Why do people claim the military "risks their lives" to "protect our freedoms"?

[rightwinger]

The U.S. goes to war for many reasons

Security of people abroad, economic interests, protection of allies, nation building, ideology

Protecting the freedom of the American people is not one of them

 

[MikeK]

None so blind as they who will not see.

 

[Statistikhengst]

Ok. Looks like there are significant grievances here. Our Constitution allows for the petitioning of our government for the redress of grievances.

So how do you plan to do it?

Regards from Rosie

Lol. ... you let em have it, 11001100

Yours truly,

00110011



Gesendet von meinem GT-I9515 mit Tapatalk

Sir 00110011, yes Sir!

<snap to salute>

Truly Yours,
11001100

Now you did it. You have my binaries standing stiff at attention.
Bless the code. Bless the code, my dear 00110011.

 

[9thIDdoc]

I can't believe you are saying all that bullshit. You know Saddam and Bin Laden were enemies don't you? Do you know why? Let me know if you don't and I will explain it. Because the reason is the basis for the WTC bombings.

Don't know; don't care. Strictly beside the point.

 

[TSJohnson]

I can't believe you are saying all that bullshit. You know Saddam and Bin Laden were enemies don't you? Do you know why? Let me know if you don't and I will explain it. Because the reason is the basis for the WTC bombings.

Don't know; don't care. Strictly beside the point.

One was an Arab leader with legitimate grievances against the world's premiere bully. The other was also an Arab leader with legitimate grievances against the world's premiere bully. Saddam had nothing to do with the WTC bombings. It's unknown how much bin Ladin had to do with it.

 

[PratchettFan]

Right. You are so used to freedom you don't even realize it is there. I guess that is what happens when something is just handed to you. You never learn to value it.

Well, it's not "there", and I'm not use to anything close to it. Also, nothing has been handed to me. I've paid my dues, for many years. Oh, I value freedom, and fully understand what it is and what it means. The difference is, that I see and face reality instead of living in a fairy tale world, and accustom to how I'd like for it to be, as opposed to how it actually is. What dues have you paid?

I think you have no clue what it means, or you wouldn't think you don't have it. You apparently think it means you get to live your life without any kind of annoyance or possibility of unfairness. How horrible for you to exist under that sort of oppression. When the police take you and your family into the woods, shoot you in the back of the head and bury you in a mass grave, then you have cause for complaint. Right now, its just childish whining. Have fun with it. You live somewhere you can do that with no fear of being killed.

FYI - Police shoot and kill unarmed innocent people all the time. They brutalize people, and abuse their power and authority. They knock doors down and enter homes with no cause, and only in possession of a No-knock warrant. They detain innocent citizens, put them in hand cuffs, and put the in jail all the time. It's really come to the forefront in recent months, but has been going on for a long time. We now live in an age where cell phones are everywhere, and citizens are able to capture the actual events live and distribute them on the internet and allow various news media to air them on national TV. We have citizens detained at airports for no other reason than they look something like a person on some list. No, I'm not use to freedom. I do the same as most people, and that is watch what I do, where I go, and try not to have any contact with law enforcement. I understand the only difference between myself and those detained and brutalized, is the fact that I've been lucky and have managed to avoid situations where there might be a chance that things could go wrong. I've never ever had anything handed to me, never. I have paid my dues. You don't even know me, nor anything about me, yet you talk as though you've known me all of my life. Basically, you're like so many that can't discuss and debate issues without personal attacks and trying to turn the conversation on the person instead of keeping the conversation on the subject matter.

I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues" and you most definitely have had something handed to you, you just don't recognize it. Of course police arrest innocent people and shoot unarmed people. They are human beings and human beings make mistakes. You see that as taking away your freedom, but it is just what happens in an imperfect world. That is a huge difference from a pogrom.

But I will ask you - name me one freedom you had before you don't have now. Or one you think we had before we don't have now.

Those "mistakes" happen way too often, by way too many members of law enforcement. No, I've never had anything handed to be. And, I recognize it all. Freedoms not freedoms any longer: (1) Freedom to travel unrestricted within the United States. (2) Freedom of the press. (3) Freedom of speech. (4) Freedom to peacefully assemble. (5) Freedom from search and seizure. (6) Free to have private communication. (7) Free to carry large sums of cash. (8) Freedom to enter public land ( national parks ) without restriction. (9) Freedom to be on public sidewalks ( homeless ), or in public parks ( homeless ). (10) Freedom to sell home grown produce, etc. without permits, and restrictions.

Do a little research and see exactly what I'm talking about. The above list applies to some states, not all. And, it applies to some cities, not all. ( By the way, U.S.M.C. 1967-1970 )

I believe I told you I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues". You put on a uniform, did your time, took your chance and got paid for it. With 4 years in you were volunteer, as I was. You made your choice and I served with a lot of guys who had that choice made for them. But the only people from our era I might concede have paid their dues in full have their names etched on a wall in DC. The rest of us lucked out because people died to hand us the freedoms we have. It was our responsibility to do what we could to maintain them, but that doesn't make it any less a gift.

I don't give a damn about anyone thanking me for my service. I did it because I owed it to the country which has given me so much. As my father did, his father and his father before him. That service entitles me to nothing but the hope the next generation would do the same. What bugs me about the OP is that it treats freedom as an entitlement, rather than something to be fought for and protected. In so doing he cheapens it and cheapens the sacrifice of those who really did pay their dues.

As to the rest, rubbish. You are confusing being free with getting your own way.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Well, it's not "there", and I'm not use to anything close to it. Also, nothing has been handed to me. I've paid my dues, for many years. Oh, I value freedom, and fully understand what it is and what it means. The difference is, that I see and face reality instead of living in a fairy tale world, and accustom to how I'd like for it to be, as opposed to how it actually is. What dues have you paid?

I think you have no clue what it means, or you wouldn't think you don't have it. You apparently think it means you get to live your life without any kind of annoyance or possibility of unfairness. How horrible for you to exist under that sort of oppression. When the police take you and your family into the woods, shoot you in the back of the head and bury you in a mass grave, then you have cause for complaint. Right now, its just childish whining. Have fun with it. You live somewhere you can do that with no fear of being killed.

FYI - Police shoot and kill unarmed innocent people all the time. They brutalize people, and abuse their power and authority. They knock doors down and enter homes with no cause, and only in possession of a No-knock warrant. They detain innocent citizens, put them in hand cuffs, and put the in jail all the time. It's really come to the forefront in recent months, but has been going on for a long time. We now live in an age where cell phones are everywhere, and citizens are able to capture the actual events live and distribute them on the internet and allow various news media to air them on national TV. We have citizens detained at airports for no other reason than they look something like a person on some list. No, I'm not use to freedom. I do the same as most people, and that is watch what I do, where I go, and try not to have any contact with law enforcement. I understand the only difference between myself and those detained and brutalized, is the fact that I've been lucky and have managed to avoid situations where there might be a chance that things could go wrong. I've never ever had anything handed to me, never. I have paid my dues. You don't even know me, nor anything about me, yet you talk as though you've known me all of my life. Basically, you're like so many that can't discuss and debate issues without personal attacks and trying to turn the conversation on the person instead of keeping the conversation on the subject matter.

I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues" and you most definitely have had something handed to you, you just don't recognize it. Of course police arrest innocent people and shoot unarmed people. They are human beings and human beings make mistakes. You see that as taking away your freedom, but it is just what happens in an imperfect world. That is a huge difference from a pogrom.

But I will ask you - name me one freedom you had before you don't have now. Or one you think we had before we don't have now.

Those "mistakes" happen way too often, by way too many members of law enforcement. No, I've never had anything handed to be. And, I recognize it all. Freedoms not freedoms any longer: (1) Freedom to travel unrestricted within the United States. (2) Freedom of the press. (3) Freedom of speech. (4) Freedom to peacefully assemble. (5) Freedom from search and seizure. (6) Free to have private communication. (7) Free to carry large sums of cash. (8) Freedom to enter public land ( national parks ) without restriction. (9) Freedom to be on public sidewalks ( homeless ), or in public parks ( homeless ). (10) Freedom to sell home grown produce, etc. without permits, and restrictions.

Do a little research and see exactly what I'm talking about. The above list applies to some states, not all. And, it applies to some cities, not all. ( By the way, U.S.M.C. 1967-1970 )

I believe I told you I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues". You put on a uniform, did your time, took your chance and got paid for it. With 4 years in you were volunteer, as I was. You made your choice and I served with a lot of guys who had that choice made for them. But the only people from our era I might concede have paid their dues in full have their names etched on a wall in DC. The rest of us lucked out because people died to hand us the freedoms we have. It was our responsibility to do what we could to maintain them, but that doesn't make it any less a gift.

I don't give a damn about anyone thanking me for my service. I did it because I owed it to the country which has given me so much. As my father did, his father and his father before him. That service entitles me to nothing but the hope the next generation would do the same. What bugs me about the OP is that it treats freedom as an entitlement, rather than something to be fought for and protected. In so doing he cheapens it and cheapens the sacrifice of those who really did pay their dues.

As to the rest, rubbish. You are confusing being free with getting your own way.

I understand. We can agree to disagree. Disagreement is not a sin. We see it differently, and that's fine. I respect your opinion and your right to express it. By the way, I was sent notice that I was about to be drafted into the Army, so I signed up for the Marine Corps instead. So, no, I did not volunteer. I was drafted, but chose a different branch of the service in order to get a better deal.

 

[9thIDdoc]

The U.S. goes to war for many reasons

Security of people abroad, economic interests, protection of allies, nation building, ideology

Protecting the freedom of the American people is not one of them

Untrue.

 

[9thIDdoc]

One was an Arab leader with legitimate grievances against the world's premiere bully. The other was also an Arab leader with legitimate grievances against the world's premiere bully. Saddam had nothing to do with the WTC bombings. It's unknown how much bin Ladin had to do with it

Both were scumbag terrorists who needed killing.

 

[TSJohnson]

I believe I told you I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues". You put on a uniform, did your time, took your chance and got paid for it. With 4 years in you were volunteer, as I was. You made your choice and I served with a lot of guys who had that choice made for them. But the only people from our era I might concede have paid their dues in full have their names etched on a wall in DC. The rest of us lucked out because people died to hand us the freedoms we have. It was our responsibility to do what we could to maintain them, but that doesn't make it any less a gift.

I don't give a damn about anyone thanking me for my service. I did it because I owed it to the country which has given me so much. As my father did, his father and his father before him. That service entitles me to nothing but the hope the next generation would do the same. What bugs me about the OP is that it treats freedom as an entitlement, rather than something to be fought for and protected. In so doing he cheapens it and cheapens the sacrifice of those who really did pay their dues.

As to the rest, rubbish. You are confusing being free with getting your own way.

There are no "dues" to pay. You don't owe Murica for being born here. You don't owe anybody your thanks or blood or life just because you're free. That's the exact opposite of being free. Freedom is an inherent human right - it is an entitlement by definition. You're entitled to be free, to have food and water and shelter, to believe and live as you choose. If you don't like that then take it up with the UN.

 

[PratchettFan]

I think you have no clue what it means, or you wouldn't think you don't have it. You apparently think it means you get to live your life without any kind of annoyance or possibility of unfairness. How horrible for you to exist under that sort of oppression. When the police take you and your family into the woods, shoot you in the back of the head and bury you in a mass grave, then you have cause for complaint. Right now, its just childish whining. Have fun with it. You live somewhere you can do that with no fear of being killed.

FYI - Police shoot and kill unarmed innocent people all the time. They brutalize people, and abuse their power and authority. They knock doors down and enter homes with no cause, and only in possession of a No-knock warrant. They detain innocent citizens, put them in hand cuffs, and put the in jail all the time. It's really come to the forefront in recent months, but has been going on for a long time. We now live in an age where cell phones are everywhere, and citizens are able to capture the actual events live and distribute them on the internet and allow various news media to air them on national TV. We have citizens detained at airports for no other reason than they look something like a person on some list. No, I'm not use to freedom. I do the same as most people, and that is watch what I do, where I go, and try not to have any contact with law enforcement. I understand the only difference between myself and those detained and brutalized, is the fact that I've been lucky and have managed to avoid situations where there might be a chance that things could go wrong. I've never ever had anything handed to me, never. I have paid my dues. You don't even know me, nor anything about me, yet you talk as though you've known me all of my life. Basically, you're like so many that can't discuss and debate issues without personal attacks and trying to turn the conversation on the person instead of keeping the conversation on the subject matter.

I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues" and you most definitely have had something handed to you, you just don't recognize it. Of course police arrest innocent people and shoot unarmed people. They are human beings and human beings make mistakes. You see that as taking away your freedom, but it is just what happens in an imperfect world. That is a huge difference from a pogrom.

But I will ask you - name me one freedom you had before you don't have now. Or one you think we had before we don't have now.

Those "mistakes" happen way too often, by way too many members of law enforcement. No, I've never had anything handed to be. And, I recognize it all. Freedoms not freedoms any longer: (1) Freedom to travel unrestricted within the United States. (2) Freedom of the press. (3) Freedom of speech. (4) Freedom to peacefully assemble. (5) Freedom from search and seizure. (6) Free to have private communication. (7) Free to carry large sums of cash. (8) Freedom to enter public land ( national parks ) without restriction. (9) Freedom to be on public sidewalks ( homeless ), or in public parks ( homeless ). (10) Freedom to sell home grown produce, etc. without permits, and restrictions.

Do a little research and see exactly what I'm talking about. The above list applies to some states, not all. And, it applies to some cities, not all. ( By the way, U.S.M.C. 1967-1970 )

I believe I told you I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues". You put on a uniform, did your time, took your chance and got paid for it. With 4 years in you were volunteer, as I was. You made your choice and I served with a lot of guys who had that choice made for them. But the only people from our era I might concede have paid their dues in full have their names etched on a wall in DC. The rest of us lucked out because people died to hand us the freedoms we have. It was our responsibility to do what we could to maintain them, but that doesn't make it any less a gift.

I don't give a damn about anyone thanking me for my service. I did it because I owed it to the country which has given me so much. As my father did, his father and his father before him. That service entitles me to nothing but the hope the next generation would do the same. What bugs me about the OP is that it treats freedom as an entitlement, rather than something to be fought for and protected. In so doing he cheapens it and cheapens the sacrifice of those who really did pay their dues.

As to the rest, rubbish. You are confusing being free with getting your own way.

I understand. We can agree to disagree. Disagreement is not a sin. We see it differently, and that's fine. I respect your opinion and your right to express it. By the way, I was sent notice that I was about to be drafted into the Army, so I signed up for the Marine Corps instead. So, no, I did not volunteer. I was drafted, but chose a different branch of the service in order to get a better deal.

Regardless of why you volunteered, you volunteered. I have no problem with disagreement. That is the nature of real freedom - there is lots of disagreement. Freedom is messy. I think you're wrong, but one of the reasons I put on that uniform was to make sure you had the right to stand up and be wrong at the top of your lungs without fear.

Whether you think we have lost our freedoms or not, the real point that people just don't seem to get is that the very presence of our military is an assurance of those freedoms. The civilian authorities may well misuse that tool, but that does not change its primary purpose. You and I both sit at our computers and write whatever we please in an open forum because young men and women take up arms and stand a post. Those who think that doesn't matter can do so because those kids stand a post. I doubt they give a damn about thanks either, but I sure am thankful for them. I'm thankful for you as well, because you stood a post.

 

[PratchettFan]

I believe I told you I don't care whether or not you have "paid your dues". You put on a uniform, did your time, took your chance and got paid for it. With 4 years in you were volunteer, as I was. You made your choice and I served with a lot of guys who had that choice made for them. But the only people from our era I might concede have paid their dues in full have their names etched on a wall in DC. The rest of us lucked out because people died to hand us the freedoms we have. It was our responsibility to do what we could to maintain them, but that doesn't make it any less a gift.

I don't give a damn about anyone thanking me for my service. I did it because I owed it to the country which has given me so much. As my father did, his father and his father before him. That service entitles me to nothing but the hope the next generation would do the same. What bugs me about the OP is that it treats freedom as an entitlement, rather than something to be fought for and protected. In so doing he cheapens it and cheapens the sacrifice of those who really did pay their dues.

As to the rest, rubbish. You are confusing being free with getting your own way.

There are no "dues" to pay. You don't owe Murica for being born here. You don't owe anybody your thanks or blood or life just because you're free. That's the exact opposite of being free. Freedom is an inherent human right - it is an entitlement by definition. You're entitled to be free, to have food and water and shelter, to believe and live as you choose. If you don't like that then take it up with the UN.

That is the philosophy of a leech.

 

[Mr. President]

Freedom is an inherent human right. And unless a force to be reckoned with preserves that right a tyrant will interpret his or her freedom to mean freedom to persecute those who he/she does not deem worthy. You do not owe anyone anything for your freedoms, but through sacrifice you may ensure those freedoms for the next generation. The real issue is that people live in a magical world where inherent rights are free. Just the opposite, inherent rights are costly because they contradict the natural instinct of man to rule.

 

[rightwinger]

Freedom is an inherent human right. And unless a force to be reckoned with preserves that right a tyrant will interpret his or her freedom to mean freedom to persecute those who he/she does not deem worthy. You do not owe anyone anything for your freedoms, but through sacrifice you may ensure those freedoms for the next generation. The real issue is that people live in a magical world where inherent rights are free. Just the opposite, inherent rights are costly because they contradict the natural instinct of man to rule.

Freedoms just another word for nothin else to lose

 

[ChrisL]

Freedom is an inherent human right. And unless a force to be reckoned with preserves that right a tyrant will interpret his or her freedom to mean freedom to persecute those who he/she does not deem worthy. You do not owe anyone anything for your freedoms, but through sacrifice you may ensure those freedoms for the next generation. The real issue is that people live in a magical world where inherent rights are free. Just the opposite, inherent rights are costly because they contradict the natural instinct of man to rule.

Freedoms just another word for nothin else to lose

Er, no it is not. Mr. President's post was correct.

 

[rightwinger]

Freedom is an inherent human right. And unless a force to be reckoned with preserves that right a tyrant will interpret his or her freedom to mean freedom to persecute those who he/she does not deem worthy. You do not owe anyone anything for your freedoms, but through sacrifice you may ensure those freedoms for the next generation. The real issue is that people live in a magical world where inherent rights are free. Just the opposite, inherent rights are costly because they contradict the natural instinct of man to rule.

Freedoms just another word for nothin else to lose

Er, no it is not. Mr. President's post was correct.

Maybe not....but its Good enough for me and my Bobby McGhee

 

[cnm]

Freedom is an inherent human right. And unless a force to be reckoned with preserves that right a tyrant will interpret his or her freedom to mean freedom to persecute those who he/she does not deem worthy. You do not owe anyone anything for your freedoms, but through sacrifice you may ensure those freedoms for the next generation. The real issue is that people live in a magical world where inherent rights are free. Just the opposite, inherent rights are costly because they contradict the natural instinct of man to rule.

That's merely a rationalisation for the imposition of the US on other nations, the Philippines for example.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Works for me.

 

[cnm]

As in, the Philippine leaders failed their people by not keeping the imperialist US from trampling on the Philippine people's inherent rights.

 

[9thIDdoc]

As in, the Philippines leaders failed their people by not keeping the imperialist US from trampling on the Philippine people's inherent rights.

Strictly a matter of opinion. Maybe the US prevents Philippine "leaders" from trampling on the rights of the people. Actually I think the Japanese were probably the biggest rights trampler and we helped send them packing.