What is ton 618?

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Again, theories and opinions.

No, direct observations. So this is false.

You clearly don't know anything about any of this. And your act is very old and tired and is just a specious pretext to reject any science that doesnt align with your personal delusions.

I can see the evolution denial coming from a mile away.

 

[LibertyWeeps]

No, direct observations. So this is false.

You clearly don't know anything about any of this. And your act is very old and tired and is just a specious pretext to reject any science that doesnt align with your personal delusions.

I can see the evolution denial coming from a mile away.

You said it yourself. OBSERVATIONS.
You cannot get any cold, hard facts from billions of miles of space between you and the objects just by OBSERVATIONS.

Again.........nothing but theories and guesswork.

 

[toobfreak]

How can you say from any certainty from ANY side?
If you haven't BEEN to one,

Because we HAVE been to one side, the outside, which is normal space, the space we live in, and we understand the physics of what must happen to normal matter and space upon entering the event horizon of a black hole. We understand and have proven the effects and process of relativistic speed, so we know that on our side of a black hole is collapsed matter, the only part we cannot be sure about is what happens to that in-falling matter and energy on the OTHER side, on the inside of the BH, and there are several theoretical possibilities including a singularity, a wormhole out to a white hole somewhere far off elsewhere in space, or another dimension where our known laws do not apply, but there is no way to test any of that as there is no returning from the other side, and even if we wanted to try, the nearest known BH is over 1500 light years away, which is about 170,000X farther away than the closest that Mars ever gets to us.

 

[toobfreak]

Just from what happens on this spec of dust we call Earth, in this vast universe?

No, what FFI says isn't half bad. The physical laws of our universe are well understood and consistent wherever you go otherwise they would not be physical laws. If we were at all wrong, your GPS and cellphone would not work! And a black hole is in our universe, so, up to a point, we have a good idea what they are and how they operate, we have even taken pictures of black holes.

Again, theories and opinions. They cannot be proven as facts.

What goes on inside our Sun is theory too as no one has or can actually go in there (inside a star). The closest equivalent would be trying to stand inside a hydrogen bomb. But we understand the processes, the physics up to a very high degree of certainty, especially as we can recreate aspects of it in the laboratory and test it.

So maybe you need to understand the science better. A good place to start is to read up on stellar dynamics, stellar formation and evolution, upon which part of the end path for many stars is to end up as a BH.

Here is some light reading, no math on the specific atomic and chemical processes inside a star, just introduces you to some basics like an HR diagram. There is even a picture of the Cats Eye nebula in Draco, which is very similar to what our star the Sun will eventually end up looking as in the latter parts of its life.

Stellar evolution - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[LibertyWeeps]

Because we HAVE been to one side, the outside, which is normal space, the space we live in, and we understand the physics of what must happen to normal matter and space upon entering the event horizon of a black hole. We understand and have proven the effects and process of relativistic speed, so we know that on our side of a black hole is collapsed matter, the only part we cannot be sure about is what happens to that in-falling matter and energy on the OTHER side, on the inside of the BH, and there are several theoretical possibilities including a singularity, a wormhole out to a white hole somewhere far off elsewhere in space, or another dimension where our known laws do not apply, but there is no way to test any of that as there is no returning from the other side, and even if we wanted to try, the nearest known BH is over 1500 light years away, which is about 170,000X farther away than the closest that Mars ever gets to us.

Humans have NOT been to a black hole.

They don't even KNOW FOR FACT that it IS what they claim it to be.

You cannot tell me that looking at a microscopic point in the galaxy gives you any freedom to claim what exactly it is you are looking at.

1. Our telescopes are far from being superior enough to zoom in to a point of perspective that we can see it as if we were there in person.
Everything is just a burry point of color, light, or absense of light. Which does not grant the persistence of calling it a "black hole".

2. You can theorize until you are blue in the face, and try to shuffle it off to the masses as "fact" when in FACT you don't have any facts, because everything you've seen is based on what very, very, very, very little you know of the cosmos from sitting on a infinitesimal planet in its vastness of however big it is.

3. Just because it's an absent area of light, doesn't meant it's something that turned into a vaccum cleaner for some reason and sucking up stuff and spitting it out somewhere else. To my understanding of what "science" is on this planet, that is science FICTION, not science FACT.

4. Even if I believed the dead planet theory or the imploding star theory turning into a black hole, it still isn't FACT. Just THEORY. There are other theories I can get behind in understanding, because they actually make sense....BASED ON WHAT LITTLE WE KNOW of interstellar science as we know it on this planet. But that still doesn't make any of it FACT.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Anyhoo...

Black holes are pretty amazing. One of the interesting things about them is that they only present 3 physical properties: mass, spin, and charge.

What this means is that, despite not knowing for sure that a black hole is a true singularity, it doesn't matter one iota, when observing a black hole and predicting its behavior.

 

[toobfreak]

Humans have NOT been to a black hole.

I did not claim that. Apparently you don't comprehend very well what I'm trying to tell you.

They don't even KNOW FOR FACT that it IS what they claim it to be.

We absolutely have identified numerous black holes. Has anyone been to the Sun? To Mars? Yet we are sure what those are and what and where they are as well.

You cannot tell me that looking at a microscopic point in the galaxy gives you any freedom to claim what exactly it is you are looking at.

Look, LW--- I'm not going to argue well-known and proven astrophysics. I don't care if you believe me or understand or not, but it obviously wouldn't hurt you to read a few books on the matter.

Here's a great general book to read:

The Physical Universe by Frank Shu.

https://www.amazon.com/Physical-Universe-Introduction-Astronomy-Books/dp/0935702059/?tag=usmb-20

 

[trevorjohnson83]

could be a piece of matter from the outer verse, or looking into the outer verse.