US Might free Jonathan Pollard

[pbel]

Russia gave Egypt top of the line brand new weapons, not second hand. If Egypt went to war with soldiers less than ready, that in nothing to do with Israel. Jordan and Syria I know had the best of training.
If they were not ready, they should not have begun a war with Israel. Arabs thought they could trample Israel in the dust, oops, they were wrong.

A steady mouthpiece of Israeli propaganda, Israel bombs the Egyptian Air force before declaring a war, had less troops than Israel on the border which any General will tell you its suicide without a great numerical advantage...

Fascism will never work because Karma is stronger...

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Another lie or link this, 5/1 crapola,

 

[aris2chat]

I might add Toast that this process is quite evident today as more and more American Jews marry non-Jews.

Well that should finally make you understand why Israel has those marriage laws.
It has NOTHING to do with Apartheid or the hatred of Arabs.
It has to do with preserving Israel as a Jewish state. Israel is tiny and the only Jewish country , you need to remember that.
So its government will do what it can to preserve it that way.

Why is it so important to have a "Jewish" country? Frankly, most of the world's religions don't have their own countries, they have to share their countries with people of other faiths.

To protect the jews from the kind of persecution and genocide they have suffered for millennia. Their religion and history is the foundation of both christianity and islam. Their past and present is important to the world, to archeology, literature, and to science. They have always been apart of the land and Jerusalem is the center of their faith, where Jesus had is last supper and where Christianity began. Even the quran says it was the land given by the children of Israel. The temple of Solomon has a whole chapter in the quran, the jewish temple built to hold the arc of moses.

Muslims have arabia. Christians have italy, along with a third of the world. Hindus have India. Jews have Israel.

 

[toastman]

A steady mouthpiece of Israeli propaganda, Israel bombs the Egyptian Air force before declaring a war, had less troops than Israel on the border which any General will tell you its suicide without a great numerical advantage...

Fascism will never work because Karma is stronger...

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Another lie or link this, 5/1 crapola,

Six-Day War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It was 4/1 plus look at all those countries that supported those 4 as well.

 

[Hossfly]

A steady mouthpiece of Israeli propaganda, Israel bombs the Egyptian Air force before declaring a war, had less troops than Israel on the border which any General will tell you its suicide without a great numerical advantage...

Fascism will never work because Karma is stronger...

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Another lie or link this, 5/1 crapola,

Actually it was more than 5/1. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq,Algeria,Libya,Morocco,Palestine,Saudia Arabia, Kuwait,Tunisia, Lebanon, Sudan,Cuba, North Korea,Pakistan. That's 17/1. And to think that one little country a little bigger than Central Park kicked the living shit out of those critters.

 

[aris2chat]

A steady mouthpiece of Israeli propaganda, Israel bombs the Egyptian Air force before declaring a war, had less troops than Israel on the border which any General will tell you its suicide without a great numerical advantage...

Fascism will never work because Karma is stronger...

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Show us a link to that declaration of war, or is that a Phalange concoction?

Article 14 of the Concession of 1856 reads:
We solemnly declare, for ourselves and our successors, subject to ratification by His
Imperial Majesty the Sultan, that the great maritime canal from Suez to Pelusium and the ports belonging to it shall be open forever, as neutral passages, to every merchant vessel crossing from one sea to the other, without any distinction, exclusion, or preference with respect to persons or nationalities, in consideration of the payment of the fees, and compliance with the regulations established by the universal company, the concession-holder, for the use of the said canal and its appurtenances.

Constantinople, 1873
It is understood that no modification, for the future, of the conditions for the passage through the Canal shall be permitted, whether in regard to the navigation toll or the dues for towage, anchorage, pilotage, etc., except with the consent of the Sublime Porte, which will not take any decision on the subject without previously coming to an understanding with the principal Powers interested therein.


The canal was international water and illegal to close to Israel. That was an act of war. Parking more of the arm of Egypt, Jordan and Syria on Israel's borders was as well. Kicking the UN troops out of the Sinai was also.

March 8th 1965
"We shall not enter Palestine with its soil covered in sand, we shall enter it with its soil saturated in blood" - President of Egypt, Gamal Abdel Nasser

Feb 22nd 1967
“it is the duty of all of us now to move from defensive positions to offensive positions and enter the battle to liberate the usurped land…Everyone must face the test and enter the battle to the end.” - President Attassi of Syria

April 8th 1967
“(this battle will be)…followed by more severe battles until Palestine is liberated and the Zionist presence ended.” - Syria’s information minister Mahmoud Zubi

May 16th 1967
"The existence of Israel has continued too long. We welcome the Israeli aggression. We welcome the battle we have long awaited. The peak hour has come. The battle has come in which we shall destroy Israel." - Cairo Radio

May 17th 1967
“All Egypt is now prepared to plunge into total war which will put an end to Israel” - Cairo Radio

May 18th 1967
“The Zionist barrack in Palestine is about to collapse and be destroyed. Every one of the hundred million Arabs has been living for the past nineteen years on one hope – to live to see the day Israel is liquidated…There is no life, no peace nor hope for the gangs of Zionism to remain in the occupied land.”

“As of today, there no longer exists an international emergency force to protect Israel….The sole method we shall apply against Israel is a total war which will result in the extermination of Zionist existence”. - Cairo Radio’s Voice of the Arabs broadcast

May 20th 1967
“Our forces are now entirely ready not only to repulse any aggression, but to initiate the act ourselves, and to explode the Zionist presence in the Arab homeland of Palestine. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united. I believe that the time has come to begin a battle of anihilation.”- Syria’s Defence Minister Hafez Assad (later to be Syria’s President).

 

[Hossfly]

[]

No one is forcing you to believe in religion Nazi Joe, so what's the point of shitting all over other peoples beliefs in the incredibly immature manner that you're doing it in?
I'm far from being a religious person, but there are far more respectful, mature ways to express your views on religion and God.

You have to EARN my respect before you get it.

And frankly, if you kept your backward-ass bronze age fairy tales to yourself, I'd have no problem with you.

Sadly, you guys don't do that... so when you aren't getting us into the middle of a fight over who a Magic Sky Pixie promised a strip of sand to, you are putting a complete retard like George W. Bush in office because he's "Right With Jesus".

Seriously, my contempt is all the religious deserve.

Don't you believe this, Heathen?


Hear now Jacob my servant and Israel, whom I have chosen - Isaiah 44:1

 

[JoeB131]

[
If you made an effort to check it out you would find that most of the land in Israel was purchased by Jews. But you already knew that, didn't you? I think you just want to use this forum to bray out your spectacular Jew hate. I feel sorry for a critter like you.

Guy, something you purchase at gunpoint is not a valid sale. No one in the Arab world, or for that matter the rest of the world, sees these purchases as legitimate. They see it for what it is, an apartheid state bullying an indigenous people.

Now, hey, let's be honest, my Cherokee ancestors would have understood this as being the way of things in the 19th century, but int he 21st century, this is no longer considered acceptable.

 

[JoeB131]

[]
Don't you believe this, Heathen?


Hear now Jacob my servant and Israel, whom I have chosen - Isaiah 44:1

NO, I refuse to worship a god that drowns and burns babies.

 

[JoeB131]

[

My legalistic proof negates your 'Israel stole their land' comment.
Just because they owned some land in the region of Mandatory Palestine, they had no sovereignty over the region which means they have zero say in decisions like the ones the British made to allow the European Jews to immigrate.
Funny thing is, had they just accepted the partition plan, things would be a lot more peaceful then they are today.
And if 5 Muslim states minded their own business and didn't declare a genocidal war against Israel while attacking them from every corner, things would be a lot more peaceful and those 700 000 refugees would still be living there.
You reap what you sow, Joe.

Guy, the British had no right to give the land to anyone.

This is another wonderful case of the UK trying to impose it's imperialism around the world.

The Muslim world is NEVER going accept Zionism. And frankly, if you go back to the history of the Crusades, they are willing to keep fighting a long time to get rid of unwanted invaders.

Meanwhile, the Zionists are going to start wondering if this was as good of an idea as it seemed to Grandpa Moshe when he fled there from Europe.

 

[JoeB131]

Well that should finally make you understand why Israel has those marriage laws.
It has NOTHING to do with Apartheid or the hatred of Arabs.
It has to do with preserving Israel as a Jewish state. Israel is tiny and the only Jewish country , you need to remember that.
So its government will do what it can to preserve it that way.

Why is it so important to have a "Jewish" country? Frankly, most of the world's religions don't have their own countries, they have to share their countries with people of other faiths.

To protect the jews from the kind of persecution and genocide they have suffered for millennia. Their religion and history is the foundation of both christianity and islam. Their past and present is important to the world, to archeology, literature, and to science. They have always been apart of the land and Jerusalem is the center of their faith, where Jesus had is last supper and where Christianity began. Even the quran says it was the land given by the children of Israel. The temple of Solomon has a whole chapter in the quran, the jewish temple built to hold the arc of moses.

Muslims have arabia. Christians have italy, along with a third of the world. Hindus have India. Jews have Israel.

Okay, here's the thing. Italy is a pluralistic state. While the Vatican does try to stick its nose into politics, the fact is, abortion is legal in Italy, divorce is legal, and they largely tell the Church to go screw itself.

India is about 1/3 muslim. IN fact it has a larger Muslim population than most Arab countries.

And frankly, given how much misery Christianity and Islam have caused throughout history, the world shouldn't really be thanking the Jews for giving them to us.

I often think, what if we had all just kept worshipping Zeus. We could have avoided the Dark Ages thing and gotten to enlightenment a lot sooner.

Never heard about Zeus insisting on genocide of people or telling them to cut their dicks. As Imaginary Sky Pixies go, Zeus actually sounded like a pretty cool guy.

 

[JoeB131]

[
Actually it was more than 5/1. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq,Algeria,Libya,Morocco,Palestine,Saudia Arabia, Kuwait,Tunisia, Lebanon, Sudan,Cuba, North Korea,Pakistan. That's 17/1. And to think that one little country a little bigger than Central Park kicked the living shit out of those critters.

If that many of your neighbors want you gone, maybe you should find another place to live.

Or at least ask what you are doing where so many of your neighbors hate you.

 

[JoeB131]

[q

What I was saying was that Americas support for Israel is not the only reason that ME Muslims hate America. It's also because the U.S has military bases in the ME, and the Muslims want them out completely. And people like you have no problem succumbing to the demands if these people (demand by attacking Americans , American bases, threats)
Sorry, but the U.S is not weak like that. They will leave the ME when THEY want to leave, not when a bunch of violent Ak-47 toting jihadists tell them to.

We have bases over there because we are looking out for Israel's interests.

If we took the 900 billion we spent on playing "Hall Monitor in the MidEast" and invested it in energy independence, we wouldn't have an issue.

And frankly, we are going to leave a lot sooner than the Zionists and Oil Companies want us to leave, because average americans are tired of watching their kids come home in boxes for nothing.

Psychosis

Psychosis is a psychiatric condition that causes a person to lose his or her sense of reality. People with psychosis have hallucinations, delusions, or disorganized thinking that cause them to lose touch with reality

No, guy, Psychosis is some shitstain thinking that we should have perpetual war over a strip of land because an Imaginary Pixie In the Sky said so.

That's just plain nuts.

Because you take out the religion aspect of it, the whole Zionism thing is batshit crazy.

 

[pbel]

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Show us a link to that declaration of war, or is that a Phalange concoction?

Article 14 of the Concession of 1856 reads:
We solemnly declare, for ourselves and our successors, subject to ratification by His
Imperial Majesty the Sultan, that the great maritime canal from Suez to Pelusium and the ports belonging to it shall be open forever, as neutral passages, to every merchant vessel crossing from one sea to the other, without any distinction, exclusion, or preference with respect to persons or nationalities, in consideration of the payment of the fees, and compliance with the regulations established by the universal company, the concession-holder, for the use of the said canal and its appurtenances.

Constantinople, 1873
It is understood that no modification, for the future, of the conditions for the passage through the Canal shall be permitted, whether in regard to the navigation toll or the dues for towage, anchorage, pilotage, etc., except with the consent of the Sublime Porte, which will not take any decision on the subject without previously coming to an understanding with the principal Powers interested therein.


The canal was international water and illegal to close to Israel. That was an act of war. Parking more of the arm of Egypt, Jordan and Syria on Israel's borders was as well. Kicking the UN troops out of the Sinai was also.

March 8th 1965
"We shall not enter Palestine with its soil covered in sand, we shall enter it with its soil saturated in blood" - President of Egypt, Gamal Abdel Nasser

Feb 22nd 1967
“it is the duty of all of us now to move from defensive positions to offensive positions and enter the battle to liberate the usurped land…Everyone must face the test and enter the battle to the end.” - President Attassi of Syria

April 8th 1967
“(this battle will be)…followed by more severe battles until Palestine is liberated and the Zionist presence ended.” - Syria’s information minister Mahmoud Zubi

May 16th 1967
"The existence of Israel has continued too long. We welcome the Israeli aggression. We welcome the battle we have long awaited. The peak hour has come. The battle has come in which we shall destroy Israel." - Cairo Radio

May 17th 1967
“All Egypt is now prepared to plunge into total war which will put an end to Israel” - Cairo Radio

May 18th 1967
“The Zionist barrack in Palestine is about to collapse and be destroyed. Every one of the hundred million Arabs has been living for the past nineteen years on one hope – to live to see the day Israel is liquidated…There is no life, no peace nor hope for the gangs of Zionism to remain in the occupied land.”

“As of today, there no longer exists an international emergency force to protect Israel….The sole method we shall apply against Israel is a total war which will result in the extermination of Zionist existence”. - Cairo Radio’s Voice of the Arabs broadcast

May 20th 1967
“Our forces are now entirely ready not only to repulse any aggression, but to initiate the act ourselves, and to explode the Zionist presence in the Arab homeland of Palestine. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united. I believe that the time has come to begin a battle of anihilation.”- Syria’s Defence Minister Hafez Assad (later to be Syria’s President).

Dear Phalanges, rhetoric is just that, and no link declarations of war are visible.

 

[pbel]

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Another lie or link this, 5/1 crapola,

Actually it was more than 5/1. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq,Algeria,Libya,Morocco,Palestine,Saudia Arabia, Kuwait,Tunisia, Lebanon, Sudan,Cuba, North Korea,Pakistan. That's 17/1. And to think that one little country a little bigger than Central Park kicked the living shit out of those critters.

Counting countries instead of actual troops at the border must be Phalange/West Virgini alliance.

 

[JoeB131]

Egypt had already declared war, removed the UN troops, amassed troops on all borders, had written orders to attack which I have previously posted part of but that were delayed, was coordinating with Jordan and Syria against Israel.
Considering it was a force of 5 against 1, Israel's only chance was to have air superiority against planes that could fly longer carry more armament and were harder to damage or shoot down.
The air battle was daring, innovative and required great skill. It was a long shot that paid off for Israel. You're upset because Israel succeeded against overwhelming odds? Some would call that a miracle or luck. Israeli pilots would probably have called desperation because if they failed it meant the loss of Israel. Their only option was to succeeded.

Show us a link to that declaration of war, or is that a Phalange concoction?

Article 14 of the Concession of 1856 reads:
We solemnly declare, for ourselves and our successors, subject to ratification by His
Imperial Majesty the Sultan, that the great maritime canal from Suez to Pelusium and the ports belonging to it shall be open forever, as neutral passages, to every merchant vessel crossing from one sea to the other, without any distinction, exclusion, or preference with respect to persons or nationalities, in consideration of the payment of the fees, and compliance with the regulations established by the universal company, the concession-holder, for the use of the said canal and its appurtenances.

Constantinople, 1873
It is understood that no modification, for the future, of the conditions for the passage through the Canal shall be permitted, whether in regard to the navigation toll or the dues for towage, anchorage, pilotage, etc., except with the consent of the Sublime Porte, which will not take any decision on the subject without previously coming to an understanding with the principal Powers interested therein.


The canal was international water and illegal to close to Israel. That was an act of war. Parking more of the arm of Egypt, Jordan and Syria on Israel's borders was as well. Kicking the UN troops out of the Sinai was also.

March 8th 1965
"We shall not enter Palestine with its soil covered in sand, we shall enter it with its soil saturated in blood" - President of Egypt, Gamal Abdel Nasser

Feb 22nd 1967
“it is the duty of all of us now to move from defensive positions to offensive positions and enter the battle to liberate the usurped land…Everyone must face the test and enter the battle to the end.” - President Attassi of Syria

April 8th 1967
“(this battle will be)…followed by more severe battles until Palestine is liberated and the Zionist presence ended.” - Syria’s information minister Mahmoud Zubi

May 16th 1967
"The existence of Israel has continued too long. We welcome the Israeli aggression. We welcome the battle we have long awaited. The peak hour has come. The battle has come in which we shall destroy Israel." - Cairo Radio

May 17th 1967
“All Egypt is now prepared to plunge into total war which will put an end to Israel” - Cairo Radio

May 18th 1967
“The Zionist barrack in Palestine is about to collapse and be destroyed. Every one of the hundred million Arabs has been living for the past nineteen years on one hope – to live to see the day Israel is liquidated…There is no life, no peace nor hope for the gangs of Zionism to remain in the occupied land.”

“As of today, there no longer exists an international emergency force to protect Israel….The sole method we shall apply against Israel is a total war which will result in the extermination of Zionist existence”. - Cairo Radio’s Voice of the Arabs broadcast

May 20th 1967
“Our forces are now entirely ready not only to repulse any aggression, but to initiate the act ourselves, and to explode the Zionist presence in the Arab homeland of Palestine. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united. I believe that the time has come to begin a battle of anihilation.”- Syria’s Defence Minister Hafez Assad (later to be Syria’s President).

If my neighbors were talking that much smack about wanting to kill me, I'd find somewhere else to live!

 

[RoccoR]

JoeB131, et al,

In a secular society, were the people try to keep separate the religious issues from the civic issues, the discord between Judaism, Christianity, and Islamic beliefs have no meaning - and are of little relative importance.

Why should you fear Zionism (a national movement within Jewish culture that supports the creation of a Jewish homeland) any more than the global expansion of Islam or the policy of the Rashidun Caliphs (the continuation of Muhammad's aggressive territorial expansion)?

Ah, shit, another one who thinks there are Muslims hiding under his bed!

Okay, guy, if a group is out for World DOmination and they really don't control much more ofthe world than they did 1000 years ago - in fact, less of it than they did 500 years ago - then I don't worry that much about their prowess as world conquerors.

All of our problems with Islam is because we keep sticking our noses in their business.

(COMMENT)

√ I don't care if there is a Muslim hiding under your bed, but my bed is a different matter.

√ Actually, I wasn't speaking to Islamic World Domination (if there is even such a thing); but, more the impact of their activities relative to the Middle Eastern Region, centered on a point with the Palestinians. They do effect the regional security and peace of the region. Remembering of course that the Palestinian protocols are based on such related, non-secular philosophies as:

• The Islamic Resistance Movement believes that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgement Day.
• This is the law governing the land of Palestine in the Islamic Sharia (law) and the same goes for any land the Moslems have conquered by force, because during the times of (Islamic) conquests, the Moslems consecrated these lands to Moslem generations till the Day of Judgement.
• Nationalism, from the point of view of the Islamic Resistance Movement, is part of the religious creed.

√ It will be several centuries yet, before humanity as a whole (including the Islamic Cultures) find common ground such that periodic clashes are avoidable in diplomacy, commerce, and interactive communication/interaction of ever nature. Humanity is just not quite ready to fully embrace the Star Trek "Prime Directive" of Non-Interference. It is not yet beyond the nature of the species to keep from "sticking our noses" into the cause of others. In fact, the philosophy is - as Edmund Burke said:

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Do not allow evil to triumph.​

In the current culture of humanity, it is very difficult to see the following Palestinian position as anything but evil:

• There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad.
• Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors.

The first is a platitude that stipulates that only conflict is the answer. The second is that compromise, negotiation, and customary mitigation are not potentials for a solution. And this is pledged on the backdrop of the Sharia.

It should be noted that the Jewish Culture, earmarked for preservation by the Allied Powers, in no way --- ever represented the same measure of expansionist threat of that --- presented by the Muslim dominated cultures. Nor have the Muslim dominated cultures exemplified any of the advancements that are exhibited by the Jewish culture.

Yeah. They Jewish culture gave us the Abrahamic Religions. The Dark Ages were the first Faith-Based initiative.

(COMMENT)

As an agnostic, I shouldn't care, one way or the other here. But as student of history, my knee-jerk reaction is to say that in Islam, the Supreme Being (the God of Abraham) is common to all three major religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islamic beliefs). It is probably one of the very few things that the believer of each can agree upon.

The Dark Ages was a period of intellectual stagnation and economic depression was not an Jewish conspiracy or the outcome of the spread of Judaism.

Your preference for Muslim Expansionism over Jewish Relocation is purely based on something other than the preservation of a human culture that was nearly rendered crippled.

I've discussed, several times, the need to extend protection to this culture. But as you have already promoted the view in favor of sectarian violence, there is little to be gained by discussing the wider humanitarian considerations that are masked by the dispute.

I'd have no problem if the Jews were going to preserve their culture by going to a land where they've been invited to do so and pay the people who own the property a fair market price for it.

I have a big problem when they go in, steal someone else's land, enrage 1/6 of the world's population against the West, and they do it all to please an Invisible Man in the Sky.

(COMMENT)

This circles us back around to the concept of a "peaceful solution" which the Palestinians has vowed not to pursue.

The potential for a negotiated settlement is right before us. But it is the Palestinian position that:

• There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad.
• Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors.

You cannot get to civil land settlement claims, war reparations, restitution and reconciliation without a "good faith effort" to negotiate these issue.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Jroc]

We have bases over there because we are looking out for Israel's interests.

If we took the 900 billion we spent on playing "Hall Monitor in the MidEast" and invested it in energy independence, we wouldn't have an issue.

And frankly, we are going to leave a lot sooner than the Zionists and Oil Companies want us to leave, because average americans are tired of watching their kids come home in boxes for nothing.

Psychosis

Psychosis is a psychiatric condition that causes a person to lose his or her sense of reality. People with psychosis have hallucinations, delusions, or disorganized thinking that cause them to lose touch with reality

No, guy, Psychosis is some shitstain thinking that we should have perpetual war over a strip of land because an Imaginary Pixie In the Sky said so.

That's just plain nuts.

Because you take out the religion aspect of it, the whole Zionism thing is batshit crazy.

Delusions are also part of the psychosis boy get some help

 

[SAYIT]

Your preference for Muslim Expansionism over Jewish Relocation is purely based on something other than the preservation of a human culture that was nearly rendered crippled.

I've discussed, several times, the need to extend protection to this culture. But as you have already promoted the view in favor of sectarian violence, there is little to be gained by discussing the wider humanitarian considerations that are masked by the dispute.

Most Respectfully,
R

I'd have no problem if the Jews were going to preserve their culture by going to a land where they've been invited to do so and pay the people who own the property a fair market price for it.

I have a big problem when they go in, steal someone else's land, enrage 1/6 of the world's population against the West, and they do it all to please an Invisible Man in the Sky.

Evidently you don't know any Jews. For 90% (perhaps 100%) of them Israel's existence has nothing to do with pleasing your IMitS. It has to do with the end of their oppression and their survival as a people.

It is equally clear you know nothing of the 100 years which preceded the rebirth of Israel as the Jewish Homeland.

While it is disappointing that any minority needs a homeland as a refuge, the advent of modern human EXTERMINATION techniques and the eagerness of some to employ them made clear that such a homeland would be necessary if Jews were to exist in the 21st Century.

Many people were dislocated following WW2 and the Jews landed on a small strip of land which most believe their ancestors inhabited centuries before.

This exacerbated upheaval in the region which was both regrettable and predictable as well as necessary. There just wasn't any way around it and there will be no do-overs in the matter.

As Rocco noted, unless and until the Arabs find it in their hearts to accept Israel's existence, there is little hope for real peace there.

 

[toastman]

[

My legalistic proof negates your 'Israel stole their land' comment.
Just because they owned some land in the region of Mandatory Palestine, they had no sovereignty over the region which means they have zero say in decisions like the ones the British made to allow the European Jews to immigrate.
Funny thing is, had they just accepted the partition plan, things would be a lot more peaceful then they are today.
And if 5 Muslim states minded their own business and didn't declare a genocidal war against Israel while attacking them from every corner, things would be a lot more peaceful and those 700 000 refugees would still be living there.
You reap what you sow, Joe.

Guy, the British had no right to give the land to anyone.

This is another wonderful case of the UK trying to impose it's imperialism around the world.

The Muslim world is NEVER going accept Zionism. And frankly, if you go back to the history of the Crusades, they are willing to keep fighting a long time to get rid of unwanted invaders.

Meanwhile, the Zionists are going to start wondering if this was as good of an idea as it seemed to Grandpa Moshe when he fled there from Europe.

Israeli know that Arabs will never accept a Jewish state in the Middle East.
But unfortunately for them, Israel doesn't abide by what they want.
They already tried to kick Israel out of the ME, remember? Several times.

And that's why Israel isn't going back the 67 borders , because it won't change anything.

And what do you mean the British had no right to give land to nobody? There was nothing illegal about the partition plan, unless you have documents to prove otherwise...

 

[JoeB131]

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Delusions are also part of the psychosis boy get some help

so you really don't have an answer.

I guess you can't even meet my low expectations for you..