Why should a hamburger flipper make the same as a highly skilled worker???

[Ame®icano]

The workers are the one busting their ass...Why the hell should all the riches go to people at the top?

Here's how this is going to work out: far less workers and far more robots.

Unskilled work that can be replaced by machines is going the way of the Dodo. Demanding more "riches" for it will only hasten the decline.

Want $15 an hour? Meet your replacement.

Woo. I recently had my windshield replaced by a lone tech at my location. He had with him a robotic arm which lifted and held the glass in place while he installed it. No helper, no shop, no office personnel. Just a phone, a warehouse, a small truck and his pet robot.

I work in automation industry... I got plenty of videos of my work, but I am under confidentiality agreements. Some pretty cool stuff.

Here are few links to something similar.

Wanna sort your pills or m&m's? Sort snacks?

 

[SAYIT]

Certainly before I would eat something prepared by a whiny sniveling socialist. The robot will never spit (or worse) in my food.

Why do I get the feeling people spit in your food frequently?

I'm certain neither of us knows how the kitchen is preparing our food but I'd trust the robot before I would trust you.

 

[JoeB131]

I'm not talking about wealthy people at all. I'm wondering if you think the guy cleaning windshields down at the corner (or mowing lawns, or cleaning houses, or any of the other jobs people do as low income, independent business people) should be allowed to work if he's not making minimum wage.

They're doing those things because they can't get a good job. And since almost all that money is under the table, most of those folks are probably collecting welfare. So essentially, you are probably paying for Squeegee man if you use him or not.

I'm just trying to figure out how minimum wage laws make any sense to you people. They're built on a couple of really dumb assumptions. First, the notion that banning low wages jobs will simply convert them into high wage jobs. It won't. If people don't value a job very much, laws aren't going to change that. Second, the idea that the damage done by minimum wage hikes will only burden business owners. Neither of these assumptions holds up to scrutiny, and without them, minimum wage is a bad joke.

Actually, we had our greatest prosperity when the minimum wage laws had teeth.

The real problem is that we've had a shifting from the working class to the investor class of the wealth.

I go back to my post at the beginning of page 35. We have AIRLINE PILOTS making barely minimum wage. We have PROFESSORS making barely minimum wage. That's fucking insane.

The foundation of a modern democracy is a well-compensated working class that can buy things.
30 years ago, a guy like Obama NEVER could have gotten elected. Today he does. That's how bad it's gotten for working class folks.

 

[Manonthestreet]

and they dont spit in your food either....or pick it off the floor and so on

 

[JoeB131]

I'm certain neither of us knows how the kitchen is preparing our food but I'd trust the robot before I would trust you.

I'm an awesome cook. And that's the one thing a machine will never be. Just like machines can't be artists or writers.

 

[Ame®icano]

I'm certain neither of us knows how the kitchen is preparing our food but I'd trust the robot before I would trust you.

I'm an awesome cook. And that's the one thing a machine will never be. Just like machines can't be artists or writers.

Newsflash: Fast food restaurant doesn't need cook. Need this:

 

[SAYIT]

I work in automation industry... I got plenty of videos of my work, but I am under confidentiality agreements. Some pretty cool stuff.
Here are few links to something similar.
Wanna sort your pills or m&m's? Sort snacks?

Looks like interesting work. I bet you are paid more than MW.
The last biz I built operated private ATMs ... essentially money dispensing robots.
I sold out to my partner when I retired. He'll be paying me for a decade.

 

[dblack]

I'm not talking about wealthy people at all. I'm wondering if you think the guy cleaning windshields down at the corner (or mowing lawns, or cleaning houses, or any of the other jobs people do as low income, independent business people) should be allowed to work if he's not making minimum wage.

They're doing those things because they can't get a good job. And since almost all that money is under the table, most of those folks are probably collecting welfare. So essentially, you are probably paying for Squeegee man if you use him or not.

That doesn't answer the question. I'm trying to get you to recognize that all minimum wage laws do is ban low wage jobs. Those that continue to do those jobs will be pushed into an underclass that can no longer rely on legal protection and has to look over their shoulder for the authorities whenever they do work - more or less like illegal immigrants do now.

I'm just trying to figure out how minimum wage laws make any sense to you people. They're built on a couple of really dumb assumptions. First, the notion that banning low wages jobs will simply convert them into high wage jobs. It won't. If people don't value a job very much, laws aren't going to change that. Second, the idea that the damage done by minimum wage hikes will only burden business owners. Neither of these assumptions holds up to scrutiny, and without them, minimum wage is a bad joke.

Actually, we had our greatest prosperity when the minimum wage laws had teeth.

The real problem is that we've had a shifting from the working class to the investor class of the wealth.

I go back to my post at the beginning of page 35. We have AIRLINE PILOTS making barely minimum wage. We have PROFESSORS making barely minimum wage. That's fucking insane.

The foundation of a modern democracy is a well-compensated working class that can buy things.
30 years ago, a guy like Obama NEVER could have gotten elected. Today he does. That's how bad it's gotten for working class folks.

Yes. I've heard the rhetoric. But none of it addresses the delusional assumptions I pointed out.

 

[SAYIT]

I'm certain neither of us knows how the kitchen is preparing our food but I'd trust the robot before I would trust you.

I'm an awesome cook...

I don't believe McDs requires "awesome" cooks ... just dependable people who take some pride in their work.

And that's the one thing a machine will never be. Just like machines can't be artists or writers.

Or whiny sniveling socialists.

 

[Ame®icano]

I work in automation industry... I got plenty of videos of my work, but I am under confidentiality agreements. Some pretty cool stuff.
Here are few links to something similar.
Wanna sort your pills or m&m's? Sort snacks?

Looks like interesting work. I bet you are paid more than MW.
The last biz I built operated private ATMs ... essentially money dispensing robots.
I sold out to my partner when I retired. He'll be paying me for a decade.

Yeah, I work in all industries that need automation. Pay is equivalent to my expertise.
But my biggest pleasure is introducing this kind of work to kids, volunteer work.

 

[Ame®icano]

I'm not talking about wealthy people at all. I'm wondering if you think the guy cleaning windshields down at the corner (or mowing lawns, or cleaning houses, or any of the other jobs people do as low income, independent business people) should be allowed to work if he's not making minimum wage.

I'm just trying to figure out how minimum wage laws make any sense to you people. They're built on a couple of really dumb assumptions. First, the notion that banning low wages jobs will simply convert them into high wage jobs. It won't. If people don't value a job very much, laws aren't going to change that. Second, the idea that the damage done by minimum wage hikes will only burden business owners. Neither of these assumptions holds up to scrutiny, and without them, minimum wage is a bad joke.

If this pressure on MW continue, I'm thinking that MW will be eliminated for good and replaced with contract work. Just like you mentioned window cleaners and lawn movers, you pay them to finish the job, and you don't care how much time they spend doing it.

 

[SAYIT]

Actually, we had our greatest prosperity when the minimum wage laws had teeth...

Minimum wage earners do not drive the economy and the demand for labor is driving wages higher without gov't meddling. 10 major national chains in a variety of industries are raising wages ... all others will follow or lose their best MW workers. We do not need a federally mandated MW.
Walmart
Target
Starbucks
Ikea
TJX
Gap
Costco
In-N-Out Burger
Shake Shake
Ben & Jerry's
Whole Foods

 

[Ame®icano]

Shaken, not stirred, please.

 

[JoeB131]

That doesn't answer the question. I'm trying to get you to recognize that all minimum wage laws do is ban low wage jobs. Those that continue to do those jobs will be pushed into an underclass that can no longer rely on legal protection and has to look over their shoulder for the authorities whenever they do work - more or less like illegal immigrants do now.

No, it doesn't. this is bullshit. Hey, I remember when Clinton got unemployment down to 3% and McDonald's was paying well above minimum wage just to get warm bodies behind the counter. the concept that we can't mandate fair wages is a fallacy. Of course we can.

I don't believe McDs requires "awesome" cooks ... just dependable people who take some pride in their work.

Hard to take "pride" in your work when you are paid so little, you have to apply for food stamps and Medicaid.

 

[SAYIT]

Yeah, I work in all industries that need automation. Pay is equivalent to my expertise..

As it should be. Apparently the whole productivity/reward concept is distasteful to socialists.

[
But my biggest pleasure is introducing this kind of work to kids, volunteer work.

I have much more time for that now. Twice a week I teach 8th graders how to separate the Internet wheat from the chafe. A course I designed and volunteer to teach.

 

[dblack]

That doesn't answer the question. I'm trying to get you to recognize that all minimum wage laws do is ban low wage jobs. Those that continue to do those jobs will be pushed into an underclass that can no longer rely on legal protection and has to look over their shoulder for the authorities whenever they do work - more or less like illegal immigrants do now.

No, it doesn't. this is bullshit. Hey, I remember when Clinton got unemployment down to 3% and McDonald's was paying well above minimum wage just to get warm bodies behind the counter. the concept that we can't mandate fair wages is a fallacy. Of course we can.

I'm not at all sure what your point is here.

 

[SAYIT]

...the concept that we can't mandate fair wages is a fallacy. Of course we can...

Let's dip you nose in some of the BS you posted in post #367 when you were arguing just the opposite:
"Honestly, because there's always someone who is willing to work for less."

 

[Ame®icano]

As it should be. Apparently the whole productivity/reward concept is distasteful to socialists.

I have much more time for that now. Twice a week I teach 8th graders how to separate the Internet wheat from the chafe. A course I designed and volunteer to teach.

Mid last year I met few guys that work on new industrial software that monitors production lines and predicting what could go wrong before it happen. Some very cool and advanced shit. Software pretty much monitors everything that effects production (machines and people) and almost completely eliminate need for "experts" that will spend weeks analyzing simple problems. This last part is what I am mostly interested in.

 

[SAYIT]

As it should be. Apparently the whole productivity/reward concept is distasteful to socialists.

I have much more time for that now. Twice a week I teach 8th graders how to separate the Internet wheat from the chafe. A course I designed and volunteer to teach.

Mid last year I met few guys that work on new industrial software that monitors production lines and predicting what could go wrong before it happen. Some very cool and advanced shit. Software pretty much monitors everything that effects production (machines and people) and almost completely eliminate need for "experts" that will spend weeks analyzing simple problems. This last part is what I am mostly interested in.

The ATMs self-monitor at short intervals and send text messages to the tech when an anomaly occurs or the cash falls below an op-adjustable minimum. We generally fixed or filled machines before the location or customers knew there was a prob.

 

[Ame®icano]

...the concept that we can't mandate fair wages is a fallacy. Of course we can...

Let's dip you nose in some of the BS you posted in post #367 when you were arguing just the opposite:
"Honestly, because there's always someone who is willing to work for less."