1/3rd of Women in US Military Raped, 90 Percent Reported Sexual Harassment

[CMike]

Trying to divert from your stupidity isn't going to work.

 

[bodecea]

Trying to divert from your stupidity isn't going to work.

So....hiding behind strong women is pretty much what you've done your whole life?

 

[Navy1960]

The report Aside, here are some real numbers,

In 2004 the US Military had a total of had a total of 2374 REPORTED cases of secual assault Commanders took punititve action against 274 offenders in completed investigations , 79 Court Martials, 91 Non-Judicial punishments, 104 adverse actions and discharges. As of Sept. 30th 2004 there were 212,000 active duty women in the military, so the number is hardly 30% but it is still a problem and those that do this sort of nonsense HAVE NO PLACE in the US Military. I can think of not one single person that I know of that would have put up with anything remotly close to this once it came to light. The key is to provide the mechanisms in which those within the military can report this, and believe it or not the military has come a long way in that area and is still going in a postitive direction the report from the OP's article not withstanding. Anyone who suggests that the atmosphere within the military would condone this sort of nonsense does not understand that this behavior runs contrary to good unit cohesion and discipline which is vital in combat and the carrying out of the missions tasked to the military.

http://www.sapr.mil/contents/references/2005 RTC Sexual Assaults.pdf

As for those who would suggest that women have no place in the military , I might suggest that at least from the aviation standpoint that argument does not hold, because at this very moment, you have women that are currently flying tanker missions, airlift missions, and yes Close Air Support missions in several different aircraft types from C-17's to F-18's and they are doing so with honor, and their accomplishments reflect the highest tradtions of service as they do for all the people that are currently doing the hard work of defending this nation.

Great job on affirming the honorable service given by females and while I understand the desire to resist seeing our military being guilty of endless sexual crimes it is an ugly reality. The specific numbers are not the centerpiece. What is at stake is acknowledging the assaults happen way way way way too damn much.

Curve, I DO NOT CONDONE any actions from these dishonorable individuals and they more than deserve their fate as they not only cause harm to these young women they also bring dishonor to the service and themselves. However, one of the things I wanted people to understand is that the mechanisms are in place for these types of crimes and make no mistake they are crimes to be reported within the military command structure. While its not a perfect one it is getting better with each passing generation and I can tell you at least from personal experience the Navy changed quite a bit in regards to how it responds to those sorts of things from when I first entered OCS till the day I retired. The key IMHO is the ability to be able to report these things and to do so without fear from ones peers that they will face reprisal or become an outcast. The other thing that needs to be addressed here is the mechanisms for those reports and not to automatically condemn the sailor or soldier who is accused until such time as it can be confirmed by command authority. If just one of these assaults happen thats one too many and can tell you that everyone that I had the honor of serving with would tell you the same thing and those that do these vile acts are people I would happily see out of the service personally.

On the debate on women in the service, I can only say that their service is no less vital to this nation than any other and should be respected and honored like any other. I can only say from personal experience that my view of a person had zero to do with who and want that person was, but were they capable, did they do the job, and did they conduct themselves in a manner befitting of the uniform. I know that if my own daughter were to come to me and express a desire to enter the Navy Academy , no father would be more pourd than I, even though I am now, regardless of her artistic ambitions. I have told her all her life that no one, other than herself can ever keep her from reaching her goals in life should she apply herself and want them bad enough. I for one am proud that my daughter has more opportunities in life to excel and do what her heart desires and even follow this old mans path if she so chooses. Her capability as well as other should be measured on the ability to do the job not by who they are.

Thats about all the two cents I have to add to this, other than to say that the Military while not the villian some would wish to make of course needs to do better in this regard and in my opinion is doing just that.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

http://www.wnd.com

 

[Kalam]

309 confirmed kills.

Lyudmila Pavlichenko | World War II Database

 

[CurveLight]

In other words, if posters question nonsense from left wing blogs that don't back anything up, you might as well just continue making shit up, because no one will believe it anyway.

And in your mind why bother having credible sources to back your shit up, that would mean that you would be posting the truth.

You didn't answer my question. If women weren't in combat, who would you be able to hide behind?

You see moron I wanted to show the difference between adequately backing up what you say and just spewing bullshit you know nothing about like you do.

I doubt you will get it though.

Did you cite WND as a source?

 

[CurveLight]

Timeline of women in ancient warfare

 

[CMike]

You didn't answer my question. If women weren't in combat, who would you be able to hide behind?

You see moron I wanted to show the difference between adequately backing up what you say and just spewing bullshit you know nothing about like you do.

I doubt you will get it though.

So, who will you hide behind if there aren't women out there serving their country on the front lines against terrorism and other bad guys?

Sorry I don't understand idiot. Women are not in the in front lines in combat in the US.

 

[CMike]

309 confirmed kills.

Lyudmila Pavlichenko | World War II Database

That's kind of funny.

Your Koran promotes wife beating. What happens if the wife can kill you after you try and beat her?

 

[CMike]

You didn't answer my question. If women weren't in combat, who would you be able to hide behind?

You see moron I wanted to show the difference between adequately backing up what you say and just spewing bullshit you know nothing about like you do.

I doubt you will get it though.

Did you cite WND as a source?

You must have missed it.

Why Israel Doesn't Send Women Into Combat

Before 1948 the Jewish community in Palestine fought the British togain our independence. In that struggle, women played an important and activepart. Women served in the Palmach, an underground paramilitary force. Women went on undercover missions, and often smuggled weapons because British soldiers were more hesitant to search women than men.

Women often were usedfor carrying messages and for surveillance work. In fact it was the practice o fPalmach to send a young man and woman together to do surveillance work. If caught, they could always play the role of loving couple.

Thus, women did play a role in the underground before the establishment of the state. Even then, when Palmach undertook a larger military operation, for example, a retaliatory raidagainst some Arab village, the women would be left behind.

It was only when isolated settlements were attacked by Arab ir-regulars, and later by invading Arab armies, that women fought shoulder toshoulder with the men. This was a matter of home defense. When a remote kibbutz of 100 or 200 people was attacked by a regular force, it was adesperate situation that required everyone to fight.

Even so, the number of women who actually handled rifles or threw hand grenades was very small. I am unaware of a single Israeli woman who has claimed, "I was in combat in1948.1 handled a rifle. I threw a hand grenade. I fired a machine gun." Theremay have been a few such women, but for the most part they existed only in the Arab imagination.

More typically, women were kept very busy looking after the essential needs of combat, such as nursing, preparing and bringingup supplies, communications, and looking after the children; after all, these were civilian settlements under attack.

Basic Training for Women

The first thing the IDF did after it was established on 26 May 1948 was to exclude all women from combat. While women do serve in, and in factare drafted into, the IDF, their role is to provide essential auxiliary services in order to free men for combat.

Furthermore, the IDF does not have mixed units on the American model; rather, women form part of a separate Women's Corps, known as CHEN.

Originally CHEN was an acronym meaning Women's Corps; it also happens to mean "grace" in Hebrew.

For administrative and disciplinary purposes, women are subject toother women. Far from treating men and women draftees equally, the IDF has whole volumes detailing exactly what may or may not be done to or with women soldiers to prevent them from being harassed or otherwise maltreated.

...Duties of Female Soldiers

Apart from their work in the Women's Corps (that is, training andsupervising other women), women in the IDF serve successfully in manyv aried and essential fields, including nursing, social work, clerical activities,psychological testing, intelligence, communications, and radar. Althoughthere are no women pilots, the IDF does employ women as instructors in somecombat-related activities, such as driving tanks and heavy self-propelledartillery pieces. This policy was first instituted during the late 1970s againsta background of breakneck expansion and sharp manpower shortages.





[I]Martin van Creveld is a professor of history at Hebrew University in Jerusalem. Hereceived his Ph.D. from the London School of Economics and has been a Fellow of WarStudies at Kings College, Cambridge. During the I99Ì-92 school year, he taught at theUS Marine Corps Command and Staff College in Quantico, Virginia. He is the author ofFighting Power: German unci U.S. Performance, 1939-1945; Technology and War;Command in War; Supplying War; The Training of Officers: From Military Profes-sionalism to Irrelevance; and, most recently, The Transformation of War. The present article, appearing originally in the Fall 1992 issue oí Policy Review (pp. 65-67), was adapted from testimony Professor Van Creveld gave last summer before the Presidential Commission on the Assignment of Women in the Armed Forces in Washington, D.C.[/I]

 

[CMike]

You didn't answer my question. If women weren't in combat, who would you be able to hide behind?

You see moron I wanted to show the difference between adequately backing up what you say and just spewing bullshit you know nothing about like you do.

I doubt you will get it though.

Did you cite WND as a source?

It's called internal documentation.

Women in Combat: Why Rush to Judgment?

Israel

The only reliable record of women in combat is provided by Israel, a nation whose policy is widely misunderstood. The popular conception is that Israeli women fight alongside men as equals. The truth is that although Israel drafts both women and men for military service, Israel has excluded women from combat units since 1950.

To be sure, female soldiers fought alongside male colleagues in Israel's War of Liberation, which ended in 1948. Because of the problems that this created, Israeli women never again were sent into battle. Explains military historian Edward N. Luttwak of the Washington, D.C.-based Center for Strategic and International Studies, who has written a book about the Israeli military: "Men moved to protect the women members of the unit instead of carrying out the mission of the unit." (Telephone interview, June 10, 1991.) Luttwak adds that women are integrated into the Israeli military at many levels, and conduct most of the training. Women also serve in the Mossad, Israel's elite counter-terrorist force. But women are excluded, Luttwak notes, from infantry and other combat positions based on "the pragmatic experience of 40 years." (Ibid.)

The Israelis also bar women from combat for cultural reasons. After the War of Liberation, Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion said that placing women in combat violated the Jewish concept of womanhood and women's status as mothers. (Interview with senior Israeli military official, June 12, 1991, Washington, D.C.) At a Washington briefing this month, a senior Israeli military official said that even tentative experiments with women serving aboard missile-defense boats had failed miserably. Furthermore, he said, because of its cultural heritage, Israel "is not ready to pay the price of a woman being held hostage, a woman returning crippled." (Ibid.)


In hearings before the Military Personnel Subcommittee of the House Committee on Armed Services in November 1979, Brigadier General Andrew J. Gatsis, USA (retired), testified that Israeli Defense Minister Moshe Dayan told him that during Israel's War of Liberation, "we had a constant fear of what the Arabs would do to our women if they captured them." The men, Dayan told Gatsis, "could not stand the psychological stress" of watching women being killed and captured. Gatsis also said that Dayan "felt that [having women in combat units] knocked down their combat effectiveness." ("Women in the Military," hearings before the Military Personnel Subcommittee of the Committee on Armed Services, House of Representatives, November 13-16, 1979 and February 11, 1980, pp. 281-282.)

 

[CMike]

My conversation with left wing idiots.

Left wing idiot: Look at this link 120% of women get raped in the military

Me: Your link from www.ilovebullshit.com isn't a credible link and doesn't back up anything it says

How about providing a credible source?

Left wing idiot: What's the point? You ain't going to believe it anyway. Like you back up anything you say about women in the Israeli military?

Me: Well actually I did. My sources was testimony before a congressional committee by an Israeli general, a senior Israeli official, an Israeli historian that teaches in a war college, and another Israeli historian who was an Israeli reserviost?

Left wing idiot? What's the matter? Afraid of strong women?

Me: What a moron

Left wing idiot: DUH

 

[CMike]

Well, at this point, with you denying the reliability of other posters' sources...what would be the point in trying to convince you. You've got your ears and eyes closed to reality and facts. It would be like pearls before swine.

In other words, if posters question nonsense from left wing blogs that don't back anything up, you might as well just continue making shit up, because no one will believe it anyway.

And in your mind why bother having credible sources to back your shit up, that would mean that you would be posting the truth.

You didn't answer my question. If women weren't in combat, who would you be able to hide behind?

Why do you think I am hiding?

 

[SFC Ollie]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

 

[Modbert]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

And someone else posted a link that the DoD themselves said that 90% of all rapes go unreported. Thoughts on that?

 

[SFC Ollie]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

And someone else posted a link that the DoD themselves said that 90% of all rapes go unreported. Thoughts on that?

No doubt they go unreported, but any good NCO is still going to hear the scuttlebutt. And if he or she isn't listening then they are sorry asses anyway. I had a Platoon of 75 people, if I remember right there were about 27 females. Even my Lieutenant was a Female. Until she moved to Battalion. And I heard about every guy who was with any of my females. Not because i asked but because i listened and my troops didn't shut up and change the subject when I walked up. Unless it was to hear what I had to say. That is the balance that a good NCO has with his/her troops. They are "one of the guys" yet in total charge. And of course mean as hell when you had to be. I can tell you that if I had heard about any rapes I would have reported them myself.

 

[CurveLight]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

Nobody can prove anything from your experiences you dumbass. Why don't you show your stupidity again and try to pass off acronyms of administrative categories of documents as "Security Clearances."

Were you a PS for the whole 22 years? No. From your posts you don't exactly send the message you are very bright but you do send the message of beng astronomically ignorant and completely fucking obsessed with telling people you were a glorified paper chasing babysitter for 22 years. You're so fucking self centered you try to claim your minuscule experiences somehow compete with all the studies done on this issue. Holy fuck man.

 

[CMike]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

And someone else posted a link that the DoD themselves said that 90% of all rapes go unreported. Thoughts on that?

If they are unreported how do they know they existed?

 

[CMike]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

Nobody can prove anything from your experiences you dumbass. Why don't you show your stupidity again and try to pass off acronyms of administrative categories of documents as "Security Clearances."

Were you a PS for the whole 22 years? No. From your posts you don't exactly send the message you are very bright but you do send the message of beng astronomically ignorant and completely fucking obsessed with telling people you were a glorified paper chasing babysitter for 22 years. You're so fucking self centered you try to claim your minuscule experiences somehow compete with all the studies done on this issue. Holy fuck man.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrllCZw8jiM]YouTube - Stripes - Don't Call Me Francis[/ame]

 

[SFC Ollie]

Going back to the OP, I have to agree with Retiredgysgt. We were the same rank in different branches. As a platoon Sergeant in the Army I would have either been told by the female or heard the rumors and guy talk. As it was in 22 years I knew of one actual rape in another company and had 3 or 4 reports of sexual harassment. I don't know where all these numbers came from but you can't prove them from my experiences.

Nobody can prove anything from your experiences you dumbass. Why don't you show your stupidity again and try to pass off acronyms of administrative categories of documents as "Security Clearances."

Were you a PS for the whole 22 years? No. From your posts you don't exactly send the message you are very bright but you do send the message of beng astronomically ignorant and completely fucking obsessed with telling people you were a glorified paper chasing babysitter for 22 years. You're so fucking self centered you try to claim your minuscule experiences somehow compete with all the studies done on this issue. Holy fuck man.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrllCZw8jiM]YouTube - Stripes - Don't Call Me Francis[/ame]

Oh my God is that stupid fuck curvelight still answering my posts? Fucking dumbass. Is he so stupid that he doesn't understand the only time I see his stupidity is when someone else posts it? I shouldn't have asked that, I know he is.