Why Didn't NY's "Red Flag Law" not apply to Payton S. Gendron (Buffalo Shooter) in 2021?

[Pellinore]

These laws need to be on the federal level, anyone talking hate speech should not be allowed to buy weapons and definitely not be allowed to buy body armor cuz then you know what they're only intent is. That's a" " DEAD " giveaway.

Banning or restricting the sale of body armor is an angle I sure haven't thought of. What would be the argument against it? It certainly isn't used for hunting or for sport.

 

[Stann]

Most of the ones that are outright evil seem to be white supremacists. Eric Harris from Columbine was a true-blue psychopath, but otherwise there sure are a lot of shot-up synagogues and Black church prayer meetings and Latino area Wal-Marts. Histories of domestic abuse show up an awful lot, too.

And there's the mental health. Unfortunately, the way we find out that many of their mental health issues manifest violently is when they open fire. When they do go over that edge, they could use a bomb or a car or a claw hammer or something, but even the most die-hard NRA recruiter has to admit that nothing is as easy and effective as a gun. That's why they're around at all.

The US is filthy rich and full of smart people. I refuse to believe that if we stopped bitching back and forth about it and got down to business, we could come up with a system by which an 18-year-old walking danger sign who has been threatening a mass killing for years is denied a firearm, but the 99% of law-abiders don't get stripped of their rights.

Correct, that's why there has to be a federal coordinating agency on all this. States keep missing things left and right.

 

[Stann]

Banning or restricting the sale of body armor is an angle I sure haven't thought of. What would be the argument against it? It certainly isn't used for hunting or for sport.

Right, a child could see this coming. It's only value outside the military is for criminals to do more damage.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

And that creep should have never been able to buy body armor, his whole history was a red flag.

how are you going to stop someone from buy body armor? It can be ordered over the internet.

 

[Stann]

how are you going to stop someone from buy body armor? It can be ordered over the internet.

 

[Stann]

There are many things you cannot buy over the internet. This would be just one more restricted item.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

There are many things you cannot buy over the internet. This would be just one more restricted item.

Based upon what law? Why should it be illegal?

 

[Stann]

Based upon what law? Why should it be illegal?

Obvious threat to society.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Obvious threat to society.

My son recently bought some, he is 20 and thinks it is cool. Plus he wants to be ready when society falls. What is the threat he poses by owning it?

 

[Stann]

My son recently bought some, he is 20 and thinks it is cool. Plus he wants to be ready when society falls. What is the threat he poses by owning it?

I would say your son is a little crazy, as you probably are, and you both should be on the watch list.

 

[Polishprince]

In August of 2019, New York’s “red flag” law went into effect. The law allows a court to issue an Extreme Risk Protection Order (“ERPO”). An ERPO prevents those who show signs of being a risk to themselves or others from purchasing or possessing a firearm....... NY's ‘Red Flag’ Law: Extreme Risk Protection Orders to Remove Guns

I do not approve of Red Flag laws on general principle and the Buffalo shooter is just another reason why. They simply don't work as intended....They seem more tailored towards the "me too" movement than anything else.

NY's much ballyhooed "Extreme Rick Protection Order" (ERPO) "Red Flag Law" did shit-all to help prevent the shooting that unfolded yesterday even though NY's state police made contact with the shooter in 2021, almost a year ago.

In June 2021, police in Broome County were called by officials of a local high school who told them Gendron had threatened violence in comments made to fellow students.

“A school official reported that this very troubled young man had made statements indicating that he wanted to do a shooting, either at a graduation ceremony, or sometime after”.

State Police were sent to investigate and Gendron, under a section of state mental health laws, was referred for a mental health evaluation and counseling, the official said.

Gunman, 18, drove more than 3 hours to Buffalo to commit hate crime, officials say

It remains to be seen if a ERPO was ever issued or followed up on....The same can be said of the mental health evaluation and counseling....NY officials have a lot to answer for on this one.....Thing is NY will just double down on stupid with more ineffective laws.

​

The purpose of Red Flag laws is to punish those who the government wants to punish- not protect anyone. Since Mr. Gendron wasn't a threat to Fredo and the rest of the Democrat establishment in New York, he wasn't going to be targeted with this.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I would say your son is a little crazy, as you probably are, and you both should be on the watch list.

And you are the very reason I would not be ok with these types of laws, you have no basic idea of what freedom or liberty are.

You want to punish the innocent for the actions of the criminals.

I did not give 20 years of my life to this country via the Marine Corps to have people like you take away rights and freedoms because you are afraid.

 

[Pellinore]

So the AP has an article about this exact subject today. It includes the line:

Federal law bars people from owning guns if a judge has determined they have a “mental defect” or they have been forced into a mental institution — but an evaluation alone would not trigger the prohibition.

Buffalo shooter's prior threat, hospital stay under scrutiny

BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) — The white gunman accused of committing a racist massacre at a Buffalo supermarket made threatening comments that brought police to his high school last spring, but he was never charged with a crime and had no further contact with law enforcement after his release from a...

apnews.com

This kid threatened his school, the police paid him a visit, and he had a day and a half in an institution, apparently being 'evaluated.' However, since his threats were determined to be general in nature, and he was under 18 at the time, that was that, until yesterday.

Here's the question: Should they re-evaluate the law so that an evaluation triggers the red flag? Temporarily or permanently?

 

[Stann]

And you are the very reason I would not be ok with these types of laws, you have no basic idea of what freedom or liberty are.

You want to punish the innocent for the actions of the criminals.

I did not give 20 years of my life to this country via the Marine Corps to have people like you take away rights and freedoms because you are afraid.

You seem to be well aware of your privileges and rights, but not your duties and obligations to your nation.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

You seem to be well aware of your privileges and rights, but not your duties and obligations to your nation.

I fully understand my duties and obligations to this nation, thus the 20 years spent serving it.

 

[Stann]

I fully understand my duties and obligations to this nation, thus the 20 years spent serving it.

I joined the Air Force during the Vietnam war, the war was ending, they offered early out to anybody who wanted them, I took advantage of that. Then you fully understand the government can and will tackle problems that fit the people face. The solutions don't always please everyone but they're in the interest of public safety.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

The solutions don't always please everyone but they're in the interest of public safety.

And they can take that way too far. We should not punish the innocent due to the actions of the criminals

 

[Stann]

And they can take that way too far. We should not punish the innocent due to the actions of the criminals

Here's the logical compromise, stop their sales on the Internet, but allow law-abiding citizens to get a special permit and as long as they qualify, they can get them in person wherever they're available.

 

[Flash]

Gun control laws never stop criminals from using guns in crime. All gun control laws do is deprive law abiding citizens from their Constitutional rights.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Here's the logical compromise, stop their sales on the Internet, but allow law-abiding citizens to get a special permit and as long as they qualify, they can get them in person wherever they're available.

Which puts the burden on the law-abiding citizen to prove they are innocent and get a permit for something the Govt has no business limiting.

We have this same shit with Allegra. It was found to be used to make Meth so now I have to show a ID to buy it and am limited in how much I can buy...which was not enough for a family of 4 in allergy season