What if the universe is infinite in every direction, macro and micro?

[Anomalism]

I am not saying that, what I am pointing out is the relevant commonality.

Might there be reality behind what we can observe and what can ever affect us?

Sure. Or no. It doesn't matter much.

Is there an elephant behind you right now? How do you know it didn't disappear, when you turned around? You don't.

So you would turn to an objective measuring device. But when your devices are useless, where does that leave you?

Was the elephant there? Correct answer: Doesn't matter in the least. Yes and no are actually the same answer, as far as we are concerned

It's fun to think about, and our models of reality are proven incomplete regularly.

 

[westwall]

It's fun to think about, and our models of reality are proven incomplete regularly.

Our models are only as good as our ability to observe, or measure the reality they are trying to describe.

Our capabilities in both, as regards cosmology, are infinitismal.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

It's fun to think about, and our models of reality are proven incomplete regularly.

Incomplete doesn't mean fundamentally wrong, though. And that's what would have to happen, here.

Not likely,IMO. I think the speed (time) limit and the space limit will forever hold, as properties of our universe.

 

[Anomalism]

Incomplete doesn't mean fundamentally wrong, though. And that's what would have to happen, here.

Not likely,IMO. I think the speed (time) limit and the space limit will forever hold, as properties of our universe.

Incomplete has sometimes meant exactly that. Foundationally wrong at certain scales rather than just missing details. Newtonian mechanics was replaced at the architectural level by relativity. The same happened with quantum mechanics.

Also I'm making a claim about the possible frame our universe operates within, not disputing its local laws. The question is whether the rules of this universe are the rules of all possible reality, or whether they're local laws that apply within a specific context.

 

[sparky]

or whether they're local laws that apply within a specific context.

trapped in the physical realm Ano?

~S~

 

[Leo123]

The Quantum theory seems to condense down to wave forms that, when observed, appear to be solid, but they are not. Nothing we see is truly solid, for instance, when we touch say, a table, we can't got through it because of opposing fields not because it is really a solid mass.

 

[Slade3200]

Not expanding AND contracting, just expanding. Based on current theory there's not enough matter to have enough gravity to bring it all back together.

My point still applies. If it’s expanding then you can’t logically say it is expanding into nothing. There needs to be space for it to expand to

 

[westwall]

My point still applies. If it’s expanding then you can’t logically say it is expanding into nothing. There needs to be space for it to expand to

Not really. The bubble theory holds that beyond the boundary of the Universe is nothing.

 

[Slade3200]

Not really. The bubble theory holds that beyond the boundary of the Universe is nothing.

It may say or assume that but it can not be explained as we are limited in our understanding by our perception of space and time.

That covers space, let’s look at time for the other example. Infinity means no beginning and no end. One second before the start or one second after. We know there is always more but we just can’t understand it.

 

[westwall]

It may say or assume that but it can not be explained as we are limited in our understanding by our perception of space and time.

That covers space, let’s look at time for the other example. Infinity means no beginning and no end. One second before the start or one second after. We know there is always more but we just can’t understand it.

Why not?

 

[Slade3200]

Why not?

Because I haven’t heard a reasonable explanation. Feel free to try and prove me wrong by proving one.

 

[westwall]

Because I haven’t heard a reasonable explanation. Feel free to try and prove me wrong by proving one.

You said we can't understand time, and space.

Why can't we?

 

[Slade3200]

You said we can't understand time, and space.

Why can't we?

I said we can’t understand infinity because of our perception of time and space

 

[westwall]

I said we can’t understand infinity because of our perception of time and space

Once again, why not? It is merely a concept. We can't live it, but we are certainly able of understanding the concept.

It's not magic.

 

[Slade3200]

Once again, why not? It is merely a concept. We can't live it, but we are certainly able of understanding the concept.

It's not magic.

Please explain the concept to me then in a way that makes logical sense

 

[westwall]

Please explain the concept to me then in a way that makes logical sense

What's not to understand. Mankind exists for a mere tic of time, infinity is merely a continuous line of tics of time.

We are here for our allotted time, and then we are gone.

There's nothing profound there.

 

[Slade3200]

What's not to understand. Mankind exists for a mere tic of time, infinity is merely a continuous line of tics of time.

We are here for our allotted time, and then we are gone.

There's nothing profound there.

Haha, like with the optical arguments you completely ignore the actual point I’ve made and then make a counterpoint on a narrative of your choosing. Let’s back up.

I’ve pointed out our inability to understand infinity and specifically the concept of time and there being no beginning. So please explain that. We also discussed the edge of an expanding universe and the concept of infinity there. I said we can’t comprehend. You said it can be explained logically. So explain it

You coming back saying that we humans are here and then gone doesn’t even come close to addressing the point. Try again.

 

[Slade3200]

What's not to understand. Mankind exists for a mere tic of time, infinity is merely a continuous line of tics of time.

We are here for our allotted time, and then we are gone.

There's nothing profound there.

Here is some food for thought from the late great Carl

 

[Hafar1014]

They are both right using two different measures one science the other faith. Science cant answer and faith is a belief.

 

[westwall]

Haha, like with the optical arguments you completely ignore the actual point I’ve made and then make a counterpoint on a narrative of your choosing. Let’s back up.

I’ve pointed out our inability to understand infinity and specifically the concept of time and there being no beginning. So please explain that. We also discussed the edge of an expanding universe and the concept of infinity there. I said we can’t comprehend. You said it can be explained logically. So explain it

You coming back saying that we humans are here and then gone doesn’t even come close to addressing the point. Try again.

But it does. You claim infinity, and time can't be understood, I say it can. I fundamentally understand the concept of time, and the passage of time. I also understand that the closer you get to the speed of light, the slower time appears to be.

None of that is profound to me.

The same goes for infinity. I understand that a line can exist with no beginning, and no end. Once again, not profound.

I also understand, that to the lifespan of a human, it doesn't matter at all.