Who Are The Palestinains?

[Sally]

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land.

I think I will go with what a traveler to the area observed hundreds of years ago. After all, we have the prerogative to believe whatever we want to believe. Whatever, floats our boat.

A Tour and Census of Palestine Year 1695: No sign of Arabian names or Palestinians

A Tour and Census of Palestine Year 1695: No sign of Arabian names or Palestinians | Palestine-Israel Conflict

 

[MJB12741]

Among the indigenous Palestinians WERE JEWS! Not a single theiving Muslim Palestinian among them until after the 7th cnentury AD.

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land. They are largely Sunni Muslim, but 20 - 30% (depending on location) were Christian, and others were Druze, Bahai, Armenians, indigenous Jews, Circassians, etc. All these groups are Palestinian, most but not all were Arab.

Hee are some sources:

The Palestinian right of return - legal and moral basis:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_right_of_return

And here are a couple of articles on why they left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

And last and saddest to me, the many villages, some going back to Bible times and earlier, that were destroyed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...epopulated_during_the_1948_Palestinian_exodus

You can click on links to read the story of each individual village. These stories are compiled from not only Palestinians who were present, but also the stories of members of Haganah, Irgun, etc. about their own roles in each case. They don't deny what they did. And these villagers had very few arms. Virtually unamed and, as you will read, in many cases totally non combatant.

In the case of Deir Yassin, a village on the outskirts of Jerusalem, the Arab population had agreed with the neighboring Jewish town to support and protect each other. The villagers refuse to allow Arab militias into the town to protect them, belieiving their solidarity with their Jewish neighbors would prevent them behind harmed. So when the attack came, not a shot was fired by the villagers in resistance. The Jews from the neighboring town tried to honor their agreement and ran over, running through the streets screaming "No! No! Don't kill them!" but to no avail. Irgun, Lehi, and Palmach units were responsible for the massacre. Afterward the survivors were paraded through streets of Jerusalem and elsewhere in trucks for several days, telling Arabs to leave before the same fate would befall them. No one really knows what happened to the "survivors" so it is possible that they were executed after being driven around, but I don't think there is any proof of that yet. At any rate, no one has turned up and said "I survived the post-Deir Yassin truck ride."

 

[Lipush]

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land. They are largely Sunni Muslim, but 20 - 30% (depending on location) were Christian, and others were Druze, Bahai, Armenians, indigenous Jews, Circassians, etc. All these groups are Palestinian, most but not all were Arab.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_people

Hee are some sources on the topics that are being discussed here:

The Palestinian right of return - legal and moral basis:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_right_of_return

And here are a couple of articles on why they left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

And last and saddest to me, the very many villages, some going back to Bible times and earlier, that were destroyed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...epopulated_during_the_1948_Palestinian_exodus

You can click on links to read the story of each individual village. These stories are compiled from not only Palestinians who were present, but also the stories of members of Haganah, Irgun, etc. about their own roles in each case. They don't deny what they did. And these villagers had very few arms. Virtually unamed and, as you will read, in many cases totally non combatant.

In the case of Deir Yassin, a village on the outskirts of Jerusalem, the Arab population had agreed with the neighboring Jewish town to support and protect each other, a mutual defense pact. So the villagers refused to allow Arab militias into the town to protect them, believing their solidarity with their Jewish neighbors would prevent them behind harmed. When the attack came, not a shot was fired by the villagers in resistance. The Jews from the neighboring town tried to honor their agreement and ran over, running through the streets screaming "No! No! Stop! Don't kill them!" ...but to no avail. Irgun, Lehi, and Palmach units were responsible for the massacre. Afterward the survivors were paraded through streets of Jerusalem and elsewhere in trucks for several days, telling Arabs to leave before the same fate would befall them. No one really knows what happened to the "survivors" so it is possible that they were executed after being driven around, but I don't think there is any proof of that yet. At any rate, no one has turned up and said "I survived the post-Deir Yassin truck ride." It seems fitting somehow that the buildings are now part of an Israeli insane asylum.

The "Palestinians" of today are a small group out of the "Palestinians" of that day. Go back to the 1800's and see how many of the original "Palestinians" were Jews. The Palestinians arriving, squatting, in Israel don't have any more rights over the land than the Jews who inhebited and brought their families to Israel.

Therefor, what you call today "Palestine" is a hoax invented and planted by the Arab clans who want the Jews in the sea.

 

[amity1844]

Sorry, that is just not right. Palestinians were never squatters. The Arab invasions of the 7th century did not result in much population transfer at all, just the arrival of a new language and culture. They are as I said. Genetics has proved this very simply and straighforward, so the debate is really at an end. I saw a series of videos on You Tube, a guy in Israel will go around and interview members of whatever group and ask them whatever question you want him to ask. It is really fascinating. He asked Israeli Jews if they believed Palestinians were "from here" and virtually every one said "yes." How could they deny it?

The Jewish community in Palestine was sometimes tiny, sometimes quite large, depending on what was going on in Europe. During times of pogroms, Spanish Inquisition, etc., an emigration would take place to Palestine. There was very little way for anyone to make a living in Palestine under the Ottomans, the Palestinians had land to work and were still pretty hungry. The Jews there were very impoverished and largely dependent on charity income from the Diaspora. They did not own agricultural land. There were mainly religious Jews who spent their days praying, almost like a monastic community.

Jewish history for the last 2000 years is truly interesting. So many good books out there I don't really need to recommend anything.

 

[Sally]

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land. They are largely Sunni Muslim, but 20 - 30% (depending on location) were Christian, and others were Druze, Bahai, Armenians, indigenous Jews, Circassians, etc. All these groups are Palestinian, most but not all were Arab.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_people

Hee are some sources on the topics that are being discussed here:

The Palestinian right of return - legal and moral basis:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_right_of_return

And here are a couple of articles on why they left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

And last and saddest to me, the very many villages, some going back to Bible times and earlier, that were destroyed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...epopulated_during_the_1948_Palestinian_exodus

You can click on links to read the story of each individual village. These stories are compiled from not only Palestinians who were present, but also the stories of members of Haganah, Irgun, etc. about their own roles in each case. They don't deny what they did. And these villagers had very few arms. Virtually unamed and, as you will read, in many cases totally non combatant.

In the case of Deir Yassin, a village on the outskirts of Jerusalem, the Arab population had agreed with the neighboring Jewish town to support and protect each other, a mutual defense pact. So the villagers refused to allow Arab militias into the town to protect them, believing their solidarity with their Jewish neighbors would prevent them behind harmed. When the attack came, not a shot was fired by the villagers in resistance. The Jews from the neighboring town tried to honor their agreement and ran over, running through the streets screaming "No! No! Stop! Don't kill them!" ...but to no avail. Irgun, Lehi, and Palmach units were responsible for the massacre. Afterward the survivors were paraded through streets of Jerusalem and elsewhere in trucks for several days, telling Arabs to leave before the same fate would befall them. No one really knows what happened to the "survivors" so it is possible that they were executed after being driven around, but I don't think there is any proof of that yet. At any rate, no one has turned up and said "I survived the post-Deir Yassin truck ride." It seems fitting somehow that the buildings are now part of an Israeli insane asylum.

The "Palestinians" of today are a small group out of the "Palestinians" of that day. Go back to the 1800's and see how many of the original "Palestinians" were Jews. The Palestinians arriving, squatting, in Israel don't have any more rights over the land than the Jews who inhebited and brought their families to Israel.

Therefor, what you call today "Palestine" is a hoax invented and planted by the Arab clans who want the Jews in the sea.

As you can see, Lipush, we are getting the same song and dance that has appeared to many times on this particular forum. It's too bad we couldn't find someone who manned the Palestine Booth at the World's Fair in 1940 so that that person could tell this forum why it was only Jews who manned that booth. As you realize, the ones giving the same song and dance care nothing about the people in the either in the rest of Middle East or the rest of the world who are really suffering much worse than these so-called Palestinians are supposed to be suffering. If the Jews are not involved, they just don't care about these other groups.

 

[MJB12741]

I'm still waiting for someone to educate me as to when Israel's land since antiquity became this "Palestinian land" that they say Israel is stealing?

 

[amity1844]

I think I will go with what a traveler to the area observed hundreds of years ago. After all, we have the prerogative to believe whatever we want to believe. Whatever, floats our boat.

A Tour and Census of Palestine Year 1695: No sign of Arabian names or Palestinians

A Tour and Census of Palestine Year 1695: No sign of Arabian names or Palestinians | Palestine-Israel Conflict

Those aren't Arab names? Look you can't just "think you will go with" a particular source. There are literally thousands, if not tens of thousands, of sources on Palestine. They described the people, drew the people, detailed their culture, etc.

I think this line of argument relies on the argument that everyone should remain and/or go back to wherever they were 2000 years ago. I am of almost totally British stock. We had genetics done, and we turned out to be almost half Scandinavian! This of course is due to the Viking depradations of the coast of Britain. They left a lot of genetic material behind unfortunately.... But the largest group represented in my genes is the Celts. 2000 years ago they were in central Europe. Should I go back to Austria, take land and depopulate the countryside to make room for "my people" because the current inhabitants are "squatters?" Hardly!

 

[amity1844]

Among the indigenous Palestinians WERE JEWS! Not a single theiving Muslim Palestinian among them until after the 7th cnentury AD.

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land. They are largely Sunni Muslim, but 20 - 30% (depending on location) were Christian, and others were Druze, Bahai, Armenians, indigenous Jews, Circassians, etc. All these groups are Palestinian, most but not all were Arab.

Hee are some sources:

The Palestinian right of return - legal and moral basis:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_right_of_return

And here are a couple of articles on why they left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

And last and saddest to me, the many villages, some going back to Bible times and earlier, that were destroyed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...epopulated_during_the_1948_Palestinian_exodus

You can click on links to read the story of each individual village. These stories are compiled from not only Palestinians who were present, but also the stories of members of Haganah, Irgun, etc. about their own roles in each case. They don't deny what they did. And these villagers had very few arms. Virtually unamed and, as you will read, in many cases totally non combatant.

In the case of Deir Yassin, a village on the outskirts of Jerusalem, the Arab population had agreed with the neighboring Jewish town to support and protect each other. The villagers refuse to allow Arab militias into the town to protect them, belieiving their solidarity with their Jewish neighbors would prevent them behind harmed. So when the attack came, not a shot was fired by the villagers in resistance. The Jews from the neighboring town tried to honor their agreement and ran over, running through the streets screaming "No! No! Don't kill them!" but to no avail. Irgun, Lehi, and Palmach units were responsible for the massacre. Afterward the survivors were paraded through streets of Jerusalem and elsewhere in trucks for several days, telling Arabs to leave before the same fate would befall them. No one really knows what happened to the "survivors" so it is possible that they were executed after being driven around, but I don't think there is any proof of that yet. At any rate, no one has turned up and said "I survived the post-Deir Yassin truck ride."

I'll excuse your silly low brow epipthets, but tell you that you are exactly right otherwise. Here is the chain of events as best I understand it:

The Romans crushed the Jewish state in A.D. 70, depopulated the cities, took many people as slaves to Rome, but the majority escaped to the countryside and continued their resistance .... Masada, Bar Kochba, etc. Of course there were other peoples there at that time, too, it wasn't 100% Jewish, but pretty much.

The synagogue tradition was developed, and some of those synagogues morphed into churches as more and more Jews converted. By time of Constantine, Palestine had a Christian majority, descended from the Jewish population.

At the time of the Muslim conquest there were many conversions, and a little intermarriage, a new language and a new culture that mixed in with the old, but no wholesale migration took place. The bedouin Arabs who were the nucleus of Islamic expansion, were a very tiny population anyway and couldn't have staged a large migration.

Later admixtures have got to include the Crusaders, Turks, etc. To this day you can see blonde haired, blue eyed Palestinians, and black African Palestinians.

But the population of Palestine remained continuous throughout. Note we have father and son, mother and daughter, all the way back to Canaanite times. And Palestinians are about 80% descended from those who were Jews in Roman times. By the way, modern Jews are descended about 72% from those who were Jews in Roman times. So Palestinians are more Jewish than the modern day Jews are? No, I don't think that is the point. The lesson is about demographics and migration.

And by the way, of course straight through there was a population of Jews who never converted. These were true "Palestinian Jews." The pattern is similar to that of the Samaritans who were left behind during the Jewish Babylonian exile, and remain there today in fact, still practicing a very old form of Judaism that existed before the Babylonian exile.

And this is what genetics has now proven. There is no place for other theories at this point.

It is interesting to see the continuity. Someone made the point that the same patterns that appear on Palestinian women's embroidered dresses are seen in Canaanite handcrafts. All over you will recognize the place names of the Bible. Cana, where Jesus turned water into wine, became Kafr Kana, etc. Most of the Christian traditions native to the Levant and Palestine .... Maronite, Syriac, etc. .... use Aramaic as their religious language. It was the language spoken by Christ.

 

[Lipush]

Sorry, that is just not right. Palestinians were never squatters. The Arab invasions of the 7th century did not result in much population transfer at all, just the arrival of a new language and culture. They are as I said. Genetics has proved this very simply and straighforward, so the debate is really at an end. I saw a series of videos on You Tube, a guy in Israel will go around and interview members of whatever group and ask them whatever question you want him to ask. It is really fascinating. He asked Israeli Jews if they believed Palestinians were "from here" and virtually every one said "yes." How could they deny it?

The Jewish community in Palestine was sometimes tiny, sometimes quite large, depending on what was going on in Europe. During times of pogroms, Spanish Inquisition, etc., an emigration would take place to Palestine. There was very little way for anyone to make a living in Palestine under the Ottomans, the Palestinians had land to work and were still pretty hungry. The Jews there were very impoverished and largely dependent on charity income from the Diaspora. They did not own agricultural land. There were mainly religious Jews who spent their days praying, almost like a monastic community.

Jewish history for the last 2000 years is truly interesting. So many good books out there I don't really need to recommend anything.

They were from "here" after they arrived "here". Read the book of Mark Twain about Israel, he didn't see the same "Palestinians" as you claim existed.

Jews were natives in Hebron until the "Palestinians" kicked them out then decided suddenly they are the natives themselves. Under 'Palestinian' villages in the north there were discovered Jewish graveyards. In the south the diggins showed the foundings of Jewish property.

The Jews of the Aliyah were owners of agricultural land, my own family among them. I don't know what history is that you think you know, but it doesn't go hand in hand with facts.

 

[Lipush]

Among the indigenous Palestinians WERE JEWS! Not a single theiving Muslim Palestinian among them until after the 7th cnentury AD.

The Palestinians were the people resident in Palestine. They are the indigenous people of Palestine. That is all. The reason the mandatory language is
"those who were habitually resident in Palestine" is because they were dissolving the Ottoman Empire, which had been the only political structure in Palestine for literally hundreds of years. But the people weren't Turkish. As genetics has proved, they are the descendents of Canaanites and Sea Peoples, Philistines, Assyrians and Jews, Romans, Arabians, Crusaders, many different migrations and influences. But there has always been a people present continuously on that land. They are largely Sunni Muslim, but 20 - 30% (depending on location) were Christian, and others were Druze, Bahai, Armenians, indigenous Jews, Circassians, etc. All these groups are Palestinian, most but not all were Arab.

Hee are some sources:

The Palestinian right of return - legal and moral basis:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_right_of_return

And here are a couple of articles on why they left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

And last and saddest to me, the many villages, some going back to Bible times and earlier, that were destroyed:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...epopulated_during_the_1948_Palestinian_exodus

You can click on links to read the story of each individual village. These stories are compiled from not only Palestinians who were present, but also the stories of members of Haganah, Irgun, etc. about their own roles in each case. They don't deny what they did. And these villagers had very few arms. Virtually unamed and, as you will read, in many cases totally non combatant.

In the case of Deir Yassin, a village on the outskirts of Jerusalem, the Arab population had agreed with the neighboring Jewish town to support and protect each other. The villagers refuse to allow Arab militias into the town to protect them, belieiving their solidarity with their Jewish neighbors would prevent them behind harmed. So when the attack came, not a shot was fired by the villagers in resistance. The Jews from the neighboring town tried to honor their agreement and ran over, running through the streets screaming "No! No! Don't kill them!" but to no avail. Irgun, Lehi, and Palmach units were responsible for the massacre. Afterward the survivors were paraded through streets of Jerusalem and elsewhere in trucks for several days, telling Arabs to leave before the same fate would befall them. No one really knows what happened to the "survivors" so it is possible that they were executed after being driven around, but I don't think there is any proof of that yet. At any rate, no one has turned up and said "I survived the post-Deir Yassin truck ride."

I'll excuse your silly low brow epipthets, but tell you that you are exactly right otherwise. Here is the chain of events as best I understand it. The Romans crushed the Jewish state in A.D. 70, depopulated the cities, took many people as slaves to Rome, but the majority escaped to the countryside and continued their resistance .... Masada, Bar Kochba, etc. Of course there were other peoples there at that time, too, it wasn't 100% Jewish, but pretty much. The synagogue tradition was developed, and some of those synagogues morphed into churches as more and more Jews converted. By time of Constantine, Palestine had a Christian majority. At the time of the Muslim conquest there were many conversions, and a little intermarriage, but no wholesale migration took place. The bedouin Arabs who were the nucleus of Islamic expansion, were a very tiny population anyway. Later admixtures have got to include the Crusaders, Turks, etc. To this day you can see blonde haired, blue eyed Palestinians, and black African Palestinians. But the population of Palestine remained continuous throughout. Note we have father and son, mother and daughter, all the way back to Canaanite times. And Palestinians are about 80% descended from those who were Jews in Roman times. By the way, modern Jews are descended about 72% from those who were Jews in Roman times. So Palestinians are more Jewish than the modern day Jews are? No, I don't think that is the point. The lesson is about demographics and migration.

And by the way, of course straight through there was a population of Jews who never converted. These were true "Palestinian Jews." The pattern is similar to that of the Samaritans who were left behind during the Jewish Babylonian exile, and remain there today in fact.

And this is what genetics has now proven. There is no room for other theories at this point.

How can they call themselves "natives" when their own identity is called "Palestine". do you know the meaning of the word?

 

[amity1844]

I don't know about Hebron and if you have a source, a GOOD source, I will read it.

I am neither a historian or a geneticist, but what I am saying here is now the accepted version. The Palestinians are very much descended from the Jews who were left behind. I'm sure you knew those Jews existed, that they weren't all taken to Rome but stayed there and continued to resist, but didn't you wonder what became of them after the Roman empire fell? Genetics has now confirmed this.

And no, I don't know the original meaning of the word "Palestine." I know it was the name bestowed on the province during roman rimes. I have heard it comes from "Philistine" but I have also heard it doesn't. Don't know the linguist's view. But I don't see why that matters too much. We'll call it Rosebud if you want. I was having a discussion with a so-called Israeli Arab once. She was saying how she feels Arabs sometimes view them as possible collaborators and therefore suspect. I told her I didn't see how that could be, they did what all Palestinians wish they could have done, just stood firm on the land. If Israel will let the other 9 million Paletinians back in to become "Israeli Arabs" I think that would solve the problem, actually. I am being a bit facetious because I guarantee you that won't happen, but my point is.... you can call Palestine Israel as far as most are concerned! The name of the land is hardly the point.

 

[amity1844]

Arabs were not doing "World's Fairs" at that time. That was a European thing. They were nonetheless the huge majority. Too bad they couldn't represent their own interests. The Jews wanted to influence people to Aliyah, of course, so that was their motive.

I don't think Mark Twain was ever there. I think it is sort of a fantasy, like a Yankee in King Arthur's Court or whatever.

 

[Sally]

Arabs were not doing "World's Fairs" at that time. That was a European thing. They were nonetheless the huge majority. Too bad they couldn't represent their own interests. The Jews wanted to influence people to Aliyah, of course, so that was their motive.

Were you there, Amity, to see who manned the different booths? Meanwhile, of course a know-it-all like you realizes that the Jerusalem Post was once named the Palestine Post, and that it was started by Jews. Now how about you bring up the fact that Winston Churchill, after receiving reports from the British officials in the area, said that the Arabs were coming in droves from their poor surrounding countries for the jobs the Jews had for them? Unless you are very dimwitted, you do realize that this same thing is happening today with poor Hispanics crossing our southern border and poor Muslims flooding in Europe for jobs. Maybe you could buy some airplane tickets for those poor Black African Muslims who take their lives in their hands by trying to get to Europe in boats that are not seaworthy (which has resulted in many of them drowning).

 

[amity1844]

I have been there a few times, yes, but I am giving the interpretation of historians and geneticists, not my own interpretation.

And yes, of course the Jerusalem Post was the Palestine Post, and of course it was founded by Jews. I never said anything that should have been taken as a denial of this. Herzl established Zionism back in the late 19th century and since that time more and more Jewish institutions were founded! Your point?

And I don't doubt that there were a lot of people coming for jobs. It was a capitalist economy laid over a traditional agricultural economy during VERY difficult economic times, so yes you are right. And I do know a lot of Palestinians who are half Palestinian and half Syrian, half Arab and half Jewish, half whatever. There was some population migration during this time, yes. But this didn't amount to much at all in demographic terms in comparison to the HUGE Jewish immigration.

Your point?

 

[Sally]

Sorry, that is just not right. Palestinians were never squatters. The Arab invasions of the 7th century did not result in much population transfer at all, just the arrival of a new language and culture. They are as I said. Genetics has proved this very simply and straighforward, so the debate is really at an end. I saw a series of videos on You Tube, a guy in Israel will go around and interview members of whatever group and ask them whatever question you want him to ask. It is really fascinating. He asked Israeli Jews if they believed Palestinians were "from here" and virtually every one said "yes." How could they deny it?

The Jewish community in Palestine was sometimes tiny, sometimes quite large, depending on what was going on in Europe. During times of pogroms, Spanish Inquisition, etc., an emigration would take place to Palestine. There was very little way for anyone to make a living in Palestine under the Ottomans, the Palestinians had land to work and were still pretty hungry. The Jews there were very impoverished and largely dependent on charity income from the Diaspora. They did not own agricultural land. There were mainly religious Jews who spent their days praying, almost like a monastic community.

Jewish history for the last 2000 years is truly interesting. So many good books out there I don't really need to recommend anything.

They were from "here" after they arrived "here". Read the book of Mark Twain about Israel, he didn't see the same "Palestinians" as you claim existed.

Jews were natives in Hebron until the "Palestinians" kicked them out then decided suddenly they are the natives themselves. Under 'Palestinian' villages in the north there were discovered Jewish graveyards. In the south the diggins showed the foundings of Jewish property.

The Jews of the Aliyah were owners of agricultural land, my own family among them. I don't know what history is that you think you know, but it doesn't go hand in hand with facts.

Lipush, it is the same old, same old the readers have seen for years no matter the screen name of the poster. One says the same thing, and when that one leaves, another one shows up and begins all over again. I would imagine some Boiler Room has an endless supply to take the place of the previous poster. Most of the Arabs living there years ago worked for the rich Turkish landowners who owned the land. Would anyone claim that the American sharecroppers actually owned the land of the rich guy for whom they worked? It's funny this claim that the Arabs owned lots of land. The Arabs who did have property stayed put and are now citizens of Israel.

 

[amity1844]

Most of the Arabs living there years ago worked for the rich Turkish landowners who owned the land. Would anyone claim that the American sharecroppers actually owned the land of the rich guy for whom they worked? It's funny this claim that the Arabs owned lots of land. The Arabs who did have property stayed put and are now citizens of Israel.

That is really blaming the victim! It is hardly the Palestinians fault that they were occupied and colonized by Turkey, and a lot of land was expropriated. But they weren't sharecroppers whatsoever. Their continuity on the land was so solid that you could tell who was from village A and who was from village B only 10 miles away by the way they were dressed!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_costume

And the reason most Palestinians left has nothing at all to do with land ownership. Whether they owned their land or not, they were uprooted and stripped of their title to the land:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internally_Displaced_Palestinians

See the other links I have already posted for a very detailed description of incidents pertaining to the Palestinian exodus, MOST of it provided by Israelis who testify to their own actions and what they witnessed during this time.

 

[Lipush]

Arabs were not doing "World's Fairs" at that time. That was a European thing. They were nonetheless the huge majority. Too bad they couldn't represent their own interests. The Jews wanted to influence people to Aliyah, of course, so that was their motive.

I don't think Mark Twain was ever there. I think it is sort of a fantasy, like a Yankee in King Arthur's Court or whatever.

They didn't have interest to begin with. A bunch of clans trying to gather around the idea of throwing Jews out is not enough to create a nation.

The idea of the "Palestinian" identity is that they tried to tell themselves they're descendants of the Plishti (Philistine) nation. But the Plishti nation wasn't the native one, either. They were Europian sailors, redheads and pail. They have no ties to today's Palestinians at ALL.

Like I said to many others before, I could cover my mouth with a beak and glue feathers to my skin, it won't make me a bird. They can call themselves Palestinians ten times over, that won't make them the offspring of the long-gone nation.

The Plishtim (פלשתי&#1501 were named by Hebrews after the word Paleshet, which means "invader" which is what they were. The Palestinians, irony at its best, name themselves "invaders" yet call themselves natives. Isn't that amusing?

 

[Lipush]

Most of the Arabs living there years ago worked for the rich Turkish landowners who owned the land. Would anyone claim that the American sharecroppers actually owned the land of the rich guy for whom they worked? It's funny this claim that the Arabs owned lots of land. The Arabs who did have property stayed put and are now citizens of Israel.

That is really blaming the victim! It is hardly the Palestinians fault that they were occupied and colonized by Turkey, and a lot of land was expropriated. But they weren't sharecroppers whatsoever. Their continuity on the land was so solid that you could tell who was from village A and who was from village B only 10 miles away by the way they were dressed!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_costume

And the reason most Palestinians left has nothing at all to do with land ownership. Whether they owned their land or not, they were uprooted and stripped of their title to the land:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internally_Displaced_Palestinians

See the other links I have already posted for a very detailed description of incidents pertaining to the Palestinian exodus, MOST of it provided by Israelis who testify to their own actions and what they witnessed during this time.

 

[amity1844]

Can't think of anything to say anymore?

Damn I'm good!

 

[Lipush]

Can't think of anything to say anymore?

Damn I'm good!

No you're not. But if it's all a game to you there is no point to discuss it any further, now, is there?

Ignorant you are to the real aspects of this conflict, dear poster, and ignorant you shall remain...