Was Jefferson or Lincoln first Republican??

[Divine Wind]

wrong of course. Plato and Aristotle framed the issue as freedom versus govt, and Republicans and Democrats still offer that exact choice. 1+1=2. the voters are free to purify that choice as much as their intellect will allow!. Do you understand?

Wrong for asking a question>? What would Plato and Aristotle say about that?

 

[IsaacNewton]

The never ending propensity of conservatives to try to couch their own beliefs in all the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers..

yes the nerve of them wanting to read the Constitution for the original meaning the founders gave it!!!

liberals are the real Americans since the Constitution means to them anything they want it to mean and that, oddly, always means [ regardless of what the founders wrote] always closer to liberal communism!! What a affirmation of the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers!!! This smug Newton has the brains of a retard!!!

The Republican party in the Senate decided THEY will decide how many years a president's term is, not the Constitution. So they decided it is 3 years for any president they don't like and denied the last president the Constitutional right to pick a Supreme Court judge and have him confirmed. Republicans have given up on the Constitution, to which I say ok you've made the choice and the rest of us don't have to live by it if you aren't going to.

Conservatives waving dead founders around is like they wave dead criminal Reagan around. You have nothing of value to offer today, so you try to wave a carcass in people's faces so they forget how bad your ideas smell.

 

[IsaacNewton]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

 

[Pogo]

"The Citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for having given to mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy: a policy worthy of imitation. All possess alike liberty of conscience and immunities of citizenship. It is now no more that toleration is spoken of, as if it was by the indulgence of one class of people, that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights." ---- George Washington, 1790​

Again, context helps. The didn't call themselves liberals or conservatives or use the words the way libs think. That was a letter to a Hebrew congregation and was trying to put their religious fears to rest.

"...May the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in this land continue to merit and enjoy the good will of the other inhabitants — while every one shall sit in safety under his own vine and fig tree and there shall be none to make him afraid.

May the father of all mercies scatter light, and not darkness, upon our paths, and make us all in our several vocations useful here, and in His own due time and way everlastingly happy."

Not liberal policies, as in socialism and gay marriage.

You're actually trying to out-doofus Special Ed?

"Socialism and gay marriage" are not Liberal policies. Actually the link I just gave you explains in copious detail what Liberalism is, and you completely whiffed on it. Not that we didn't already know you were clueless about it but then that's why I gave you a link --- which sailed right over your hood.

Narrated Wiki:

>> Liberalism is a political philosophy or worldview founded on ideas of liberty and equality.[1][2][3] Liberals espouse a wide array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but generally they support ideas and programmes such as freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion, free markets, civil rights, democratic societies, secular governments, gender equality, and international cooperation.[4][5][6][7][8][9][10]

Liberalism first became a distinct political movement during the Age of Enlightenment, when it became popular among philosophers and economists in the Western world. Liberalism rejected the prevailing social and political norms of hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The 17th-century philosopher John Locke is often credited with founding liberalism as a distinct philosophical tradition. Locke argued that each man has a natural right to life, liberty and property,[11] while adding that governments must not violate these rights based on the social contract. Liberals opposed traditional conservatism and sought to replace absolutism in government with representative democracy and the rule of law.

Prominent revolutionaries in the Glorious Revolution, the American Revolution, and the French Revolution used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of what they saw as tyrannical rule. <<​

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

"Socialism and gay marriage" are not Liberal policies.

exactly anyone knows these are things conservatives support!! See why we have to be positive that liberalism is based in pure ignorance??

 

[Divine Wind]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

For what purpose?....other than to destroy the US and let China and/or Russia become the world's leading powers?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of what they saw as tyrannical rule. <<

exactly and modern liberals spied for Stalin and gave him the bomb in the belief that he was not tyrannical. Modern liberals think Hitler Stalin and Mao Obama Pol Pot Castro etc are not tyrannical since they use the power of the state to do good, as if thats possible!! Our founders knew it wasn't!!! Does that help ease your confusion??

Welcome to your first lesson in American History:
Jefferson:
"Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny."

 

[IsaacNewton]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

For what purpose?....other than to destroy the US and let China and/or Russia become the world's leading powers?

No to avoid a civil war.It is on the horizon, the Republicans do not follow the Constitution any more. It's over. Just a matter of how it's going to end.

 

[Divine Wind]

You're actually trying to out-doofus Special Ed? ...

ROFL. Pretty clear who the doofus is.

Look, Iceweasel and I don't agree very much, but his post to you was logical and civil. It's okay to disagree, as I do, but your reply was immature. This is a trend for you, not a one time thing either.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

For what purpose?....other than to destroy the US and let China and/or Russia become the world's leading powers?

This newton does not think ahead that far and is easily confused if he tries!!!

 

[Divine Wind]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

For what purpose?....other than to destroy the US and let China and/or Russia become the world's leading powers?

No to avoid a civil war.It is on the horizon, the Republicans do not follow the Constitution any more. It's over. Just a matter of how it's going to end.

Neither do the Democrats. Why are you so biased?

Fine, let's have another Civil War. You are free to start shooting first. How good are you with a weapon? Are you prepared to fight?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

the Republicans do not follow the Constitution any more.

OMG!!! which is why they appoint justices who are originalists while Democrats are not !!!

 

[IsaacNewton]

.... The Republican party died long ago....

True, and sad. Also sad is the same applies to the Democratic party.

What do you think we should do now/

I've stated it numerous times here, it's time to break up the country.

For what purpose?....other than to destroy the US and let China and/or Russia become the world's leading powers?

No to avoid a civil war.It is on the horizon, the Republicans do not follow the Constitution any more. It's over. Just a matter of how it's going to end.

Neither do the Democrats. Why are you so biased?

Fine, let's have another Civil War. You are free to start shooting first. How good are you with a weapon? Are you prepared to fight?

False equivalency. The two political parties do not do everything equally. This is a false construction of conservative media. The rely on the False Equivalency as someone lost in the desert dives into the first pool of water they see.

 

[Pogo]

You're actually trying to out-doofus Special Ed? ...

ROFL. Pretty clear who the doofus is.

Look, Iceweasel and I don't agree very much, but his post to you was logical and civil. It's okay to disagree, as I do, but your reply was immature. This is a trend for you, not a one time thing either.

Would have made a lot more sense if you hadn't excised out the entire content of the post, wimp.

Must have been inconvenient. And you wanna talk "immature". Poster, please.

 

[regent]

"The Citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for having given to mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy: a policy worthy of imitation. All possess alike liberty of conscience and immunities of citizenship. It is now no more that toleration is spoken of, as if it was by the indulgence of one class of people, that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights." ---- George Washington, 1790​

Again, context helps. The didn't call themselves liberals or conservatives or use the words the way libs think. That was a letter to a Hebrew congregation and was trying to put their religious fears to rest.

"...May the children of the stock of Abraham who dwell in this land continue to merit and enjoy the good will of the other inhabitants — while every one shall sit in safety under his own vine and fig tree and there shall be none to make him afraid.

May the father of all mercies scatter light, and not darkness, upon our paths, and make us all in our several vocations useful here, and in His own due time and way everlastingly happy."

Not liberal policies, as in socialism and gay marriage.

You're actually trying to out-doofus Special Ed?

"Socialism and gay marriage" are not Liberal policies. Actually the link I just gave you explains in copious detail what Liberalism is, and you completely whiffed on it. Not that we didn't already know you were clueless about it but then that's why I gave you a link --- which sailed right over your hood.

Narrated Wiki:

>> Liberalism is a political philosophy or worldview founded on ideas of liberty and equality.[1][2][3] Liberals espouse a wide array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but generally they support ideas and programmes such as freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion, free markets, civil rights, democratic societies, secular governments, gender equality, and international cooperation.[4][5][6][7][8][9][10]

Liberalism first became a distinct political movement during the Age of Enlightenment, when it became popular among philosophers and economists in the Western world. Liberalism rejected the prevailing social and political norms of hereditary privilege, state religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The 17th-century philosopher John Locke is often credited with founding liberalism as a distinct philosophical tradition. Locke argued that each man has a natural right to life, liberty and property,[11] while adding that governments must not violate these rights based on the social contract. Liberals opposed traditional conservatism and sought to replace absolutism in government with representative democracy and the rule of law.

Prominent revolutionaries in the Glorious Revolution, the American Revolution, and the French Revolution used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of what they saw as tyrannical rule. <<​

I would think that any course in American history would begin with the Age of Enlightenment or Age of Reason. Even the terms liberalism and conservatism starts to make sense. There are still Americans that believe that "small government and large government" create an ideology.

 

[Picaro]

The never ending propensity of conservatives to try to couch their own beliefs in all the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers. They were radical liberals of their day, many of the Deists who thought Christianity an enslavement to human beings. Lincoln was the first elected president of the Republican party, and after Eisenhower there haven't been any Republicans, only demagogues that view being president as tantamount to becoming king with unquestionable power. The Republican party died long ago, now it's just a mishmash of neocons, end-of-the-worlders, corporatists that think the middle class and poor can never be stepped on hard enough, and fake kristians who are pro-birth but once you are out of the whom they couldn't careless if you died in the street the next day because of hunger or you couldn't afford healthcare.

lol there were very few 'Deists' around. 'Deism' was just another pseudo-intellectual fashion, among a very tiny set of aristocrats and their sycophants and had zero influence on anything. The vast majority of founders were Christians, period. Get over it; it's still going to be a long time before you can marry your favorite puppy or whatever other animal you're in love with at the moment.

 

[Iceweasel]

Liberals simply do not know history. Everything is seen through political filters. Some founders were deists but it's not debatable that most were Christian. Prayers were part of opening sessions, bibles were issued to the troops, there are many quotes of faith in their writings, even Jefferson who even called himself a Christian, although quite unorthodox. Liberals know so much that isn't true.

 

[Iceweasel]

The never ending propensity of conservatives to try to couch their own beliefs in all the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers. They were radical liberals of their day, many of the Deists who thought Christianity an enslavement to human beings. Lincoln was the first elected president of the Republican party, and after Eisenhower there haven't been any Republicans, only demagogues that view being president as tantamount to becoming king with unquestionable power. The Republican party died long ago, now it's just a mishmash of neocons, end-of-the-worlders, corporatists that think the middle class and poor can never be stepped on hard enough, and fake kristians who are pro-birth but once you are out of the whom they couldn't careless if you died in the street the next day because of hunger or you couldn't afford healthcare.

You are 180 degrees off. Both parties have shifted left but Democrats rule like dictators, we just got rid of one. Your memory is that flawed?

 

[Iceweasel]

Thanks for the condescension. No, Republicans today claim they want smaller government, but they also want FEDERAL LAW to ban abortion, gay marriage and other bullshit.

Some may but it's bullshit to make that claim. Most want those issues to go back to the states where they belong. How would that make the federal government bigger?

When they seek to use Federal law to ban abortion and gay marriage.

When did that become the Republican party platform?

 

[Iceweasel]

The never ending propensity of conservatives to try to couch their own beliefs in all the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers..

yes the nerve of them wanting to read the Constitution for the original meaning the founders gave it!!!

liberals are the real Americans since the Constitution means to them anything they want it to mean and that, oddly, always means [ regardless of what the founders wrote] always closer to liberal communism!! What a affirmation of the saccharine goodness of the founding fathers!!! This smug Newton has the brains of a retard!!!

The Republican party in the Senate decided THEY will decide how many years a president's term is, not the Constitution. So they decided it is 3 years for any president they don't like and denied the last president the Constitutional right to pick a Supreme Court judge and have him confirmed. Republicans have given up on the Constitution, to which I say ok you've made the choice and the rest of us don't have to live by it if you aren't going to.

Conservatives waving dead founders around is like they wave dead criminal Reagan around. You have nothing of value to offer today, so you try to wave a carcass in people's faces so they forget how bad your ideas smell.

The dems have had total control from time to time, why haven't they changed the term limits? How is it the Republican's fault?

Of course the details of government management is up to congress, you don't even know what the Constitution is. Obama had the right to appoint another activist on the bench and the senate had the right to say no. Democrats matter, Republicans don't. We get it. Criminal Reagan? You're on dope.