What is the goal of capitalism?

[progressive hunter]

China is a special case... It is not fully capitalist. For example state owned companies are responsible for about 40% of gdp. Most of the banking sector is state-owned. And the Communist Party of China is still ruling and calling itself "communist"... although the country is only communist to a limited extent.

china is a perfect example of crony capitalism,,,

 

[Mexicano]

no thats capitalism throughout the history of mankind,,, its never changed,, whats changed is the government forcing both employers and employees to work in a way they demand,,

and youre giving laws that force capitalism to deteriorate away from being true free market capitalism into crony capitalism,,

Your statements seem to contradict each other.

On one hand you seem to be admitting the government is enacting laws, that arise from the demands of "employees" ( let's be clear at that , the 8 hour shift was not the employers idea).
Then you seem to imply that those laws "force capitalism to deteriorate".
... that's puzzling to say the least.

 

[progressive hunter]

Your statements seem to contradict each other.

On one hand you seem to be admitting the government is enacting laws, that arise from the demands of "employees" ( let's be clear at that , the 8 hour shift was not the employers idea).
Then you seem to imply that those laws "force capitalism to deteriorate".
... that's puzzling to say the least.

did you miss the part where I said it makes it into a crony capitalist system and not a free market capitalism???

so no I didnt contradict myself,,

do you consider corporations as free market or crony capitalism,,,

 

[TruthNotBS]

This is just a philosophical question. Is there a goal for capitalism at all? Is it to maximize personal liberty or production? or is it to maximize well being?

Private capital accumulation a.k.a. Profits. The driving force and bottom line of capitalist production isn't the public good, meeting the needs of the consumer, charity, or patriotism, it's profits. You can have the vaccine for a deadly disease and if no one has the money to purchase it, people die. You can have a warehouse full of food, and if people don't have the money to purchase the food, they starve. There are millions of people right now starving around the world, yet we have plenty of food to feed them. There are millions of vacant homes and apartments in the US, and yet we have 600K homeless people, living out in the street. In capitalism you can have a surplus of goods, stored in warehouses and the public still suffers.

Here in New York City, bakeries throw away tons of food monthly, that could be eaten by the homeless or those in need:

The goal of capitalism is private capital accumulation/profits. It's that simple.
​

 

[Blues Man]

This is just a philosophical question. Is there a goal for capitalism at all? Is it to maximize personal liberty or production? or is it to maximize well being?

There is no goal.

Why does there have to be?

 

[TruthNotBS]

There is no goal.

Why does there have to be?

There doesn't have to be anything, but there is a goal nonetheless. Profits.

 

[Mexicano]

There is no goal.

Why does there have to be?

Allow me to rephrase the question: What is the goal of allowing a capitalist system to run a country?

 

[Mexicano]

did you miss the part where I said it makes it into a crony capitalist system and not a free market capitalism???

so no I didnt contradict myself,,

do you consider corporations as free market or crony capitalism,,,

No , I didn't, but then I have to assume the time in which workers had to work 12 to 14 hours with no days off and no security in their jobs seem to be your prefered form of capitalism.
By the standard definition of corporation, it is a part of the free market.
On the other hand, monopolies and oligopolies are a natural formation of capitalism ( due to profit accumulation) that don't allow the mechanisms of competition to work correctly.

Corporation - a company or group of people authorized to act as a single entity (legally a person) and recognized as such in law.

 

[progressive hunter]

No , I didn't, but then I have to assume the time in which workers had to work 12 to 14 hours with no days off and no security in their jobs seem to be your prefered form of capitalism.
By the standard definition of corporation, it is a part of the free market.
On the other hand, monopolies and oligopolies are a natural formation of capitalism ( due to profit accumulation) that don't allow the mechanisms of competition to work correctly.

Corporation - a company or group of people authorized to act as a single entity (legally a person) and recognized as such in law.

how can a corporation be free market when everything they do is regulated by government??

monopolies are also a creation of government,,

its the government that stops any competition and causes monopolies,,

how can you say corporations are free market and then show how they are a creation of government,,

you may want to wait til you get out of jr high before having anymore adult conversations,,

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Non-profit equals deficit, debt, bankruptcy. Poverty shared by all.

Profits reflect efficiency and growth of investment. Profits allow for expansion and growth of enterprise. Profit reflects reward in proportion to investment and effort manged efficiently.

Those opposed to profits/free enterprise/capitalism tend to be ineffective, non-productive and greedy. Wanting to take form the productive others without earning such theft.

Oinkonomics

Strawman. But you can sell your straw to your cult so they can stuff their empty brain-cavities with it. It also provides a soft bed for pigs to sleep on.

 

[progressive hunter]

Allow me to rephrase the question: What is the goal of allowing a capitalist system to run a country?

who said it runs a country,,

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

there is a goal nonetheless. Profits.

Privileges

 

[Dadoalex]

This is just a philosophical question. Is there a goal for capitalism at all? Is it to maximize personal liberty or production? or is it to maximize well being?

In a single photo

In the end all the resources will be in the hands of a single person.

 

[Mexicano]

how can a corporation be free market when everything they do is regulated by government??

monopolies are also a creation of government,,

its the government that stops any competition and causes monopolies,,

how can you say corporations are free market and then show how they are a creation of government,,

you may want to wait til you get out of jr high before having anymore adult conversations,,

Property rights, ( including intellectual property) the right to safety, to life and liberty are also government regulations. Free market occurs within a legal framework
From the investopedia:
"A free market is one where voluntary exchange and the laws of supply and demand provide the sole basis for the economic system, without government intervention".
So yes, free markets happen not only with government regulations , but because government regulations exist.

There is no empirical evidence that government is responsible for creating monopolies and oligopolies. They have formed all other the globe in al forms of governments. That includes the period of US history where the government size was small . Enter the robber barons era:

Robber Barons: Definition, Significance, Criticism, and Examples

A robber baron is a term from America's Gilded Age attributed to any successful businessperson whose practices are considered unethical or unscrupulous.

www.investopedia.com

Finally I am discussing politely. I do not engage into name calling, I find that to be a childish behavior. I encourage you to stop any personal attacks for the sake of discussion.

 

[task0778]

I do have to point out there was a time in history when human trafficking was seen as business as usual.
The "freedom" is therefore not an intrinsic characteristic of capitalism but an amendment to it.

To me, "freedom" means free to choose. It is the voluntary choice to buy or sell at a given or negotiated price, otherwise it ain't capitalism. As far as human trafficking is concerned, the people being bought and sold is obviously not capitalism since they were not given a choice. It is slavery under a different name, and there is nothing voluntary about that.

 

[TruthNotBS]

To me, "freedom" means free to choose. It is the voluntary choice to buy or sell at a given or negotiated price, otherwise it ain't capitalism. As far as human trafficking is concerned, the people being bought and sold is obviously not capitalism since they were not given a choice. It is slavery under a different name, and there is nothing voluntary about that.

The product doesn't have to be objectified or exploited by choice to be sold for a profit. If the sale of products in a marketplace is for the purpose of private capital accumulation or in the pursuit of profits, then that's capitalism.

 

[task0778]

The product doesn't have to be objectified or exploited by choice to be sold for a profit. If the sale of products in a marketplace is for the purpose of private capital accumulation or in the pursuit of profits, then that's capitalism.

Says you. I do not believe a human being can be or should be considered the same as property or a product. Hell, any economic model you care to name could include slavery or any other illegal activity that results from an involuntary action or decision. That shit has been going on for thousands of years before capitalism came along. And now all of a sudden you want to denigrate capitalism for the sins of human behavior? Fuck that.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Says you. I do not believe a human being can be or should be considered the same as property or a product. Hell, any economic model you care to name could include slavery or any other illegal activity that results from an involuntary action or decision. That shit has been going on for thousands of years before capitalism came along. And now all of a sudden you want to denigrate capitalism for the sins of human behavior? Fuck that.

That's why capitalism can't function without some type of government regulation and oversight. It requires government infrastructure and what Adam Smith called "public goods".

 

[Captain Caveman]

This is just a philosophical question. Is there a goal for capitalism at all? Is it to maximize personal liberty or production? or is it to maximize well being?

The goal is, you reap what you sow and you have choice.

 

[progressive hunter]

Property rights, ( including intellectual property) the right to safety, to life and liberty are also government regulations. Free market occurs within a legal framework
From the investopedia:
"A free market is one where voluntary exchange and the laws of supply and demand provide the sole basis for the economic system, without government intervention".
So yes, free markets happen not only with government regulations , but because government regulations exist.

There is no empirical evidence that government is responsible for creating monopolies and oligopolies. They have formed all other the globe in al forms of governments. That includes the period of US history where the government size was small . Enter the robber barons era:

Robber Barons: Definition, Significance, Criticism, and Examples

A robber baron is a term from America's Gilded Age attributed to any successful businessperson whose practices are considered unethical or unscrupulous.

www.investopedia.com

Finally I am discussing politely. I do not engage into name calling, I find that to be a childish behavior. I encourage you to stop any personal attacks for the sake of discussion.

wrong again

property rights are protected by the government not granted,, theres no such right as a right to safety,, life and liberty are protected by government not granted,,
free market is what it is,, all government can do is restrict it,,

again youre wrong,, government regulations are the opposite of a free market system,,,

you should stop reading marx and get up to speed,, you sound like the typical college de-educated useful idiot,,