Why Can't the Pro-Choice Crowd Be Honest?

[Anguille]

If there's no cause to punish the woman, then abortion cannot be considered murder. By anyone rational anyway.

Kudos to you for having the patience to try to reason with these wackos.

Sadly, I find it fun.

 

[JBeukema]

No, it was your claim that there is no difference whatsoever between a fertilized egg and ME,

and therefore there is no difference in killing either one.

So you can't tell me what the difference is?

So far all you've been able to do is give them the same general name.

A fertilized human egg is 2 cells with its genetic material virtually the only thing it has in common with a born human being.

Do you deny that's the only similarity? Other than your name for them?

Fail.

The ovum, once fertilized, ceases to be an ovum. The two gametes (ovum and spermatozoon) form a zygote. The zygote is the first stage of human development. We start out as a single cell. Then comes cleavage and we become two cells. Then four, then eight, then 16, and so on.

Did they not have sex ed when you were in school? Go to the library and ask for a book on embryology and human embryogenesis.

If killing some people is okay and killing others isn't, what is the difference?

If it has something to do with the person's age, then at what age does killing you go from being an okay thing to a not okay thing? At what point does what change that makes killing you in cold blood no longer okay?

 

[Ravi]

Does anyone else wish that Buttemia had been aborted?

 

[NYcarbineer]

So you can't tell me what the difference is?

A fertilized human egg is 2 cells with its genetic material virtually the only thing it has in common with a born human being.

Do you deny that's the only similarity? Other than your name for them?

Fail.

The ovum, once fertilized, ceases to be an ovum. The two gametes (ovum and spermatozoon) form a zygote. The zygote is the first stage of human development. We start out as a single cell. Then comes cleavage and we become two cells. Then four, then eight, then 16, and so on.

Did they not have sex ed when you were in school? Go to the library and ask for a book on embryology and human embryogenesis.

If killing some people is okay and killing others isn't, what is the difference?

If it has something to do with the person's age, then at what age does killing you go from being an okay thing to a not okay thing? At what point does what change that makes killing you in cold blood no longer okay?

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

You have offered no similarity other than the genetic material in the cells. That is an immaterial difference.

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

That is absolutely false, since there is no material similarity between a fertilized egg and a born human.

You have offered nothing material to prove they are identical. In form, a fertilized human egg is far more similar to the fertilized egg of many non-human species than it is to a fully grown human being.

The case for declaring the killing of that fertilized egg to be no different than the killing of a born human is without material support.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Oh for the record, Beukema said in post 100 that a woman having an abortion would probably be best described as manslaughter.

 

[Mr Liberty]

If the anti-abortion folk would work to mandate sex education and birth control availabilty in our society the way we do sports trivia and automobile ownership, then abortion would indeed be a rarity that would STILL be a private choice by the individual.

Instead, you get a bunch of hysterical, idealogical clowns with mantras like "sex educaton promotes promiscuity and STD's" and the like over the decades.

Bottom line: you don't like what your neighbor is doing in their bedroom or with their doctor, THEN MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS....because all the racial, class, religious and social prejudices will be waiting for all those new borns who no one wanted or want to know about as they grow up.

I have always promoted sexual education and support pregnancy prevention. I don't think you should be able to use abortion as birth control. That is what their doing. Is it right to take drugs while pregnant? No, Because it can harm the baby. If it is morally wrong to harm the baby at any point during development, then it is wrong to kill it.

 

[AllieBaba]

A fertilized human egg is 2 cells with its genetic material virtually the only thing it has in common with a born human being.

Do you deny that's the only similarity? Other than your name for them?

Fail.

The ovum, once fertilized, ceases to be an ovum. The two gametes (ovum and spermatozoon) form a zygote. The zygote is the first stage of human development. We start out as a single cell. Then comes cleavage and we become two cells. Then four, then eight, then 16, and so on.

Did they not have sex ed when you were in school? Go to the library and ask for a book on embryology and human embryogenesis.

If killing some people is okay and killing others isn't, what is the difference?

If it has something to do with the person's age, then at what age does killing you go from being an okay thing to a not okay thing? At what point does what change that makes killing you in cold blood no longer okay?

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

You have offered no similarity other than the genetic material in the cells. That is an immaterial difference.

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

That is absolutely false, since there is no material similarity between a fertilized egg and a born human.

You have offered nothing material to prove they are identical. In form, a fertilized human egg is far more similar to the fertilized egg of many non-human species than it is to a fully grown human being.

The case for declaring the killing of that fertilized egg to be no different than the killing of a born human is without material support.

You used material three times in that.

And I don't believe he said they were identical. I don't think anybody said that.

Do you want to try again without attributing false assertions?

 

[JBeukema]

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

Do cite that claim

why can't you people ever not lie?

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

Did I? Please cite the post in question and read it very carefully and slowly

 

[JBeukema]

Fail.

The ovum, once fertilized, ceases to be an ovum. The two gametes (ovum and spermatozoon) form a zygote. The zygote is the first stage of human development. We start out as a single cell. Then comes cleavage and we become two cells. Then four, then eight, then 16, and so on.

Did they not have sex ed when you were in school? Go to the library and ask for a book on embryology and human embryogenesis.

If killing some people is okay and killing others isn't, what is the difference?

If it has something to do with the person's age, then at what age does killing you go from being an okay thing to a not okay thing? At what point does what change that makes killing you in cold blood no longer okay?

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

You have offered no similarity other than the genetic material in the cells. That is an immaterial difference.

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

That is absolutely false, since there is no material similarity between a fertilized egg and a born human.

You have offered nothing material to prove they are identical. In form, a fertilized human egg is far more similar to the fertilized egg of many non-human species than it is to a fully grown human being.

The case for declaring the killing of that fertilized egg to be no different than the killing of a born human is without material support.

You used material three times in that.

And I don't believe he said they were identical. I don't think anybody said that.

Do you want to try again without attributing false assertions?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Fail.

The ovum, once fertilized, ceases to be an ovum. The two gametes (ovum and spermatozoon) form a zygote. The zygote is the first stage of human development. We start out as a single cell. Then comes cleavage and we become two cells. Then four, then eight, then 16, and so on.

Did they not have sex ed when you were in school? Go to the library and ask for a book on embryology and human embryogenesis.

If killing some people is okay and killing others isn't, what is the difference?

If it has something to do with the person's age, then at what age does killing you go from being an okay thing to a not okay thing? At what point does what change that makes killing you in cold blood no longer okay?

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

You have offered no similarity other than the genetic material in the cells. That is an immaterial difference.

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

That is absolutely false, since there is no material similarity between a fertilized egg and a born human.

You have offered nothing material to prove they are identical. In form, a fertilized human egg is far more similar to the fertilized egg of many non-human species than it is to a fully grown human being.

The case for declaring the killing of that fertilized egg to be no different than the killing of a born human is without material support.

You used material three times in that.

And I don't believe he said they were identical. I don't think anybody said that.

Do you want to try again without attributing false assertions?

Well yes I think he has; certainly he is free to elaborate, revise, reassert, or whatever.

Do you wish to stipulate there is a profound difference between a fertilized egg and a born person, that they bear virtually no physical similarity other than their DNA?

 

[NYcarbineer]

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

You have offered no similarity other than the genetic material in the cells. That is an immaterial difference.

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

That is absolutely false, since there is no material similarity between a fertilized egg and a born human.

You have offered nothing material to prove they are identical. In form, a fertilized human egg is far more similar to the fertilized egg of many non-human species than it is to a fully grown human being.

The case for declaring the killing of that fertilized egg to be no different than the killing of a born human is without material support.

You used material three times in that.

And I don't believe he said they were identical. I don't think anybody said that.

Do you want to try again without attributing false assertions?

Are you now acknowledging that I am correct? That there is virtually no similarity between a fertilized egg and a born person?

Or do you continue to claim there is no difference?

If the latter, then prove that a 2 celled entity is identical to a zillion celled fully developed human person, and thus it is justified to assign the exact same standards of treatment to both.

 

[NYcarbineer]

We are debating your contention that the fertilized egg is absolutely the same thing as an adult human.

Do cite that claim

why can't you people ever not lie?

Remember, you said using RU486 was no different than killing a born human.

Did I? Please cite the post in question and read it very carefully and slowly

I read it, and your qualifications were not material.

Are you now acknowledging a profound difference between a fertilized egg and a born person or not?

State your position, honestly, and clearly.

 

[JBeukema]

that a 2 celled entity is identical to a zillion celled fully developed human person, and thus it is justified to assign the exact same standards of treatment to both.

No two people are identical; your premise is bullshit

 

[JBeukema]

Carib claims there's some meaningful difference, but can't say what it is?

 

[Synthaholic]

Second flaw: you also don't understand the difference between organs and organisms. A pinky is not an organism. It is an organ, and a PART of an organism.

A pinky is an appendage, not an organ.

Quiet, you! Don't you know that Cecilie1200 is an expert?

 

[NYcarbineer]

that a 2 celled entity is identical to a zillion celled fully developed human person, and thus it is justified to assign the exact same standards of treatment to both.

No two people are identical; your premise is bullshit

We are talking about them being the same in the context of killing them. You say there is no difference between killing the 2 celled version of a human and the fully developed born version of a human.

I say that is preposterous.

I would suggest that in the event you think I have misrepresented your position that you make that known by clearly and unequivocally stating your exact position. As opposed to the obfuscation you're prone to.

I have no desire to misrepresent your specific views, but when you don't state them clearly, it becomes difficult.

 

[JBeukema]

that a 2 celled entity is identical to a zillion celled fully developed human person, and thus it is justified to assign the exact same standards of treatment to both.

No two people are identical; your premise is bullshit

We are talking about them being the same in the context of killing them.

Oh, so they have to have the same skin colour as you? They have to be the same religion? What, exactly, are the criteria for being a 'real' human?

You say there is no difference between killing the 2 celled version of a human and the fully developed born version of a human.

Do cite

Why can't you people ever be honest?

make that known by clearly and unequivocally stating your exact position.

I have. Multiple times. Three times in this very thread.

Not my fault you never learned how to read.

Now, answer the question: at what time did what fundamental aspect of your nature change that made killing you in cold blood go from being an okay thing to a not-okay thing?

 

[Immanuel]

Does anyone else wish that Buttemia had been aborted?

No, not particularly, there aren't any on this site that I feel that way about... well, except for... {loss of connection requires this post to remain incomplete}... sorry, for some reason I can't finish that sentence.

Immie

 

[snjmom]

What, exactly, are the criteria for being a 'real' human?

Removal from the host.

What is your take on embryos in fertility clinics? Do the frozen embryos have the right to demand a host to continue their development?

 

[Ravi]

Does anyone else wish that Buttemia had been aborted?

No, not particularly, there aren't any on this site that I feel that way about... well, except for... {loss of connection requires this post to remain incomplete}... sorry, for some reason I can't finish that sentence.

Immie

Off topic, but I think Babble is the product of an unfertilized egg.