What is wrong with 'division'?

[owebo]

There has been much waste and also some good developments... Clean energy is one. A big chunk goes towards the military and national security as well

DumBama cut our military, don't you remember?

And what clean energy are you referring to? Cutting coal production and forcing electric companies to try to do without is not funded by the government--it's funded by the consumers.

I don't remember Obama cutting the military. Might want to check the facts on that one:

None

Link to budget under Obama? Thanks!!

Huh? There is a link in my post

Huh....so what does that make your post? These been no budget since obama took office....

You're not that good at this stuff, are you.....

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So republicans were also responsible for the cuts right? Obamas cuts were from bringing troops home... What about the other stats that show the investments made... Lowest rate of nuclear disarment? Budget increases in Obamas budget that got reduced by republicans, but still resulted in a 6% increase.... Those points mean anything to you?

I wouldn't brag so much about DumBama bringing troops home. Yes he did, and he handed Iraq over to ISIS at the same time. You know, Iraq is that country where we lost thousands of Americans; all in vain now.

 

[oldsoul]

What a joke. there is no winning and losing... We are trying to make solutions to problems... So there is effective and ineffective... Your way is the later

There is winning and losing .. as demonstrated by history .. and confrontation produces results.

Change does not come from talking about it .. it never has. Change comes through demand. We can talk about the demands, but demands they are.

This is an excellent example of what is wrong with this country right now. This absolutely stupid "Us versus Them" mentality. It's dumb, it's divisive, and it's going to ruin our country. You can call it what ever you want, it's destructive. Period. BOTH "sides" are guilty, and BOTH "sides" must come together to find a solution, or we are doomed. The venomous HATE that is obviously behind your statements is what is going to destroy us. YOU, my friend, are part of the problem. The sooner you understand and accept that the better.
We are ALL first and foremost AMERICAN'S.

The more divisive republicans are, the easier the fight is to win .. which is why republicans have lost on virtually every social issue in this country.

It's a good thing the Democrats of 1964 did not "win" their fight to stop the Civil Rights Act of 1964. So YOU could have a better life. Wake up, the Democrats are just as much to blame as anyone else.

Keep it up republicans. Spew that hate like God told you to.

This is an example of the same HATE that racists spew. YOU are no better than them. HATE is HATE, it matters not who you are or who you HATE.

Spare me the 'we're all in this together, we're all Americans' crap. Save that bullshit for the cowards.

African-Americans have been in this country for more than 400 years .. and have only been relatively free for 51 YEARS .. AND, even that relative freedom came through demand. The reason the Civil Rights ACT finally happened was because of the demand for change by black people who forced the political hand.

Hate is not passive .. and only a fool deals with it passively. You hate me .. expect that I will hate you.

First and foremost, your assumption that I hate ANYONE is patently false. I do not give in to such a destructive emotion. I hate no one.

Secondly, unless, and until, the majority of our society accepts that first and foremost we are all humans, and in this country nearly all of us are Americans, there will only be separate and not equal. I judge people on the content of their character, gee where have I heard that before? Apparently you do not, at least not in a political sense.

Third, since you brought up African-Americans specifically (no the Civil Rights Act of 1964 is not about race, it is about equal treatment despite differences in appearance and opinion/beliefs), are you aware of the FACTS that:

1. Slaves from Africa where brought here, originally, by the British (primarily)
2. That said slaves where "captured" by rival tribes (in many but not all cases)
3. And that under British rule it was illegal to free a slave as long as the original "owner" lived?

It's not in the text books, it's not taught in public schools, and it is widely unknown to those who have not done the study necessary to learn these things. Why do you think that is? And please leave political name-calling out of it, I desire a CIVIL discussion, and will tolerate nothing less.

First, I never suggested that you hate anyone .. my comment was about those who do.

Secondly, I don't hate white people .. I hate republicans and racists who demonstrate hate towards non-white people. THAT is their character, not their color. Maybe you should study King a bit better .. just as you should study other elements of what made civil rights possible.

Do not presume that you know more about the African journey to America than I do. I know all about what you've said .. and none of it makes any difference to anything today. The Brits abolished slavery long before the US did .. the Mexican government refused slavery and slave-holders .. which is what the Alamo was all about .. and they provided safe-havens for runaway slaves and refused to return them to slave-holders.

I am engaging in a civil conversation, but you don't get to dictate what I say in that conversation. I'm not a democrat, haven't been for many years .. but if you're trying to convince me that democrats are just as evil as republicans on the issue of African-Americans, you're barking up the wrong tree. That's an argument you cannot win

You hate me .. expect that I will hate you.

First, I never suggested that you hate anyone .. my comment was about those who do.

I suggest that you choose your words more carefully in the future then.

Do not presume that you know more about the African journey to America than I do.

I do not, I was merely asking if you are aware of the stated facts. It seems as though you are one of those who do know and understand the realities of history. Now, keep in mind I do not attribute any of the following to you or assume you agree with any of it, I merely would like to have your opinion on the following remarks:
I would seem that many, if not a majority, of those joining and supporting/agreeing with groups such as BLM do not know, or chose to ignore, the realities of history. This, in my opinion, is what leads to thinking that slavery is the US's original sin, while saying nothing about other nations that:

• had slavery at the same time
• continue to have slavery-like institutions (Somalia comes to mind, though things may have changed since I last followed the politics there) (many aspects of certain Islamic followers would fall into this as well, i.e. sharia law subscribers)
• refuse to defend/strive for equality within their borders

I would seem as though many would like us to believe that the only thing holding "black people" down is "systemic racism". And yet these same people have not shown where our current President has done ANYTHING to improve the situation (something that he campaigned on and promised). You know the saying, "If your not part of the solution, you are part of the problem." So, what makes BHO, or any other leader, part of the solution? What I see is blame, and problem identification (sort of), but we don't seem to be having a real conversation about what the real problem is and how to correct it. It seems to me that nearly everyone is just waiting for "someone else" to "do something". This is a very dangerous national attitude and will only lead to further division, resentment, and (eventually) hostilities.

.. but if you're trying to convince me that democrats are just as evil as republicans on the issue of African-Americans, you're barking up the wrong tree.

It would seem to me that Democrats have done a poor job of advancing the "black cause", to be kind. Or is it the racist Republicans that have destroyed places like Detroit, and Chicago, despite decades of Democrats in power?

 

[oldsoul]

As a military commander

lol, you've never been a "military commander." Hilarious how all of the conservatives on this forum are either former military commanders, former intelligence agents, or professional IT workers. You're a fraud.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I claim none of those things. Therefore, your statement FAILS.

 

[oldsoul]

No you wouldn't have. Bush crashed the economy with his tax cuts and his wars, and the housing bubble. In order to balance the budget, you would have had to pull out of both wars, fully, stop spending on the military, and bring the troops home, and to what? An economy shedding 500,000 jobs a month?

In order to balance the budget, you would have to increase revenues, and/or cut spending. You spend during a recession, and cut during periods of growth. To increase taxes is unwise, as it tends to deepen a recession, as does cutting spending.

As an example, in the run up to the Canadian election last year, the Conservative government wanted to run on a balanced budget. Spending cuts would have balanced the budget by 2017, but the Conservative government was desperate to tell Canadians they had balanced the budget, so they made some very deep cuts to spending to achieve that goal. It put the country into a mild recession, and still failed to balance the budget because of reduced revenues caused by falling oil prices.

One has to wonder if Obama has been allowed to spend more to stimulate the economy, whether the recovery would have been quicker.

No, because none of DumBama's policies did anything for our economy. That's why our economy still sucks.

If you were in debt in your household, do you think you could spend your way out of it? It just doesn't make any sense. It's illogical.

DumBama is the most anti-business President of our lifetime. Had he just sat in the White House and did nothing the last seven years, our market forces would have driven our economy along the way and we'd be in much better shape today. But no. He burdened our businesses with more taxes. He inflicted his idiotic healthcare plan that not only stopped businesses from expanding, but prevented new businesses from starting. The people that lost their healthcare plans now have to pay for them with after-tax money. In many cases, that's a very expensive SUV or a small house payment. This is money that doesn't go into circulation in our society. The less money movement, the less economic activity. And to add insult to injury, we still have millions of people without healthcare and it's more expensive than before DumBama became President.

The only real bump we had in our economy was the results of fracking which DumBama and the Democrats are totally against. Lower fuel prices gives us more disposable income which has a stimulating effect. But people have to beware because at anytime, DumBama could send his henchmen in from the EPA to create regulations to burden that industry as well just like he did with our coal mining operations.

RE: "If you were in debt in your household, do you think you could spend your way out of it? It just doesn't make any sense. It's illogical"

Come on Ray, you know better. The economics of our national debt is completely different than a household debt. Don't spread those lies.

The only difference is that the Federal government can print money. When the fed does that, it screws all of us.

The majority of new money is created by the banks not the printing press

The Fed controls how much money private banks can create.

Assuming this is true, and I am not saying that it is or is not, is that not part of the problem? The government telling private businesses what to do, and how much money they can make? For a more extreme example, look at the former Soviet Union. Now, I admit, it is not a perfect, nor a direct, comparison, until you look at what government controls on profits lead to. That is total government control. When a business violates regulations, they are fined. Do it enough, and all assets are seized. When this happens with a business that is deemed "too big to fail", the government "must" step-in and take over. There you have it, a logical, easy to follow, blueprint for government take-over of private business.

 

[Slade3200]

There has been much waste and also some good developments... Clean energy is one. A big chunk goes towards the military and national security as well

DumBama cut our military, don't you remember?

And what clean energy are you referring to? Cutting coal production and forcing electric companies to try to do without is not funded by the government--it's funded by the consumers.

I don't remember Obama cutting the military. Might want to check the facts on that one:

None

Link to budget under Obama? Thanks!!

Huh? There is a link in my post

Huh....so what does that make your post? These been no budget since obama took office....

You're not that good at this stuff, are you.....

Is something wrong with you? Your attacks sound like they are coming from a grade schooler... Petty, baseless and uneducated. How old are you?

Mr. Obama’s defense budget reflects a new age of military deterrence

 

[Slade3200]

So republicans were also responsible for the cuts right? Obamas cuts were from bringing troops home... What about the other stats that show the investments made... Lowest rate of nuclear disarment? Budget increases in Obamas budget that got reduced by republicans, but still resulted in a 6% increase.... Those points mean anything to you?

I wouldn't brag so much about DumBama bringing troops home. Yes he did, and he handed Iraq over to ISIS at the same time. You know, Iraq is that country where we lost thousands of Americans; all in vain now.

You are glossing over many details here. I'm fine with some objections and debate over policy or military strategy decisions, I have a few of my own... But when you classify the man for a fraction of decisions and ignore others that fall in line with things you support (like military budget increases or effective air strikes) then you come off as bias and unobjective

 

[owebo]

DumBama cut our military, don't you remember?

And what clean energy are you referring to? Cutting coal production and forcing electric companies to try to do without is not funded by the government--it's funded by the consumers.

I don't remember Obama cutting the military. Might want to check the facts on that one:

None

Link to budget under Obama? Thanks!!

Huh? There is a link in my post

Huh....so what does that make your post? These been no budget since obama took office....

You're not that good at this stuff, are you.....

Is something wrong with you? Your attacks sound like they are coming from a grade schooler... Petty, baseless and uneducated. How old are you?

Mr. Obama’s defense budget reflects a new age of military deterrence

Sorry about that...I'm talking down to your limited education level...

 

[Slade3200]

I don't remember Obama cutting the military. Might want to check the facts on that one:

None

Link to budget under Obama? Thanks!!

Huh? There is a link in my post

Huh....so what does that make your post? These been no budget since obama took office....

You're not that good at this stuff, are you.....

Is something wrong with you? Your attacks sound like they are coming from a grade schooler... Petty, baseless and uneducated. How old are you?

Mr. Obama’s defense budget reflects a new age of military deterrence

Sorry about that...I'm talking down to your limited education level...

So the way it works is you take that little pointy arrow thing and click on the link, then you get your mommy to read the article for you

 

[owebo]

Link to budget under Obama? Thanks!!

Huh? There is a link in my post

Huh....so what does that make your post? These been no budget since obama took office....

You're not that good at this stuff, are you.....

Is something wrong with you? Your attacks sound like they are coming from a grade schooler... Petty, baseless and uneducated. How old are you?

Mr. Obama’s defense budget reflects a new age of military deterrence

Sorry about that...I'm talking down to your limited education level...

So the way it works is you take that little pointy arrow thing and click on the link, then you get your mommy to read the article for you

Did you're mommy type that...tell her good job.....

 

[Dragonlady]

Sorry about that...I'm talking down to your limited education level...

When you resort to grade school level insults as a response to a post that pwned you, you are basically admitting that you've got nothing and you've lost the debate. Lacking a cogent response, and unable to debate the facts, you attack the poster.

Your concession is acknowledged.