Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

1.4 million immigrate to the US annually, we take an additional 50K refugees and you think it's ok to continue to flood the country with additional people from the third world. Does that really make sense to you?
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No, it doesn't make sense. We need more, a lot more immigrants. The 1.4 million figure is only 4 immigrants per 1000 of population.

Demographers and economists have been warning that the aging baby-boomer population presents a serious challenge to the nation’s finances, as the ratio of seniors to working-age adults—the age-dependency ratio—rises. However the problem is not just retirements but a shrinking birth rate. Without more young adults we not only face a seriously finance problem but a serious economic problem. Within a decade we will have a shortage 24 million workers and that number will continue to grow till at least 2050.

While many clamor for a halt to immigration, more immigrants are exactly what we need. They are younger, have a higher birth rate, and more entrepreneurial than native born Americans. Immigrants are the life blood of the nation as they have been in the past. Although more immigration means more cultural changes, that is nothing new to America because we are a melting pot of cultures.


I've never called for a halt to immigration, I do however think it is necessary to raise the quality of immigrants. They need to have skills that we need, they have to demonstrate they can support themselves. We can't continue to bring in impoverished, uneducated people who drop a kid and go immediately on welfare and food stamps and they don't tend to assimilate. I saw a man interviewed on the local news that had been in the country 23 years, he had to speak though an interpreter, he was here illegally.
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A better class of immigrants would be highly desirable. The problem of course is people with good job skills and education are the least likely to immigrate. However, I think there are things than can be done to encourage a better class of immigrants.
  • First we need to increase the number of visas for highly educated workers. There are not near enough to meet demand. Many students with post graduate degrees and experience in engineer and science are turned down every year because of their country of origin.
  • Second, we need to tell the world that we want and need educated skilled workers. We don't care about your country of origin, your race, or your religion. We are looking for well educated, skilled workers that can be an asset to America.
  • We need to restrict family immigration to the immediate family. Other immigration should be based on merit and limits should be raised.
Assimilation is a slow process. Typically taking several generation. First generation immigrants rarely assimilate. They learn what they need to learn to make a living in the US and to function in society. Second generation becomes the hyphen generation. Thrid generation approaches what Americans think of as assimilation.
The one thing we don't need is more H1-B visas. This country is flooded with high tech workers from India. wages in my field haven't increased for the last 15 years. Yeah, software companies keep talking about shortages, but that's because they like cheap labor.

Heh... cry me a river. Software pays quite well. We don't need the phony protectionism.
I have no idea what phone protectionism is. Controlling immigration is not protectionism. I fail to understand why anyone would support importing millions of people to compete for their jobs. Only a certifiable idiot would support that.
 
We can end these threads now. Trump says the wall is just about finished.

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump
Mexico is paying for the Wall through the new USMCA Trade Deal. Much of the Wall has already been fully renovated or built. We have done a lot of work. $5.6 Billion Dollars that House has approved is very little in comparison to the benefits of National Security. Quick payback!

5:35 AM - 2 Jan 2019
 
Then go home.

Need help packing?
lol. i am more native than You.
So you have some spearchucker in you?
i know where the mountains of the Caucasians are.
Good for you, now get back to the lawn.
with my native work ethic?
You're not an anchor baby, so not born here. And get your donkey out of the front yard.
 
I'd be all for upgrading Ellis Island with ovens. You want more than the minimum wage, then upgrade your skills, you fucking lazy lawnmower.
this is why I don't take the right wing seriously about morals, the law, politics, or economics.
If you want to be wrong, I don't care. And don't forget to trim the hedges.
you only have gossip and one way street-ism. not enough morals to go around on the right wing?
I'm enjoying watching the beaners get gassed at the border. Are they having fun yet?
i no longer take the right wing seriously in abortion threads.
I never took you seriously in any thread. I win.
 
I agree with both your points.

A wall will force or persuade people to seek an easier crossing. I think it's becoming pretty clear that there isn't going to be 2000, or even a 1000 mile mall completed. At most it will end up being about 200 mile of slatted fence with 1800 miles of reinforced fencing, cattle fencing, electronic monitoring, and aerial surveillance. Even if the "wall" were extended to 2000 miles, it wouldn't stop half the illegal crossing because most illegal entries will be at ports of entry. Less than 1% of vehicles are searched and only a small fraction of a percent of containers, boxcars or private planes are searched. Almost all of these searches are for drugs, not people.

Yes, reducing visa overstays, will require changes in the laws but it will also require a tracking system, and cooperation from sanctuary cities and states. In order to get changes in immigration laws needed to significantly reduce the number of illegal immigrants in the country, democrat votes in congress are going to be needed, and that's not going happen without changes that republicans are not going to like such sharp increases the number of temporary work permits and increased country limits.


1.4 million immigrate to the US annually, we take an additional 50K refugees and you think it's ok to continue to flood the country with additional people from the third world. Does that really make sense to you?
.
No, it doesn't make sense. We need more, a lot more immigrants. The 1.4 million figure is only 4 immigrants per 1000 of population.

Demographers and economists have been warning that the aging baby-boomer population presents a serious challenge to the nation’s finances, as the ratio of seniors to working-age adults—the age-dependency ratio—rises. However the problem is not just retirements but a shrinking birth rate. Without more young adults we not only face a seriously finance problem but a serious economic problem. Within a decade we will have a shortage 24 million workers and that number will continue to grow till at least 2050.

While many clamor for a halt to immigration, more immigrants are exactly what we need. They are younger, have a higher birth rate, and more entrepreneurial than native born Americans. Immigrants are the life blood of the nation as they have been in the past. Although more immigration means more cultural changes, that is nothing new to America because we are a melting pot of cultures.


I've never called for a halt to immigration, I do however think it is necessary to raise the quality of immigrants. They need to have skills that we need, they have to demonstrate they can support themselves. We can't continue to bring in impoverished, uneducated people who drop a kid and go immediately on welfare and food stamps and they don't tend to assimilate. I saw a man interviewed on the local news that had been in the country 23 years, he had to speak though an interpreter, he was here illegally.

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I was born in a very ethnic neighborhood and lived there until the age of 7. I distinctly remember how people off the boat would strive to learn the language of their new country. It meant just about everything to them. Of course people back then came here to become an American, not use America for the money or welfare.

Our local Catholic school held free English classes for the Polish immigrants. My Grandfather used to take us to the bar for chips and pop while he had a couple of beers, and American patrons were teaching the immigrant patrons the language. Most of the American people in the neighborhood were bilingual.

Our neighbors were off the boat too. My sister befriended the girl around her age and taught her English. My mother too was bilingual and spoke broken Polish, but certainly enough to easily communicate with the girl. That girl grew up and eventually became a Doctor.

Foreigners today couldn't have it easier when it comes to learning our language. If the people I observed back in the 60's could do it with very limited resources, there is no excuse how foreigners can't do it today given our much advanced technology.
I hate to break your bubble but immigrants today are no better or worst than those of the 19th and 20th century. Skilled workers, the educated, the middle class, don't leave their jobs, their homeland, their friends, and family to come to a strange new country. We certainly can attract a few "better class of immigrants" but most immigrants will always come from the lower socioeconomic class, the poor, the homeless, the wretched masses. It is from them that America was built.
So?

Why should we allow any of them to come in? How do we gain?
 
True, all illegals should be kicked out of the country.

How do you propose to accomplish that?

Change the penalty for being here. Make being here illegally a first degree felony with a minimum sentence of five years in prison for the first offense. That’s how.

Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com
Terrible idea for several reasons. First, it would not serve as deterrent for those that entered the country to escape poverty and crime in their home country which is a major reason they are here. Federal prison would be better than the alternative. Second, half of those arrested for being in the country illegally voluntarily accept deportation. Adding a mandatory prison sentence would send all these cases to court and fill federal prisons with non-violent offenders as well as saddling the government with the care thousands of children, pregnant women, and those with serious health problems. Lastly, hundreds of thousands of illegals are illegal because they are waiting on immigration court rulings.
 
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A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux
Ancde all wrong
 
lol. i am more native than You.
So you have some spearchucker in you?
i know where the mountains of the Caucasians are.
Good for you, now get back to the lawn.
with my native work ethic?
You're not an anchor baby, so not born here. And get your donkey out of the front yard.
who cares what "Caucasians away from their mountains, say"?
 
this is why I don't take the right wing seriously about morals, the law, politics, or economics.
If you want to be wrong, I don't care. And don't forget to trim the hedges.
you only have gossip and one way street-ism. not enough morals to go around on the right wing?
I'm enjoying watching the beaners get gassed at the border. Are they having fun yet?
i no longer take the right wing seriously in abortion threads.
I never took you seriously in any thread. I win.
so what; You have nothing but fallacy.
 
1.4 million immigrate to the US annually, we take an additional 50K refugees and you think it's ok to continue to flood the country with additional people from the third world. Does that really make sense to you?

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We don't have an immigration clause, it is a naturalization clause. We should have no illegals in the US.

True, all illegals should be kicked out of the country.
how socialist of you. why not simply fine them and make honest tourists of them. we don't have an immigration problem we have lousy naturalization policy.

They had every chance to be honest tourists, but they chose otherwise.

True, we don't have immigration problem, since immigration is about people who are permitted to be here. We have a problem with illegal aliens and criminals who do not belong here.
We don't have an immigration clause. We have an Express naturalization clause. We should have no illegals.


You might want to read Article 1, Section 9, Clause 1. That is the immigration clause.

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I've never called for a halt to immigration, I do however think it is necessary to raise the quality of immigrants. They need to have skills that we need, they have to demonstrate they can support themselves. We can't continue to bring in impoverished, uneducated people who drop a kid and go immediately on welfare and food stamps and they don't tend to assimilate. I saw a man interviewed on the local news that had been in the country 23 years, he had to speak though an interpreter, he was here illegally.

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If they can support themselves, all that means is that they will be taking a job from an American. We don't need any more immigrants, period, educated or not.


We have 9 million jobs available now, and you seem to have skipped over them having skills we need.

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If you want wages to go up, then you need to restrict the supply of labor. Expanding the supply of labor can't fail to make wages go down or remain stagnant.


You want businesses to flourish and be able to expand, they need to be able to fill positions with qualified people to do that. Merit based immigration is a win win for the country. This thing we're doing now is a big negative.
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Merit based immigration is invariably a point based system, based on such factors as education level, wealth, connection with the country, language fluency, existing job offer, or others. Of course the devil is in the details. Such a system could be used to severely limit immigration or increase it.

If such a system were used to provide better educated, better skilled workers in the numbers America will need in the future, then we would have to abandon the current country limits which could result in a large migration of Asians.


And that would be bad, how?

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True, all illegals should be kicked out of the country.

How do you propose to accomplish that?

Two steps: e-verify first, than cut sources of their income, entitlements, services, as second.
E-Verify is voluntary and is about 6 months behind immigration records which severely limits it's usefulness.

Federal law prohibits any federal assistance dollars being spent on illegal immigrants, this includes Social Security, Medicare, TANF, SNAP, federal housing assistance, etc which is why illegal immigrants receive very little public assistance. Federal dollars are used to assist children of illegal immigrants born in the US since they are US citizens. Free and Reduced lunch programs in schools are probably one the major violations of law because most schools don't track immigration status.


We're paying hospitals 4 billion a year to take care of illegals, once an illegal drops a kid, they are eligible for welfare and snap for the kid, other services also.

.
 
So you have some spearchucker in you?
i know where the mountains of the Caucasians are.
Good for you, now get back to the lawn.
with my native work ethic?
You're not an anchor baby, so not born here. And get your donkey out of the front yard.
who cares what "Caucasians away from their mountains, say"?
So you hate white people. Got it.
 
If you want to be wrong, I don't care. And don't forget to trim the hedges.
you only have gossip and one way street-ism. not enough morals to go around on the right wing?
I'm enjoying watching the beaners get gassed at the border. Are they having fun yet?
i no longer take the right wing seriously in abortion threads.
I never took you seriously in any thread. I win.
so what; You have nothing but fallacy.
I also have a country that your family wants to come to. I win again.
 
We still have a government shut down...and Trump is claiming it's because of a wall

But I guess the Trumpers don't want to talk about it any more since well...it's not actually a wall but a fence...and it's not actually going to run across the whole southern border...because ya know....like the sane ones of us have been saying...that would be a stupid waste of money that pretty much could never happen anyway
 
We're paying hospitals 4 billion a year to take care of illegals, once an illegal drops a kid, they are eligible for welfare and snap for the kid, other services also.

Right. The problems are the welfare state and birthright citizenship. We can address those issues without turning our country into a police state.
 
We're paying hospitals 4 billion a year to take care of illegals, once an illegal drops a kid, they are eligible for welfare and snap for the kid, other services also.

Right. The problems are the welfare state and birthright citizenship. We can address those issues without turning our country into a police state.


Enforcing laws doesn't make us a police state. And the commies will never allow the welfare state to be diminished.

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"If they think a wall is "immoral," then they're admitting it's effective. An ineffective wall would merely be a place for illegals to stop and get a little shade before continuing their march into the United States." --Ann Coulter
 
who cares what "Caucasians away from their mountains, say"?

No wonder you're commie. This perfectly explains you...

upload_2019-1-2_16-53-3.png
 

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