Why counting illegal aliens in the Census is wrong explained calmly and clearly in a video

[MisterBeale]

True, but the language used in the Constitution, we all play freeze frame and get counted, then go back to playing.

So I should add, one can disagree if they selectively choose to enforce the law passed by the appropriate authorities.


If that is the case, an administration could just choose to never do a census again. . .

 

[MisterBeale]

I don’t. Why do you?

Like many leftists, they don't hate it, they just want it selectively enforced.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Illegals are not US citizens. It's really that simple

 

[Winston]

Why counting illegal aliens in the Census is wrong explained calmly and clearly in a video, and related matters.



This ^ is a cool, calm and accurate statement about how and why it is wrong to count illegal aliens in the Census for purposes of representation in the House and, thus, for the electoral college.

I agree with it. And I’m curious who can honestly and logically disagree with it. And why?

If illegal aliens get “counted” for other things, such as figuring out ahead of time what resources a State might need, that’s also problematic, too (although more understandable). But to allow (as in the example) California to increase its sway over national legislation by rewarding California’s willing acceptance of illegal aliens and encouragement of illegal immigration is simply wrong.

Thoughts? (I mean thoughts about the video. It would be cool to see any thread stay on the actual topic.)

The video was lame, Basically, California has a bunch of illegals and thereby they get more Congressional representatives and more electoral college votes. Well, Texas and Florida both have a bunch of illegal immigrants too. Texas, 1.6 million illegal immigrants, 6% of the population. Which is possibly a higher percentage than California. Nevada is looking at an illegal immigration population that is over 7% of their total population.

But you are looking for reasons. First, the US Census has always counted everyone, since the very first one in 1790. Sure, I know, the whole 3/5th compromise thing. But those slaves were counted. Women were counted and yet they could not vote. Children are counted, they cannot vote.

But second, believe it or not, a representative's job is to represent all the people in the district. Not just the citizens, not just the people that voted for him. And surprisingly enough, not just the people that stroked his or her's campaign a big ass check. Although it sure looks like that most of the time, on both sides of the aisle.

And a note here, no Senators are not suppose to represent the interest of their respective state. They are supposed to be the learned, the wise, and should be chosen on their ability to look at the big picture, not be front side focused on their state. Hell, it was why the founders set it up so that they were appointed, not elected. But like many things, that kind of went off the rails within the first one hundred years.

But perhaps most important of all, there is this thing called the Constitution, and it has amendments, like the 14th.

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed.

Are illegal immigrants not whole? Are they not persons? Are they not taxed? I mean what is your argument here?

 

[Edgetho]

. . oh, and I suppose denial of what the Constitution states.

Interpretation of The Constitution requires an understanding of the INTENT of the Framers.

Since there was no problem with Illegal Aliens back then, there can be no intent to interpret.

dimocrap FILTH are just using an oversight by the Framers to their own devious amd Anti-American Advantage.

There was/is nothing in the COTUS about The People having Automatic Weapons or .50 Cal Machine Guns. Or M1 Tanks, or Napalm. Or any number of other rights not delineated or restricted.

So SCOTUS had to determine "Intent''. And mix that with reality.

Since dimocraps are the scum of the Earth, every last one of them, they use oversights when they're to their advantage without regard to what's best for America and Americans.

When SCOTUS invents and manufactures a 'Right' out of thin air -- Privacy -- dimocrap FILTH applaud because it suits their agenda. And because they are scum.

When SCOTUS is too cowardly to act on a problem that simply didn't exist in 1789, dimocrap FILTH take advantage and lie. Without regard to what's best for America and Americans and the realities of Modern Life. They do this because --

dimocraps are scum

 

[ozro]

Illegals should be counted only to make decisions concerning where immigration enforcement agents are needed the most.

 

[Edgetho]

Illegals are not US citizens. It's really that simple

Citizenship is not relevant to me in this case. They are here ILLEGALLY. THAT is the relevant part. If they were here on a legal Visa or Green Card or Work Permit or Student Visa, that would be one thing. But they are here ILLEGALLY. They are, by definition, criminal illegal aliens.

Only an idiot or a dimocrap scumbag would think counting them in our Census is anything but wrong.

 

[MisterBeale]

Actually the way a person disagrees with it from a legal standpoint isn't "emotion", it's to quote the language of the Constitution.

WW

Agreed.

Please quote the language that allows states and municipalities to protect non-naturalized people from federal immigration and naturalization laws passed by Congress.

 

[Winston]

Illegals are not US citizens. It's really that simple

So, the founders, in the Constitution, said only citizens should be counted? Uh NO.

Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.

Rather one was a citizen or not was not even a question of the first Census. The total number of people enumerated was just shy of four million. Without a doubt, hundreds of thousands of them were not citizens, were foreign born, and had not been naturalized. Probably, more than half were female. The majority of those counted did not own property. And then there is that damn pesky 14th amendment.

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed.

The Constitution, including the amendments, is the supreme law of the land. You don't get to violate it to get what you want. Every member of Congress, of the Senate, the President, and the Vice-president, swear an oath, to DEFEND the Constitution, not ignore it when it suits their purposes.

 

[Winston]

Agreed.

Please quote the language that allows states and municipalities to protect non-naturalized people from federal immigration and naturalization laws passed by Congress.

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[MisterBeale]

Interpretation of The Constitution requires an understanding of the INTENT of the Framers.

Since there was no problem with Illegal Aliens back then, there can be no intent to interpret.

dimocrap FILTH are just using an oversight by the Framers to their own devious amd Anti-American Advantage.

There was/is nothing in the COTUS about The People having Automatic Weapons or .50 Cal Machine Guns. Or M1 Tanks, or Napalm. Or any number of other rights not delineated or restricted.

So SCOTUS had to determine "Intent''. And mix that with reality.

Since dimocraps are the scum of the Earth, every last one of them, they use oversights when they're to their advantage without regard to what's best for America and Americans.

When SCOTUS invents and manufactures a 'Right' out of thin air -- Privacy -- dimocrap FILTH applaud because it suits their agenda. And because they are scum.

When SCOTUS is too cowardly to act on a problem that simply didn't exist in 1789, dimocrap FILTH take advantage and lie. Without regard to what's best for America and Americans and the realities of Modern Life. They do this because --

dimocraps are scum

I'd like to agree with what you post, you make some good points, but black and white thinking is fallacious.

Splitting (psychology) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Tulsi and RFKjr. were democrats, and you felt the same when they were.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

So, the founders, in the Constitution, said only citizens should be counted? Uh NO.

Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.

Rather one was a citizen or not was not even a question of the first Census. The total number of people enumerated was just shy of four million. Without a doubt, hundreds of thousands of them were not citizens, were foreign born, and had not been naturalized. Probably, more than half were female. The majority of those counted did not own property. And then there is that damn pesky 14th amendment.

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed.

The Constitution, including the amendments, is the supreme law of the land. You don't get to violate it to get what you want. Every member of Congress, of the Senate, the President, and the Vice-president, swear an oath, to DEFEND the Constitution, not ignore it when it suits their purposes.

You're annoying, stop being annoying

 

[Orangecat]

The Constitution does not agree.

As if you can read.

 

[MisterBeale]

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If a state legislature decided to fund and build an army to invade Canada, this case could be used to justify such behavior.

Just stahp please.

 

[WorldWatcher]

The Census has its purposes. But giving more House Representatives to States which encourage illegal immigration to artificially swell their “population” does not appear to have been even considered.

Therefore, why would it be wrong to returning to a period where all people were counted for some purposes but only counting citizens would be the method of apportioning Representation in the House and, thus, also the total EC vote?

I'm not disagreeing with considering it.

I'm saying that after such consideration that the Constitution should and can be amended to reflect the change.

Unless of course some people consider the Constitution to be a living, breathing document that can be ignored when they don't like something. Which is a pretty liberal viewpoint.

WW

 

[WorldWatcher]

Illegals are not US citizens. It's really that simple

Which has nothing to do with the Constitutional requirement to count all persons.

It's really that simple.

WW

 

[Hafar1014]

It states to count all...The only exception is the untaxed indians.

It says person not illegal person

 

[WorldWatcher]

Agreed.

Please quote the language that allows states and municipalities to protect non-naturalized people from federal immigration and naturalization laws passed by Congress.

#1 Non-naturalized != Illegal.

#2 Move the goal posts much.

Why would you assume that I think that states and municipalities get to "protect" non-naturalized citizens?

Are non-naturalized persons (legal or illegal) are still subject to the law and it's protections. Meaning equal treatment and due process guaranteed by the Constitution to all persons.

If said persons are here illegally, then deport them. If they are working illegally, arrest the employer.

WW

 

[Orangecat]

I'd prefer that only citizens were counted, but whatever the case it should be addressed through legislation. Perhaps until then a compromise could be reached that illegals be counted as three fifths a person.

In the meantime, Trump can sign an EO that designates all illegals as untaxed Indians.

 

[rightwinger]

Really? The Constitution contemplated and allowed the “counting” of a massive influx of illegal aliens for purposes of Congressional and Electoral College purposes?

Please share with us all, if you’d be so kind, which Article, Clause, Section or Amendment supports your claim.

The Constitution considered and allowed the counting of slaves, didn’t make it right

They knew the meaning of words and used the term persons instead of citizens