alan grayson threatens lawsuit on citizenship grounds if ted cruz is the gop nominee

[Skylar]

Only shills produce fraudulent docs. They don't exist without shills.

Now that's twice that it's been proven. That you lack the cognitive means to understand that, is simply a wonderful bonus.

Hell, you can't even properly navigate the quotes on this forum, no less, prove a word of your delusions.

Claiming you've proven something because you said it isn't actually proof. You really should know that without me having to tell you.

Who uses the category of "African" for race?

An African.

Those of us old enough recall that "race" was: Caucasian, Negro, Oriental, or Indian.

Old enough.....like 1962?

Column 5. Race.- Write European, Arab, Somali or African, etc. Asians must write Indian or Pakistan.

http://www.waikato.ac.nz/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/117476/Kenya-1962-en.pdf

So a Kenyan African declaring his race is African. Um....shocker?

Remember, Rabbi......you don't actually have the slightest clue what you're talking about.

Idiot.
Kenya is not Hawaii. They did not ask people to state their race. They had set categories and you had to pick one.

Prove it. You probably think there was a pull down combobox to pick from in 1961; but in fact, it was typed on a typewriter where anything could be entered.

Exactly. There's no box to check. There's only a box to type in.

And we've already established that an African from Kenya would self identify as an African. As the 1962 Kenyan Census for makes ludicrously clear. What were the 'set categories' that Hawaii forced a person to chose from. And according to who?

 

[Faun]

Hell, you can't even properly navigate the quotes on this forum, no less, prove a word of your delusions.

Claiming you've proven something because you said it isn't actually proof. You really should know that without me having to tell you.

Who uses the category of "African" for race?

An African.

Those of us old enough recall that "race" was: Caucasian, Negro, Oriental, or Indian.

Old enough.....like 1962?

Column 5. Race.- Write European, Arab, Somali or African, etc. Asians must write Indian or Pakistan.

http://www.waikato.ac.nz/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/117476/Kenya-1962-en.pdf

So a Kenyan African declaring his race is African. Um....shocker?

Remember, Rabbi......you don't actually have the slightest clue what you're talking about.

Idiot.
Kenya is not Hawaii. They did not ask people to state their race. They had set categories and you had to pick one.

Prove it. You probably think there was a pull down combobox to pick from in 1961; but in fact, it was typed on a typewriter where anything could be entered.

Exactly. There's no box to check. There's only a box to type in.

And we've already established that an African from Kenya would self identify as an African. As the 1962 Kenyan Census for makes ludicrously clear. What were the 'set categories' that Hawaii forced a person to chose from. And according to who?

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their "proof" is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Because the Registar of Hawaii already affirmed

ROFLMNAO!

Rabbi.. she's tryin' to place some sense of legitimacy over the 'affirmation' by a state that has a law making it legal for them to issue fraudulent birth certificates to children NOT BORN IN HAWAII.

Meaning that the affirmation is from those who set no legal stock in what 'affirmation' actually means, but she needs YOU to use the actual meaning of the word when you read it... despite it not meaning what she wants you to believe it means.

 

[Skylar]

Who uses the category of "African" for race?

An African.

Those of us old enough recall that "race" was: Caucasian, Negro, Oriental, or Indian.

Old enough.....like 1962?

Column 5. Race.- Write European, Arab, Somali or African, etc. Asians must write Indian or Pakistan.

http://www.waikato.ac.nz/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/117476/Kenya-1962-en.pdf

So a Kenyan African declaring his race is African. Um....shocker?

Remember, Rabbi......you don't actually have the slightest clue what you're talking about.

Idiot.
Kenya is not Hawaii. They did not ask people to state their race. They had set categories and you had to pick one.

Prove it. You probably think there was a pull down combobox to pick from in 1961; but in fact, it was typed on a typewriter where anything could be entered.

Exactly. There's no box to check. There's only a box to type in.

And we've already established that an African from Kenya would self identify as an African. As the 1962 Kenyan Census for makes ludicrously clear. What were the 'set categories' that Hawaii forced a person to chose from. And according to who?

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their proof is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

Sigh........its their echo chamber. They're trained to think that accusations ARE evidence. They're kinda caught flat footed when we question them or ask for actual quotes. As again, to them the accusations are the evidence.

From their perspective its like asking for evidence of evidence. It strips their gears. As in the echo chamber, no one questions any of the silly, brain dead shit these hapless souls tell each other. No one fact checks it. No one even thinks too hard about it.

 

[Rexx Taylor]

if alan ever passes a stone, that would be the end. what a way to die.

 

[Skylar]

Because the Registar of Hawaii already affirmed

ROFLMNAO!

Rabbi.. she's tryin' to place some sense of legitimacy over the 'affirmation' by a state that has a law making it legal for them to issue fraudulent birth certificates to children NOT BORN IN HAWAII.

What law?

And for the 3rd time, you can't factually establish that a birth certificate issued by the State of Hawaii for a child born in a foreign country would say that the child was born in Hawaii.

Which destroys your entire argument. As that's where the President's does.

Meaning that the affirmation is from those who set no legal stock in what 'affirmation' actually means, but she needs YOU to use the actual meaning of the word when you read it... despite it not meaning what she wants you to believe it means.

Or.....you're once again hopelessly uninformed. And ignoring objective evidence in favor of your own imiaginary fantasies. Fantasies that you can't back with evidence.

Remember Keyes.....your ONLY argument is to ignore objective evidence and cite your personal opinion as evidence. That's it. And your opinion isn't evidence of anything objective.

Try again.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their "proof" is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

In every case... the proof is in the existence of the fact.

The Fact of the Publisher publishing her report that obama told her that he was born in Kenya.
The Fact that Hawaiian law provides for the issuing of fraudulent birth certificates.
The fact that ONLY Shills issue Fraudulent Documents.
The fact that "African" ... is NOT a race. In 1960... "Negro" was the medically used term for 'homey', at the time.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

What law?

[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.

(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.

(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM

 

[Faun]

Because the Registar of Hawaii already affirmed

ROFLMNAO!

Rabbi.. she's tryin' to place some sense of legitimacy over the 'affirmation' by a state that has a law making it legal for them to issue fraudulent birth certificates to children NOT BORN IN HAWAII.

Meaning that the affirmation is from those who set no legal stock in what 'affirmation' actually means, but she needs YOU to use the actual meaning of the word when you read it... despite it not meaning what she wants you to believe it means.

What is fraudulent about issuing a birth certificate to a foreigner who is adopted by a Hawaiian when the birth certificate identifies the individual was born in another country and the certificate does not provide evidence of U.S. citizenship?

 

[Skylar]

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their "proof" is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

In every case... the proof is in the existence of the fact.

That's just circular reasoning. As your 'proof' of the fact is your assumption of the 'fact'. Your evidence and your conclusion are the same thing. Its like watching a dog chasing its own tail.

Watch:

The Fact of the Publisher publishing her report that obama told her that he was born in Kenya.

But that's not a 'fact'. That's an accusation. One you can't back with anything. And one contradicted by expert testimony:

This was nothing more than a fact checking error by me — an agency assistant at the time," Goderich wrote. "There was never any information given to us by Obama in any of his correspondence or other communications suggesting in any way that he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii. I hope you can communicate to your readers that this was a simple mistake and nothing more."

Which just destroys your argument. As this is expert eye witness testimony which contradicts you. And you have nothing to back your claim.

Just you. Citing you. Which tell us nothing. As you don't know what you're talking about.

The Fact that Hawaiian law provides for the issuing of fraudulent birth certificates.

That's not a 'fact' either. That's your accusation. But when pressed to show us ANY birth certificate issued by the State of Hawaii that says a person was born in Hawaii when they weren't......

.....and you've got nothing. Nothing isn't evidence. Nor does it establish a 'fact'.

The fact that ONLY Shills issue Fraudulent Documents.

What 'fraudlent documents'? What 'shills'? You have yet to factually establish that the State of Hawaii indicates that someone was born in Hawaii.....when they weren't.

So much for your 'fact'. Its just more nested assumptions. Citing yourself. And you're nobody.

The fact that "African" ... is NOT a race.

Says who? We've already established that per the 1962 census, African was a recognized racial designation. Meaning its not only plausible but probable that a Kenya African would identify as 'African' for his race.

Once again, you're offering us your accusations as facts. And they aren't the same thing.

Do you ever have any argument that isn't you offering your subjective opinion as objective evidence? Any at all?

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

The point is-- Ted Cruz was actually born in Alberta, Canada. So how does this make him eligible to be POTUS?

It doesn't make he eligible.

It also doesn't disqualify him.

What disqualifies him is the same thing that disqualified the Brown Clown: He was born to a Foreign National Father.

The Natural Born Citizen clause requires a candidate for President (and Vice President by extension) be born to TWO US Citizen Parents.

Feel Better?

 

[Skylar]

Because the Registar of Hawaii already affirmed

ROFLMNAO!

Rabbi.. she's tryin' to place some sense of legitimacy over the 'affirmation' by a state that has a law making it legal for them to issue fraudulent birth certificates to children NOT BORN IN HAWAII.

Meaning that the affirmation is from those who set no legal stock in what 'affirmation' actually means, but she needs YOU to use the actual meaning of the word when you read it... despite it not meaning what she wants you to believe it means.

What is fraudulent about issuing a birth certificate to a foreigner who is adopted by a Hawaiian when the birth certificate identifies the individual was born in another country and the certificate does not provide evidence of U.S. citizenship?

Not a thing.

But once again, Keyes insists that he must be right because he says he is. And the Dictionary, the Naturalization Act of 1790, the Founders, the 1st Congress, the Supreme Court, history and English common law must be wrong.

Because he says they are.

This is what passes for evidence among conservatives: anything they can possibly type.

 

[Skylar]

The point is-- Ted Cruz was actually born in Alberta, Canada. So how does this make him eligible to be POTUS?

It doesn't make he eligible.

It also doesn't disqualify him.

What disqualifies him is the same thing that disqualified the Brown Clown: He was born to a Foreign National Father.

And who says that disqualifies him? Again, there's nothing about your argument that isn't you just making shit up.

The Natural Born Citizen clause requires a candidate for President (and Vice President by extension) be born to TWO US Citizen Parents.

Feel Better?

Says who? You're offering us your subjective definition. But what does that have to do with the constitution or the term's actual meaning?

 

[Skylar]

What law?

[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.

(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.

(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM

Yeah, but where does it this law say that the birth certificate would indicate the child was born in Hawaii?

That's where your argument breaks. And you know it breaks....as you omit any mention of this question about the birth certificate indicating the child was born in Hawaii in any reply. You won't even quote me asking the question.

You always tell me where you know your argument is weakest by what you refuse, over and over, to address. Or even acknowledge exists.

Oh, and how any of that law 'fraudulent'?

 

[Faun]

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their "proof" is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

In every case... the proof is in the existence of the fact.

The Fact of the Publisher publishing her report that obama told her that he was born in Kenya.
The Fact that Hawaiian law provides for the issuing of fraudulent birth certificates.
The fact that ONLY Shills issue Fraudulent Documents.
The fact that "African" ... is NOT a race. In 1960... "Negro" was the medically used term for 'homey', at the time.

You're fucking deranged. Everything you state there as proof is actually you saying, because you say so.



But then, what else can one expect from a brain-dead hypocritical conservative who says he will help an "illegitimate" candidate become president against the authority of the Constitution?

 

[Faun]

What law?

[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.

(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.

(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM

You know that has nothing to do with Obama, right?

 

[Skylar]

No doubt you've noticed -- not a single accusation made was proved.

• Obama told his publisher he was born in Kenya.

• Obama's COLB is fake.

• Obama COLB was produced by shills working for the Hawaiian government.

• "African" is not a race that would have been typed.

.... and in every single case -- their "proof" is the same -- because they say so. One idiot even claims he proved it twice because he said it twice.

In every case... the proof is in the existence of the fact.

The Fact of the Publisher publishing her report that obama told her that he was born in Kenya.
The Fact that Hawaiian law provides for the issuing of fraudulent birth certificates.
The fact that ONLY Shills issue Fraudulent Documents.
The fact that "African" ... is NOT a race. In 1960... "Negro" was the medically used term for 'homey', at the time.

You're fucking deranged. Everything you state there as proof 8s actually you saying, because you say so.



But then, what else can one expect from a brain-dead hypocritical conservative who says he will help an "illegitimate" candidate become president against the authority of the Constitution?

Keyes is offering you a lovely window into how he thinks. He's offering you what he believes is irrefutable proof: his opinion.

That's simply his process. To Keyes his subjective opinion is irrefutable, objective and universal truth. On any topic. The meaning of words, the will of God, nature, sexuality, the law, the constitution, anything at all.

Can you imagine what it must be like to live with a person like that? Its no wonder his wife has tried over and over to divorce him.

 

[Synthaholic]

I believe that's false. The POTUS makes decisions that affect all American citizens, therefore anyone can bring a suit.

What you believe does change reality

The reality is that I am correct.

You clearly haven't studied the topic of standing

Yet, you still cannot prove me wrong. Imagine that.

I don't need to. The precedent is there.

What's the precedent of a Canadian being elected POTUS?

 

[Syriusly]

The dictionary, the Naturalization Act of 1790, the Wong Kim Ark decision all point in one direction: place of birth.

The Phrase Natural Born Citizen speaks to "THE NATURE OF CITIZENSHIP".

The nature of citizenship is a function of ... (wait for it... ) NATURE.

This is to say that the function of the standard for the office of the US President rests in THE NATURE OF CITIZENSHIP... and decidedly NOT: THE LAW.

Meaning that the Constitution requires that beyond the age requirement, the minimal requirement to hold the office of the President of the United States, the individual must have come to BE a citizen of the United States as a natural consequence of their birth.

This requirement was established so as to preclude divided loyalties common to individuals who are merely citizens by law; such as where a child is born to two individuals of distinct nationalities. The Child may well be the citizen of TWO nations... but in any regard such a child would likely be influenced by the loyalties of the foreign parent to the foreign ideas common to their parents nationality; ideas which are often HOSTILE TO AMERICAN PRINCIPLE.

Thus the PRESIDENT being the Chief Executive, he is tasked with defending the state via its Charter of Principles and to do so through strict adherence to the Charter of Laws.

An individual with loyalties to Foreign Ideas Hostile to those Principles, will likely alter enforcement of the Laws as a means of escaping the responsibilities intrinsic in the principles.

The Standard, set now ell over two centuries hence, reads like PROPHECY... as the failure to adhere to that standard has subjected the United States to PRECISELY what the Standard was designed to prevent.

Now... that standard... was intended to prevent the British and French and their degenerate ideas from infiltrating the US Government.

And in a delicious irony... we have in the above cited would-be 'contributor', a Mouthy British subject, coming to deflect, conflate, obscure and take whatever measures are necessary to separate you, the Reader, from the Principles set under that standard, so as to prevent you from recognizing that it was designed to prevent people like IT, from getting anywhere NEAR the office of the Presidency of the United States.

Again... to Recap: "Natural Born Citizen" is NOT a phrase of law... it does not speak to "THE LAW", it does not count UPON the law, because it stands ABOVE THE LAW... as it sits entirely in NATURE.. and specifically:

THE NATURE of CITIZENSHIP.

Two Citizens join to produce a child... the NATURAL consequence of of that child being BORN... is A CITIZEN.​

And being the conservative hypocrite you are, you'll carelessly toss all of that aside to vote for a candidate you believe does not have the Constitutional authority to head the Executive branch.

Yep, folks, conservatives like this gay_keys loser have no convictions. They stand for nothing other than ideology over country.

Their standards don't actually apply to them. Even their 'precedent' argument is meaningless drivel. As the first president born in the US with only 1 US parent......wasn't Barack Obama.

It was Chester Authur in 1881. Who was born in the US to an American mother and an Irish-Canadian father. Even by their own logic, Obama is eligible. But they ignore their own reasoning, history, reason, the founders, English common law, the Supreme Court, US law, everything......

.......and just make up whatever they like. This they call 'objective'. I call it adorable.

You still haven't proved he wasn't born in Kenya.

Well none of us have to prove Barack Obama was 'not born in Kenya' - after all he has been elected twice- and is still our President.

But if you want 'proof'- just look at the Department of Health of Hawaii's website- its right there.

 

[Syriusly]

I just want to point out that Birthers can find no example of Americans believing this crap in the 100 years prior to Obama running for election.

And I just want to point out that no one has accepted the appeal to popularity as valid argument for some 3000 years. But that's only because science proved WAY BACK THEN... that such is a fatally flawed, thus unsound logical construct... thus such is unworthy of consideration by reasonable people.

Now is there anyway that we can demonstrate this?

Hmm...

Ok.... Let's try this:

You say that for over a century, 'just being BORN in the USA to at least one US Citizen is plenty to be a "Natural Born Citizen".

So fine... we let of Chester take his seat on the bench, because 'its just the Vice Presidency... and BANG! four months later he's the President... .

Fast forward 120ish years and a poor black child of dubious birth origins, is born to a communist bitch US Citizen, sired by a communist Kenyan. His party says he was born in the only state in the US which legally provided Birth Certs to foreign born children during that time... and what the hell... he's in.

While Chester muddled through his time without any major damage... and while some douche no one has ever heard of was VP to some President of no consequence, despite also being the child of a foreign National parent... the THIRD TIME was the evil charm.

In the nidst of the the carnage from the catastrophic failure of socialist economic policy... and as the US is at war with a fair percentage of Islam engaged in an international manhunt for Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Ladin... Come to the stage... the PROOF CERTAIN that God has a WICKED SENSE OF HUMOR... a Brown Clown by the name of Barak Hussein Obama.

A man who pledged to "Fundamentally Change" the US Constitution... who has stepped around the Constitution, rejected the Charter of Principles... added more debt to the US Federal Budget than every President who came before him, who has implemented foreign policy that has directly resulted in the reversal of US influence in the Middle East, empowered the enemies of the US and the latest information is that he founded, funded, armed and trained "AL QAEDA on STEROIDS", OKA: ISIS and has done everything in his power, without getting arrested and charged with treason... to promote the interests, lending aid and comfort at every point possible.

The damage that this creature has done to the United States as a direct consequence of his disdain for American principle is INCALCULABLE.

The ONLY reason that he was able to do that... is because some idiots in the 1880s wanted to put Chester Author's fat ass up as Vice President... and to do that they made the same specious argument that these idiots are making.

And as was inevitable... nefarious forces used that idiocy to sit the Brown Clown and severely, if not fatally injure the United States.

More of Keys pulling crap out of his ass and calling it gold.