What Capitalism has Done for the Common Man.

[SniperFire]

The problem is keeping capitalism, capitalistic. It's like economist Friedman said, capitalism runs on greed, so some, pretending to be capitalists, end up trying to destroy capitalism by creating monopolies, mergers, holding companies and so on. To keep capitalism alive and well, government has had to pass all kinds of laws and regulations keeping the greedy ones from destroying our capitalistic economic system.

More accurately, I think you mean free markets and fair access to them.

 

[SniperFire]

If Capitalism has benefited the "common man" I can assure you it was unintentional.

Who cares if it was "intentional?" The question is what is the system that benefits the common man the most. The movie is a clue for you: it ain't socialism.

Furthermore, how does an economic system have "intention?"

You aren't thinking like a good communist.

 

[there4eyeM]

It is a bit strange to talk about what 'capitalism' has 'done' for 'the common man'. Without going into the classic problem in threads of defining all these terms, capitalism is not a faith or political ideology. It is simply an economic system. There is nothing that would make it an organ for either improving nor reducing the level of life for 'average' people.
The system developed at the end of the Middle Ages and debut of the Renaissance and had a truly liberating effect in many ways. As with all human institutions, certain psychological types soon seized upon it to manipulate the world to their liking. The same happens historically with religion, ideologies and organizations in general.
Capitalism is merely one way of doing things. There are many ways of doing things. Humans must remain flexible and maintain their choices, or they become less than human.
We have ideas. We should not let ideas 'have' us. Eclectic comes as close to a general human prescription as we can perhaps come.

 

[there4eyeM]

"Many economists believed that resources would forever remain limited and would result in a population bubble that would pop via death and mass starvation."

Why is this in the past tense? Why 'belief'? Of course resources are limited. Everything material in the universe is limited to some degree. There will certainly be a sudden and radical decline in human population if humans do not change their current habits. These are truths that are self evident. Biology is like that.

 

[Steelplate]

I dont't think "occupied" understands capitalism.

What you are reading from "occupied" and others of that ilk are examples of the educators bias against capitalism! This bias was taught in their colleges. The colleges have done as the MSM has done taken the "exceptions" i.e. the Madorffs, the Hollywood narrative, "Greed is good" and made that the rule !
As a result educators/colleges and people like "occupied" see ALL business, all Capitalism, All bankers as the bad guys! They hate Walmart. They love unions and all because a handful of educators who NEVER ran a business teach students who become teachers!

The test for the "Occupieds" of the world is ask a simple question..
what is the net profit of the average health insurance company.
They will immediately launch diatribes against high salaried execs. People being canceled or turned down. NOT ONE of them will understand the question much less know the answer!

Oh, trust me I know. When I went to college they required that I have 3 "social justice" credits. They accepted my economics class from a previous school. I didn't understand why until I found out that their economics class's had nothing to do with the sciences and everything to do with the arts (I assume you know the difference between the two). Whereas I was crunching numbers and plotting graphs, learning about scarcity, opportunity cost, trade, inflation, unemployment, employment, cost curves, employment curves etc. , they wrote unscientific essays on poverty and inequality. Go figure.

wow...you had to take 3 whole credits in....gasp!.....social justice? Do you mean to tell me that you actually had to listen to an opinion you didn't agree with? O my Good Lord, what is this nation coming to? That people actually have to sit aside their own emotions and learn about things they don't necessarily agree with!

It was one class dude....obviously you weren't scarred for life....suck it up.

 

[there4eyeM]

R.O.T.C. was compulsory (for men; how's that for sexist?) at my university. Talk about suffering for 3 credit hours doing something objectionable!

 

[Indofred]

If Capitalism has benefited the "common man" I can assure you it was unintentional.

Of course capitalism works for the common man.
Look at communism and ask which works better for the prols.

 

[OODA_Loop]

Pays the bills.

Baby needs a new pair of shoes.

 

[editec]

Yup.


Capitalism can be a highly productive system that can benefit a society greatly, no doubt.

OTOH, it does have some problems.

Like for example the 46 recession/depressions our system has suffered in the last 236 years.

Perhaps these economic downturns are a perfectly nature part of the system.

Or perhaps they are contrived by the money masters to insure that they continue to gain control over greater and greater percentage of the overall wealth.

But either way, the fact is that capitalism does have a propensity for providing us with a UNSTABLE economy.

 

[SniperFire]

Yup.


Capitalism can be a highly productive system that can benefit a society greatly, no doubt.

OTOH, it does have some problems.

Like for example the 46 recession/depressions our system has suffered in the last 236 years.

Perhaps these economic downturns are a perfectly nature part of the system.

Or perhaps they are contrived by the money masters to insure that they continue to gain control over greater and greater percentage of the overall wealth.

But either way, the fact is that capitalism does have a propensity for providing us with a UNSTABLE economy.

The other side of those 46 recessions, of course, are the 46 economic expansions that brought human beings from scratching a living out of the dirt to the poorest among us enjoying cable TV, free food and free healthcare.

In the big picture, the trade off is well worth it.

 

[there4eyeM]

Does anyone think that there is no alternative to 'capitalism'?

 

[midcan5]

"Most interactions with people that you trust, people that you love, or people that just need to cooperate with on an immediate basis, take the form of “From each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs.” It doesn’t matter if you’re working for the government, working for a corporation, or working in your family; if you need to fix the toilet because it’s leaking and you say “Hand me the wrench,” the other guy doesn’t say “What do I get for that?” It’s not an exchange; people act according to their abilities to chip in. Ironically communism is applied because it’s the only thing that works; it’s the most efficient way to allocate resources. Thus I like to say that you could argue that capitalism is just a bad way of organizing communism." David Graeber


I am always fascinated by those who look to some ideology and grant it a power and accomplishment that cannot be found in it. It is people working together or fighting each other that forms the world we live in. Capitalism is just a word with many meanings. I started reviewing my quote database but stopped with the few noted, enjoy and think.


"Moreover, if we give the matter a moment's thought, we can see that the 20th century morality tale of 'socialism vs. freedom' or 'communism vs. capitalism' is misleading. Capitalism is not a political system; it is a form of economic life, compatible in practice with right wing dictatorships (Chile under Pinochet), left-wing dictatorships (contemporary China), social-democratic monarchies (Sweden), and plutocratic republics (the United States), whether capitalist economies thrive best under conditions of freedom is perhaps more of an open question than we like to think." Tony Judt 'Ill fares the Land'

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." Abraham Lincoln

"Adam Smith's position on the role of the state in a capitalist society was close to that of a modern twentieth century US liberal democrat." Spence J. Pack

"...In his classic study of mid 19th century American labor, Norman Ware observes that the imposition of industrial capitalism and its values 'was repugnant to an astonishingly large section of the earlier American community'. The primary reason was 'the decline of the industrial worker as a person', the 'degradation' and 'psychological change' that followed from the 'loss of dignity and independence' and of democratic rights and freedoms. These reactions were vividly expressed in the working class literature, often by women, who played a prominent role despite their subordination in the general society." Introduction Alex Carey 'Taking The Risk Out Of Democracy'

"...The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evil." Albert Einstein

"Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone." John Maynard Keynes As quoted in Michael Albert, Moving Forward: Programme for a Parlicipatory Economy (Edinburgh: AK, 2000)

 

[SniperFire]

Does anyone think that there is no alternative to 'capitalism'?

Even the Chinese believe in 'capitalism.'

 

[8537]

Capitalism and the exploitation of the dense energy found in oil have revolutionized our world.

Time will tell which played a bigger role.

Does the word "exploitation" in the above sentence have a positive or negative connotation?

Well neither. It's just a descriptive.

 

[there4eyeM]

Does anyone think that there is no alternative to 'capitalism'?

Even the Chinese believe in 'capitalism.'

They certainly believe it is the best method for bringing it down!

This post does not, however, answer the question.

 

[SniperFire]

Does anyone think that there is no alternative to 'capitalism'?

Even the Chinese believe in 'capitalism.'

They certainly believe it is the best method for bringing it down!

This post does not, however, answer the question.

Well, it actually does. Name any nation which does not participate in small 'c' capitalism.

 

[8537]

Limited resource theories, or, classical economics, never takes in to account technology, innovation, or efficiency. One of the few things Adam Smith didn’t take in to account believe it or not.

I'm fairly certain classical economics takes technology into account. It's right their in the function!

Y = A(K^a,L^b)

And all economics treats technology, innovation and increased efficiencies as shorthand synonyms.

 

[miami_thomas]

Of course it is UNINTENTIONAL!!!
"Intentional" is where a handful of people thinking (central planning..) they know how many potatoes should be eaten in a year and therefore how many should be planted.
FAILS because there is ALWAYS something unexpected!

CENTRAL PLANNING for example ..
1986 Congress passed EMTALA good intentions being anyone going to hospital for emergency treatment but not able to pay is covered IF the hospital takes Medicare!
Sounds well intentioned.. right??

Well guess what .. hospitals with the BLESSING of Medicare "pad and pass" on to Medicare these "uncompensated" costs... as a result today some hospitals send Medicare claims marked up 6,000% and Medicare Pays!
Why because they know the hospital is "absorbing" uncompensated services!
Good intentions but nevertheless grossly INEFFICIENT!
As this practice snowballed, health care costs increased. Insurance companies pay the claims and to cover, increase premiums! Vicious cycle!
All because of "good intentions".. central planning!!!

I dont't think "occupied" understands capitalism.

What you are reading from "occupied" and others of that ilk are examples of the educators bias against capitalism! This bias was taught in their colleges. The colleges have done as the MSM has done taken the "exceptions" i.e. the Madorffs, the Hollywood narrative, "Greed is good" and made that the rule !
As a result educators/colleges and people like "occupied" see ALL business, all Capitalism, All bankers as the bad guys! They hate Walmart. They love unions and all because a handful of educators who NEVER ran a business teach students who become teachers!

The test for the "Occupieds" of the world is ask a simple question..
what is the net profit of the average health insurance company.
They will immediately launch diatribes against high salaried execs. People being canceled or turned down. NOT ONE of them will understand the question much less know the answer!

You can also ask them to tell you which country does not have the rich? Which government does not have greed? Where is this so called utopia?

 

[miami_thomas]

"Most interactions with people that you trust, people that you love, or people that just need to cooperate with on an immediate basis, take the form of “From each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs.” It doesn’t matter if you’re working for the government, working for a corporation, or working in your family; if you need to fix the toilet because it’s leaking and you say “Hand me the wrench,” the other guy doesn’t say “What do I get for that?” It’s not an exchange; people act according to their abilities to chip in. Ironically communism is applied because it’s the only thing that works; it’s the most efficient way to allocate resources. Thus I like to say that you could argue that capitalism is just a bad way of organizing communism." David Graeber


I am always fascinated by those who look to some ideology and grant it a power and accomplishment that cannot be found in it. It is people working together or fighting each other that forms the world we live in. Capitalism is just a word with many meanings. I started reviewing my quote database but stopped with the few noted, enjoy and think.


"Moreover, if we give the matter a moment's thought, we can see that the 20th century morality tale of 'socialism vs. freedom' or 'communism vs. capitalism' is misleading. Capitalism is not a political system; it is a form of economic life, compatible in practice with right wing dictatorships (Chile under Pinochet), left-wing dictatorships (contemporary China), social-democratic monarchies (Sweden), and plutocratic republics (the United States), whether capitalist economies thrive best under conditions of freedom is perhaps more of an open question than we like to think." Tony Judt 'Ill fares the Land'

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." Abraham Lincoln

"Adam Smith's position on the role of the state in a capitalist society was close to that of a modern twentieth century US liberal democrat." Spence J. Pack

"...In his classic study of mid 19th century American labor, Norman Ware observes that the imposition of industrial capitalism and its values 'was repugnant to an astonishingly large section of the earlier American community'. The primary reason was 'the decline of the industrial worker as a person', the 'degradation' and 'psychological change' that followed from the 'loss of dignity and independence' and of democratic rights and freedoms. These reactions were vividly expressed in the working class literature, often by women, who played a prominent role despite their subordination in the general society." Introduction Alex Carey 'Taking The Risk Out Of Democracy'

"...The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evil." Albert Einstein

"Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone." John Maynard Keynes As quoted in Michael Albert, Moving Forward: Programme for a Parlicipatory Economy (Edinburgh: AK, 2000)

Communism never works and will always fail. It is an attempt to create equality when there is none. Sure you can run around and quote a bunch of people about free market capitalism but the fact is that it works. The reason it works is because it does work off greed and humans by nature are greedy. It also promotes people to perform at their best and to reach their highest possible outcomes in order to better themselves in economic terms.

Communism fails because it tries to make humans something they are not. It tries to build equality. If this person is smarter then he should do work that requires more intelligence. If this person is stronger then he should do work that requires more strength. What if the person is both smart and strong? Then it is to provide all the same depending upon their needs. Well that means that no one can have good stuff because there is not enough of good stuff to go around. That is why it is more expensive because it is rare.

So there is no incentive to do better because no matter what you do your outcomes will be the same. In many cases it could be far worse because if one guy gets to just sit at home why in the world would you want to jump in a sewage tank risking your life for the same things. Communism is a wonderful idea but at the end it is just a fairy tale because you are trying to create equality in a world where nothing is equal.

As for freedom, sure there is bad that comes from freedom. There are always those that will abuse those freedoms and make the case for freedom being bad. But at the end, as bad as freedom can be it still beats the hell out of the alternative.

 

[miami_thomas]

Yup.


Capitalism can be a highly productive system that can benefit a society greatly, no doubt.

OTOH, it does have some problems.

Like for example the 46 recession/depressions our system has suffered in the last 236 years.

Perhaps these economic downturns are a perfectly nature part of the system.

Or perhaps they are contrived by the money masters to insure that they continue to gain control over greater and greater percentage of the overall wealth.

But either way, the fact is that capitalism does have a propensity for providing us with a UNSTABLE economy.

And which financial system does not have these problems?