Yeah, Police Are Such Bad People...

Canon Shooter

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I get sick and fucking tired of listening to people whine about how bad the police are. They'll point to a couple of incidents to "prove" that the problem with bad cops is systemic (it's not).

None of the police naysayers, though, would ever have the balls to post something like this:


This is a fine example of a cop doing good, and then ramping it up a notch to have an undeniably positive impact in his community...
 

SavannahMann

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I love these arguments. When we talk about misconduct, we have to put it in context of every single time the cop interacted with anyone and didn’t do anything.

Why is it we never view any other crime that way? When a man is accused of rape, why is it that we never talk about the thousands, or hundreds of thousands of times he interacted with a woman and did not Commit rape?

When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found? Why is it that false positives are not allowed to be discussed? They would be Germaine in any other test wouldn’t they? If you had a blood test to identify Covid, and it was only right half the time, the test would be considered a failure.

The problem is not that there is misconduct in the police. There is going to be misconduct in anything that humans are involved in. The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses. If we were half as determined to root out the misconduct in the cops as we were to do anything else, we would have a virtually misconduct free police department wouldn’t we?
 

Billyboom

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I get sick and fucking tired of listening to people whine about how bad the police are. They'll point to a couple of incidents to "prove" that the problem with bad cops is systemic (it's not).
If the police would stop executing black people you wouldn't have to hear it.
Truth is, your going to hear it until it ends.
#blacklivesmatter
 
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Canon Shooter

Canon Shooter

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When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.
Your argument fails because it assumes that someone who's done something wrong has always done things wrong...

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?
I won't say it never happens. I will say that I believe the incidence of it is comparatively rare when put against those times it hasn't happened...

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found?
Let's talk about them. Show us just how common a problem that is because, like cops planting drugs, I believe such cases are rare...

The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses.
No, the problem is that the cases of shitty cops is blown waaaay out of proportion. If cops were as bad as the left would have us believe, we'd be hearing about cops murdering people in every city and town in America every single day. But the percentage of those cases, compared to those cases which are 100% legit, is so small as to be statistically nonexistent.

The reason you have people bringing up stories like the one I did is because the rare incidents of cops being bad cops are always blown so fucking out of proportion it's ridiculous. Let me ask you: How many black men were arrested and not killed by white cops in this country on May 25, 2020? Those numbers matter.

Let's look at the lunacy we've seen since Floyd was killed: the Dixie Chicks have changed their name, Houston realtors are going to stop using the phrase "master bedroom", Lady Antebellum changed their name to Lady A (who's actually a 61 year old black jazz singer from Seattle), despite the fact that the word "antebellum" actually has nothing to do with the Civil War. Aunt Jemima wants to change their brand name, despite the family of the original Aunt Jemima being 100% against it. L'oreal is going to stop using the words "whitening" and "lightening" on their products. Monuments and memorials are being torn down. The University of Oregon and Oregon State University for years have had the "Civil War" in football, but have announced they will stop using that moniker.

This has gotten so fucking far out of control that you'd have to be Stevie Fucking Wonder to not see it. They're making being white a bad thing. Well, as a white guy, I have no intention of apologizing for a single fucking thing that I didn't have a hand in, and anyone who thinks I should can go fuck themselves. Racism sucks; let's work on that. But there needs to be a level playing field. Slavery sucked, but that's history and can't be fixed. It's there for us to learn from. The shit that's going on now, if it's not stopped by an effort from all parties, will result in a level of violence this country hasn't seen in decades.

I'm prepared to address the situation to avoid that. I'm also prepared for when the violence starts.

Are you?
 

SavannahMann

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When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.
Your argument fails because it assumes that someone who's done something wrong has always done things wrong...

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?
I won't say it never happens. I will say that I believe the incidence of it is comparatively rare when put against those times it hasn't happened...

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found?
Let's talk about them. Show us just how common a problem that is because, like cops planting drugs, I believe such cases are rare...

The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses.
No, the problem is that the cases of shitty cops is blown waaaay out of proportion. If cops were as bad as the left would have us believe, we'd be hearing about cops murdering people in every city and town in America every single day. But the percentage of those cases, compared to those cases which are 100% legit, is so small as to be statistically nonexistent.

The reason you have people bringing up stories like the one I did is because the rare incidents of cops being bad cops are always blown so fucking out of proportion it's ridiculous. Let me ask you: How many black men were arrested and not killed by white cops in this country on May 25, 2020? Those numbers matter.

Let's look at the lunacy we've seen since Floyd was killed: the Dixie Chicks have changed their name, Houston realtors are going to stop using the phrase "master bedroom", Lady Antebellum changed their name to Lady A (who's actually a 61 year old black jazz singer from Seattle), despite the fact that the word "antebellum" actually has nothing to do with the Civil War. Aunt Jemima wants to change their brand name, despite the family of the original Aunt Jemima being 100% against it. L'oreal is going to stop using the words "whitening" and "lightening" on their products. Monuments and memorials are being torn down. The University of Oregon and Oregon State University for years have had the "Civil War" in football, but have announced they will stop using that moniker.

This has gotten so fucking far out of control that you'd have to be Stevie Fucking Wonder to not see it. They're making being white a bad thing. Well, as a white guy, I have no intention of apologizing for a single fucking thing that I didn't have a hand in, and anyone who thinks I should can go fuck themselves. Racism sucks; let's work on that. But there needs to be a level playing field. Slavery sucked, but that's history and can't be fixed. It's there for us to learn from. The shit that's going on now, if it's not stopped by an effort from all parties, will result in a level of violence this country hasn't seen in decades.

I'm prepared to address the situation to avoid that. I'm also prepared for when the violence starts.

Are you?
How widespread is the problem? In 44 states not including California there were 85,000 investigations for misconduct.


That is one in ten cops in the nation. And it does not include the state with the largest number of cops. If we included the last six should they ever open their records we would see what? One in five or six? That would be about right since a poll of judges and lawyers found they believe the cops lie in one case out of five.

The study referenced above in another page showed that bad cops who were transferred tended to cause the good cops to start acting bad. Instead of straightening out the bad cop the bad cop infected many more with their misconduct.

But think about it for a minute. If it was just one in ten the bad cops would be terrified of doing anything wrong wouldn’t they? I mean they would know their fellow cops would rat them out right? But they do it anyway. They do it expecting to get away with it. And they are getting away with it. So where are these good cops?
 
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Canon Shooter

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How widespread is the problem? In 44 states not including California there were 85,000 investigations for misconduct.
How many of those involved cases involved interactions of white cops with unarmed black men? That's the number that matters here. "Misconduct" is a pretty big umbrella. It can actually be something as simple as a cop not filing a required report. That doesn't exactly make him a cop who's prone to killing unarmed black men...
 

Agit8r

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Wouldn't be something you'd have to hear about if they didn't exist
Untitled drawing - 2020-06-27T232416.493.png
 

SavannahMann

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How widespread is the problem? In 44 states not including California there were 85,000 investigations for misconduct.
How many of those involved cases involved interactions of white cops with unarmed black men? That's the number that matters here. "Misconduct" is a pretty big umbrella. It can actually be something as simple as a cop not filing a required report. That doesn't exactly make him a cop who's prone to killing unarmed black men...
I love this. Now you get to decide what Misconduct matters. Let me help you understand.

Imagine that everyday you crumple up a piece of paper and throw it in a pile next to a house. One piece of paper. Mostly little note paper. Not even full sheets. In time those little papers add up. Then a spark and it becomes a raging fire. Blaming the last piece of paper or the spark is stupid when you had all the other things piled up waiting for that spark.

Those little things are lying on reports and under oath. Stopping people with no cause. Planting drugs. Stealing. All sorts of little things. But in RL the papers talk. They are seen. Then eventually they burst into flame.

Remember the old saying. The straw that broke the camels back. A single piece of straw weighs nothing. But added to the extreme weight already on the camel it was too much.

That is what is happening. Harassment and daily examples of those little things add up. The papers or weight on the camel. Then a final straw. Everyone who is pro cop no matter what runs around screaming the straw is imperfect. And they are right. It is. But they are also wrong as you are. Those little things add up.

Imaging you are a boss of a business. You have an employee who is always two minutes late and always leaves five minutes early. Finally you fire him for showing up two minutes late. He screamed that you fired him for being two lousy minutes late. It is posted online and everyone says you are a real martinet and a controlling ass for firing the guy.

It was not two lousy minutes. It was two minutes every single day. In that context your actions are justified. In the same context of daily harassment and “little things” the anger, if not the riots, is justified.

I have a theory. It is never one thing. It is never one thing that causes an accident. It is never one thing that causes a failure. It is always many things. It is not one thing that causes riots. It is many things. The last thing while imperfect is merely the last straw.

This is where the DOJ investigations into the Police were good. In Ferguson it showed the Mike Brown shooting as justified. It also showed the Ferguson PD was regularly violating the constitution and the civil rights of the people. Those were the straws that built up until one last straw broke the camels back. The cops were breaking the law regularly. None of the cop supporters ever admit that. They just chant that Mike Brown died from his own actions. So we end up in a cycle of repeating cause and effect. The straws build up and eventually one breaks the camel again. And we start all over again adding straws to a new camel.

At some point we need to break the cycle.
 

Agit8r

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Wouldn't be something you'd have to hear about if they didn't exist
View attachment 356597
Agreed.

But we need to keep the number of occurrences in perspective.

Most cops are good cops...
Not in my experience.
And what is that experience?
I worked for a cleaning contractor during the 2000s that had the account with the Spokane County courthouse complex. I cleaned at various time the Police and Sheriff squad rooms and locker rooms, Jail offices and medical ward, and later trained people in those areas. I witnessed a number of unsettling behaviors from the police and sheriff personell in those areas.

One particular incident that sticks out was when I trained a lay pastor in the jail complex, who happened to be a black man. Day one of training him, we went into the intake area to get keys from the sargeant. As we were headed to the secure door out of intake, someone stopped my trainee and asked him "Where do you think you're going?!"

I hoped it was just an isolated incident, but in fact it was not. We eventually had to reassign him to a different building because they wouldn't open doors for him.

The first day he was on his own in the building, I got a call from my supervisor, to go and scort him out because they knew me, becaue apparently he couldn't clean, and couldn't get back out of the secured area. It must have been terrifying for him. I'm just glad he had a celular phone. F~ck only knows what would have happpened, otherwise.

Another time we had a partly disabled Ukrainian fellew with a lazy eye cleaning the men's shower and locker area. He had to be reassigned because the police staff couldn't tell which way he was looking, and it threatened their fragile masculinity.

The SWAT team people always appeared to be on drugs (my guess was anabolic steroids).

While doing MRSA decontaminations in the lockup portion of the jail, I noticed that blacks were kept almost exclusively on the sixth floor, where the mental health cases were kept.
 

LuckyDuck

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I love these arguments. When we talk about misconduct, we have to put it in context of every single time the cop interacted with anyone and didn’t do anything.

Why is it we never view any other crime that way? When a man is accused of rape, why is it that we never talk about the thousands, or hundreds of thousands of times he interacted with a woman and did not Commit rape?

When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found? Why is it that false positives are not allowed to be discussed? They would be Germaine in any other test wouldn’t they? If you had a blood test to identify Covid, and it was only right half the time, the test would be considered a failure.

The problem is not that there is misconduct in the police. There is going to be misconduct in anything that humans are involved in. The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses. If we were half as determined to root out the misconduct in the cops as we were to do anything else, we would have a virtually misconduct free police department wouldn’t we?
Clearly a person that is upset over getting pulled over and ILLEGAL drugs were found in the car. I would venture to guess that the dogs don't indicate drugs on the cop, because the cop isn't a DRUGGIE CRIMINAL. If it bothers you that they pull you over for having ILLEGAL DRUGS in your car.......DON'T HAVE ILLEGAL DRUGS IN THE CAR.....DON'T COMMIT CRIMES!
As for the bad cops, they amount to only about 2% of the entire cop population.
Now, that same cop in the picture with the black family, they are highly likely to be a NON-CRIMINAL FAMILY. When he's not there, he could just as easily be trying to arrest a person for a crime he/she has committed......say.....illegal drug selling, illegal drug buying, burglary, home-invasion, robbery of a store or bank, mugging, domestic abuse, et cetera, et cetera. And those people, the vast majority of them, are arrested and brought into the station and processed....but....others....RESIST ARREST. Those are the ones that escalate things to dangerous levels.
 

SavannahMann

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I love these arguments. When we talk about misconduct, we have to put it in context of every single time the cop interacted with anyone and didn’t do anything.

Why is it we never view any other crime that way? When a man is accused of rape, why is it that we never talk about the thousands, or hundreds of thousands of times he interacted with a woman and did not Commit rape?

When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found? Why is it that false positives are not allowed to be discussed? They would be Germaine in any other test wouldn’t they? If you had a blood test to identify Covid, and it was only right half the time, the test would be considered a failure.

The problem is not that there is misconduct in the police. There is going to be misconduct in anything that humans are involved in. The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses. If we were half as determined to root out the misconduct in the cops as we were to do anything else, we would have a virtually misconduct free police department wouldn’t we?
Clearly a person that is upset over getting pulled over and ILLEGAL drugs were found in the car. I would venture to guess that the dogs don't indicate drugs on the cop, because the cop isn't a DRUGGIE CRIMINAL. If it bothers you that they pull you over for having ILLEGAL DRUGS in your car.......DON'T HAVE ILLEGAL DRUGS IN THE CAR.....DON'T COMMIT CRIMES!
As for the bad cops, they amount to only about 2% of the entire cop population.
Now, that same cop in the picture with the black family, they are highly likely to be a NON-CRIMINAL FAMILY. When he's not there, he could just as easily be trying to arrest a person for a crime he/she has committed......say.....illegal drug selling, illegal drug buying, burglary, home-invasion, robbery of a store or bank, mugging, domestic abuse, et cetera, et cetera. And those people, the vast majority of them, are arrested and brought into the station and processed....but....others....RESIST ARREST. Those are the ones that escalate things to dangerous levels.
Wow that is a lot of guesses, and since you got every single one of them wrong, I can only assume you’re the lead Detective of your local Police Department. Idiot.
 
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Canon Shooter

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Wouldn't be something you'd have to hear about if they didn't exist
View attachment 356597
Agreed.

But we need to keep the number of occurrences in perspective.

Most cops are good cops...
Not in my experience.
And what is that experience?
I worked for a cleaning contractor during the 2000s that had the account with the Spokane County courthouse complex. I cleaned at various time the Police and Sheriff squad rooms and locker rooms, Jail offices and medical ward, and later trained people in those areas. I witnessed a number of unsettling behaviors from the police and sheriff personell in those areas.

One particular incident that sticks out was when I trained a lay pastor in the jail complex, who happened to be a black man. Day one of training him, we went into the intake area to get keys from the sargeant. As we were headed to the secure door out of intake, someone stopped my trainee and asked him "Where do you think you're going?!"

I hoped it was just an isolated incident, but in fact it was not. We eventually had to reassign him to a different building because they wouldn't open doors for him.

The first day he was on his own in the building, I got a call from my supervisor, to go and scort him out because they knew me, becaue apparently he couldn't clean, and couldn't get back out of the secured area. It must have been terrifying for him. I'm just glad he had a celular phone. F~ck only knows what would have happpened, otherwise.

Another time we had a partly disabled Ukrainian fellew with a lazy eye cleaning the men's shower and locker area. He had to be reassigned because the police staff couldn't tell which way he was looking, and it threatened their fragile masculinity.

The SWAT team people always appeared to be on drugs (my guess was anabolic steroids).

While doing MRSA decontaminations in the lockup portion of the jail, I noticed that blacks were kept almost exclusively on the sixth floor, where the mental health cases were kept.
So you base your opinion that most cops are bad on those few anecdotal instances?

How stupid...
 

Agit8r

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Wouldn't be something you'd have to hear about if they didn't exist
View attachment 356597
Agreed.

But we need to keep the number of occurrences in perspective.

Most cops are good cops...
Not in my experience.
And what is that experience?
I worked for a cleaning contractor during the 2000s that had the account with the Spokane County courthouse complex. I cleaned at various time the Police and Sheriff squad rooms and locker rooms, Jail offices and medical ward, and later trained people in those areas. I witnessed a number of unsettling behaviors from the police and sheriff personell in those areas.

One particular incident that sticks out was when I trained a lay pastor in the jail complex, who happened to be a black man. Day one of training him, we went into the intake area to get keys from the sargeant. As we were headed to the secure door out of intake, someone stopped my trainee and asked him "Where do you think you're going?!"

I hoped it was just an isolated incident, but in fact it was not. We eventually had to reassign him to a different building because they wouldn't open doors for him.

The first day he was on his own in the building, I got a call from my supervisor, to go and scort him out because they knew me, becaue apparently he couldn't clean, and couldn't get back out of the secured area. It must have been terrifying for him. I'm just glad he had a celular phone. F~ck only knows what would have happpened, otherwise.

Another time we had a partly disabled Ukrainian fellew with a lazy eye cleaning the men's shower and locker area. He had to be reassigned because the police staff couldn't tell which way he was looking, and it threatened their fragile masculinity.

The SWAT team people always appeared to be on drugs (my guess was anabolic steroids).

While doing MRSA decontaminations in the lockup portion of the jail, I noticed that blacks were kept almost exclusively on the sixth floor, where the mental health cases were kept.
So you base your opinion that most cops are bad on those few anecdotal instances?

How stupid...
I gave you the "highlights." I worked there for 4 years. I saw enough that all the cop criticisms i hear fit the pattern of behavior that I observed.
 

Agit8r

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Another serial killer like Chauvin, abusing his uniform in order to get his sick kicks. Another example of how absolute power--the legal ability to take a life--corrupts absolutely:

 

progressive hunter

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I get sick and fucking tired of listening to people whine about how bad the police are. They'll point to a couple of incidents to "prove" that the problem with bad cops is systemic (it's not).
If the police would stop executing black people you wouldn't have to hear it.
Truth is, your going to hear it until it ends.
#blacklivesmatter
 

hadit

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I love these arguments. When we talk about misconduct, we have to put it in context of every single time the cop interacted with anyone and didn’t do anything.

Why is it we never view any other crime that way? When a man is accused of rape, why is it that we never talk about the thousands, or hundreds of thousands of times he interacted with a woman and did not Commit rape?

When we are talking about a Murderer, why is it we never talk about the millions of times he did not commit murder? But when a cop comes into the question, all of a sudden his years of not getting caught matter. In this case, it’s all the other cops who did something good, for a change.

Help me out here. I really want to understand this. When cops call the drug dogs to the side of the road, why does the dog never key on the cops with drugs in their pockets that they later plant in the car? We’ve seen enough of that on Video to know it happens, but for some reason the dog never keys on the cop. Why?

Why are we never allowed to know the number of times the dog keys and nothing is found? Why is it that false positives are not allowed to be discussed? They would be Germaine in any other test wouldn’t they? If you had a blood test to identify Covid, and it was only right half the time, the test would be considered a failure.

The problem is not that there is misconduct in the police. There is going to be misconduct in anything that humans are involved in. The problem is that we minimize the misconduct of the police, and make excuses. If we were half as determined to root out the misconduct in the cops as we were to do anything else, we would have a virtually misconduct free police department wouldn’t we?
Clearly a person that is upset over getting pulled over and ILLEGAL drugs were found in the car. I would venture to guess that the dogs don't indicate drugs on the cop, because the cop isn't a DRUGGIE CRIMINAL. If it bothers you that they pull you over for having ILLEGAL DRUGS in your car.......DON'T HAVE ILLEGAL DRUGS IN THE CAR.....DON'T COMMIT CRIMES!
As for the bad cops, they amount to only about 2% of the entire cop population.
Now, that same cop in the picture with the black family, they are highly likely to be a NON-CRIMINAL FAMILY. When he's not there, he could just as easily be trying to arrest a person for a crime he/she has committed......say.....illegal drug selling, illegal drug buying, burglary, home-invasion, robbery of a store or bank, mugging, domestic abuse, et cetera, et cetera. And those people, the vast majority of them, are arrested and brought into the station and processed....but....others....RESIST ARREST. Those are the ones that escalate things to dangerous levels.
Note as well that the dog never alerts on an individual, even if he had had just ingested the drugs or was exposed to them in the car and would be bearing their scent. One of the reasons for this is the dog is trained to check the car, not the suspect. He doesn't have to check the suspect, because he's been searched.
 

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