Was the reason for independence really taxation without representation?

[Votto]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

 

[$ecular#eckler]

Because details are difficult.

"Taxation without representation," rhymes, therefore, it is easy to remember.

 

[$ecular#eckler]

There were legends and half-truths designed to help install trust in the founding.

What does "limited government" mean, and it is obvious to learned people, that the government has expanded considerably in the executive branch, but not proportionally in the legislative branch.

How do we know if the "checks and balances" work?

If the checks and balances work, then why do we need oaths for offices?

 

[Yarddog]

Because details are difficult.

"Taxation without representation," rhymes, therefore, it is easy to remember.

yeah that probably makes sense. History is often taught in simplistic terms to the masses for the sake of ease, and the fact that way back then people were more concerned about eeking out a living and creating a new history. Little did they know that they would be accused of a grand conspiracy to pull the wool over peoples eyes, and that they only wanted to form their own nation so they could own slaves.

 

[cnm]

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

Follow the money.

 

[Pellinore]

Yeah, "taxation without representation" was short, easily understood, and infuriating, so it was the best way for the Patriots to get people convinced and involved. Getting into trade inequities and political theory and a lot of terms ending in "-ism" isn't really relatable to the common man.

Ultimately, the biggest reason was because the Colonists started seeing themselves as Americans (or Virginians, or New Yorkers, or whatever) rather than the British. That led, quite predictably, to resentment over King George and the British treating the Colonists as second-class citizens, which they did, interfering with our God-given right to smuggle by giving breaks to the East India Company, which they also did, and by responding to our righteous tea protestin' with the super-restrictive and unfair Intolerable Acts. So a lot of it was that we didn't like being clamped down on but, yeah, taxing the hell out of us in several waves, ostensibly to make money to pay for the French and Indian War, didn't go over very well, either.

So the British closed the Port of Boston in 1774, all 13 Colonies got pissed on Massachusetts' behalf, we threw down in '75, adopted the DoI in '76, and here we are.

 

[cnm]

The colonists wanted to expand west and the treaties the British had joined with the Indian nations prevented that. Declaring independence voided those treaties to the founders' satisfaction.

 

[Votto]

Yeah, "taxation without representation" was short, easily understood, and infuriating, so it was the best way for the Patriots to get people convinced and involved. Getting into trade inequities and political theory and a lot of terms ending in "-ism" isn't really relatable to the common man.

Ultimately, the biggest reason was because the Colonists started seeing themselves as Americans (or Virginians, or New Yorkers, or whatever) rather than the British. That led, quite predictably, to resentment over King George and the British treating the Colonists as second-class citizens, which they did, interfering with our God-given right to smuggle by giving breaks to the East India Company, which they also did, and by responding to our righteous tea protestin' with the super-restrictive and unfair Intolerable Acts. So a lot of it was that we didn't like being clamped down on but, yeah, taxing the hell out of us in several waves, ostensibly to make money to pay for the French and Indian War, didn't go over very well, either.

So the British closed the Port of Boston in 1774, all 13 Colonies got pissed on Massachusetts' behalf, we threw down in '75, adopted the DoI in '76, and here we are.

Taxation without Representation jingle was started in the 20th century to explain what happened.

Before then, that was not the case.

Perhaps it is a watering down of intelligence from the American populace, but my guess is, since Progressives seem to be behind this there is another explanation. Perhaps they are trying to make us forget all the grievances towards a despotic government, in order to help us turn a blind eye as to how large and obtrusive their own government has become. After all, they all now have taxation with representation, so what grievances could we possibly have now?

In fact, one of my favorite quotes comes from Ben Franklin. It makes me laugh every time I read it.

It would be thought a hard government that should tax its people one tenth part.

 

[Crepitus]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

 

[Votto]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

 

[whitehall]

Why is it a lie? You could find the other grievances by reading the Declaration. Taxation without representation fit better with the Boston Tea Party for the 19th century (an on) pop culture so it was adapted as a symbol.

 

[Pellinore]

Yeah, "taxation without representation" was short, easily understood, and infuriating, so it was the best way for the Patriots to get people convinced and involved. Getting into trade inequities and political theory and a lot of terms ending in "-ism" isn't really relatable to the common man.

Ultimately, the biggest reason was because the Colonists started seeing themselves as Americans (or Virginians, or New Yorkers, or whatever) rather than the British. That led, quite predictably, to resentment over King George and the British treating the Colonists as second-class citizens, which they did, interfering with our God-given right to smuggle by giving breaks to the East India Company, which they also did, and by responding to our righteous tea protestin' with the super-restrictive and unfair Intolerable Acts. So a lot of it was that we didn't like being clamped down on but, yeah, taxing the hell out of us in several waves, ostensibly to make money to pay for the French and Indian War, didn't go over very well, either.

So the British closed the Port of Boston in 1774, all 13 Colonies got pissed on Massachusetts' behalf, we threw down in '75, adopted the DoI in '76, and here we are.

Taxation without Representation jingle was started in the 20th century to explain what happened.

Before then, that was not the case.

Perhaps it is a watering down of intelligence from the American populace, but my guess is, since Progressives seem to be behind this there is another explanation. Perhaps they are trying to make us forget all the grievances towards a despotic government, in order to help us turn a blind eye as to how large and obtrusive their own government has become. After all, they all now have taxation with representation, so what grievances could we possibly have now?

In fact, one of my favorite quotes comes from Ben Franklin. It makes me laugh every time I read it.

It would be thought a hard government that should tax its people one tenth part.

The phrase predates the Revolution, and was used widely in order to convince Colonists to support the cause.

And yeah, we do pay a ton more taxes now than they did in the 18th century, but we have a lot more services now. They didn't have schools, hospitals, cops, fire fighters, paramedics, libraries, museums, colleges, parks, park rangers, the mail, roads, trains, port authority, air traffic control, pollution control, care if you get sick, care when you get old, Social Security, Worker's Comp, NASA, OSHA, FEMA, the FED, the FTC, the FDA, the FAA, the FDIC, the EPA, the CDC, the BLM, the NWS, the NRC, the NLRB, the SEC, the VA, and a full-time, five-branch standing military, among others.

 

[LuckyDuck]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

What lie? In the interest of brevity, the taxation issue was one of the issues. Exclusion of the others isn't a lie. As to the others, they consist primarily of individual and group grievances on judicial matters regarding the tactics of a Monarchy, which doesn't generally allow for much in the individual rights and certainly not in far distant colonies. King George, just as Queen Elizabeth II have control of the military and the King let the military rule the colonies. With little exception, the colonists were right to complain to the king on being ruled from a distant land. One exception was that the British government had begun honoring the treaties with the native tribes, whereas the local colonists considered the native tribes to be savages, not worthy of having land. The colonists were wrong on this situation and rather than try to understand and work with the native tribes, kept taking land away from the areas they lived and hunted on.

 

[gipper]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

I’d take King George over any government we’ve had to endure over the past 50 years.

 

[Crepitus]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

I’d take King George over any government we’ve had to endure over the past 50 years.

Wow.

England is one flight away, you know.

 

[Pellinore]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

I’d take King George over any government we’ve had to endure over the past 50 years.

I can only hope that's hyperbole, because if it isn't, it's the most ignorant thing I've seen ever posted on this board.

 

[bodecea]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Have you read the Declaration of Independence? It tells you why.

 

[bodecea]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

Don't you have representation? Aren't you allowed to vote?

 

[gipper]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

I’d take King George over any government we’ve had to endure over the past 50 years.

I can only hope that's hyperbole, because if it isn't, it's the most ignorant thing I've seen ever posted on this board.

Not really. If you understood what’s really going on, you’d agree.

 

[Crepitus]

As with most things, I think we have all been lied to again regarding our history. Time and again I have been told that the reason the Founding Fathers formed their own nation was because of taxation without representation.

However, if so, what of the 26 other grevances listed in the Declaration of Independence?

Taxation without representation is #17, so what gives?

Why have we been lied to all these years and why did they do it?

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence

The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence The List of Grievances from the Declaration of Independence1. He has refused his Assent to Laws,

theridgewoodblog.net

Are you saying D.C. should declare it's independence?

What I'm saying is, the Federal government has become far larger and obtrusive than the British crown from which the Revolution sprung.

I’d take King George over any government we’ve had to endure over the past 50 years.

I can only hope that's hyperbole, because if it isn't, it's the most ignorant thing I've seen ever posted on this board.

Not really. If you understood what’s really going on, you’d agree.

What a buncha bullshitm