Why Islam is bad! v2

[logical4u]

This is not about Christianity.

Any weakness that Christianity might have now or in the past does not add or detract from this subject.

It is merely a distraction, a diversion.

A weakness of Christianity does not erase any problem with Islam.

All religions have their dark sides for sure. But even someone with a low IQ can realize that Islam is the worst. It's the reason why we are at war to keep them under control.

The original poster is dead on right. Islam is not a peaceful religion, it will be peaceful when they make the world muslim and make us all live under Sharia Law. It is interesting that Sharia law did not come into the Kuran until years after the profit Mohammad had died. That's also why we can not allow Iran to have a nuke, they will use it, they are not afraid to die, that is considered an honorable death to murder innocense as they think they become martyrs. That 72 virgin thing is just too much, ridiculous, they have a problem with sex. What is a woman's reward for suicide bombing? A pink cadillac?

When everyone is coverted or killed for islam, there will still be fighting (as in the ME) between the islam factions. Women get nothing in islam. They do not get to go to heaven (unless maybe they are a virgin, ewwwhh). They get no glory. They are terrorist factories, with no choice, no way out, no hope.

 

[nitroz]

Latest details on D.C. drone bomb plot - CBS News

Eleven foreign terrorists on the streets and not deported - Telegraph

WHDH-TV - Ashland man arrested for terror plot on the U.S.

US confronts Pak with evidences of ISI's terror links

Muslim extremists in Nigeria kill Christians in two states

Question:

Are Muslims permitted to lie?


Summary Answer:

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances, taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.


The Qur'an:

Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.

Qur'an (3:28) - This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."

Qur'an (9:3) - "...Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters..." The dissolution of oaths with the pagans who remained at Mecca following its capture. They did nothing wrong, but were evicted anyway.

Qur'an (40:28) - A man is introduced as a believer, but one who must "hide his faith" among those who are not believers.

Qur'an (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts" The context of this remark is marriage, which explains why Sharia allows spouses to lie to each other for the greater good.

Qur'an (66:2) - "Allah has already ordained for you, (O men), the dissolution of your oaths"

Qur'an (3:54) - "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers." The Arabic word used here for scheme (or plot) is makara, which literally means deceit. If Allah is deceitful toward unbelievers, then there is little basis for denying that Muslims are allowed to do the same. (See also 8:30 and 10:21)

Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.



From the Hadith:



Bukhari (52:269) - "The Prophet said, 'War is deceit.'" The context of this is thought to be the murder of Usayr ibn Zarim and his thirty unarmed men by Muhammad's men after he "guaranteed" them safe passage (see Additional Notes below).



Bukhari (49:857) - "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar." Lying is permitted when the end justifies the means.



Bukhari (84:64-65) - Speaking from a position of power at the time, Ali confirms that lying is permissible in order to deceive an "enemy."



Muslim (32:6303) - "...he did not hear that exemption was granted in anything what the people speak as lie but in three cases: in battle, for bringing reconciliation amongst persons and the narration of the words of the husband to his wife, and the narration of the words of a wife to her husband (in a twisted form in order to bring reconciliation between them)."



Bukhari (50:369) - Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at Muhammad's insistence. The men who volunteered for the assassination used dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.



From Islamic Law:



Reliance of the Traveler (p. 746 - 8.2) - "Speaking is a means to achieve objectives. If a praiseworthy aim is attainable through both telling the truth and lying, it is unlawful to accomplish through lying because there is no need for it. When it is possible to achieve such an aim by lying but not by telling the truth, it is permissible to lie if attaining the goal is permissible (N:i.e. when the purpose of lying is to circumvent someone who is preventing one from doing something permissible), and obligatory to lie if the goal is obligatory... it is religiously precautionary in all cases to employ words that give a misleading impression...



"One should compare the bad consequences entailed by lying to those entailed by telling the truth, and if the consequences of telling the truth are more damaging, one is entitled to lie.






Additional Notes:


Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers in order to defeat them. The two forms are:



Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true.



Kitman - Lying by omission. An example would be when Muslim apologists quote only a fragment of verse 5:32 (that if anyone kills "it shall be as if he had killed all mankind") while neglecting to mention that the rest of the verse (and the next) mandate murder in undefined cases of "corruption" and "mischief."



Though not called Taqiyya by name, Muhammad clearly used deception when he signed a 10-year treaty with the Meccans that allowed him access to their city while he secretly prepared his own forces for a takeover. The unsuspecting residents were conquered in easy fashion after he broke the treaty two years later, and some of the people in the city who had trusted him at his word were executed.



Another example of lying is when Muhammad used deception to trick his personal enemies into letting down their guard and exposing themselves to slaughter by pretending to seek peace. This happened in the case of Ka'b bin al-Ashraf (as previously noted) and again later against Usayr ibn Zarim, a surviving leader of the Banu Nadir tribe, which had been evicted from their home in Medina by the Muslims.



At the time, Usayr ibn Zarim was attempting to gather an armed force against the Muslims from among a tribe allied with the Quraish (against which Muhammad had already declared war). Muhammad's "emissaries" went to ibn Zarim and persuaded him to leave his safe haven on the pretext of meeting with the prophet of Islam in Medina to discuss peace. Once vulnerable, the leader and his thirty companions were massacred by the Muslims with ease, belying the probability that they were mostly unarmed, having been given a guarantee of safe passage (Ibn Ishaq 981).



Such was the reputation of Muslims for lying and then killing that even those who "accepted Islam" did not feel entirely safe. The fate of the Jadhima is tragic evidence for this. When Muslim "missionaries" approached their tribe one of the members insisted that they would be slaughtered even though they had already "converted" to Islam to avoid just such a demise. However, the others were convinced that they could trust the Muslim leader's promise that they would not be harmed if they simply offered no resistance. (After convincing the skeptic to lay down his arms, the unarmed men of the tribe were quickly tied up and beheaded - Ibn Ishaq 834 & 837).



Today's Muslims often try to justify Muhammad's murder of poets and others who criticized him at Medina by saying that they broke a treaty by their actions. Yet, these same apologists place little value on treaties broken by Muslims. From Muhammad to Saddam Hussein, promises made to non-Muslim are distinctly non-binding in the Muslim mindset.



Leaders in the Arab world routinely say one thing to English-speaking audiences and then something entirely different to their own people in Arabic. Yassir Arafat was famous for telling Western newspapers about his desire for peace with Israel, then turning right around and whipping Palestinians into a hateful and violent frenzy against Jews.



The 9/11 hijackers practiced deception by going into bars and drinking alcohol, thus throwing off potential suspicion that they were fundamentalists plotting jihad. This effort worked so well, in fact, that even weeks after 9/11, John Walsh, the host of a popular American television show, said that their bar trips were evidence of 'hypocrisy.'



The transmission from Flight 93 records the hijackers telling their doomed passengers that there is "a bomb on board" but that everyone will "be safe" as long as "their demands are met." Obviously none of these things were true, but these men, who were so intensely devoted to Islam that they were willing to "slay and be slain for the cause of Allah" (as the Qur'an puts it) saw nothing wrong with employing Taqiyya in order to facilitate their mission of mass murder.



The near absence of Qur'anic verse and reliable Hadith that encourage truthfulness is somewhat surprising, given that many Muslims are convinced that their religion teaches honesty. In fact, it is because of this ingrained belief that many Muslims are quite honest. When lying is addressed in the Qur'an, it is nearly always in reference to the "lies against Allah" - referring to the Jews and Christians who rejected Muhammad's claim to being a prophet.



Finally, the circumstances by which Muhammad allowed a believer to lie to a non-spouse are limited to those that either advance the cause of Islam or enable a Muslim to avoid harm to his well-being (and presumably that of other Muslims as well). Although this should be kept very much in mind when dealing with matters of global security, such as Iran's nuclear intentions, it is not grounds for assuming that the Muslim one might personally encounter on the street or in the workplace is any less honest than anyone else.

 

[nitroz]

Belgian cop attacked for trying to unveil Muslim woman — RT

2011.09.29 (Tamia, Egypt) - A guard at a church is taken out by a Muslim drive-by.
2011.09.29 (Kirkuk, Iraq) - Jihadis detonate a massive truck bomb outside a bank. Two women are among the dead.
2011.09.28 (Hajjalmakhi, Dagestan) - An 11-year-old girl is among eight killed in a violent car bombing by Muslim extremists.
2011.09.28 (Abu Ghraib, Iraq) - Three children are among five family members brutally shot to death in their home by al-Qaeda intruders.
2011.09.28 (Lashkar Gah, Afghanistan) - Sunni hardliners roll up on a local police checkpoint and machine-gun eight officers.


Question:

Are Muslims permitted to force others into accepting Islam?


Summary Answer:

Muslims are commanded to fight unbelievers until they are either dead, converted to Islam, or in a permanent state of subjugation under Muslim domination. Allowing people of other faiths to live and worship independently of Islamic rule is not an option.


The Qur'an:

Qur'an (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued." Suras 9 and 5 are the last "revelations" that Muhammad handed down - hence abrogating what came before, which includes the oft-quoted verse 2:256 -"Let there be no compulsion in religion...".

Qur'an (9:5) "But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them..." Prayer and charity are among the Five Pillars of Islam, as salat and zakat. See below.

Qur'an (9:11) - (Continued from above) "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion" This confirms that Muhammad is speaking of conversion to Islam.

Qur'an (2:193) - "And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion be only for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrong-doers." The key phrase is to fight until "religion be only for Allah."


From the Hadith:



Sahih Muslim (1:33) The Messenger of Allah said: "I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah..." The last part is the Shahada, or profession of faith in Islam.



Sahih Muslim (19:4294) - "When you meet your enemies who are polytheists (which includes Christians), invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them ... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them" Osama bin Laden echoes this order from his prophet: "Does Islam, or does it not, force people by the power of the sword to submit to its authority corporeally if not spiritually? Yes. There are only three choices in Islam … . Either submit, or live under the suzerainty of Islam, or die.” (source: The al-Qaeda Reader p. 19-20)



Bukhari (8:387) - "Allah's Apostle said, 'I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.' And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally and their reckoning will be with Allah.'"



Bukhari (53:392) - "While we were in the Mosque, the Prophet came out and said, "Let us go to the Jews" We went out till we reached Bait-ul-Midras. He said to them, "If you embrace Islam, you will be safe. You should know that the earth belongs to Allah and His Apostle, and I want to expel you from this land. So, if anyone amongst you owns some property, he is permitted to sell it, otherwise you should know that the Earth belongs to Allah and His Apostle."



Bukhari (2:24) - "Allah's Apostle said: "I have been ordered (by Allah) to fight against the people until they testify that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that Muhammad is Allah's Apostle, and offer the prayers perfectly and give the obligatory charity, so if they perform a that, then they save their lives and property from me except for Islamic laws and then their reckoning (accounts) will be done by Allah."



Bukhari (60:80) - "The Verse:--'You (true Muslims) are the best of peoples ever raised up for mankind.' means, the best of peoples for the people, as you bring them with chains on their necks till they embrace Islam."



Bukhari (60:40) - "...:And fight them till there is no more affliction (i.e. no more worshiping of others along with Allah)." 'Affliction' of Muslims is explicitly defined here being a condition in which others worship a different god other than Allah. Muslims are commanded to use violence to 'rectify' the situation.



Bukhari (59:643) - "Testify that none has the right to be worshipped except Allah, or else I will chop off your neck!" Words of a military leader that Muhammad sent on an expedition with the mission of destroying a local religion in Yemen.



Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 959 - Then the apostle sent Khalid bin Walid… to the Banu al-Harith and ordered him to invite them to Islam three days before he attacked them. If they accepted then he was to accept it from them, and if they declined he was to fight them. So Khalid set out and came to them, and sent out riders in all directions inviting the people to Islam, saying, “If you accept Islam you will be safe.” So the men accepted Islam as they were invited. The text goes on to say that Khalid taught the al-Harith about Islam after their "conversion," proving that it was based on fear of slaughter rather than a free and intelligent decision.



Ibn Kathir (Commenting on Quran 2:256, which says "let there be no compulsion in religion") - "Therefore all people of the world should be called to Islam. If anyone of them refuses to do so, or refuses to pay the jizya, they should be fought till they are killed."




Additional Notes:

Following his flirtation with preaching relative peace and tolerance at Mecca - a 13-year disaster that netted less than 100 followers (mostly friends and family) - Muhammad changed tactics during his last ten years. Once he obtained the power to do so, he began forcing others into accepting his claims about himself at the point of a sword. In many places in the Hadith, he tells his followers that he has been commanded by Allah to fight unbelievers until they profess their faith in Islam (the Shahada).



During these later years, Muhammad did not seem at all bothered by conversions that were made under obvious duress. These included that of his sworn enemy of Abu Sufyan and his wife Hind. According to Muslim historians, when Abu Sufyan went to seek peace with Muhammad, he was ordered instead to embrace Islam. The exact words spoken to him in Muhammad's presence were, "Submit and testify that there is no God but Allah and that Muhammad is the apostle of Allah before you lose your head" - (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 814). He did.



The entire city of Mecca followed suit, even though the residents and leaders detested Muhammad and had resisted his preaching from the beginning. Most of them "converted" to Islam the day that he marched through their city with an army so dominant that little resistance was offered. Only the most credulous of believers would think that the city's religious epiphany just happened to coincide with the sword at their necks.



Meccans who would not change their religion were forcibly expelled from the city following that last Haj (Quran 9:5). The Christians and Jews living in Arabia at the time suffered the same fate on Muhammad's deathbed order. They were given the choice of either accepting Islam or being forced off their land (Sahih Muslim 19:4366).



The Jews at Khaybar were not at war with Muhammad when he ordered his warriors to attack them. Even his faithful son-in-law, Ali, whom he chose to head the mission, was somewhat perplexed as to the pretext on which they were to assault this peaceful farming community so far away from Medina:

Muhammad said: 'Proceed on and do not look about until Allah grants you victory', and Ali went a bit and then halted and did not look about and then said in a loud voice: 'Allah's Messenger, on what issue should I fight with the people?' Thereupon he (the Prophet) said: 'Fight with them until they bear testimony to the fact that there is no god but Allah and Muhammad is his Messenger' (Sahih Muslim 31:5917)

The Jews were caught entirely be surprise, of course. Their wealth was stolen and their women and children taken and distributed as slaves by the prophet of Islam to his men. Muhammad even took a woman for himself - after ordering the death of her husband.



Before he died, Muhammad sent his warriors against pagan Arab tribes, such as the al-Harith, demanding that they either convert to Islam or be wiped out (naturally, they opted for the Religion of Peace). He cursed Christians and Jews to the very end (Bukhari 8:427).



Muslims are taught to follow in the way of Muhammad. A Muslim under the reign of Umar put it this way "Our Prophet, the Messenger of our Lord, has ordered us to fight you till you worship Allah Alone or give Jizya (i.e. tribute)" (Bukhari 53:386).



Likewise, Abu Bakr, Muhammad's closest companion and immediate successor, pressed Jihad aggressively in foreign territory against people who did not want war and were of no threat. In a letter sent to the Persians, the caliph bluntly stated, "You should convert to Islam, and then you will be safe, for if you don't, you should know that I have come to you with an army of men that love death, as you love life."



Down through the centuries Muslims have forced Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, Zoroastrians, pagans and others to accept Islam, either by bluntly offering them death as an alternative, or by making their lives so miserable (ie. taxes, denial of rights...) that the conquered convert to Islam under the strain.



Forced conversions persist among extremists. Recently in Egypt, a Christian girl was kidnapped and told that she would be raped if she did not convert. In 2010, an 11-year-old Christian boy in Pakistan was kept enslaved in chains (1, 2) by his Muslim landlord, who proudly told the world that he would liberate the lad if he embraced Islam.



Neither of these examples of attempted forced conversion was condemned by Islamic organizations, even in the West. From the Muslim perspective, the victim in each case still technically retains the choice to convert. In fact, some even lauded the Pakistani slave-owner for being magnanimous in offering freedom and debt relief to his subject for embracing Islam.



Since Muslims believe so sincerely that their religion is truth, they often can't help but feel, on some level, that forced conversion is more of a favor done to the subject - a case of the end justifying the means. As Muhammad said, "Allah marvels at those who are brought to paradise in chains" (Bukhari 52:254).



It is also important to note the critical role that jizya plays in Islamic conversion. Paying a "tax" to Muslims is the only avenue of escape for those who don't want to leave their religion, according to the Qur'an. This answers the question of why Muhammad, his companions, and subsequent Muslim armies didn't force everyone to convert to Islam.



As Muhammad realized with the Jews of Khaybar, who were allowed to keep their farming community provided they directed the profits of their labor to him, it was often more lucrative to leave local economies in place rather than killing every male who wouldn't convert. This became the loose rule for the Muslim armies that swept across Christian, Jewish, Persian, Hindu and Buddhist lands in the decades that followed. The money that was collected was then used to further Islamic expansion.



As Muhammad put it: "My sustenance is under the shade of my spear, and he who disobeys my orders will be humiliated by paying Jizya" (another translation: "My provision has been placed under the shadow of my spear, and abasement and humility have been placed on the one who disobeys my command.") The hadith has been quoted by al-Qaeda and is found in the original version of Bukhari and Ahmad (5114 or 4869, depending on the translation).



Another point to keep in mind is the distinction between speaking and believing. Muslims are commanded to fight unbelievers until they say they believe in Allah (or pay the Jizya), but there seems to be a tacit understanding that belief itself can't be forced (ie. "there is no compulsion in religion"). Nevertheless, once a subjugated individual outwardly converts to Islam under the strain of taxes and discrimination, they are not allowed to recant upon penalty of death. Their children must also be raised Muslim. And, if they aren't, then it is a sign of apostasy - subject to death.



This is how Islam managed to spread so successfully within conquered populations to ratios in the high 90th percentiles over native religion.



It is interesting to note that Muhammad's later practice of ordering people to profess their belief in him proved disastrous both for his own family and the legacy of his religion. By the time of his death, his empire included a great many people and tribes who had accepted his rule merely to avoid war and slavery. Many of them wanted out after he died, and several wars were immediately fought, resulting in thousands of deaths and cementing Islam's legacy of violent intolerance.



Incredibly, even Muhammad's sworn enemy of Abu Sufyan may have gotten the last laugh. So ambitious was the prophet of Islam that he accepted his former foe's outward profession of allegiance (at the point of a sword) in order to expand his empire. Yet, it was Abu Sufyan's own children who ultimately benefited - at the expense of Muhammad's.



Abu Sufyan's son, Muawiyah, inherited the empire after defeating Muhammad's adopted son, Ali. He also poisoned Hasan, one of the prophet's two favorite grandsons. Abu Sufyan's grandson, Yazid, became the next caliph and promptly had the head of Muhammad's other favorite grandson, Hussein, brought to him on a platter.



Such are the perils of forcing others to say that you are a prophet when they prefer to believe otherwise.



See also: MYTH: Muhammad Rejected Conversions Made Under Duress




Recent Examples of Forced Conversions and Attempts:

Muslims Beat Man with Iron Rods for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Christian Girl Kidnapped, Beaten, Raped - But Resists Demand to Embrace Islam...
Two Christians Severely Beaten for Refusing to Convert...
Father Threatens to Kill Boy if He Does Not Embrace Islam...
Christian Families Flee After Child Refuses to Convert...
Two Coptic Girls Abducted and Forced to 'Embrace' Islam...
Abduction and Forced Conversion of Christian Girl Called a 'Pious Act'...
Canadian Raped, Stabbed - Invited to Embrace Islam...
'Hundreds' of Pakistani Christian Girls Forced to Convert...
Rights Group: Indonesian Military Forces 56 to Embrace Islam...
Hindu Family Forcibly Converted, Circumcised...
Pakistani Christian Ordered to Convert or Die...
Obama Ordered to Embrace Islam or Face Sharia Justice...
Russian Soldier Beheaded for Refusing to Convert to Islam
Beaten US Hostage Embraces Religion of Peace...
Wife of Jailed Christian Man Told to Convert to Islam...
Christian Students Abased, Pressured to Convert (Pak.)...
Farm Woman Sentenced to Death after Refusing to Embrace Islam
Kidnapped Girl Returns Home after Forced Conversion, Rape...
Egypt Refuses to Allow Muslim to Convert 'On Paper'...
Hindu Girl Kidnapped, Forcibly Converted to Islam...
Sikhs Ordered to Embrace Islam
Coptic Girls Kidnapped - Forcibly Converted...
Hindu Girl Kidnapped, Taken to Muslim Seminary, Forcibly Converted, Raped...
Indigenous Malaysian Tribes Forced to Embrace Islam to Receive Development Aid...
Man Loses House and Daughter over Refusal to Embrace Islam...
Christian Professor Beaten for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Christian Nurse Kidnapped, Forcibly Converted to Islam...
Widow of Christian Tortured to Death Ordered to Embrace Islam
NJ Jihadist Beat Family for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Two Christian Sisters Kidnapped, Forced into Marriage...
Ethiopian Christians Forcibly Converted to Islam...
13-Year-Old Hindu Girl Abducted, Forcibly Converted...
16-Year-Old Hindu Girl Survives Kidnapping, Forced Conversion and Rape...
12-Year-Old Christian Girl Kidnapped, Converted, Raped...
Christian Hacked to Death After Declining to Embrace Islam...
Middle Eastern Christians Invited to Embrace Islam or Die...
Rare Escape by Coptic Girl from Abduction, Forced Conversion...
Americans Offered Peace Plan: Accept Islam or Die...
Cleric Behind Kidnap, Forced Conversion of Hindu Girl...
Stockholm Bomber's Wife Converted 'Under Pressure'...
Hindu Girl Kidnapped, Forced to Accept Islam...
al-Qaeda Frees Spanish Hostage after She Embraces Islam...
8th Grade Christian Girl Kidnapped, Converted, 'Married'...
Man Beaten with Sticks for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Christian Beaten Unconscious for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Three Sikhs Beheaded After Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Report: 19-Year-Old Christian Kidnapped, Forced to Convert...
Filipinos Told, Embrace Islam or Lose Your Job...
UK Student Killed for Refusing to Convert to Islam...
Christian Girls (Ages 11 & 16) Kidnapped, Forcibly Converted and 'Married' Off...
Christian Girl Raped over Father's Refusal to Embrace Islam...
Rape Victim Ordered to Convert to Islam...
Christian Killed after Refusing to 'Embrace Islam'...
Abductee Refuses to Convert Under Torture, Pays the Price...
Beheaded Engineer Chose Death Rather than 'Embrace' Islam...
Christian Refuses to Convert, Stabbed 24 Times...
Hindus Told to Embrace Islam, Pay Up - or Else...
Burn Victim Who Refused to Convert Dies in Hospital...
Pakistan Christians Invited to Embrace Islam or Die Horribly...
Saudis Force Christian Workers to Convert or Lose Job...
Christian Journalist Warned to 'Embrace Islam' or Family will 'Suffer'...
Iran Releases Jailed Christians after Failing to Convert Them...
Hindus and Christians Invited to 'Embrace Islam' or Face 'Elimination'...
Pakistan Christians Attacked for Refusing to Convert...
Slain Christians had Been Warned for Months to Convert to Islam...
Islamists Up the Violence to Force Christians to Convert...
Murdered Yemeni Jew Had Been Warned by Killer to Convert or Leave...
20-25 Hindu Girls Abducted Each Month, Forcibly Converted...
Pakistani Christians Told to Convert or Die...
Egypt Sentences Christian Woman to Three Years for Refusing to Convert to Islam...
18-Year-Old Christian Raped, Forced to Convert to Islam...
Korean Pastor Killed for Refusing to Convert to Islam...
Man Gang-Raped, Tortured for Refusing to Embrace Islam...
Nigerian Woman Sentenced to Stoning after Declining to Convert
Hostages Forced at Gunpoint to Convert to Islam...
Girl Drugged, Raped, and Forcibly 'Converted' to Islam...
Christian Girls Rescued after Kidnapping, Forced Conversions...
Christian Professor Forcibly 'Converted' to Islam by Hamas...
Christian Children Kidnapped, Forcibly Converted in Nigeria...

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

 

[Sunni Man]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

Nitro nuts post all of this nonsense without any links so he is basically plagiarizing.

But for some reason the Mods let him get away with it.

 

[nitroz]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

Nitro nuts post all of this nonsense without any links so he is basically plagiarizing.

But for some reason the Mods let him get away with it.

Have I used it as my own work?
Have I made a profit off of it?

I have posted links on 3/4 of the stuff on here.
But if you insist on accelerated posting WITH links....

 

[nitroz]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

ok ok







Srs buzness yo

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

Nitro nuts post all of this nonsense without any links so he is basically plagiarizing.

But for some reason the Mods let him get away with it.

most of it is exerpts from the koran. You should know that bro

The rest, pop into google and BAM there it is...but yeah some of it needs linkage, i don't like looking for links.

 

[nitroz]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

Nitro nuts post all of this nonsense without any links so he is basically plagiarizing.

But for some reason the Mods let him get away with it.

most of it is exerpts from the koran. You should know that bro

The rest, pop into google and BAM there it is...but yeah some of it needs linkage, i don't like looking for links.

well all of it comes from here.
Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Time

 

[JStone]

Fuck nitroz this is the interwebz, you need to post smaller posts

Nitro nuts post all of this nonsense without any links so he is basically plagiarizing.

But for some reason the Mods let him get away with it.

The Torah says to love thy neighbor as thyself and to love the foreigner and the stranger.

Can you show us where Quran says to love non-Muslims, islamonazi? No, I didn;t think so

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. Islam is the root of *all* evil.
2. One day GOD himself will ride it rough shod.
3. Won't be anything left of it.
4. It is written.



Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[logical4u]

Latest details on D.C. drone bomb plot - CBS News

Eleven foreign terrorists on the streets and not deported - Telegraph

WHDH-TV - Ashland man arrested for terror plot on the U.S.

US confronts Pak with evidences of ISI's terror links

Muslim extremists in Nigeria kill Christians in two states

Question:

Are Muslims permitted to lie?


Summary Answer:

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances, taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.


The Qur'an:

Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.

Qur'an (3:28) - This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."

Qur'an (9:3) - "...Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters..." The dissolution of oaths with the pagans who remained at Mecca following its capture. They did nothing wrong, but were evicted anyway.

Qur'an (40:28) - A man is introduced as a believer, but one who must "hide his faith" among those who are not believers.

Qur'an (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts" The context of this remark is marriage, which explains why Sharia allows spouses to lie to each other for the greater good.

Qur'an (66:2) - "Allah has already ordained for you, (O men), the dissolution of your oaths"

Qur'an (3:54) - "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers." The Arabic word used here for scheme (or plot) is makara, which literally means deceit. If Allah is deceitful toward unbelievers, then there is little basis for denying that Muslims are allowed to do the same. (See also 8:30 and 10:21)

Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.



From the Hadith:



Bukhari (52:269) - "The Prophet said, 'War is deceit.'" The context of this is thought to be the murder of Usayr ibn Zarim and his thirty unarmed men by Muhammad's men after he "guaranteed" them safe passage (see Additional Notes below).



Bukhari (49:857) - "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar." Lying is permitted when the end justifies the means.



Bukhari (84:64-65) - Speaking from a position of power at the time, Ali confirms that lying is permissible in order to deceive an "enemy."



Muslim (32:6303) - "...he did not hear that exemption was granted in anything what the people speak as lie but in three cases: in battle, for bringing reconciliation amongst persons and the narration of the words of the husband to his wife, and the narration of the words of a wife to her husband (in a twisted form in order to bring reconciliation between them)."



Bukhari (50:369) - Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at Muhammad's insistence. The men who volunteered for the assassination used dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.



From Islamic Law:



Reliance of the Traveler (p. 746 - 8.2) - "Speaking is a means to achieve objectives. If a praiseworthy aim is attainable through both telling the truth and lying, it is unlawful to accomplish through lying because there is no need for it. When it is possible to achieve such an aim by lying but not by telling the truth, it is permissible to lie if attaining the goal is permissible (N:i.e. when the purpose of lying is to circumvent someone who is preventing one from doing something permissible), and obligatory to lie if the goal is obligatory... it is religiously precautionary in all cases to employ words that give a misleading impression...



"One should compare the bad consequences entailed by lying to those entailed by telling the truth, and if the consequences of telling the truth are more damaging, one is entitled to lie.






Additional Notes:


Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers in order to defeat them. The two forms are:



Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true.



Kitman - Lying by omission. An example would be when Muslim apologists quote only a fragment of verse 5:32 (that if anyone kills "it shall be as if he had killed all mankind") while neglecting to mention that the rest of the verse (and the next) mandate murder in undefined cases of "corruption" and "mischief."



Though not called Taqiyya by name, Muhammad clearly used deception when he signed a 10-year treaty with the Meccans that allowed him access to their city while he secretly prepared his own forces for a takeover. The unsuspecting residents were conquered in easy fashion after he broke the treaty two years later, and some of the people in the city who had trusted him at his word were executed.



Another example of lying is when Muhammad used deception to trick his personal enemies into letting down their guard and exposing themselves to slaughter by pretending to seek peace. This happened in the case of Ka'b bin al-Ashraf (as previously noted) and again later against Usayr ibn Zarim, a surviving leader of the Banu Nadir tribe, which had been evicted from their home in Medina by the Muslims.



At the time, Usayr ibn Zarim was attempting to gather an armed force against the Muslims from among a tribe allied with the Quraish (against which Muhammad had already declared war). Muhammad's "emissaries" went to ibn Zarim and persuaded him to leave his safe haven on the pretext of meeting with the prophet of Islam in Medina to discuss peace. Once vulnerable, the leader and his thirty companions were massacred by the Muslims with ease, belying the probability that they were mostly unarmed, having been given a guarantee of safe passage (Ibn Ishaq 981).



Such was the reputation of Muslims for lying and then killing that even those who "accepted Islam" did not feel entirely safe. The fate of the Jadhima is tragic evidence for this. When Muslim "missionaries" approached their tribe one of the members insisted that they would be slaughtered even though they had already "converted" to Islam to avoid just such a demise. However, the others were convinced that they could trust the Muslim leader's promise that they would not be harmed if they simply offered no resistance. (After convincing the skeptic to lay down his arms, the unarmed men of the tribe were quickly tied up and beheaded - Ibn Ishaq 834 & 837).



Today's Muslims often try to justify Muhammad's murder of poets and others who criticized him at Medina by saying that they broke a treaty by their actions. Yet, these same apologists place little value on treaties broken by Muslims. From Muhammad to Saddam Hussein, promises made to non-Muslim are distinctly non-binding in the Muslim mindset.



Leaders in the Arab world routinely say one thing to English-speaking audiences and then something entirely different to their own people in Arabic. Yassir Arafat was famous for telling Western newspapers about his desire for peace with Israel, then turning right around and whipping Palestinians into a hateful and violent frenzy against Jews.



The 9/11 hijackers practiced deception by going into bars and drinking alcohol, thus throwing off potential suspicion that they were fundamentalists plotting jihad. This effort worked so well, in fact, that even weeks after 9/11, John Walsh, the host of a popular American television show, said that their bar trips were evidence of 'hypocrisy.'



The transmission from Flight 93 records the hijackers telling their doomed passengers that there is "a bomb on board" but that everyone will "be safe" as long as "their demands are met." Obviously none of these things were true, but these men, who were so intensely devoted to Islam that they were willing to "slay and be slain for the cause of Allah" (as the Qur'an puts it) saw nothing wrong with employing Taqiyya in order to facilitate their mission of mass murder.



The near absence of Qur'anic verse and reliable Hadith that encourage truthfulness is somewhat surprising, given that many Muslims are convinced that their religion teaches honesty. In fact, it is because of this ingrained belief that many Muslims are quite honest. When lying is addressed in the Qur'an, it is nearly always in reference to the "lies against Allah" - referring to the Jews and Christians who rejected Muhammad's claim to being a prophet.



Finally, the circumstances by which Muhammad allowed a believer to lie to a non-spouse are limited to those that either advance the cause of Islam or enable a Muslim to avoid harm to his well-being (and presumably that of other Muslims as well). Although this should be kept very much in mind when dealing with matters of global security, such as Iran's nuclear intentions, it is not grounds for assuming that the Muslim one might personally encounter on the street or in the workplace is any less honest than anyone else.

This is one of the reasons that those that seriously consider Allah vs the Lord know that the two are not the same. The Lord of Abraham and Jacob hate lies. Yeshua spoke against deceivers, and said they would be outside His holy city, they would not be welcome, inside. Islam, particularly Shariah promotes a "culture" of deceit, destruction and death.

 

[nitroz]

Ohio Muslim inmates sue over meal preparation - Yahoo! News

13 killed in Pakistan shooting attacks - Asia, World - The Independent

Rezwan Ferdaus: Muslim American with physics degree denies 'toy plane' terror attack plot | Mail Online

http://www.twincities.com/ci_19034035?nclick_check=1

BBC News - Huge Somalia suicide car bomb kills dozens in capital

BBC News - Bangladesh war crimes: First charges filed

PAKISTAN Muslims, extremists and others, oppose death penalty for

Catholic Culture : Latest Headlines : Christians who have fled Iran receive death threats

Shhhh! CAIR wants speaker silenced at U.S. law school

Indonesia Tweets Fuel Acts of Violence, 3 October 2011 Monday 10:13

Terror suspect accused of trying to hit FBI agent - Nation Wires - MiamiHerald.com

Lebanon: threats against vendors of alcohol in South - ANSAmed - ANSAMED.info

2011.10.04 (Mogadishu, Somalia) - Over seventy people are blown to bits in a powerful truck bombing by Islamic fundamentalists.
2011.10.04 (Quetta, Pakistan) - Thirteen Shia pilgrims are pulled off of a bus by Sunni gunmen, lined up and mowed down.
2011.10.03 (Maiduguri, Nigeria) - A tea seller and customer are shot at point blank range by local Islamists.
2011.10.03 (Arab Jobour, Iraq) - Hardliners open fire on a schoolteacher, killing him and injuring his wife and young son.
2011.10.03 (Baghdad, Iraq) - Terrorsts kill a child with a bomb.
2011.10.03 (Kandahar, Afghanistan) - A Shahid sucide bomber takes two civilians with him, including a child.


Question:

Does Islam proscribe the death penalty for Muslims who wish to embrace another religion?

Summary Answer:

Those who turn their back on Islam are to be executed. This is confirmed by the words and deeds of Muhammad. The only freedom of belief in Islam is the freedom to become Muslim.


The Qur'an:

Qur'an (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them"

Qur'an (9:11-12) - "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist."

Other verses that seem to support the many Hadith demanding death for apostates are Qur'an verses 2:217, 9:73-74, 88:21, 5:54, and 9:66.



From the Hadith:



The reason why executing apostates has always been well-ensconced in Islamic law is that there is an indisputable record of Muhammad and his companions doing exactly that according to the reliable Hadith. According to verse 4:80 of the Quran: "Whoso obeyeth the Messenger obeyeth Allah."



Bukhari (52:260) - "...The Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' " Note that there is no distinction as to how that Muslim came to be a Muslim.



Bukhari (83:37) - "Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate."



Bukhari (84:57) - "[In the words of] Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"



Bukhari (89:271) - A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to "the verdict of Allah and his apostle."



Bukhari (84:58) - "There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu'adh asked, 'Who is this (man)?' Abu Muisa said, 'He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.' Then Abu Muisa requested Mu'adh to sit down but Mu'adh said, 'I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice.' Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, 'Then we discussed the night prayers'"



Bukhari (84:64-65) - "Allah's Apostle: 'During the last days there will appear some young foolish people who will say the best words but their faith will not go beyond their throats (i.e. they will have no faith) and will go out from (leave) their religion as an arrow goes out of the game. So, wherever you find them, kill them, for whoever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection.'"



Abu Dawud (4346) - "Was not there a wise man among you who would stand up to him when he saw that I had withheld my hand from accepting his allegiance, and kill him?" Muhammad is chastising his companions for allowing an apostate to "repent" under duress. (The person in question was Muhammad's former scribe who left him after doubting the authenticity of divine "revelations" upon finding out that he could suggest grammatical changes. He was brought back to Muhammad after having been captured in Medina).



Reliance of the Traveller (Islamic Law) o8.1 - "When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed." (o8.4 affirms that there is no penalty for killing an apostate).




Additional Notes:

While the rest of the world generally believes that if God wanted people dead over their religious beliefs, then he would do the job himself, apostasy is taken so seriously by Muslims that it spawned the first of many major internal wars.



Immediately after Muhammad's death, several tribes wanted to leave Islam and return to their preferred religion. In a conflict known as the Riddah (apostasy) Wars, they were slaughtered in such places remembered as "Garden of Death" and "Gulley of Blood" by the first caliph Abu Bakr's aggressive and violent campaign to force submission (and keep the tribute payments flowing back to Mecca, of course). Within months, a great many people were dead, including Muslims who had memorized the Qur'an by heart.



As Abu Bakr, Muhammad's closest companion, explained in a letter at the time, his prophet "struck whoever turned his back to Him until he came to Islam, willingly or grudgingly." Thus did Abu Bakr promise to "burn them with fire, slaughter them by any means, and take women and children captive" any who left Islam. (al-Tabari v10 p.55-57)



Ali, the fourth "Rightly Guided Caliph" was Muhammad's son-in-law and one of the first converts to Islam. He also had people burned alive for wanting to follow their conscience. An old man named Rumahis b. Mansur, who regretted leaving Christianity and vowed not to remain a Muslim, was beheaded by Ali. (al-Tabari v.17 p.191).



In 1400 years, there has never been a system of Islamic law that did not prescribe the death penalty for any Muslim choosing to leave Islam. Even in modern, ostensibly secular Islamic countries with constitutions "guaranteeing" freedom of religion, there is de facto enforcement of this law with intimidation and the occasional murder of apostates.



A sound philosophy never requires violence or threats to retain believers. Contemporary Muslim apologists thus find it embarrassing that their religion (and theirs alone) endorses killing over a change in opinion. As such there are various tricks played to deny or explain away this weak and draconian which is so well-ensconced in Islamic tradition.



Such defenders usually quote verse 2:256 to Western audiences. The verse states "Let there be no compulsion in religion, for truth stands out from error." They may also include a fragment of verse 10:99-100, "Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers?" What they don't say is that nearly all Muslim scholars agree that both verses were spoken by Muhammad during an earlier time in his teachings, when he did not have the power to compel others. They are abrogated by later verses, such as verse 9:29, which clearly commands Muslims to fight unbelievers until they relent and either accept Islam or a state of humiliation under Islamic rule (an obvious illustration of compulsion).



These apologists also ignore the fact that apostasy is not mere unbelief, but unbelief that follows belief, which neither of these verses address. Muhammad's recognition of the distinction is reflected in his own deeds, following his capture of Mecca, and in those of his companions following his death (the Ridda Wars). How could those closest to him have felt that there should be "no compulsion in religion" if they were instructed to kill anyone who wanted to leave Islam?



The "Religion of Peace" subsequently expanded across the globe by conquering people of other religions and then making life miserable for those who didn't "embrace Islam." Once spoken, a person was locked into the faith. Any sign of false witness - such as raising their children in another faith - was punished with death. Thus did Islam gradually supplant other religions.



Tellingly, the same apologists who lie about Islam's mandate to kill apostates do not appear all that bothered when it does happen, nor do they champion the right of other religions to evangelize in Muslim countries. In fact, they discourage it. They know as well as anyone that Islam cannot compete within the arena of free ideas and must rely on brute force at some level to retain believers.


A Sample of Modern Day Treatment of Those Who Leave Islam:

Christian Convert Survives Brutal Stabbing in "Moderate" Morocco
Schoolteacher Gunned Down After Converting to Ahmadi Faith
Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam and Embracing Christianity...
Christian Girl Tortured and Killed for Leaving Islam...
Christian Convert Flees after Severe Beating by Family...
Swedish Imam Calls on Muslims to Kill Converts...
25 Ex-Muslims Arrested in Iran...
Morocco Gives Ex-Muslim 15 Years in Jail for 'Proselytizing'...
14-Year-Old 'Apostate' Girl Unable to Walk after Torture...
Court Orders Apostate to 'Repent His Christian Faith' or Die...
Christian Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam
New Ground Zero Imam Says Apostates Should be Jailed...
Muslim Murdered for Intention to Convert to Hinduism...
Palestinian Couple Declared Apostates, Forcibly Divorced...
Time Running Out for Apostate Pastor Facing Execution...
Muslim-American Leaders Challenged to Reject Killing Apostates
Palestinian Authority Labels Ahmadis 'Apostates'...
Suicide Bombers Close in on 'Apostate' Pakistan Ahmadi Community...
'Blessings' Promised to Those who Kill Ahmadiya 'Apostates'
'Apostate' Ahmadiyahs Brutally Murdered by 'Allah Akbar' Mob
Man in Britain Beaten with Plank for Leaving Islam...
Christian Couple Stabbed in Home for Leaving Islam...
21-Year-Old Christian Executed for Leaving Islam...
Afghan Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam...
Christian Father of Ten Executed in Front of Home
Christian Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
Father of 6 Jailed and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Tortured Aid Worker Faces Execution for Becoming Christian...
63-Year-Old Convert & Son Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Imprisoned Pastor Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
Ethiopian Stabbed for Leaving Islam...
Son Confesses to Killing Father for Leaving Islam...
17-Year-Old Girl Beaten by Family, in Shackles for Leaving Islam...
15-Year-Old Girl Attacked with Acid for Leaving Islam...
Asylum Seekers in Norway Scald Christian Convert with Boiling Water...
Christian Convert Flees Torture in Bangladesh...
Christian Convert Beaten to Death...
False Cattle Theft Charge Used to Stop Christian Convert...
Egyptian Muslims Attempt to Behead Christian Convert...
Afghanistan Detains 20 Christian Converts amid Call for Death...
Torture Fears for Humanitarian Worker Charged with Apostasy...
Schoolchildren Forced to Watch Execution of Christian Convert...
Pastor to Hang for Apostasy...
Islamic Scholars Mull Putting Ex-Muslims to Death...
Pastors Warned to Return to Islam or Risk Murder...
Australian Islamists Vow to Murder Ex-Muslims...
Cleric: Ex-Muslims Should be Reasoned With - Then Killed...
Egypt Jails Christian Convert Accused of Distributing Bibles...
Egyptian Convert to Christianity Describes Beatings...
Christian Convert Executed by Somali Islamists...
Malaysia: Whipping, Prison and Fines for Anyone Trying to Convert Muslims...
Bangladeshi Christian Convert Threatened with Death...
Ethiopian Christian Convert Languishes in Jail over Bibles...
Bibles Burned, Christian Converts Threatened with Same Fate...
Family Ordered to 'Sacrifice' Christian Convert Son...
Judge Tells Christian Convert of His Desire to Kill Her...
Police Round Up Christian Converts in Iran...
Elderly Christian Converts Driven from Home...
Police Rape and Torture Christian Convert - Promise to Release Her if She Will Return to Islam...
Christian Converts Hunted Down and Beaten in Comoros...
Son of Murdered Christian Convert Also Faces Death...
Iran's Parliament Votes to Kill Christian Converts...
Christian Convert Shot to Death by Devout Muslims...
Mob Pelts Christian Converts with Rocks...
Innocent Man Slain After Cleric Declares Ahmadis to be Wajibul Qatl...
Jordan Annuls Marriage of Christian Convert...
Christian Convert & Wife Beaten, Flee to Save Children...
New Zealand Christian Convert Goes Underground to Stay Alive...
Christian Convert Needs Police Protection - in the UK!...
Genital-Shocking Egyptian Police Detain Christian Convert...
Ethiopian Islamists Stab Christian Convert's Son...
Christian Convert (Father of 4) Murdered by Islamists...
Christian Convert Murdered by Islamic Radicals...
16-Year-Old Christian Convert has Muslim Man Forced on Her...
Imam Calls for His Own Son's Murder for Leaving Islam...
Somali Christian Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
Father of Two Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
Iran Holds Women in Notorious Prison for Leaving Islam...
Christian Woman Divorced and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Libya Urged to Stop Torturing Christians for Leaving Islam...
Graphic Video Posted of Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
Christian Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
Saudi Cuts Out Daughter's Tongue for Leaving Islam...
Prominent Canada Threatens to Kill Daughter for Leaving Islam...
Yemen Arrests Nine for Leaving Islam...
Maldives Cleric Vows to Kill Anyone Leaving Islam...
Four Christians Sent to Jail for Leaving Islam...
Elderly Woman Burned to Death for Leaving Islam...
Malaysia Officially Bars Muslims from Leaving Islam...
Young Christian Murdered after Leaving Islam...
Apostate Woman's Fingernails Torn Out by Family...
Apostate Spat on in the UK, Threatened with Death...
Poll: 4 in 5 Pakistanis Support Stoning Adulterers, Apostates...
Iraqi Mujahideen Post Video of 'Apostate' Beheading...
Harvard Chaplain Defends Killing Apostates...
Executed Somali Christian was Accused of Apostasy...
Man Under House Arrest over Son's Apostasy...
(Canada) Mother Threatens to Kill Apostate Son...
Apostasy: Iran to Enforce Death Penalty Worldwide?...
Apostates Suffer Religious Persecution in Britain...
UK Clerics Refuse to Denounce Killing Apostates...
Somali Christian Casually Executed for Apostasy...
Dutch Muslims Assault Apostate...
Non-Muslims Horrified by Details of Apostate Family's Murder...
Apostate and Christian Father of 7 Shot Dead in Ethiopia...
Islamists Post 'Hit List' of Apostates...

When And Muslims brag that theirs is the "fastest growing" religion... Now you know why!

TheReligionofPeace - Islam: Killing Apostates

 

[nitroz]

Ohio Muslim inmates sue over meal preparation - Yahoo! News

13 killed in Pakistan shooting attacks - Asia, World - The Independent

Rezwan Ferdaus: Muslim American with physics degree denies 'toy plane' terror attack plot | Mail Online

http://www.twincities.com/ci_19034035?nclick_check=1

BBC News - Huge Somalia suicide car bomb kills dozens in capital

BBC News - Bangladesh war crimes: First charges filed

PAKISTAN Muslims, extremists and others, oppose death penalty for

Catholic Culture : Latest Headlines : Christians who have fled Iran receive death threats

Shhhh! CAIR wants speaker silenced at U.S. law school

Indonesia Tweets Fuel Acts of Violence, 3 October 2011 Monday 10:13

Terror suspect accused of trying to hit FBI agent - Nation Wires - MiamiHerald.com

Lebanon: threats against vendors of alcohol in South - ANSAmed - ANSAMED.info

2011.10.04 (Mogadishu, Somalia) - Over seventy people are blown to bits in a powerful truck bombing by Islamic fundamentalists.
2011.10.04 (Quetta, Pakistan) - Thirteen Shia pilgrims are pulled off of a bus by Sunni gunmen, lined up and mowed down.
2011.10.03 (Maiduguri, Nigeria) - A tea seller and customer are shot at point blank range by local Islamists.
2011.10.03 (Arab Jobour, Iraq) - Hardliners open fire on a schoolteacher, killing him and injuring his wife and young son.
2011.10.03 (Baghdad, Iraq) - Terrorsts kill a child with a bomb.
2011.10.03 (Kandahar, Afghanistan) - A Shahid sucide bomber takes two civilians with him, including a child.


Question:

Does Islam proscribe the death penalty for Muslims who wish to embrace another religion?

Summary Answer:

Those who turn their back on Islam are to be executed. This is confirmed by the words and deeds of Muhammad. The only freedom of belief in Islam is the freedom to become Muslim.


The Qur'an:

Qur'an (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them"

Qur'an (9:11-12) - "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist."

Other verses that seem to support the many Hadith demanding death for apostates are Qur'an verses 2:217, 9:73-74, 88:21, 5:54, and 9:66.



From the Hadith:



The reason why executing apostates has always been well-ensconced in Islamic law is that there is an indisputable record of Muhammad and his companions doing exactly that according to the reliable Hadith. According to verse 4:80 of the Quran: "Whoso obeyeth the Messenger obeyeth Allah."



Bukhari (52:260) - "...The Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' " Note that there is no distinction as to how that Muslim came to be a Muslim.



Bukhari (83:37) - "Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate."



Bukhari (84:57) - "[In the words of] Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"



Bukhari (89:271) - A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to "the verdict of Allah and his apostle."



Bukhari (84:58) - "There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu'adh asked, 'Who is this (man)?' Abu Muisa said, 'He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.' Then Abu Muisa requested Mu'adh to sit down but Mu'adh said, 'I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice.' Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, 'Then we discussed the night prayers'"



Bukhari (84:64-65) - "Allah's Apostle: 'During the last days there will appear some young foolish people who will say the best words but their faith will not go beyond their throats (i.e. they will have no faith) and will go out from (leave) their religion as an arrow goes out of the game. So, wherever you find them, kill them, for whoever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection.'"



Abu Dawud (4346) - "Was not there a wise man among you who would stand up to him when he saw that I had withheld my hand from accepting his allegiance, and kill him?" Muhammad is chastising his companions for allowing an apostate to "repent" under duress. (The person in question was Muhammad's former scribe who left him after doubting the authenticity of divine "revelations" upon finding out that he could suggest grammatical changes. He was brought back to Muhammad after having been captured in Medina).



Reliance of the Traveller (Islamic Law) o8.1 - "When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed." (o8.4 affirms that there is no penalty for killing an apostate).




Additional Notes:

While the rest of the world generally believes that if God wanted people dead over their religious beliefs, then he would do the job himself, apostasy is taken so seriously by Muslims that it spawned the first of many major internal wars.



Immediately after Muhammad's death, several tribes wanted to leave Islam and return to their preferred religion. In a conflict known as the Riddah (apostasy) Wars, they were slaughtered in such places remembered as "Garden of Death" and "Gulley of Blood" by the first caliph Abu Bakr's aggressive and violent campaign to force submission (and keep the tribute payments flowing back to Mecca, of course). Within months, a great many people were dead, including Muslims who had memorized the Qur'an by heart.



As Abu Bakr, Muhammad's closest companion, explained in a letter at the time, his prophet "struck whoever turned his back to Him until he came to Islam, willingly or grudgingly." Thus did Abu Bakr promise to "burn them with fire, slaughter them by any means, and take women and children captive" any who left Islam. (al-Tabari v10 p.55-57)



Ali, the fourth "Rightly Guided Caliph" was Muhammad's son-in-law and one of the first converts to Islam. He also had people burned alive for wanting to follow their conscience. An old man named Rumahis b. Mansur, who regretted leaving Christianity and vowed not to remain a Muslim, was beheaded by Ali. (al-Tabari v.17 p.191).



In 1400 years, there has never been a system of Islamic law that did not prescribe the death penalty for any Muslim choosing to leave Islam. Even in modern, ostensibly secular Islamic countries with constitutions "guaranteeing" freedom of religion, there is de facto enforcement of this law with intimidation and the occasional murder of apostates.



A sound philosophy never requires violence or threats to retain believers. Contemporary Muslim apologists thus find it embarrassing that their religion (and theirs alone) endorses killing over a change in opinion. As such there are various tricks played to deny or explain away this weak and draconian which is so well-ensconced in Islamic tradition.



Such defenders usually quote verse 2:256 to Western audiences. The verse states "Let there be no compulsion in religion, for truth stands out from error." They may also include a fragment of verse 10:99-100, "Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers?" What they don't say is that nearly all Muslim scholars agree that both verses were spoken by Muhammad during an earlier time in his teachings, when he did not have the power to compel others. They are abrogated by later verses, such as verse 9:29, which clearly commands Muslims to fight unbelievers until they relent and either accept Islam or a state of humiliation under Islamic rule (an obvious illustration of compulsion).



These apologists also ignore the fact that apostasy is not mere unbelief, but unbelief that follows belief, which neither of these verses address. Muhammad's recognition of the distinction is reflected in his own deeds, following his capture of Mecca, and in those of his companions following his death (the Ridda Wars). How could those closest to him have felt that there should be "no compulsion in religion" if they were instructed to kill anyone who wanted to leave Islam?



The "Religion of Peace" subsequently expanded across the globe by conquering people of other religions and then making life miserable for those who didn't "embrace Islam." Once spoken, a person was locked into the faith. Any sign of false witness - such as raising their children in another faith - was punished with death. Thus did Islam gradually supplant other religions.



Tellingly, the same apologists who lie about Islam's mandate to kill apostates do not appear all that bothered when it does happen, nor do they champion the right of other religions to evangelize in Muslim countries. In fact, they discourage it. They know as well as anyone that Islam cannot compete within the arena of free ideas and must rely on brute force at some level to retain believers.


A Sample of Modern Day Treatment of Those Who Leave Islam:

Christian Convert Survives Brutal Stabbing in "Moderate" Morocco
Schoolteacher Gunned Down After Converting to Ahmadi Faith
Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam and Embracing Christianity...
Christian Girl Tortured and Killed for Leaving Islam...
Christian Convert Flees after Severe Beating by Family...
Swedish Imam Calls on Muslims to Kill Converts...
25 Ex-Muslims Arrested in Iran...
Morocco Gives Ex-Muslim 15 Years in Jail for 'Proselytizing'...
14-Year-Old 'Apostate' Girl Unable to Walk after Torture...
Court Orders Apostate to 'Repent His Christian Faith' or Die...
Christian Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam
New Ground Zero Imam Says Apostates Should be Jailed...
Muslim Murdered for Intention to Convert to Hinduism...
Palestinian Couple Declared Apostates, Forcibly Divorced...
Time Running Out for Apostate Pastor Facing Execution...
Muslim-American Leaders Challenged to Reject Killing Apostates
Palestinian Authority Labels Ahmadis 'Apostates'...
Suicide Bombers Close in on 'Apostate' Pakistan Ahmadi Community...
'Blessings' Promised to Those who Kill Ahmadiya 'Apostates'
'Apostate' Ahmadiyahs Brutally Murdered by 'Allah Akbar' Mob
Man in Britain Beaten with Plank for Leaving Islam...
Christian Couple Stabbed in Home for Leaving Islam...
21-Year-Old Christian Executed for Leaving Islam...
Afghan Released after 9 Months in prison for Leaving Islam...
Christian Father of Ten Executed in Front of Home
Christian Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
Father of 6 Jailed and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Tortured Aid Worker Faces Execution for Becoming Christian...
63-Year-Old Convert & Son Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Imprisoned Pastor Faces Death Penalty for Leaving Islam...
Ethiopian Stabbed for Leaving Islam...
Son Confesses to Killing Father for Leaving Islam...
17-Year-Old Girl Beaten by Family, in Shackles for Leaving Islam...
15-Year-Old Girl Attacked with Acid for Leaving Islam...
Asylum Seekers in Norway Scald Christian Convert with Boiling Water...
Christian Convert Flees Torture in Bangladesh...
Christian Convert Beaten to Death...
False Cattle Theft Charge Used to Stop Christian Convert...
Egyptian Muslims Attempt to Behead Christian Convert...
Afghanistan Detains 20 Christian Converts amid Call for Death...
Torture Fears for Humanitarian Worker Charged with Apostasy...
Schoolchildren Forced to Watch Execution of Christian Convert...
Pastor to Hang for Apostasy...
Islamic Scholars Mull Putting Ex-Muslims to Death...
Pastors Warned to Return to Islam or Risk Murder...
Australian Islamists Vow to Murder Ex-Muslims...
Cleric: Ex-Muslims Should be Reasoned With - Then Killed...
Egypt Jails Christian Convert Accused of Distributing Bibles...
Egyptian Convert to Christianity Describes Beatings...
Christian Convert Executed by Somali Islamists...
Malaysia: Whipping, Prison and Fines for Anyone Trying to Convert Muslims...
Bangladeshi Christian Convert Threatened with Death...
Ethiopian Christian Convert Languishes in Jail over Bibles...
Bibles Burned, Christian Converts Threatened with Same Fate...
Family Ordered to 'Sacrifice' Christian Convert Son...
Judge Tells Christian Convert of His Desire to Kill Her...
Police Round Up Christian Converts in Iran...
Elderly Christian Converts Driven from Home...
Police Rape and Torture Christian Convert - Promise to Release Her if She Will Return to Islam...
Christian Converts Hunted Down and Beaten in Comoros...
Son of Murdered Christian Convert Also Faces Death...
Iran's Parliament Votes to Kill Christian Converts...
Christian Convert Shot to Death by Devout Muslims...
Mob Pelts Christian Converts with Rocks...
Innocent Man Slain After Cleric Declares Ahmadis to be Wajibul Qatl...
Jordan Annuls Marriage of Christian Convert...
Christian Convert & Wife Beaten, Flee to Save Children...
New Zealand Christian Convert Goes Underground to Stay Alive...
Christian Convert Needs Police Protection - in the UK!...
Genital-Shocking Egyptian Police Detain Christian Convert...
Ethiopian Islamists Stab Christian Convert's Son...
Christian Convert (Father of 4) Murdered by Islamists...
Christian Convert Murdered by Islamic Radicals...
16-Year-Old Christian Convert has Muslim Man Forced on Her...
Imam Calls for His Own Son's Murder for Leaving Islam...
Somali Christian Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
Father of Two Shot to Death for Leaving Islam...
Iran Holds Women in Notorious Prison for Leaving Islam...
Christian Woman Divorced and Beaten for Leaving Islam...
Libya Urged to Stop Torturing Christians for Leaving Islam...
Graphic Video Posted of Man Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
Christian Beheaded for Leaving Islam...
Saudi Cuts Out Daughter's Tongue for Leaving Islam...
Prominent Canada Threatens to Kill Daughter for Leaving Islam...
Yemen Arrests Nine for Leaving Islam...
Maldives Cleric Vows to Kill Anyone Leaving Islam...
Four Christians Sent to Jail for Leaving Islam...
Elderly Woman Burned to Death for Leaving Islam...
Malaysia Officially Bars Muslims from Leaving Islam...
Young Christian Murdered after Leaving Islam...
Apostate Woman's Fingernails Torn Out by Family...
Apostate Spat on in the UK, Threatened with Death...
Poll: 4 in 5 Pakistanis Support Stoning Adulterers, Apostates...
Iraqi Mujahideen Post Video of 'Apostate' Beheading...
Harvard Chaplain Defends Killing Apostates...
Executed Somali Christian was Accused of Apostasy...
Man Under House Arrest over Son's Apostasy...
(Canada) Mother Threatens to Kill Apostate Son...
Apostasy: Iran to Enforce Death Penalty Worldwide?...
Apostates Suffer Religious Persecution in Britain...
UK Clerics Refuse to Denounce Killing Apostates...
Somali Christian Casually Executed for Apostasy...
Dutch Muslims Assault Apostate...
Non-Muslims Horrified by Details of Apostate Family's Murder...
Apostate and Christian Father of 7 Shot Dead in Ethiopia...
Islamists Post 'Hit List' of Apostates...

When And Muslims brag that theirs is the "fastest growing" religion... Now you know why!

TheReligionofPeace - Islam: Killing Apostates

 

[Poli_Sigh]

It's a 2000 plus year-old thing. The Jews, the Christians and the Muslims are still fighting over control of the Holy Land. The new wrinkles added to this thousand year old insanity are the unlikely alliance of the Jews and the Christians against the Muslims, who happen to control the majority of the oil in the world.

 

[Ropey]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qp9dc9im3-M]John Lennon - Watching The Wheels - YouTube[/ame]

Johny knew what mattered.

 

[logical4u]

It's a 2000 plus year-old thing. The Jews, the Christians and the Muslims are still fighting over control of the Holy Land. The new wrinkles added to this thousand year old insanity are the unlikely alliance of the Jews and the Christians against the Muslims, who happen to control the majority of the oil in the world.

Yet only one of those faiths are declaring their intention of converting, killing or oppressing anyone that does not believe as they do. Can you guess which one?

 

[nitroz]

PAKISTAN Armed group kills Christian over disputed land in Punjab - Asia News

Girl, eight, sold to Afghan police officer as his bride | News

Indonesia: Islamic movement protests against shoppings malls - Adnkronos Religion

Muslims in Spain Declare Jihad on Dogs :: Hudson New York

THE DAILY STAR :: News :: Middle East ::

BBC - The Editors: Families of BBC staff being harassed in Iran

2011.10.06 (Gereshk, Afghanistan) - Taliban snipers pick off a child riding a bus. Sixteen other civilians survive with injuries.
2011.10.04 (Tanjol, Nigeria) - Muslim militants gun down two Christian villagers.
2011.10.04 (Mogadishu, Somalia) - Over one-hundred people are blown to bits in a powerful truck bombing by Islamic fundamentalists. Many victims were students.
2011.10.04 (Quetta, Pakistan) - Fourteen Shia pilgrims are pulled off of a bus by Sunni gunmen, lined up and mowed down.
2011.10.03 (Maiduguri, Nigeria) - A tea seller and customer are shot at point blank range by local Islamists.
2011.10.03 (Arab Jobour, Iraq) - Hardliners open fire on a schoolteacher, killing him and injuring his wife and young son.

 

[nitroz]

God's perfect religion marches on in Egypt, where Christian
minorities were pummeled, stabbed, shot and even run over
merely for peacefully protesting church burnings on Sunday.







Islam's Latest Contributions to Peace
"Mohammed is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless
to the unbelievers but merciful to one another" Quran 48:29

2011.10.13 (Pattani, Thailand) - A married couple and their relative are brutally cut to pieces in their own shop by Islamic gunmen.
2011.10.13 (Pattani, Thailand) - Two people riding in a pickup truck and a teenager standing nearby are machine-gunned by Muslim militants.
2011.10.12 (Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Pakistan) - Children are among the casualties of an Islamist drive-by and mortar attack.
2011.10.12 (Baghdad, Iraq) - A powerful Shahid car bomb blast leaves at least fourteen Iraqis dead.
2011.10.12 (Baghdad, Iraq) - Nine people are reported dead after a Sunni suicide bombing in a Shia neighborhood.
2011.10.11 (Dasht, Pakistan) - The Taliban set fire to an oil tanker, burning the driver and helper to death.

Indonesia: About '1.8 million people' have terror links - Adnkronos Security
Toronto News: Speakers at Muslim conference noted for disparaging gays and Jews - thestar.com
"Honor killings" target Turkey's LGBT community - World Watch - CBS News
Student torture: No broken bones, no case – The Express Tribune
Three U.S. Muslims convicted in terrorism case - latimes.com
IRANIAN EMBASSY IN NORWAY WANTS TO CENSOR NORWEGIAN STUDENTS……. |
BBC News - UNHCR reduces Kenya aid operation after MSF abductions
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlin...er-says-politician-criticized-muslim-in-laws/
APOSTATE FROM ISLAM SHOT AT IN BERLIN FOR BOOK ON MOHAMED…..? |
Zombie Muhammad? Atheist attacked by Muslim during Halloween parade - National Humanist | Examiner.com
Obedient Wives Club publishes explicit sex book - The Malaysian Insider
Family of 36 stricken by dad’s sadistic savagery - Emirates 24/7

The Islamization of London: A Photo Tour | FrontPage Magazine

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. If you say Islam, you might as well say *Shithole*.
2. I can't think of any other *crap hole* that could possibly be worse.
3. And I can not think of one positive thing to say about it.
4. So the sooner with tear their tree house down, the better.
5. It will all begin with a loud crack.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas