidence based. Those "studies" are done by people "addicted" to funding grants that pay their salaries.

Yes, all the studies university and government studies are conspiracies. What a convenient way for you to keep your head in the sand on the issue. What a pathetic rebuttal.

 

[Steinlight]

I like that logic, if we no longer call the people selling and manufacturing drugs criminals, than the drug money will no longer be flowing to criminals. Cool how that works.
.

I know you don't live in the United States, but I would think whatever backward country you do live in would have heard of the great experiment the United States had with alcohol prohibition.

That prohibition enriched criminals and killed Americans. It was a huge failure.

Just like marijuana prohibition.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol were driven out of the business by legal alcohol producers- and that is exactly what is happening with marijuana.

The criminals who sold illegal alcohol didn't suddenly become law abiding. They moved into drug sales. .

There was little in the way of an illegal drug market in 1930- organized crime focused on loan sharking, gambling and prostitution once they lost the alcohol market. And violence dropped once the big money was eliminated.

Also, you never answered the question. Since there is much organized violence behind heroin and cocaine, the solution should be to legalize these substances, yes?

The argument for legalizing those substances makes more sense and costs far less than the insane phony "war on drugs" that you mindlessly support.

Think of all the tax money we will get from legalized heroin! No external costs there at all...

 

[TheOldSchool]

Except that nonsense has been completely and utterly debunked.

If that were true millions of 70's hippies would all be hooked on heroin. Only that never happened. They just stopped smoking joints and became respectable adults with jobs and families instead.

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Most people, if any, don't start at heroin, but started at softer drugs like marijuana. Show me one heroin addict that started at heroin and I will show you 50 that started at pot. This is the point, that soft drug use leads to an increased likelihood of harder dug use. Meaning those who haven't used substances like marijuana to begin with are less like to use harder drugs.

Many baby boomers are amoral, selfish, narcissistic faggots, bad example.

Marijuana, NOT EVEN ONCE.

So according to that fallacy of yours soda is a gateway to becoming an alcoholic because you can't show me a single alcoholic who never started by drinking a soda, right?

Your false equivalence fails because there is no causality. Addicts become addicts because they have addictive personalities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the substances they abuse either. People who are addicted to gambling or cutting themselves or bulimia didn't all smoke pot first.

It isn't a fallacy.

It is just a fact someone who smokes marijuana is at a higher risk of using hard drugs than someone who doesn't use marijuana. Gateway drug theory isn't about gambling or bulimia so stop confusing the issue.

You're wrong bud. Your just spewing propoganda. I promise you all the cokeheads and heroine users of the world tried alcohol first. And probably cigarettes.

But I CAN think of a way that marijuana IS a gateway drug! Because it's so illegal the only way to get it is to get mixed up with criminals. And those criminals have access to other drugs! So it makes getting into further illegal activities seem not so bad!

But I can think of one very easy way to end that...

Someone that just drinks alcohol is less likely than someone who uses marijuana to use hard drugs

Because it is legal and they are not exposed to the criminal element.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Alcohol and cigarettes may have higher rates of addiction, but are less harmful as far as cognitive function goes. Moderate Marijuana use in the immediate term is far more harmful than cigarette use and certainly more so than moderate alcohol consumption.

Read the studies I linked in the thread, they aren't but a couple pages back. But in reality, you don't care about the science behind the issue, so what's the point? Your view wouldn't change even if you read the studies and admitted marijuana is more harmful. Because at the end of the day, you just don't think the government has the right to tell someone not to toke, regardless of harm level. I would be curious to see if that logic applies to cocaine and heroin as well? We shouldn't be inconsistent right?

I have read the studies and they are self serving in the exact same way the "studies" done by the big tobacco companies were bogus. The reality is that millions of people use cannabis on a daily basis. The "evidence" doesn't stand up to reality.

Oh, and you are the one who lacks logic because you are constantly trying to equate cannabis to heroin and cocaine which are as addictive and harmful as nicotine, if not more so. I notice that you don't make that "inconsistent" argument. Why not? Does the term hypocrisy ring any bells?

 

[BullKurtz]

You don't understand what gateway drug theory is.

The idea is not that everyone who smokes weed moves to heroin or cocaine.

Oh I understand it better than you will ever know, and it's idiocy to say I said "everyone" who smokes a joint ends up a junkie. It's really a pity there are so many simpletons here who don't understand what they read.