Want universal background checks? A question....

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

 

[LoneLaugher]

If I wanted a few Percocet and my buddy Jimbo had some that sold to me...how does the government even know that we broke the law?

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

The answer is stunningly simple.

The new state IDs can be tied to very federal database we have. How hard would it be to design an app for your Droid? Slide the ID like a credit card, bam you've ran an NCIC check on that person...

I bet Google could design that app in a week for less than $1K

Or we could let the government contract it out and it would end up costing a trillion bucks and not work worth a fuck.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

The answer is stunningly simple.

The new state IDs can be tied to very federal database we have. How hard would it be to design an app for your Droid? Slide the ID like a credit card, bam you've ran an NCIC check on that person...

You don't understand the premise here.

We -didn't- run a background chreck on each other, which violates the supposed law.
How does the state prove this?

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

The answer is stunningly simple.

The new state IDs can be tied to very federal database we have. How hard would it be to design an app for your Droid? Slide the ID like a credit card, bam you've ran an NCIC check on that person...

You don't understand the premise here.

We -didn't- run a background chreck on each other, which violates the supposed law.
How does the state prove this?

Well, if they can prove a gun was sold, it is of course easy, but good luck proving a gun is sold.

However, suppose there was a law that said if you sell someone a gun and they commit a crime with that gun and it can be proven that you sold them that gun without a background check that you have committed a crime, most people are going to err on the side of caution and perform the background check.

 

[turtledude]

the problem is I have owned some guns for over 30 years (bought my first pistol in 1980) and I inherited a couple dozen from my father-guns he bought between 1946 and 2006. so I sell one to my good shooting buddy M14 Shooter. Oh sorry officer I sold it to him TWO YEARS before that stupid law was passed.

prove otherwise

 

[NYcarbineer]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

The answer is stunningly simple.

The new state IDs can be tied to very federal database we have. How hard would it be to design an app for your Droid? Slide the ID like a credit card, bam you've ran an NCIC check on that person...

You don't understand the premise here.

We -didn't- run a background chreck on each other, which violates the supposed law.
How does the state prove this?

Well, if they can prove a gun was sold, it is of course easy, but good luck proving a gun is sold.

Indeed - and that is only the beginning.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

The seller does not have to pass a background check

 

[M14 Shooter]

the problem is I have owned some guns for over 30 years (bought my first pistol in 1980) and I inherited a couple dozen from my father-guns he bought between 1946 and 2006. so I sell one to my good shooting buddy M14 Shooter. Oh sorry officer I sold it to him TWO YEARS before that stupid law was passed.
prove otherwise

The very best thing to do here? Say nothing.
If you say nothing, they cannot prove anyting.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.
Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.
How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

The seller does not have to pass a background check

So...?
We both -bought- a gun.

 

[turtledude]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

uh that means that someone is going to be charged as a felon in possession etc.

If I know I cannot pass a background check and I try to sell a gun, the fifth amendment shields me from being prosecuted for failing to incriminate myself

 

[NYcarbineer]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

The seller does not have to pass a background check

The scenario was they bought guns off each other. Which means they were both buyers.

 

[turtledude]

the problem is I have owned some guns for over 30 years (bought my first pistol in 1980) and I inherited a couple dozen from my father-guns he bought between 1946 and 2006. so I sell one to my good shooting buddy M14 Shooter. Oh sorry officer I sold it to him TWO YEARS before that stupid law was passed.
prove otherwise

The very best thing to do here? Say nothing.
If you say nothing, they cannot prove anyting.

I know, I did this stuff professionally for 30 years. and I won a lot of cases because people did say stuff that we used against them in a court of law.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.
Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.
How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

How does that prove anything?

 

[M14 Shooter]

the problem is I have owned some guns for over 30 years (bought my first pistol in 1980) and I inherited a couple dozen from my father-guns he bought between 1946 and 2006. so I sell one to my good shooting buddy M14 Shooter. Oh sorry officer I sold it to him TWO YEARS before that stupid law was passed.
prove otherwise

The very best thing to do here? Say nothing.
If you say nothing, they cannot prove anyting.

I know, I did this stuff professionally for 30 years. and I won a lot of cases because people did say stuff that we used against them in a court of law.

I know you know.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.

Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.

How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

The seller does not have to pass a background check

The scenario was they bought guns off each other. Which means they were both buyers.

I didn't see that part, my bad.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.
Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.
How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

How does that prove anything?

He's assuming it can be proven that guns changed hands.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.
Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.
How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

How does that prove anything?

He's assuming it can be proven that guns changed hands.

And, apparently, at a time where such a check was necessary.
And so, he assumes facts not in evidence -- and so his "proof" is left, well, wanting.

 

[turtledude]

If you support imposing universal background checks on all gun sales, whether through a dealer or not, I have a question for you.
Say I meet up with Turtledude; he and I buy a gun off each other, get a beer, and go home.
How does the government prove that background checks were not run before we sold the guns?

By showing that one or both of you could not have passed a properly run background check.

How does that prove anything?

He's assuming it can be proven that guns changed hands.

to convict you'd have to prove it happened after the silly law had been passed.

that's gonna be really hard to do unless the gun is documented (on a 4473) as being PURCHASED by the PRIVATE SELLER after the law went into effect. I guess some are that stupid.