CDZ What if we ARE alone?

[Syriusly]

It means, if we are alone in the Universe, it only means we are the first. The Universe is far from being finished.

That seems illogical to me. Given the vastness of the universe, the odds of intelligent life randomly appearing only once is infinitesimal. If we are indeed unique, there must have been some purpose for our existence.

Given the vastness of the universe there could be millions of intelligent species that we will never be able to detect. So while you may think we are unique, it would just be a matter of faith to actually believe that we are unique- just as it would be a matter of faith to declare that we are not unique.

 

[Flash]

It is foolish to believe we are alone in the universe. The sheer size of the universe is beyond the capacity of the human brain to comprehend it. To try to imagine a space so immense, that it NEVER ends? Even if there is an end at some point, a HUGE glass ball we exist in, then we must ask, "What is on the other side of the glass?"

This is why people who deny God are such fools.

It is foolish to conjure up science where science doesn't exist.

Right now we have absolutely zero scientific proof that life exist outside of earth.

We are alone until we find something else.

God may have created an universe teaming with life or we may be His only creation. We just don't know right now.

I use to think that microbial life could be fairly common beyond earth. I was also thinking that advance life could happen but be rare.

However, the more I learn about the boundaries between Chemistry and Biology the more I am inclined to think that earth may be the only place that the magic happen.

It takes a lot more than just water, a bunch of organic chemicals and the right temperature to produce life. If that is all it took then every Jr High school science class would be producing life as a classroom lab demonstration.

I suspect that the Human race will die out before we answer that question definitely.

I doubt we will ever get beyond Mars, if even there. If we don't find some kind of evidence of microbial life forming during the same time period it formed on earth back when Mars had water and an atmosphere then we will probably never find it.

Probably the best we can hope for is one of these days we can produce life in the lab. Then that would at least give us the condition that need to happen for Chemistry to turn into Biology. Of course even then we will never know if those conditions ever existed outside of the lab or the primordial earth.

 

[fncceo]

It is foolish to conjure up science where science doesn't exist.

You obviously don't understand science.

In order to discover what is true, you are required to speculate what might be true. You speculations must match the observed data or, if they don't, you must discard or change your speculations.

It is a methodology for discovery that has brought us out of ignorance but, it requires both hard calculated logic as well as a great deal of speculation.

 

[Flash]

It is foolish to conjure up science where science doesn't exist.

You obviously don't understand science.

In order to discover what is true, you are required to speculate what might be true. You speculations must match the observed data or, if they don't, you must discard or change your speculations.

It is a methodology for discovery that has brought us out of ignorance but, it requires both hard calculated logic as well as a great deal of speculation.

To speculate on anything you really need more than one data point.

We only have one data point on life in the universe.

We need to have at least one more data point or else anything that we speculate on is nothing more than wishful thinking. At least that is what I learned in my Engineering classes.

A TV show where Cpt Kirk is screwing a green Orion Slave Girl is not a data point.

Somebody saying "there just has to more life in the Universe because it is so large" is not a data point.

Statistics doesn't produce life.

 

[fncceo]

To speculate on anything you really need more than one data point.

Not really. You can create a hypothesis with a single data point. You can even create one where you have no data at all (referred to as a Null Hypothesis), just a hypothesis that doesn't disagree with established observations.

Speculating that life (intelligent or otherwise) might exist doesn't clash with our known observations of the Universe. That is science.

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

 

[task0778]

To speculate on anything you really need more than one data point.

Not really. You can create a hypothesis with a single data point. You can even create one where you have no data at all (referred to as a Null Hypothesis), just a hypothesis that doesn't disagree with established observations.

Speculating that life (intelligent or otherwise) might exist doesn't clash with our known observations of the Universe. That is science.

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

You were going good until you wrote the last line. Claiming that UFOs have visited us is a hypothesis based on thousands of observations; i.e., speculation. That is science. Do we know who or what is responsible for much of human civilization? I don't think so, so claiming that UFOs are responsible for that is science too; you said it yourself, a hypothesis can be created without a single data point. There are a lot of hypotheses out there concerning human civilization, and alien visitation is only one of them, but nonetheless has not been dis-proven to my knowledge. True, not very likely but science does not arbitrarily discard that which is very unlikely without evidence.

 

[Flash]

[Q

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

Nobody has ever said it was. At least no serious scientist.

However, one of the reasons that so many people are absolutely convinced that there is life elsewhere is because the Human race has been brainwashed for the last 100 years with Science Fiction.

When a person can turn on the TV every night and see aliens and Cpt Kirk star trekking across the universe they become believers. Even with no science to back it up.

 

[fncceo]

[Q

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

Nobody has ever said it was. At least no serious scientist.

However, one of the reasons that so many people are absolutely convinced that there is life elsewhere is because the Human race has been brainwashed for the last 100 years with Science Fiction.

When a person can turn on the TV every night and see aliens and Cpt Kirk star trekking across the universe they become believers. Even with no science to back it up.

You get that Science Fiction is fiction, right?

No one really believes the immediate galaxy is filled with English-Speaking aliens who look like us except for bumps on their heads.

Science fiction is a way of using speculative science as a metaphor for a more mundane setting.

 

[fncceo]

a hypothesis can be created without a single data point

Yes, but you skipped the part where they can't be in disagreement with other known data points.

We know who created the pyramids. We know that human DNA evolved on this planet. Claiming an alien origin for human existence or human artifacts isn't science ... it's pop culture.

 

[Flash]

[Q

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

Nobody has ever said it was. At least no serious scientist.

However, one of the reasons that so many people are absolutely convinced that there is life elsewhere is because the Human race has been brainwashed for the last 100 years with Science Fiction.

When a person can turn on the TV every night and see aliens and Cpt Kirk star trekking across the universe they become believers. Even with no science to back it up.

You get that Science Fiction is fiction, right?

No one really believes the immediate galaxy is filled with English-Speaking aliens who look like us except for bumps on their heads.

Science fiction is a way of using speculative science as a metaphor for a more mundane setting.

I think you are confused about the point I was making.

Being inundated with Science fiction has caused many people to be convinced that there is life elsewhere when the science doesn't support it.

 

[fncceo]

[Q

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

Nobody has ever said it was. At least no serious scientist.

However, one of the reasons that so many people are absolutely convinced that there is life elsewhere is because the Human race has been brainwashed for the last 100 years with Science Fiction.

When a person can turn on the TV every night and see aliens and Cpt Kirk star trekking across the universe they become believers. Even with no science to back it up.

You get that Science Fiction is fiction, right?

No one really believes the immediate galaxy is filled with English-Speaking aliens who look like us except for bumps on their heads.

Science fiction is a way of using speculative science as a metaphor for a more mundane setting.

I think you are confused about the point I was making.

Being inundated with Science fiction has caused many people to be convinced that there is life elsewhere when the science doesn't support it.

There is nothing wrong with believing that life exists elsewhere. Nothing is science precludes it.

I'm sure 'Lord of the Rings' movies convinced a few people that Orcs, Goblins, and Hobbits really existed. However, science does preclude that.

There were people in the day who thought 'I Love Lucy' was real.

As for the contention, that Science Fiction causes science ignorance? Well, I will argue that the ignorance was already there before Science Fiction showed up. It is merely being blamed for the crime.

 

[task0778]

a hypothesis can be created without a single data point

Yes, but you skipped the part where they can't be in disagreement with other known data points.

We know who created the pyramids. We know that human DNA evolved on this planet. Claiming an alien origin for human existence or human artifacts isn't science ... it's pop culture.

Whoa dude, we were talking about who might be responsible for human civilization, not the evolution of human DNA or the origin of human existence. Actually, current science cannot rule out alien intervention in either case. If so, maybe you could provide a link that shows how/why that is not possible? Until science can provably rule out a theory or hypothesis, it remains just that, an unproven idea. And science does not rule out anything that has not been disproved. It might not be accepted theory, pop culture if you will, I don't think a scientist should discard as not science something that may be very unlikely but nonetheless not impossible either.

 

[AveryJarhman]

Being inundated with Science fiction has caused many people to be convinced that there is life elsewhere when the science doesn't support it.

If you believe scientist's estimating that 100 to 400 billion planets exist in the Milky Way galaxy, then it is reasonable to believe the laws of probability when considering if life exists in the ENTIRE universe. A universe said to be populated by countless galaxies.

Peace.

 

[fncceo]

a hypothesis can be created without a single data point

Yes, but you skipped the part where they can't be in disagreement with other known data points.

We know who created the pyramids. We know that human DNA evolved on this planet. Claiming an alien origin for human existence or human artifacts isn't science ... it's pop culture.

Whoa dude, we were talking about who might be responsible for human civilization, not the evolution of human DNA or the origin of human existence. Actually, current science cannot rule out alien intervention in either case. If so, maybe you could provide a link that shows how/why that is not possible? Until science can provably rule out a theory or hypothesis, it remains just that, an unproven idea. And science does not rule out anything that has not been disproved. It might not be accepted theory, pop culture if you will, I don't think a scientist should discard as not science something that may be very unlikely but nonetheless not impossible either.

I'm addressing the theories propagated by Von Daniken, Velikovsky and others concerning alien / cosmic intervention in Human History or the idea that an alien race might be seeding the galaxy with humanoid life.

We already know enough about the use of technology throughout history to make redundant the outrageous speculation that alien technology created our ancient monuments. I can't prove Elves or Fairies didn't built the pyramids, that doesn't make it a scientifically valid hypothesis because there are so many mundane observations that prove otherwise.

As for an alien race populating the galaxy, humans have so much DNA in common with all other forms of life on the planet that the idea that humanoids have an alien origin doesn't fit.

There is an idea, one to which I am partial, that all life on Earth, not just human life, could have come here an ancient asteroids. A very simple kind of microbe that evolved over Billions of years to adapt to our planet. The same microbes landing on a different planet would have evolved in a very different direction.

 

[Flash]

Being inundated with Science fiction has caused many people to be convinced that there is life elsewhere when the science doesn't support it.

If you believe scientist's estimating that 100 to 400 billion planets exist in the Milky Way galaxy, then it is reasonable to believe the laws of probability when considering if life exists in the ENTIRE universe. A universe said to be populated by countless galaxies.

Peace.

The Law of Probability doesn't produce life.

Scientists can't estimate anything with only one data point.

When we get other data points then we can establish probabilities. Until then not so much so.

If this is an finite universe then there can be unique things. For all we know life is unique to earth.

 

[AveryJarhman]

If this is an finite universe then there can be unique things. For all we know life is unique to earth.

Hey, Flash. The science I follow tells me new galaxies are constantly forming from the remnants of exploding stars. Meaning the universe is not finite.

However, you could be correct. Without more info it would be silly to argue this point.

Peace.

 

[Syriusly]

It is foolish to conjure up science where science doesn't exist.

You obviously don't understand science.

In order to discover what is true, you are required to speculate what might be true. You speculations must match the observed data or, if they don't, you must discard or change your speculations.

It is a methodology for discovery that has brought us out of ignorance but, it requires both hard calculated logic as well as a great deal of speculation.

To speculate on anything you really need more than one data point.

We only have one data point on life in the universe.

We need to have at least one more data point or else anything that we speculate on is nothing more than wishful thinking. At least that is what I learned in my Engineering classes.

A TV show where Cpt Kirk is screwing a green Orion Slave Girl is not a data point.

Somebody saying "there just has to more life in the Universe because it is so large" is not a data point.

Statistics doesn't produce life.

I agree.

Just like saying that life is complex so there must be an intelligent design.

We have no evidence of life outside of Earth and we have no evidence of an God like beings- stating that either must be true is just a matter of faith.

 

[Flash]

If this is an finite universe then there can be unique things. For all we know life is unique to earth.

Hey, Flash. The science I follow tells me new galaxies are constantly forming from the remnants of exploding stars. Meaning the universe is not finite.

However, you could be correct. Without more info it would be silly to argue this point.

Peace.

Yea that is the problem. We have never found life off earth. We can't produce life in the Lab.

We just don't have enough data to make any definitive assertions about life elsewhere.

 

[Syriusly]

[Q

Claiming that UFOs have visited us and are responsible for much of human civilization which directly refutes what we already know. That is not science.

Nobody has ever said it was. At least no serious scientist.

However, one of the reasons that so many people are absolutely convinced that there is life elsewhere is because the Human race has been brainwashed for the last 100 years with Science Fiction.

When a person can turn on the TV every night and see aliens and Cpt Kirk star trekking across the universe they become believers. Even with no science to back it up.

You get that Science Fiction is fiction, right?

No one really believes the immediate galaxy is filled with English-Speaking aliens who look like us except for bumps on their heads.

Science fiction is a way of using speculative science as a metaphor for a more mundane setting.

I think you are confused about the point I was making.

Being inundated with Science fiction has caused many people to be convinced that there is life elsewhere when the science doesn't support it.

Before there was science fiction, people speculated that they were spotting angels and demons and fairies.

People are going to come up with explanations for things that they see that they can't explain.

 

[Votto]

How would that conclusion change your perception of the Earth, the universe and mankind? Would you still believe all of these were accidental? Would our uniqueness upset your belief in scientific certainty?

Or would you never accept the possibility that we might be alone?

I sure wish we were alone. It's hell being abducted and anally probed for no good reason.

Bunch of sick Left wing fairies no doubt.