What firearms are protected by the 2nd Amendment

[JakeStarkey]

Charles, I respect what you are saying, but the Constitution, as far as slavery was concerned, was, as Garrison wrote, a compact with hell. The Constitution did not end slavery. A mighty civil war that killed 3 and wounded 5 of every hundred Americans ended it. The 13th Amendment was the result of the Civil War.
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You just proved what I said.

The founders, some of them opposed to Slavery, understood there would be no ratification, and no nation, if they attempt to end slavery.

However in their wisdom they made a constitution that was able to be changed later.

Which the 13th Amendment is proof of.

You are right, it took a civil war to end slavery. Which is exactly why the founders did not even attempt to end it. Because it would have split the colonies and ended any chance at Ratification.

Yes, we agree that the FF failed on the issue of slavery, knowing it would be later generations that would have to settle the issue and also alter the Constitution to exclude the cultural illness.

 

[Charles_Main]

Charles, I respect what you are saying, but the Constitution, as far as slavery was concerned, was, as Garrison wrote, a compact with hell. The Constitution did not end slavery. A mighty civil war that killed 3 and wounded 5 of every hundred Americans ended it. The 13th Amendment was the result of the Civil War.
.

You just proved what I said.

The founders, some of them opposed to Slavery, understood there would be no ratification, and no nation, if they attempt to end slavery.

However in their wisdom they made a constitution that was able to be changed later.

Which the 13th Amendment is proof of.

You are right, it took a civil war to end slavery. Which is exactly why the founders did not even attempt to end it. Because it would have split the colonies and ended any chance at Ratification.

Yes, we agree that the FF failed on the issue of slavery, knowing it would be later generations that would have to settle the issue and also alter the Constitution to exclude the cultural illness.

We agree? Hmm, I said I suppose you could call it failure. However in truth. The only way they were going to create this Nation in the first place, was to put off the issue, and they knew it.

So in that they actually did the only thing that could be done.

Several of the founders wrote extensively about the issue, and how they would have liked to put an end to slavery, but knew it was not in the cards at the time.

Sure I would like to be able to look back, and not see the blemish that is constitutionally accepted slavery. However I am happy to have a United States History to look back on at all, and I assure you had they stood on Moral Principle and tried to create a Nation free of Slavery. You would not be living in the United States we know and love today.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I am in firm agreement

 

[JBeukema]

I realize that. It was the SLAVE TRADE and any part of it was wrong...period.

Making the FF and COTUS wrong

And COTUS prevented any amendment to abolish slavery, btw


Meaning that if you believe in the constitution, you believe that abolishing slavery in 1807 would have been evil and wrong because it would have been unconstitutional.


Sometimes the Law is simply wrong.

The FF new that if they abolished slavery then the southern half of the colonies would secede from the Union, just as they did in 1865.

Yes, we know, the Southerners we all evil slaveholders while the North was always a bastion of liberty in all the years preceding the war
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[JBeukema]

This silliness is old.

Verdugo-Urquidez, 494 U. S. 259, 265 (1990) :



If the 2nd doesn't protect an individual right to arms, then there's no way to argue that the government needs a warrant to tap your cell phone.

Are you responding to me or to JBEK because I agree with you. Without collectiveness at an individual level, you would not have a national community. I agree that the 2nd Amendment protects the right of individuals to own arms.

I know. I was responding to the silliness that JB brought up thru you because JB is a waste of time, and so is on ignore.

There's -no question- that the 2nd protects and individual right, regardless of that individual's relationship to any militia.

Then why does it mention the militia at all? And why did you spend page after page tying the right to have a gun to the concept of a militia?

 

[JBeukema]

Then do not defend the Founders' failures about slavery.

Who the fuck do you think you are? The founders fought and died for something your punk ass does not deserve. You're passing judgement on them why not pass judgement on the people from which they came from? Why not pass judgement on the place that it still happens today? Fuck you fuck everything about you when you died I hope you die in pain eaten alive by rats.. You filthy piece of shit.

Wow, you get really mad when your religion is questioned...

Koestler warned us about this

The [dogmatic] novice, subjecting his soul to the canon law of [the leaders], [feels] something of the release which Catholicism also brings... Once the renunciation has been made, the mind, instead of operating freely, becomes the servant of a higher and unquestioned purpose. To deny the truth is an act of service. This, of course, is why it is useless to discuss any particular aspect of [the matter] with [these people]. Any genuine intellectual contact which you have with him involves a challenge to his fundamental faith, a struggle for his soul. For it is very much easier to lay the oblation of spiritual pride on the alter of [political vision] than to snatch it back again

 

[JBeukema]

Who the fuck do you think you are? The founders fought and died for something your punk ass does not deserve. You're passing judgement on them why not pass judgement on the people from which they came from? Why not pass judgement on the place that it still happens today? Fuck you fuck everything about you when you died I hope you die in pain eaten alive by rats.. You filthy piece of shit.

Man that felt good.

The Founders failed on the issue of slavery, biggie. Not even a discussion can exist on that.

If you read many of the founders writings, you will learn that many of them did not like slavery, but they recognized that if they had tried to end it then, the United States would have never been a Nation. Period.

IN order to unite the colonies, and to have the strength and will to defy England. They had no choice but to put off the issue of slavery for another time. However in their wisdom they did make a constitution able to be changed in the future to put an end to it.

It's 1807: do you support or oppose a vote to abolish slavery?

 

[JBeukema]

you cannot talk shit about the founders then praise the flag, country and the constitution you hypocrit piece of shit. It was the founders who gave it to you..

How many times have you insulted the Wobblies and Suffragettes (read: evil lefty communists) who made America as good as it is today?

 

[JBeukema]

enemy of the state

You refer, of course, to every traitor who raised arms against the Crown, right?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Then do not defend the Founders' failures about slavery.

Who the fuck do you think you are? The founders fought and died for something your punk ass does not deserve. You're passing judgement on them why not pass judgement on the people from which they came from? Why not pass judgement on the place that it still happens today? Fuck you fuck everything about you when you died I hope you die in pain eaten alive by rats.. You filthy piece of shit.

Wow, you get really mad when your religion is questioned...

Koestler warned us about this

The [dogmatic] novice, subjecting his soul to the canon law of [the leaders], [feels] something of the release which Catholicism also brings... Once the renunciation has been made, the mind, instead of operating freely, becomes the servant of a higher and unquestioned purpose. To deny the truth is an act of service. This, of course, is why it is useless to discuss any particular aspect of [the matter] with [these people]. Any genuine intellectual contact which you have with him involves a challenge to his fundamental faith, a struggle for his soul. For it is very much easier to lay the oblation of spiritual pride on the alter of [political vision] than to snatch it back again

No I get pissed off at hypocrits and those who defend them. and turn around and call me un-American, especially when they talk shit about the founders of this country and the constitution.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

you cannot talk shit about the founders then praise the flag, country and the constitution you hypocrit piece of shit. It was the founders who gave it to you..

How many times have you insulted the Wobblies and Suffragettes (read: evil lefty communists) who made America as good as it is today?

Are you a troll? Just wondering?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The Founders failed on the issue of slavery, biggie. Not even a discussion can exist on that.

If you read many of the founders writings, you will learn that many of them did not like slavery, but they recognized that if they had tried to end it then, the United States would have never been a Nation. Period.

IN order to unite the colonies, and to have the strength and will to defy England. They had no choice but to put off the issue of slavery for another time. However in their wisdom they did make a constitution able to be changed in the future to put an end to it.

It's 1807: do you support or oppose a vote to abolish slavery?

The only reason the north wanted to end slavery was because they where not agriculture based. It was not a moral issue at the time. The south had a lot of money invested in slavery because of Yankee shipping. The North is not given a pass they are just as dirty as the south.

 

[JBeukema]

Who the fuck do you think you are? The founders fought and died for something your punk ass does not deserve. You're passing judgement on them why not pass judgement on the people from which they came from? Why not pass judgement on the place that it still happens today? Fuck you fuck everything about you when you died I hope you die in pain eaten alive by rats.. You filthy piece of shit.

Wow, you get really mad when your religion is questioned...

Koestler warned us about this

The [dogmatic] novice, subjecting his soul to the canon law of [the leaders], [feels] something of the release which Catholicism also brings... Once the renunciation has been made, the mind, instead of operating freely, becomes the servant of a higher and unquestioned purpose. To deny the truth is an act of service. This, of course, is why it is useless to discuss any particular aspect of [the matter] with [these people]. Any genuine intellectual contact which you have with him involves a challenge to his fundamental faith, a struggle for his soul. For it is very much easier to lay the oblation of spiritual pride on the alter of [political vision] than to snatch it back again

No I get pissed off at hypocrits and those who defend them. and turn around and call me un-American, especially when they talk shit about the founders of this country and the constitution.

Saying they were human is 'talking shit'?

What are you, that 'human' is such an insult?

 

[JBeukema]

If you read many of the founders writings, you will learn that many of them did not like slavery, but they recognized that if they had tried to end it then, the United States would have never been a Nation. Period.

IN order to unite the colonies, and to have the strength and will to defy England. They had no choice but to put off the issue of slavery for another time. However in their wisdom they did make a constitution able to be changed in the future to put an end to it.

It's 1807: do you support or oppose a vote to abolish slavery?

[bullshit]

You didn't answer the question

 

[JBeukema]

you cannot talk shit about the founders then praise the flag, country and the constitution you hypocrit piece of shit. It was the founders who gave it to you..

How many times have you insulted the Wobblies and Suffragettes (read: evil lefty communists) who made America as good as it is today?

Are you a troll? Just wondering?

My user title and occupation are there for all to see

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Wow, you get really mad when your religion is questioned...

Koestler warned us about this

No I get pissed off at hypocrits and those who defend them. and turn around and call me un-American, especially when they talk shit about the founders of this country and the constitution.

Saying they were human is 'talking shit'?

What are you, that 'human' is such an insult?

You need to stop right there go back and read some of jakes old post he has made to me.

 

[JohnnyApplesack]

These second amendment nut cases should be allowed to buy all the muskets they want. Hell, let 'em form little neighborhood militias and go play war anytime they'd like - plenty of woodlands still left out there.

Who's trying to stop them?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

These second amendment nut cases should be allowed to buy all the muskets they want. Hell, let 'em form little neighborhood militias and go play war anytime they'd like - plenty of woodlands still left out there.

Who's trying to stop them?

You should remove yourself from the internet and start using your voice and Parchment and quill, because they never thought that an ink pen and a computer would have been the means to exercise your first amendment right.

 

[AmericanFirst]

The 2nd amendment protects your right to own and bear guns, it does not specify what type of guns. It was written for the purpose of the citizens of this great country could protect themselves against a tyrannical gov't. The liberals know this that is why they want to take our gun rights away.

 

[JBeukema]

These second amendment nut cases should be allowed to buy all the muskets they want. Hell, let 'em form little neighborhood militias and go play war anytime they'd like - plenty of woodlands still left out there.

Who's trying to stop them?

You should remove yourself from the internet and start using your voice and Parchment and quill, because they never thought that an ink pen and a computer would have been the means to exercise your first amendment right.

Should I be allowed to make ricin and buy yellowcake?