Walker: I'd 'absolutely' nuke the filibuster to repeal Obamacare

[Bfgrn]

Galt and Sassy spoke on THIS thread. I never hear any of you 'conservatives' take people who speak that way to task.

I didn't just fall off the back of a turnip truck. I have heard 'conservatives' compare the death of people like Freddie Gray as 'taking out the garbage'


"Conservatism, though a necessary element in any stable society, is not a social program; in its paternalistic, nationalistic and power adoring tendencies it is often closer to socialism than true liberalism; and with its traditionalistic, anti-intellectual, and often mystical propensities it will never, except in short periods of disillusionment, appeal to the young and all those others who believe that some changes are desirable if this world is to become a better place."
Friedrich August von Hayek-The Road to Serfdom

I disagree with you completely. You can only provide limited and anecdotal evidence of a few individuals that cannot, to any thinking person, provide a reality that everyone acts and believes in the manner you describe.

Given the truth of the majority of the American conservative, the belief is that people should be held responsible for their own actions, and that to act in a manner contrary to common sense (fighting a cop just after you have robbed a store, or resisting arrest when you have a rap sheet longer than you are tall (Freddy Gray)) is not cause for concern with regard to changing our system.

I find it funny that such individuals as yourself speak against traditionalistic propensities of conservatives, yet fight tooth and nail to protect such programs as Social Security, Abortion on demand, and entitlement payments to the poor.

You do realize that all of these things are 30 and 40 years old, and can be considered traditions of the American culture. One might even say, they are old traditions that should make way for the new way of thinking.....

Either way, your belief that all conservatives believe this way is demonstrably wrong, and as such, easy to ignore. Which means your opinion isn't valid with Me.

I am waiting for one of you to prove me wrong...it has been YEARS...still crickets.

Let's talk about Freddie Gray. His 'rap sheet' is irrelevant. Gray was walking, and had committed no crime when officers on bicycles claim he ran. He was apprehended, with one officer bending Gray's legs backwards, and another holding Gray down by pressing a knee into Gray's neck, subsequent to which most witnesses contemporaneously commented that he "couldn't walk. Two bystanders captured Gray's arrest with video recordings, showing Gray, screaming in pain, being dragged to a police van by officers. The Baltimore Sun reported that another witness saw Gray being beaten with police batons. He was handcuffed and placed in a police van without a seatbelt and given a 'rough ride'...an unsanctioned practice where a handcuffed prisoner is placed without a seatbelt in an erratically driven vehicle. The medical investigation found that Gray had sustained the injuries while in transport. Gray died of injuries to his spinal cord.

There is overwhelming evidence of police brutality. Yet NONE of you conservatives who wail all the time about overreaching government and government invasion of our privacy has ONE word to say when it actually happens.


"In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. He believes that if government is in the hands of decent men, it ought not to be too much restricted by rigid rules. Since he is essentially opportunist and lacks principles..."
Friedrich August von Hayek-Why I am Not a Conservative

Why would I jump to do your bidding? I have knowledge that I think is correct, which proves you wrong. Given your replies in this thread, it is a certainty that you won't acknowledge or even give such knowledge a passing glance.

I am not in the habit of wasting time on trying to change a closed mind.

I'll simply state My opinion, based upon the information I believe to be correct, and will carry on with My life. The fact that you disagree or have a low opinion of those who have the willingness disagree with you doesn't really matter much to anyone but yourself.

Don't want to defend your false charge against Freddie Gray?

Not a big deal...it's not like the poor kid died or something...oh WAIT...

I made no false charges. Are you seriously going to say he did not have a rap sheet?

No, you said he resisted arrest. Even the arresting officers never made that claim. They said Gray was taken into custody "without the use of force or incident," according to Officer Garret Miller.

 

[Darkwind]

I disagree with you completely. You can only provide limited and anecdotal evidence of a few individuals that cannot, to any thinking person, provide a reality that everyone acts and believes in the manner you describe.

Given the truth of the majority of the American conservative, the belief is that people should be held responsible for their own actions, and that to act in a manner contrary to common sense (fighting a cop just after you have robbed a store, or resisting arrest when you have a rap sheet longer than you are tall (Freddy Gray)) is not cause for concern with regard to changing our system.

I find it funny that such individuals as yourself speak against traditionalistic propensities of conservatives, yet fight tooth and nail to protect such programs as Social Security, Abortion on demand, and entitlement payments to the poor.

You do realize that all of these things are 30 and 40 years old, and can be considered traditions of the American culture. One might even say, they are old traditions that should make way for the new way of thinking.....

Either way, your belief that all conservatives believe this way is demonstrably wrong, and as such, easy to ignore. Which means your opinion isn't valid with Me.

I am waiting for one of you to prove me wrong...it has been YEARS...still crickets.

Let's talk about Freddie Gray. His 'rap sheet' is irrelevant. Gray was walking, and had committed no crime when officers on bicycles claim he ran. He was apprehended, with one officer bending Gray's legs backwards, and another holding Gray down by pressing a knee into Gray's neck, subsequent to which most witnesses contemporaneously commented that he "couldn't walk. Two bystanders captured Gray's arrest with video recordings, showing Gray, screaming in pain, being dragged to a police van by officers. The Baltimore Sun reported that another witness saw Gray being beaten with police batons. He was handcuffed and placed in a police van without a seatbelt and given a 'rough ride'...an unsanctioned practice where a handcuffed prisoner is placed without a seatbelt in an erratically driven vehicle. The medical investigation found that Gray had sustained the injuries while in transport. Gray died of injuries to his spinal cord.

There is overwhelming evidence of police brutality. Yet NONE of you conservatives who wail all the time about overreaching government and government invasion of our privacy has ONE word to say when it actually happens.


"In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. He believes that if government is in the hands of decent men, it ought not to be too much restricted by rigid rules. Since he is essentially opportunist and lacks principles..."
Friedrich August von Hayek-Why I am Not a Conservative

Why would I jump to do your bidding? I have knowledge that I think is correct, which proves you wrong. Given your replies in this thread, it is a certainty that you won't acknowledge or even give such knowledge a passing glance.

I am not in the habit of wasting time on trying to change a closed mind.

I'll simply state My opinion, based upon the information I believe to be correct, and will carry on with My life. The fact that you disagree or have a low opinion of those who have the willingness disagree with you doesn't really matter much to anyone but yourself.

Don't want to defend your false charge against Freddie Gray?

Not a big deal...it's not like the poor kid died or something...oh WAIT...

I made no false charges. Are you seriously going to say he did not have a rap sheet?

No, you said he resisted arrest. Even the arresting officers never made that claim. They said Gray was taken into custody "without the use of force or incident," according to Officer Garret Miller.

He was dragged to the van and lifted bodily into it. Maybe he was drugged out (though there is no report that he was)...

You do realize that refusing to cooperate (laying down in the street, sitting in the street, forcing cops to drag you) is resisting arrest?

But I'll let that point go...

Do you deny he had a rap sheet? If not...

Then what makes you think the cops just decided to arrest him without cause? Was that also in the report?

 

[Bfgrn]

I am waiting for one of you to prove me wrong...it has been YEARS...still crickets.

Let's talk about Freddie Gray. His 'rap sheet' is irrelevant. Gray was walking, and had committed no crime when officers on bicycles claim he ran. He was apprehended, with one officer bending Gray's legs backwards, and another holding Gray down by pressing a knee into Gray's neck, subsequent to which most witnesses contemporaneously commented that he "couldn't walk. Two bystanders captured Gray's arrest with video recordings, showing Gray, screaming in pain, being dragged to a police van by officers. The Baltimore Sun reported that another witness saw Gray being beaten with police batons. He was handcuffed and placed in a police van without a seatbelt and given a 'rough ride'...an unsanctioned practice where a handcuffed prisoner is placed without a seatbelt in an erratically driven vehicle. The medical investigation found that Gray had sustained the injuries while in transport. Gray died of injuries to his spinal cord.

There is overwhelming evidence of police brutality. Yet NONE of you conservatives who wail all the time about overreaching government and government invasion of our privacy has ONE word to say when it actually happens.


"In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. He believes that if government is in the hands of decent men, it ought not to be too much restricted by rigid rules. Since he is essentially opportunist and lacks principles..."
Friedrich August von Hayek-Why I am Not a Conservative

Why would I jump to do your bidding? I have knowledge that I think is correct, which proves you wrong. Given your replies in this thread, it is a certainty that you won't acknowledge or even give such knowledge a passing glance.

I am not in the habit of wasting time on trying to change a closed mind.

I'll simply state My opinion, based upon the information I believe to be correct, and will carry on with My life. The fact that you disagree or have a low opinion of those who have the willingness disagree with you doesn't really matter much to anyone but yourself.

Don't want to defend your false charge against Freddie Gray?

Not a big deal...it's not like the poor kid died or something...oh WAIT...

I made no false charges. Are you seriously going to say he did not have a rap sheet?

No, you said he resisted arrest. Even the arresting officers never made that claim. They said Gray was taken into custody "without the use of force or incident," according to Officer Garret Miller.

He was dragged to the van and lifted bodily into it. Maybe he was drugged out (though there is no report that he was)...

You do realize that refusing to cooperate (laying down in the street, sitting in the street, forcing cops to drag you) is resisting arrest?

But I'll let that point go...

Do you deny he had a rap sheet? If not...

Then what makes you think the cops just decided to arrest him without cause? Was that also in the report?

I don't deny he had a rap sheet, I said it is IRRELEVANT, and police officers had no way of knowing his record when they arrested him.

OH, I see how it works, police brutality injures you so you can't walk. THEN they can charge you with resisting arrest.

Thank you for defending government brutality...

 

[Darkwind]

Why would I jump to do your bidding? I have knowledge that I think is correct, which proves you wrong. Given your replies in this thread, it is a certainty that you won't acknowledge or even give such knowledge a passing glance.

I am not in the habit of wasting time on trying to change a closed mind.

I'll simply state My opinion, based upon the information I believe to be correct, and will carry on with My life. The fact that you disagree or have a low opinion of those who have the willingness disagree with you doesn't really matter much to anyone but yourself.

Don't want to defend your false charge against Freddie Gray?

Not a big deal...it's not like the poor kid died or something...oh WAIT...

I made no false charges. Are you seriously going to say he did not have a rap sheet?

No, you said he resisted arrest. Even the arresting officers never made that claim. They said Gray was taken into custody "without the use of force or incident," according to Officer Garret Miller.

He was dragged to the van and lifted bodily into it. Maybe he was drugged out (though there is no report that he was)...

You do realize that refusing to cooperate (laying down in the street, sitting in the street, forcing cops to drag you) is resisting arrest?

But I'll let that point go...

Do you deny he had a rap sheet? If not...

Then what makes you think the cops just decided to arrest him without cause? Was that also in the report?

I don't deny he had a rap sheet, I said it is IRRELEVANT, and police officers had no way of knowing his record when they arrested him.

OH, I see how it works, police brutality injures you so you can't walk. THEN they can charge you with resisting arrest.

Thank you for defending government brutality...

You don't see how it works. There is no proof that the cops harmed him at all prior to putting him in the van. There is no proof that they deliberately harmed him while he was in the van. There is a strong suspicion that they were negligent when they failed to strap him into a seat with a seat belt and for that, they should be held responsible.

BTW...these are local cops who are very familiar with the criminal element of their beats. To say they were unaware of his rap sheet is stretching credibility just a bit too far.

It doesn't matter if you think it is irrelevant or not. What matters is what the evidence proves, and what comes out in the trial.

If a trial even happens, since it appears that the Baltimore DA was a bit premature in charges. In either case, the courts will decide this. Not you or I.

 

[The Rabbi]

Galt speaks for every conservative?

Do you honestly believe that? If so, I'll pretty much stop interacting with you now as you don't wish to apply critical thought to the hear and now, let alone to issues.

Galt and Sassy spoke on THIS thread. I never hear any of you 'conservatives' take people who speak that way to task.

I didn't just fall off the back of a turnip truck. I have heard 'conservatives' compare the death of people like Freddie Gray as 'taking out the garbage'


"Conservatism, though a necessary element in any stable society, is not a social program; in its paternalistic, nationalistic and power adoring tendencies it is often closer to socialism than true liberalism; and with its traditionalistic, anti-intellectual, and often mystical propensities it will never, except in short periods of disillusionment, appeal to the young and all those others who believe that some changes are desirable if this world is to become a better place."
Friedrich August von Hayek-The Road to Serfdom

I disagree with you completely. You can only provide limited and anecdotal evidence of a few individuals that cannot, to any thinking person, provide a reality that everyone acts and believes in the manner you describe.

Given the truth of the majority of the American conservative, the belief is that people should be held responsible for their own actions, and that to act in a manner contrary to common sense (fighting a cop just after you have robbed a store, or resisting arrest when you have a rap sheet longer than you are tall (Freddy Gray)) is not cause for concern with regard to changing our system.

I find it funny that such individuals as yourself speak against traditionalistic propensities of conservatives, yet fight tooth and nail to protect such programs as Social Security, Abortion on demand, and entitlement payments to the poor.

You do realize that all of these things are 30 and 40 years old, and can be considered traditions of the American culture. One might even say, they are old traditions that should make way for the new way of thinking.....

Either way, your belief that all conservatives believe this way is demonstrably wrong, and as such, easy to ignore. Which means your opinion isn't valid with Me.

I am waiting for one of you to prove me wrong...it has been YEARS...still crickets.

Let's talk about Freddie Gray. His 'rap sheet' is irrelevant. Gray was walking, and had committed no crime when officers on bicycles claim he ran. He was apprehended, with one officer bending Gray's legs backwards, and another holding Gray down by pressing a knee into Gray's neck, subsequent to which most witnesses contemporaneously commented that he "couldn't walk. Two bystanders captured Gray's arrest with video recordings, showing Gray, screaming in pain, being dragged to a police van by officers. The Baltimore Sun reported that another witness saw Gray being beaten with police batons. He was handcuffed and placed in a police van without a seatbelt and given a 'rough ride'...an unsanctioned practice where a handcuffed prisoner is placed without a seatbelt in an erratically driven vehicle. The medical investigation found that Gray had sustained the injuries while in transport. Gray died of injuries to his spinal cord.

There is overwhelming evidence of police brutality. Yet NONE of you conservatives who wail all the time about overreaching government and government invasion of our privacy has ONE word to say when it actually happens.

It turns out

This is the issue. Freddie Gray was one isolated incident. But libs want to see vast trends behind one isolated incident. Never let a crisis go to waste etc etc.
Do bad incidents caused by police happen? Yes, of course
Is it indicative of widespread racism and police brutality? No, of course not.

Michael Brown
Eric Garner
Walter Scott

Michael Brown was an out of control thug.
You've got nothing. Absolutely nothing. There are millions of police-citizen contacts every single day in this country. You cherry pick one or two and try to create some vast societal problem. It doesnt work.